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Snowy roads and Loch Muick

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General fitness, health and nutrition
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21 February 2005
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23 February 2005
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  1. I've spent the weekend in Aberdeen intending to walk the Munros south
    of Loch Muick, Broad Cairn etc., but the snow scuppered that idea. The
    road out along Deeside was relatively OK, but none of the side roads
    were clear and my car even struggled to get up to the car park at
    Scolty Hill in Banchory for even a short walk, so I doubted I could get
    along Glen Muick. My car is front wheel drive, and I was wondering if
    snow chains or snow tyres would have been enough of an improvement to
    get to the good walks. Does anyone use these; snow tyres or chains?
    How good are they, and when do you put them on? And what are they like
    to drive with on tarmac?

    Oh, and did anyone else do the walks around Loch Muick this weekend?
    How did you get there? What were the conditions like?

    Thanks.

  2. Quoted message said:

    get to the good walks. Does anyone use these; snow tyres or chains?
    How good are they, and when do you put them on? And what are they like
    to drive with on tarmac?

    Caveat: This is second hand rather than direct experience, but I gather
    that (a) they're very good, and (b) you /don't/ use them on tarmac,
    pausing to put them on and off as needed. You wouldn't do that for a
    few metwers gap, but any serious length of tarmac you'd just damage it
    quite badly driving around on chains.

    Quoted message said:

    Oh, and did anyone else do the walks around Loch Muick this weekend?
    How did you get there? What were the conditions like?

    Went to Ben Lawers, thinking there's be more snow than there was :-(

    Pete.
    --
    Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
    Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
    Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
    net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

  3. In message <[email hidden]>, Chris Street
    <[email hidden]> writes

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    I've spent the weekend in Aberdeen intending to walk the Munros south
    of Loch Muick, Broad Cairn etc., but the snow scuppered that idea. The
    road out along Deeside was relatively OK, but none of the side roads
    were clear and my car even struggled to get up to the car park at
    Scolty Hill in Banchory for even a short walk, so I doubted I could get
    along Glen Muick. My car is front wheel drive, and I was wondering if
    snow chains or snow tyres would have been enough of an improvement to
    get to the good walks. Does anyone use these; snow tyres or chains?
    How good are they, and when do you put them on? And what are they like
    to drive with on tarmac?

    Oh, and did anyone else do the walks around Loch Muick this weekend?
    How did you get there? What were the conditions like?

    Thanks.

    You cannot use chains on tarmac. On snow they make a big difference - I
    regularly drive in the Alps in a Focus with chains and unless the snow is
    so deep that the front spolier catches it you won't be stopped. Just takes
    a long time.

    Snow tyres are a good compromise. They do make a big difference and can
    be used on tarmac. I put them on in October and take them off in late
    April (though I forgot one year and kept them on all summer).

  4. <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    I've spent the weekend in Aberdeen intending to walk the Munros south
    of Loch Muick, Broad Cairn etc., but the snow scuppered that idea. The
    road out along Deeside was relatively OK, but none of the side roads
    were clear and my car even struggled to get up to the car park at
    Scolty Hill in Banchory for even a short walk, so I doubted I could get
    along Glen Muick. My car is front wheel drive, and I was wondering if
    snow chains or snow tyres would have been enough of an improvement to
    get to the good walks. Does anyone use these; snow tyres or chains?
    How good are they, and when do you put them on? And what are they like
    to drive with on tarmac?

    Oh, and did anyone else do the walks around Loch Muick this weekend?
    How did you get there? What were the conditions like?

    Thanks.


    Here in Canada smart people put snow tires on their cars about mid November
    or earlier and take them off about mid April.

    They make a huge difference in traction and are highly recommended.

