520 or T800 touring bike?

Toadman said:

I'm considering buying a touring bike. Cannondale T800 or Trek 520? Pros
or cons? Any other touring bikes about the same price ($1200.00)?

I rode the Trek 520, but preferred the Jamis Aurora and eventually bought
one. It's a great bike, cost somewhat lower than your budget (~$730 last
year), but you could use the extra money to swap in snazzy components like
a custom touring cassette (I bought mine from Harris Cyclery, and I'm sure
there are other sources).

You could also consider the Jamis Nova, which IIRC has similar geometry to
the Aurora, has a nicer frame and components, and might make a good tourer
if you made a few component swaps (e.g. wheels and cassette to start). Any
decent bike shop would do these trades for minimal cost beyond the
component price difference. I think I would have chosen this one with a
larger budget.

Also check out the Fuji Touring and Bianchi Volpe. Rivendell, Surly, and
others make touring bikes too.

Good luck,

Reid

--
Please do not CC me on replies to my USENET or mailing list posts.

Reid Priedhorsky said:

Also check out the Fuji Touring and Bianchi Volpe. Rivendell, Surly, and
others make touring bikes too.

Speaking of which, anybody try one of those "long haul trucker"
touring frames from Surly yet? Seems to be a very rational and
practical frame, strong w/ no bs. The Pacer looks nice too, an affordable
road frame that can fit "normal" reach brakes and fenders.

I don't know if I'm hip enough to own a Surly myself... they have such a
rock star cachet around these parts, although I did get a new pair of
hipster Jack Purcells today. That's gotta count for something.
:P😉

Toadman said:

Right now my wife and I both have a Cannondale Adventure 400. We ride

a lot

Quoted message said:

on the local trails. I've been riding more on the roads lately.

Riding

Quoted message said:

season is just getting started here in Western Pa. I did one solo

self

Quoted message said:

contained camping trip last year, 115 miles with one over night stay.

We

Quoted message said:

have a 200+ mile self contained camping trip on the WV Greenbrier

River

Quoted message said:

Trail planned this year and I hope to do that same 115 mile trip

again this

Quoted message said:

year too. I also do a couple rides week nights after work, usually

from 6 to

Quoted message said:

16 miles on local back roads. I'm considering buying a touring bike.
Cannondale T800 or Trek 520? Pros or cons?

I doubt you'll get many direct comparisons of those two bikes. It
would require someone who's either ridden both extensively, or sold a
lot of both and seen the customer feedback.

I've got a Cannondale touring bike from 1986. A couple years ago it
took me coast to coast, with full packs, no problems. Of course, it's
done lots of shorter tours as well. It's a good bike.

Quoted message said:

Would a road bike stand up to self contained camping
trips? I did purchase a BoB YAK trailer this spring to hepl carry

camping

Quoted message said:

gear.

I'd recommend against a road bike, based on experience. I had to get
my daughter's road bike ready for that same trip, and it wasn't easy.
Tire sizes were limited. Gearing was too high. Fitting racks was a
pain. Fitting fenders was much more of a pain... etc.

Road bikes are meant for fast, unloaded riding. Using one for a tour
is like using a Mazda Miata to pull a camping trailer. It's not
impossible - but it's certainly not optimal.

OTOH, there's much less penalty involved in using a touring bike for
fast, unloaded riding. The touring bike is simply a lot more
versatile.

- Frank Krygowski

In article <[email hidden]>, Toadman

Quoted message said:

Right now my wife and I both have a Cannondale Adventure 400. We ride a lot
on the local trails. I've been riding more on the roads lately. Riding
season is just getting started here in Western Pa. I did one solo self
contained camping trip last year, 115 miles with one over night stay. We
have a 200+ mile self contained camping trip on the WV Greenbrier River
Trail planned this year and I hope to do that same 115 mile trip again this
year too. I also do a couple rides week nights after work, usually from 6 to
16 miles on local back roads. I'm considering buying a touring bike.
Cannondale T800 or Trek 520? Pros or cons? Any other touring bikes about the
same price ($1200.00)? Would a road bike stand up to self contained camping
trips? I did purchase a BoB YAK trailer this spring to hepl carry camping
gear.

Almost any bikes can be made to do self-supported touring. You really
do not need a dedicated touring bike, though it's nice to have.

But again, the decision choosing between a Cannondale and a Trek is
always fit fit and fit. That's super important. One person may fit
great on a Trek, but not on a Cannondale and it's true vice versa.

