Reflector Rain Capes - Where to Find?

In article <[email hidden]>, Elisa Francesca Roselli

Quoted message said:

I would like some kind of outerwear for cycling in the rain. Ideally this would be something like
a hooded poncho, short enough not to get in the gears but large enough to go over my outerclothes
and backpack, in an extremely garish, dayglow color with reflector patches on all sides. It
should be completely waterproof and windbreaking but sufficiently breathable not to create a
sauna around me.

[...]

Quoted message said:

I'd find it hard to believe I'm the first to be having this problem?

Basically, you're imagining a problem where there is none; so, no wonder you can't find what
you're looking for.

Jeantex is selling a yellow rain cap which will do quite well. You can find it in general sport
store (Go-Sport (for sure) or Decathlon (most lokely)) and in bike shops.

Now, for the details :
- with a cape, there is absoletuly no need for breathable fabric. In fact, you want the most
waterproof possible fabric. By design, air circulates very well as the bottom is totally open.
Breathable fabric do not work for cyclists: we generate too much heat and sweat.

- for the reflectors. There is no magic in them! Contrary to popular belief, "invisible cyclists"
are both a myth and an excuse for criminal motorists to get away. Covering yourself in
reflective tape will not make you more visible or safe. The most important thing is to stand
where motorists look: on the road, well into the lane (1m off the gutter is a good rule of
thumb). The second important thing is an active front light. The third one is an active back
light (of the steady kind). Remember that most of the dangers will come from the front of you,
not from the back.

My personal rain cape is 25 year old, dark grey, bougth before reflectite (or even light:-) was
invented. I use it to commute when it rains or snows, and I've never been hit.

Jean-Pierre Nancy, France too:-)

Elisa said:

I would like some kind of outerwear for cycling in the rain. Ideally this would be something like
a hooded poncho, short enough not to get in the gears but large enough to go over my outerclothes
and backpack, in an extremely garish, dayglow color with reflector patches on all sides. It
should be completely waterproof and windbreaking but sufficiently breathable not to create a
sauna around me.

Alternatively, this could be a great big one-piece overall with a front zip long enough to step in
and out of, with remaining features similar. Or even a 2-piece rainsuit, large enough to go over
my day-clothes (since this will be for cycling to work and at work I wear long skirt and Victorian
blouse). But this solution is less attractive because it might have trouble getting over my
outerwear and bag.

I've been scouring the Internet for such garments and am surprised to find that they practically
do not exist. Why not? Why is there such a paucity of designs with reflector features? I have been
looking at industrial reflector rainclothes and finding that they tend to be in PVC! The rainsuits
in Illuminite or Gore-Tex are navy blue or black, really intelligent for visibility in gloomy
weather!

Yet the sites I've been visiting on the subject of safe riding in the rain all describe the kind
of garments I have in mind, and it seems obvious that there would be a market among cycling
commuters for such things.

Anyone have any pointers? I'm an excellent seamstress, so if even I could find a source of raw
materials - lime-green Gore-tex or Illuminite by the yard or stitch-on, velcro-on reflector
patches, I could fabricate something myself.

I'd find it hard to believe I'm the first to be having this problem?

Elisa Roselli Paris, France

Hey Elisa-- I'm crossposting this query to my other favorite NG. Someone there will provide a
source of high-vis rainwear fabric within hours. Add your own reflector stripes. I found an
fabulous selection on-line and now have enough sew-on Reflexite (r)(tm) to trim all my outerwear,
each bike bag, my riding partner nieces' outerwear, and a couple of car covers. Yes, it is
depressing that manufacturers believe we should wear dark colored outerwear. I jazz mine up, even
the winter coats that get worn only for auto travel. (Don't want to get hit in a parking lot by
some cretin juggling a fast food order and a cell phone.)

HTH --Karen M.

Quoted message said:

Elisa said:

I would like some kind of outerwear for cycling in the rain. Ideally this would be something like
a hooded poncho, short enough not to get in the gears but large enough to go over my outerclothes
and backpack, in an extremely garish, dayglow color with reflector patches on all sides. It
should be completely waterproof and windbreaking but sufficiently breathable not to create a
sauna around me.