    A lot of people use what we call all season tires - but these are usually
    optimized for wet conditions rather than snow or ice and as long as they are
    only driving in the city they are usually OK. For snow and ice conditions
    though, there is nothing better than snow tires. We very seldom use chains
    or studs in the tires these days due to highway damage and speed
    restrictions. Snow tires, however, can be used at all reasonable speeds on
    highways and other than when it is extremely hot - 30 C and above - in the
    summer they provided excellent highway handling. At high temperatures, they
    are probably going to overheat and wear very quickly. This is why most of
    us have a set of cheap steel wheels with snow tires that we put on for the
    winter months and then change back to summer/all season tires in the spring.

    I'm not sure how the winter/snow tires available in the UK would compare to
    those available in Canada - take a look at http://www.canadiantire.ca and
    there may be some information you could use for comparison.

    Bill Brabender

  5. I recently purchased a second hand Peugeot Estate as my old 306 started
    to collapse although it was great in the snow. My new car is useless.
    I got stuck on 25 and 26 December and again 2 January in snow. It was
    suggested that I get winter tyres but as I stay in a flat I have
    nowhere to store them. I purchased a set of snow chains recently and
    tried to fit them to my tyres. Took ages. I think the main problem
    will be trying to fit them in the cold and snow with freezing fingers.
    Apparently you should only use them on snow and take them off when the
    road is clear. If you have the money and space I think you should go
    for the winter tyre option.
    Lindsay.
    Caledonia Hilltreks

  6. In message <[email hidden]>

    Quoted message said:

    I've spent the weekend in Aberdeen intending to walk the Munros south
    of Loch Muick, Broad Cairn etc., but the snow scuppered that idea. The
    road out along Deeside was relatively OK, but none of the side roads
    were clear and my car even struggled to get up to the car park at
    Scolty Hill in Banchory for even a short walk, so I doubted I could get
    along Glen Muick. My car is front wheel drive, and I was wondering if
    snow chains or snow tyres would have been enough of an improvement to
    get to the good walks. Does anyone use these; snow tyres or chains?
    How good are they, and when do you put them on? And what are they like
    to drive with on tarmac?

    I do a fair amount of driving under winter conditions and also summer
    in the Alps. I usually do two winter driving trips to the Alps for
    skiing and ski-touring. I also visit Wales and the Lake District and
    sometimes Scotland throughout the year.

    Until 5 years ago I drove a front wheel drive Astra estate. I purchased
    a set of chains and used them in anger a few times on mountain roads in
    the Alps and once or twice during winter in the Lake District. They
    really do make a huge difference on snow covered roads, but you have to
    take them off whenever you meet bare tarmac. They also require practice
    to put on and take off, particularly during bad weather in the dark! For
    the variability of conditions you'll meet in the UK they are a good
    option to consider. Bear in mind that the cheapest chains will probably
    be the most difficult to fit and the quickest to break or wear out.

    Winter tyres are another possibility. They work better than summer
    tyres under various conditions including just cold and damp. They aren't
    only for driving in the snow, and they will cope much better with a
    variety of winter conditions. Snow tyres generally aren't rated for
    high speed use in warm summer conditions so you need to bear in mind
    where you live and the types of driving you expect to do. You can of
    course still combine winter tyres with chains for extreme conditions.
    What you probably should consider regarding winter tyres is do you have
    somewhere to store the wheels that aren't in use? If you do then buy a
    new set of cheap steel wheels and have winter tyres fitted to them.
    Steel wheels are best because if you do fit chains you won't run the
    risk of damaging expensive alloy wheels. As to the running expenses it
    shouldn't be too great so long as you expect to keep your car for
    several years, since you will even out the wear on the summer and winter
    sets of tyres during that period.

    Five years ago I took a different option. After observing what were the
    popular vehicles in the mountain regions of Switzerland I traded in my
    Astra for an all wheel drive Subaru. All the current models of Subaru
    are pretty good under snow conditions, including Legacy, Imprezza and
    also the model I opted for, the Forester. The AWD on the Forester
    combined with the standard UK fit Highway/Terrain tyres has coped well
    with all the conditions I've driven under. So far I've only had to
    resort to using chains once and that was to get through a deep snow
    drift on a hill just south of where I live in Cambridge!