Some people have a love hate relationship with the Bob Yak trailer. I,
for one, hated it with a vengeance! Some people like it. I've seen
people towing a Bob Yak trailer with their expensive Trek 5200 or even
a Litespeed Tuscany at one point in time. So obviously, road bikes can
and do stand up to self contained comping trips. But be careful of how
we define by what we mean by self-supported camping trips. I mean, the
people I met on these nice fancy dandy high tech road bikes carry loads
of not more than 40lbs on the trailer, probably eat out a lot and
probably don't camp when it's showering outside. So, you've got to
know what you want to do touring wise in order to know which bike you
need to get to meet your demands.

I mean, What's wrong with the bike you have now?

Cannondale T2000 if you can get one. Most comfy bike I ever owned,
excepting recumbent....

"Toadman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Right now my wife and I both have a Cannondale Adventure 400. We ride a
lot
on the local trails. I've been riding more on the roads lately. Riding
season is just getting started here in Western Pa. I did one solo self
contained camping trip last year, 115 miles with one over night stay. We
have a 200+ mile self contained camping trip on the WV Greenbrier River
Trail planned this year and I hope to do that same 115 mile trip again
this
year too. I also do a couple rides week nights after work, usually from 6
to
16 miles on local back roads. I'm considering buying a touring bike.
Cannondale T800 or Trek 520? Pros or cons? Any other touring bikes about
the
same price ($1200.00)? Would a road bike stand up to self contained
camping
trips? I did purchase a BoB YAK trailer this spring to hepl carry camping
gear.

David said:

In article <[email hidden]>, Toadman

Quoted message said:

16 miles on local back roads. I'm considering buying a touring bike.
Cannondale T800 or Trek 520? Pros or cons? Any other touring bikes about the
same price ($1200.00)? Would a road bike stand up to self contained camping
trips? I did purchase a BoB YAK trailer this spring to hepl carry camping
gear.

Almost any bikes can be made to do self-supported touring. You really
do not need a dedicated touring bike, though it's nice to have.

I don't believe this is really true. There really is a
difference between generic road bike and touring bike if
you are riding it "loaded".

I road for about 3 weeks with a fellow on a tour who had a
Specialized Allez. It's a fine bike, but the fellow was
having a terrible time with broken spokes and wheel bearings.
The problems eventually had him taking a train home to do the
tour another day. He did so the following year on a Cannondale
tourer.

A trailer might alleviate some of the wear of loaded touring
on a non-touring bike. Not really certain as I don't use a
trailer, but have thought about using one for a mountain bike
trip.

Quoted message said:

But again, the decision choosing between a Cannondale and a Trek is
always fit fit and fit. That's super important. One person may fit
great on a Trek, but not on a Cannondale and it's true vice versa.

Fit would definitely be the deciding factor between these two
bikes. I have a 520 and its a great bike. I've heard great
things about the Cannondale as well.

As another has mentioned, there are other great bikes that can
be used for touring although I don't know I'd include Bianchi.
Some of these bikes might better be considered "creditcard tourers".
Fuji has a reputation for low cost but not certain how it holds
up under loaded touring conditions.

SMH

"Toadman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I'm considering buying a touring bike.
Cannondale T800 or Trek 520?

Aside from differences in fit and ride quality, one major difference between
the two bikes is gearing; the Cannondale's is much more sensible for a
loaded touring bike, with a wider range cassette and smaller chainrings.
Yes, you can have your Trek dealer modify the 520 to suit, but I still give
points to the company that gets it right the first time. The Bianchi Volpe
is another bike in the same price range that also has the 28/38/48
chainrings (but its chainstays are a touch on the short side for a touring
bike).

Look at the Bruce Gordon BLT - http://www.bgcycles.com/blt.html - to see the
"type specimen" for touring bikes.

RichC

"Toadman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Right now my wife and I both have a Cannondale Adventure 400. We ride a
lot
on the local trails. I've been riding more on the roads lately. Riding
season is just getting started here in Western Pa. I did one solo self
contained camping trip last year, 115 miles with one over night stay. We
have a 200+ mile self contained camping trip on the WV Greenbrier River
Trail planned this year and I hope to do that same 115 mile trip again
this
year too. I also do a couple rides week nights after work, usually from 6
to
16 miles on local back roads. I'm considering buying a touring bike.
Cannondale T800 or Trek 520? Pros or cons?