Alternatively, this could be a great big one-piece overall with a front zip long enough to step
in and out of, with remaining features similar. Or even a 2-piece rainsuit, large enough to go
over my day-clothes (since this will be for cycling to work and at work I wear long skirt and
Victorian blouse). But this solution is less attractive because it might have trouble getting
over my outerwear and bag.

I've been scouring the Internet for such garments and am surprised to find that they practically
do not exist. Why not? Why is there such a paucity of designs with reflector features? I have
been looking at industrial reflector rainclothes and finding that they tend to be in PVC! The
rainsuits in Illuminite or Gore-Tex are navy blue or black, really intelligent for visibility in
gloomy weather!

if you go for a custom item, Illuminte is available in yellows and golds.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Anyone have any pointers? I'm an excellent seamstress, so if even I could find a source of raw
materials - lime-green Gore-tex or Illuminite by the yard or stitch-on, velcro-on reflector
patches, I could fabricate something myself.

I'd find it hard to believe I'm the first to be having this problem?

if you visit my tips for gear making site www.specialtyoutdoors.com/tips.htm you will find a full
list of outdoors fabrics retailers for the WORLD ( Europe, Canada, US) where you can get more
fabircs that you ever dreamed of, plus some cycling patterns. Haven't seem a poncho pattern tho, you
may have to draft that yourself. I have been making all my own cycling gear for 10+ years.

penny s

--
Specialty Outdoors Modification & Repair of Outdoor Gear & Clothing Factory Authorized by The North
Face www.specialtyoutdoors.com

Jean-Pierre Jacquot said:

Jeantex is selling a yellow rain cap which will do quite well. You can find it in general sport
store (Go-Sport (for sure) or Decathlon (most lokely)) and in bike shops.

You mean cape I presume? Great if Go Sport has them, I can check that out at my local branch
this weekend.

Quoted message said:

- with a cape, there is absoletuly no need for breathable fabric. In fact, you want the most
waterproof possible fabric.

Hadn't thought of that, good point.

Quoted message said:

- for the reflectors. There is no magic in them! Contrary to popular belief, "invisible
cyclists" are both a myth and an excuse for criminal motorists to get away. Covering yourself
in reflective tape will not make you more visible or safe.

But it could add weight to the prosecution if Mr Sarkozy sues the criminal motorist who hit me.
There's that little "Rouler sans danger" feature that comes on TF1 just before the news. The guy
advised cyclists to wear reflector vests, but gave no indication where these could be bought. The
road where I may be cycling next year is very dark, very bendy and has a very steep gradient. I'm
all for big lights, and plan to get a set at the rentrée, but I don't see how it would hurt to make
my contours visible as well. Motorists estimating on lights alone may have trouble gaging just how
wide I actually am. Also, my bike has enormous panniers, needed for shopping and transport, which
obscure the back light from the sides.

Quoted message said:

The second important thing is an active front light. The third one is an active back light (of
the steady kind). Remember that most of the dangers will come from the front of you, not from
the back.

Why is that so? I'm particularly scared of being siderolled by overtaking cars. The ones in front I
can see ....

Quoted message said:

My personal rain cape is 25 year old, dark grey, bougth before reflectite (or even light:-) was
invented. I use it to commute when it rains or snows, and I've never been hit.

And you are evidently a very experienced cyclist, who has no trouble signalling or looking behind
you. I'm a newbie of a few months whose balance gets thrown off by a summer breeze. I need the cars
around me to be very aware of me because I am deficient in being aware of them, even with the best
of intentions.

Quoted message said:

Jean-Pierre Nancy, France too:-)

J'adore le baroque polonais. : )

Elisa Roselli Ile de France

Penny S. said:

if you visit my tips for gear making site www.specialtyoutdoors.com/tips.htm you will find a full
list of outdoors fabrics retailers for the WORLD ( Europe, Canada, US) where you can get more
fabircs that you ever dreamed of, plus some cycling patterns.