    --
    o/ \\ // |\ ,_ o Mike Clark
    <\__,\\ // __o | \ / /\, "A mountain climbing, cycling, skiing,
    "> || _`\<,_ |__\ \> | immunology lecturer, antibody engineer and
    ` || (_)/ (_) | \corn computer user"

  7. Quoted message said:


    Oh, and did anyone else do the walks around Loch Muick this weekend?
    How did you get there? What were the conditions like?

    Yes. We did them on Friday from Glen Clova though, the roads were
    completely free of ice and snow. We did Tom Buidhe, Tolmount,
    Fafernie, Carn an t-Sagart Mor, Carn a' Choire Bhoidheach, Cairn
    Bannoch and Broad Cairn, quite a long walk at around 20 miles but only
    4300 or so ascent.

    We were beaten by our friend Tom who added Lochnagar to the day, an
    extra 5 miles/500 feet ascent, and still caught us up at the summit of
    Broad Cairn!

    Took us 11 3/4 hours, returning to the hut at about 7.30, the main
    problem being that the marked bridge over the Burn of Gowal doesn't
    exist so we had to detour though the FC plantation :-(

    On Saturday it was much windier. No significant extra snow so you
    might have got to the car park, but I wouldn't have like to have been
    on the plateau - those of our group who set off that way turned back.

    Sunday I'm not sure about as we headed home, couldn't face yet another
    day in biting gale force winds, but there was a fair amount of new
    snow on the Glen Clova road, so I'd guess that Glen Muick was a lot
    worse.

    S.

    --
    Stop ID cards and the Database State
    http://www.no2id.net/

  8. Simon Caldwell said:
    Quoted message said:

    Oh, and did anyone else do the walks around Loch Muick this weekend?
    How did you get there? What were the conditions like?

    Yes. We did them on Friday from Glen Clova though, the roads were
    completely free of ice and snow. We did Tom Buidhe, Tolmount,
    Fafernie, Carn an t-Sagart Mor, Carn a' Choire Bhoidheach, Cairn
    Bannoch and Broad Cairn, quite a long walk at around 20 miles but only
    4300 or so ascent.

    We were beaten by our friend Tom who added Lochnagar to the day, an
    extra 5 miles/500 feet ascent, and still caught us up at the summit of
    Broad Cairn!

    Took us 11 3/4 hours, returning to the hut at about 7.30, the main
    problem being that the marked bridge over the Burn of Gowal doesn't
    exist so we had to detour though the FC plantation :-(

    Which of the two crossings? I did that round recently and crossed a
    bridge at NO 277789 (didn't I - or am I dreaming?)

    druidh

  9. Simon Caldwell said:
    Quoted message said:


    Oh, and did anyone else do the walks around Loch Muick this weekend?
    How did you get there? What were the conditions like?

    Yes. We did them on Friday from Glen Clova though, the roads were
    completely free of ice and snow. We did Tom Buidhe, Tolmount,
    Fafernie, Carn an t-Sagart Mor, Carn a' Choire Bhoidheach, Cairn
    Bannoch and Broad Cairn, quite a long walk at around 20 miles but


    only

    Quoted message said:

    4300 or so ascent.

    We were beaten by our friend Tom who added Lochnagar to the day, an
    extra 5 miles/500 feet ascent, and still caught us up at the summit


    of

    Quoted message said:

    Broad Cairn!

    Took us 11 3/4 hours, returning to the hut at about 7.30, the main
    problem being that the marked bridge over the Burn of Gowal doesn't
    exist so we had to detour though the FC plantation :-(

    On Saturday it was much windier. No significant extra snow so you
    might have got to the car park, but I wouldn't have like to have been
    on the plateau - those of our group who set off that way turned back.