If you decide on the 520 check out the stock gearing which is too high and
the stem which is too low . See:
http://www2.trekbikes.com/en/Bikes/Specialty_Bikes/Touring/520/index.php
You really need a mountain bike crankset up front and a stem wih lots of
rise. This critique has been aimed at Trek many times but they don't do
anything about it and presumably has the existing components on the shelf.
The 520 seems to be somewhat of an orphan. Who needs a 128" top gear on a
touring bike. At the other end, the lowest ratio is 24" which is a bit tall
for loaded touring. Otherwise it seems fine
Any other touring bikes about the

Quoted message said:

same price ($1200.00)?

You might like to check out:
http://ucycle.com/bikes/item.php?name=urbtour&cat=urbanite

You can spec it out yourself. I bought one about 21/2 years ago, fully
equipped as shown in the picture for $1650 Canadian.This translates to about
$US1350. I have been very pleased with it

Good luck.

Roy

Frank Krygowski said:

I'd recommend against a road bike, based on experience.

Quoted message said:

Road bikes are meant for fast, unloaded riding.

Quoted message said:

The touring bike is simply a lot more versatile.

Frank, this is probably just semantics, but a touring bike IS a road
bike. I think you're using "road bike" as being synonymous with "racing
bike." It isn't.

Art Harris

Stephen Harding said:

Fit would definitely be the deciding factor between these two
bikes. I have a 520 and its a great bike. I've heard great
things about the Cannondale as well.

There's really nothing to differentiate these bikes in terms of fit.
Fit is a matter of picking the right size frame and tweaking various
things.

Cannondale Trek Surly26 Surly27

ST angle 73 73.5 73 73
HT angle 71.5 71 71 72
ST 21 21 21.3 22
TT 21.5 21.9 21.9 22.4
BB 11.1 10.6
WB 41.3 41.5 41.5 41.6
CS 18 17.7 18.1 18.1
OFF 2.1 2.0 1.8 1.8
TR 2.3 2.5

Art Harris said:

Frank Krygowski said:

I'd recommend against a road bike, based on experience.

Quoted message said:

Road bikes are meant for fast, unloaded riding.

Quoted message said:

The touring bike is simply a lot more versatile.

Frank, this is probably just semantics, but a touring bike IS a road
bike. I think you're using "road bike" as being synonymous with

"racing

Quoted message said:

bike." It isn't.

Yes, I think it is just semantics. I agree, most touring bikes are
"road bikes" in any practical sense.

But the Buycycling magazine convention is to shorten "road racing bike"
(or "fast recreation road riding bike"😉 to "road bike."

Maybe we need new category names for bikes?

- Frank Krygowski

Peter Cole said:

Stephen Harding said:

Fit would definitely be the deciding factor between these two
bikes. I have a 520 and its a great bike. I've heard great
things about the Cannondale as well.

There's really nothing to differentiate these bikes in terms of fit.
Fit is a matter of picking the right size frame and tweaking various
things.

Cannondale Trek Surly26 Surly27

ST angle 73 73.5 73 73
HT angle 71.5 71 71 72
ST 21 21 21.3 22
TT 21.5 21.9 21.9 22.4
BB 11.1 10.6
WB 41.3 41.5 41.5 41.6
CS 18 17.7 18.1 18.1
OFF 2.1 2.0 1.8 1.8
TR 2.3 2.5

Didn't mean fit in the sense of frame geometry.

Meant in the classic "fit" sense. Do you have the
right seat? Seat height? Stem/handlebar height,
handlebar width, frame size, etc.

I'm still convinced there is no such thing as the
"perfect" frame size for someone. Stem, seatpost,
handlebar and seat adjustment make it so.

What I hadn't thought of was gearing. I bought my
520 12 years ago and it came with a 24/28 low end.
I've since put a 30 on the rear but the stock ratio
had been overwhelmingly sufficient for nearly all my
touring challenges! I guess Trek has slipped up in
later models.

SMH

David said:

Some people have a love hate relationship with the Bob Yak trailer. I,
for one, hated it with a vengeance!

Why do you hate this trailer ? I am interested in your opinion because I
heard good things about it (till now) and plan to buy one for our next
summer holidays.

Thanks for explaining

Jacques

Stephen Harding said:

Didn't mean fit in the sense of frame geometry.

Meant in the classic "fit" sense. Do you have the
right seat? Seat height? Stem/handlebar height,
handlebar width, frame size, etc.

I'm still convinced there is no such thing as the
"perfect" frame size for someone. Stem, seatpost,
handlebar and seat adjustment make it so.

Well, there's an ideal frame size. My point was that since the geometry
of these bikes is virtually identical, fit is no reason to select one
brand over the other.