Neat! Thanks for the pointer. We might end up having another hobby in common (apart from
cycling : ) )

Elisa Roselli Ile de France

Elisa Francesca Roselli scribbled :

Quoted message said:

Penny S. said:

if you visit my tips for gear making site www.specialtyoutdoors.com/tips.htm you will find a full
list of outdoors fabrics retailers for the WORLD ( Europe, Canada, US) where you can get more
fabircs that you ever dreamed of, plus some cycling patterns.

Neat! Thanks for the pointer. We might end up having another hobby in common (apart from
cycling : ) )

Elisa Roselli Ile de France

here's just some of the cycle gear I have made specialtyoutdoors.compgallery.htmOpen ↗
specialtyoutdoors.comflowerjersey.jpgOpen ↗
specialtyoutdoors.comwildjerseyf.jpgOpen ↗

Penny S

--
me and my bike: www.specialtyoutdoors.com/biking.htm

In article <[email hidden]>, Elisa Francesca Roselli

Quoted message said:

I would like some kind of outerwear for cycling in the rain. Ideally this would be something like a
hooded poncho, short enough not to get in the gears but large enough to go over my outerclothes and
backpack, in an extremely garish, dayglow color with reflector patches on all sides. It should be
completely waterproof and windbreaking but sufficiently breathable not to create a sauna around me.

A bicycle cape for $30:

campmor.comProductDisplayOpen ↗

I don't think the material is anything particularly breathable, but it's designed to stay open at
the bottom and keep you ventilated that way. I've never used this of thing, but people who have seem
to like it. My typical ride being less than 15 minutes, I avoid carrying around clothing that seems
overly bike-specific, so I use a jacket like this:

rei.comProductDisplayOpen ↗
0&langId=-1

Bright obnoxious yellow color, no hood (my head can get kinda wet but so far it hasn't bothered me
enough to do anything about it). No gore-tex or anything, but it has underarm vents and such. Works
OK. I've seen a lot of people claim that vents and such are more important than breathable material
for cyclists, but never having put up the money for any of those gold-plated breathable materials, I
wouldn't know.

I'm skeptical of hoods as I don't want something that'd obstruct my side-to-side vision, but maybe
someone with a hood can explain how they work around that problem.

--b.

Jean-Pierre Jacquot <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

- for the reflectors. There is no magic in them! Contrary to popular belief, "invisible
cyclists" are both a myth and an excuse for criminal motorists to get away. Covering yourself
in reflective tape will not make you more visible or safe. The most important thing is to
stand where motorists look: on the road, well into the lane (1m off the gutter is a good rule
of thumb). The second important thing is an active front light. The third one is an active
back light (of the steady kind). Remember that most of the dangers will come from the front
of you, not from the back.

Although lighting yourself up like a christmas tree can't hurt. Should the unfortunate ever happen,
you can then show the judge what you were wearing at the time--thereby giving a motorist *no chance*
of escape from justice.

-Luigi dum spiro, spero

In article <[email hidden]>, Elisa Francesca Roselli

Quoted message said:

Anyone have any pointers?

All kinds of outdoor clothing patterns & fabrics: justmakeit.comjustmakeit.comOpen ↗

Quoted message said:

I'm an excellent seamstress,

How I envy your sewing prowess :-) That's one skill I've never been able to acquire.

Quoted message said:

so if even I could find a source of raw materials - lime-green Gore-tex or Illuminite by the yard
or stitch-on, velcro-on reflector patches, I could fabricate something myself.

I'd find it hard to believe I'm the first to be having this problem?

I'm using a cycling rain cape that I obtained locally. It has a hood (it stuffs into a pocket in the
collar), but I never use
it. Hoods obscure sideways vision, and funnel rain right into one's face. If tightened with a
drawstring, they're restrictive, hot, and they look funny. So I use a separate helmet cover
with a flap down the back. To this day I haven't found anything that really keeps hair "nice"
after a ride of any length in the rain.