    Sunday I'm not sure about as we headed home, couldn't face yet


    another

    Quoted message said:

    day in biting gale force winds, but there was a fair amount of new
    snow on the Glen Clova road, so I'd guess that Glen Muick was a lot
    worse.

    S.

    I'm so jealous. I've been waiting for a good walk like that for a
    month now and I've just gotten over a cold so I was raring to go. I
    thought about going on Friday when the weather was fine but I needed a
    map of the area first so spent that day shopping in Aberdeen. Tiso is
    earning a fortune from me!

    Do you mind me asking if you did this as part of an official group or
    club? I've been doing solo walks for a while now as my regular partner
    has buggered his knee, and I'm thinking about joining a club but only
    if it's worth it.

    BTW, can anyone recommend any particular snow tyre manufacturer in the
    UK?

  10. On Mon, 21 Feb 2005 20:54:49 GMT, druidh <[email hidden]>

    Quoted message said:


    Which of the two crossings? I did that round recently and crossed a
    bridge at NO 277789 (didn't I - or am I dreaming?)

    The other one - 280781
    We didn't see the first as it was well after sunset by then, so just
    followed the obvious big landrover track - which unfortunately
    included a deep wide ford!
    We weren't the first, as there was a path of sorts through the forest,
    though hands-and-knees were required in places.

    --
    Stop ID cards and the Database State
    http://www.no2id.net/

  11. Quoted message said:


    Do you mind me asking if you did this as part of an official group or
    club? I've been doing solo walks for a while now as my regular partner
    has buggered his knee, and I'm thinking about joining a club but only
    if it's worth it.

    Yes - the York Alpine Club. Might be a bit far from home for you
    though ;-)

    --
    York Alpine Club - http://www.yorkalpineclub.org.uk
    Recent Photos - http://climbing.me.uk
    Old Photos - http://www.simon-caldwell.co.uk
    My Brother's Photos - http://www.caldwellcreations.co.uk

  12. Simon Caldwell said:

    On Mon, 21 Feb 2005 20:54:49 GMT, druidh <[email hidden]>

    Quoted message said:

    Which of the two crossings? I did that round recently and crossed a
    bridge at NO 277789 (didn't I - or am I dreaming?)

    The other one - 280781
    We didn't see the first as it was well after sunset by then, so just
    followed the obvious big landrover track - which unfortunately
    included a deep wide ford!
    We weren't the first, as there was a path of sorts through the forest,
    though hands-and-knees were required in places.

    Ah! - what you need is a GPS!!!

    Funny - when we were there, we saw all these other folk on the West bank
    of the river after we'd crossed. After passing the ford, I couldn't work
    out where they'd come from. Must have been more forest dwellers.

    druidh

  13. In message <[email hidden]>
    [email hidden] wrote:
    [snip]

    Quoted message said:


    BTW, can anyone recommend any particular snow tyre manufacturer in the
    UK?

    Typing "winter" and "tyres" and selecting pages from the UK on Google
    throws up a large selection of possibilities.

    http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&ie=ISO-8859-1&q=Winter+tyres&btnG=Google+Search&meta=cr%3DcountryUK%7CcountryGB

    A good starting place is the Tyres-Online Technical information page

    http://www.tyres-online.co.uk/techinfo/winter.asp

    Mike
    --
    o/ \\ // || ,_ o Mike Clark, "An antibody engineer who also
    <\__,\\ // __o || / /\, likes the mountains"
    "> || _`\<,_ // \\ \> | Cambridge Climbing and Caving Club
    ` || (_)/ (_) // \\ \_ <URL:http://www.path.cam.ac.uk/~mrc7/cccc/>

  14. Simon Caldwell said:
    Quoted message said:


    Oh, and did anyone else do the walks around Loch Muick this weekend?
    How did you get there? What were the conditions like?


    Some photos here:
    http://homepage.ntlworld.com/simon.caldwell/Clova/index.html

    --
    Stop ID cards and the Database State
    http://www.no2id.net/

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