I spent a lot of time on a trainer this winter, and out of boredom more
than anything else, started fooling around with every fit adjustment on
a new bike I built up. It was an interesting exercise. I think it's a
great way to dial in a bike. My idea of a perfect bike fit is to have
the bike "disappear". I think getting there is a bunch of subtle tweaks.

Jacques Moser said:

David said:

Some people have a love hate relationship with the Bob Yak trailer. I,
for one, hated it with a vengeance!

Why do you hate this trailer ? I am interested in your opinion because I
heard good things about it (till now) and plan to buy one for our next
summer holidays.

Thanks for explaining

What I don't like, it makes the bike react very slowly. It's like
driving a big rig. When you turn you turn wide. When you stop you
mkust account for the extra weight.

What I like, you can throw anything you want in there and go. Also
drivers give you a wide berth. Anything that gets you noticed while
riding is a good thing.

--
Linux Home Automation Neil Cherry [email hidden]
http://home.comcast.net/~ncherry/ (Text only)
http://hcs.sourceforge.net/ (HCS II)
http://linuxha.blogspot.com/ My HA Blog

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I'd recommend against a road bike, based on experience. I had to get
my daughter's road bike ready for that same trip, and it wasn't easy.
Tire sizes were limited. Gearing was too high. Fitting racks was a
pain. Fitting fenders was much more of a pain... etc.

Road bikes are meant for fast, unloaded riding. Using one for a tour
is like using a Mazda Miata to pull a camping trailer. It's not
impossible - but it's certainly not optimal.

OTOH, there's much less penalty involved in using a touring bike for
fast, unloaded riding. The touring bike is simply a lot more
versatile.

- Frank Krygowski

I'm definitely leaning toward a touring. Tire size, stability and they are
set up for front racks. I do plan on riding it unloaded for my short evening
rides also. I hadn't really considered gearing all that much, but I'm sure
it's a big factor. Any bike could be changed or tweaked to make it more
suitable for the task. A touring bike seems to fit what I want right out of
the box.

"Pat Lamb" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Not that Frank needs any defense, but he's following most of the major
bike manufacturers by putting touring bikes in a different category.
Trek, for instance, lists the 520 under "Specialty Bikes" on its web
site. Cannondale has "Performance Road," "Specialty Road," and
"Touring" categories.

Personally, I think they should list tourers under "Road" and what they
call road bikes under "Racing (Road)."

For the OP, I'd suggest a modification of the standard advice for any
bike is best. Find a good dealer in you area, one you can trust, that
has a touring bike in stock. Get the dealer to fit you to whatever
touring bike they carry. Most places I've been have zero to one touring
bike in the area; buy whatever they carry, and perhaps have it modified
(stem, gears, fenders, racks) to your needs. Don't worry about which
brand is a better bike unless you have to -- meaning you live near both
a Trek and a Cannondale (or Fuji, or Jamis, etc.) dealer who stocks
touring bikes.

If you are that lucky, where are you??

Pat

Where am I? About 70 miles east of Pittsburgh, Pa. I have within about 4
miles and about 2 blocks from each other, a Trek and a Cannondale dealer. I
may be partial to Cannondale, they are made in Pa. I like the guys at the
Cannondale dealer, they are very friendly and have invited us on club rides
and also to join the local club. As far as debating touring or road
classifications, I think we all know they are the same but different.
Toadman

"Bartow W. Riggs" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Cannondale T2000 if you can get one. Most comfy bike I ever owned,
excepting recumbent....

"Toadman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Right now my wife and I both have a Cannondale Adventure 400. We ride a
lot
on the local trails. I've been riding more on the roads lately. Riding
season is just getting started here in Western Pa. I did one solo self
contained camping trip last year, 115 miles with one over night stay. We
have a 200+ mile self contained camping trip on the WV Greenbrier River
Trail planned this year and I hope to do that same 115 mile trip again
this
year too. I also do a couple rides week nights after work, usually from

6

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

to
16 miles on local back roads. I'm considering buying a touring bike.
Cannondale T800 or Trek 520? Pros or cons? Any other touring bikes about
the
same price ($1200.00)? Would a road bike stand up to self contained
camping
trips? I did purchase a BoB YAK trailer this spring to hepl carry

camping

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

gear.

T2000 is getting a little to high priced!!

It's sounding more and more like the Cannondale T800. My other choices from
my LBSs are Specialized, Schwinn, Giant and some other brand which I forget.
I want to buy local. I work at a car dealership and I know what it's like to
have someone purchase a vehicle somewhere else then bring it to us and ask,
"Can you fix my car?". Our answer is usually, "We'll get to it right after
we finish fixing all our regular customer's vehicles, which may be 3 weeks
from now".