The rain cape itself is amply vented in the back, and has an inner, "draw string" sort of belt --
it's stitched to the back, and ties around the waist (inside the cape). Thumb loops on inside of the
front nap can be hooked around one's thumbs, or on the brake levers. Both the inside belt and the
thumb loops help keep the cape from getting wind-blown into one's face. An occasional application of
ScotchGard (the green label version) keeps it more-or-less rainproof.

If you can't find a real cycling rain cape, an army surplus rain poncho might be adaptable, with
the thumb loops and inner belt thing added on, and a vent cut across the back where the shoulder
blades would be.

Rain capes are nice & cool, cheap, and very portable. They also helps keep much of the bike cleaner
than it would otherwise be in the rain.

On the downside, they inhibit hand signals, catch headwinds, make mounting/dismounting one's bike a
little awkward, and can be a bit of a nuisance if going into a shop -- if left on, they get in the
way when reaching for stuff, and it makes one look like a shoplifter. If taken off, you're stuck
with a wet, drippy sheet of plastic draped over your arm, and then you've got to put this wet thing
back on for the return trip.

But they're well worth their price.

cheers, Tom

--
-- Powered by FreeBSD Above address is just a spam midden. I'm really at: tkeats [curlicue] vcn
[point] bc [point] ca

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>, Elisa Francesca Roselli

Quoted message said:

I would like some kind of outerwear for cycling in the rain. Ideally this would be something like
a hooded poncho, short enough not to get in the gears but large enough to go over my outerclothes
and backpack, in an extremely garish, dayglow color with reflector patches on all sides. It
should be completely waterproof and windbreaking but sufficiently breathable not to create a
sauna around me.

[...]

Quoted message said:

I'd find it hard to believe I'm the first to be having this problem?

Jean-Pierre Jacquot said:

Basically, you're imagining a problem where there is none; so, no wonder you can't find what
you're looking for.

Jeantex is selling a yellow rain cap which will do quite well. You can find it in general sport
store (Go-Sport (for sure) or Decathlon (most lokely)) and in bike shops.

Merci, bud. Appreciate the suggestion.

Quoted message said:

Now, for the details :
- with a cape, there is absoletuly no need for breathable fabric. In fact, you want the most
waterproof possible fabric. By design, air circulates very well as the bottom is totally open.
Breathable fabric do not work for cyclists: we generate too much heat and sweat.

Makes sense to me.

Quoted message said:

- for the reflectors. There is no magic in them! Contrary to popular belief, "invisible
cyclists" are both a myth and an excuse for criminal motorists to get away. Covering yourself
in reflective tape will not make you more visible or safe.

Covering yourself in tape is, indeed, counter productive.

Putting an outline on the cape, suggestive of a stick figure, is the most effective use of reflector
tape. BBC news item last year showed people recognized the 'stick figure' tape far further away than
horizonal applications of tape or an all-reflector suit.

Quoted message said:

The most important thing is to stand where motorists look: on the road, well into the lane (1m off
the gutter is a good rule of thumb).

Yep

Quoted message said:

The second important thing is an active front light. The third one is an active back light (of the
steady kind).

Why steady and not blinkies?

Quoted message said:

Remember that most of the dangers will come from the front of you, not from the back.

Can you source proof of that? We've had an awful lot of 'hit from behind' instances lately, enough
for me to replace my rearview with a larger mirror.

<snip>
--
Nobody but a fool goes into a federal counterrorism operation without duct tape - Richard Preston,
THE COBRA EVENT.

"Elisa Francesca Roselli" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I would like some kind of outerwear for cycling in the rain. Ideally this would be something like
a hooded poncho, short enough not to get in the gears but large enough to go over my outerclothes
and backpack, in an extremely garish, dayglow color with reflector patches on all sides. It
should be completely waterproof and windbreaking but sufficiently breathable not to create a
sauna around me.

Alternatively, this could be a great big one-piece overall with a front zip long enough to step in
and out of, with remaining features similar. Or even a 2-piece rainsuit, large enough to go over
my day-clothes (since this will be for cycling to work and at work I wear long skirt and Victorian
blouse). But this solution is less attractive because it might have trouble getting over my
outerwear and bag.

I've been scouring the Internet for such garments and am surprised to find that they practically
do not exist. Why not? Why is there such a paucity of designs with reflector features? I have been
looking at industrial reflector rainclothes and finding that they tend to be in PVC! The rainsuits
in Illuminite or Gore-Tex are navy blue or black, really intelligent for visibility in gloomy
weather!

Yet the sites I've been visiting on the subject of safe riding in the rain all describe the kind
of garments I have in mind, and it seems obvious that there would be a market among cycling
commuters for such things.

Anyone have any pointers? I'm an excellent seamstress, so if even I could find a source of raw
materials - lime-green Gore-tex or Illuminite by the yard or stitch-on, velcro-on reflector
patches, I could fabricate something myself.

I'd find it hard to believe I'm the first to be having this problem?

Elisa Roselli Paris, France

Motorcycle shops sell stuff like this; lots of bikers get caught in the rain, and like to have
something when it happens. When I had my Kawasaki, I kept a jacket and pants, and they had some
venting scheme where they wouldn't make you sweat like a pig. Probably find some useful items at
www.jcwhitney.com in the motorcycle section, or check this site out
www.motorcyclecruiser.com/streetsurvival/wetriding/ for info on a variety of rainsuits. Hope this
helps . . . --Tock

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>, Elisa Francesca Roselli

Quoted message said:

I would like some kind of outerwear for cycling in the rain. Ideally this would be something
like a hooded poncho, short enough not to get in the gears but large enough to go over my
outerclothes and backpack, in an extremely garish, dayglow color with reflector patches on all
sides. It should be completely waterproof and windbreaking but sufficiently breathable not to
create a sauna around me.

[...]

Quoted message said:

I'd find it hard to believe I'm the first to be having this problem?

Jean-Pierre Jacquot said:

Basically, you're imagining a problem where there is none; so, no wonder you can't find what
you're looking for.

Jeantex is selling a yellow rain cap which will do quite well. You can find it in general sport
store (Go-Sport (for sure) or Decathlon (most lokely)) and in bike shops.

Merci, bud. Appreciate the suggestion.

Quoted message said:

Now, for the details :
- with a cape, there is absoletuly no need for breathable fabric. In fact, you want the most
waterproof possible fabric. By design, air circulates very well as the bottom is totally
open. Breathable fabric do not work for cyclists: we generate too much heat and sweat.

Makes sense to me.

Quoted message said:

- for the reflectors. There is no magic in them! Contrary to popular belief, "invisible
cyclists" are both a myth and an excuse for criminal motorists to get away. Covering
yourself in reflective tape will not make you more visible or safe.

Covering yourself in tape is, indeed, counter productive.

Putting an outline on the cape, suggestive of a stick figure, is the most effective use of
reflector tape. BBC news item last year showed people recognized the 'stick figure' tape far
further away than horizonal applications of tape or an all-reflector suit.

Quoted message said:

The most important thing is to stand where motorists look: on the road, well into the lane (1m
off the gutter is a good rule of thumb).

Yep

Quoted message said:

The second important thing is an active front light. The third one is an active back light (of
the steady kind).

Why steady and not blinkies?

I've found that sometimes it's difficult to judge the distance to a blinking light, especially if
the flash is short.

....

--
David Kerber An optimist says "Good morning, Lord." While a pessimist says "Good Lord,
it's morning".

Remove the ns_ from the address before e-mailing.

Thu, 17 Jul 2003 17:42:53 GMT, <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] (John

Bartley K7AAY (ex-KGH2126)) said:

Quoted message said:

The second important thing is an active front light. The third one is an active back light (of the
steady kind).

Why steady and not blinkies?

Blinkies aren't legal in some European countries, like France. Secondly, they don't allow drivers to
judge distance accurately. They've great for attracting attention but a steady light, in addition to
the blinked is safer and may be required by local laws.

Recently our MVA has been amended to permit blinkies with integral reflectors as legally fulfilling
the requirement for bicycle to display a red reflector and a tail light to the rear.

Who are these IDIOTS that put them on the front too?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Remember that most of the dangers will come from the front of you, not from the back.

Can you source proof of that? We've had an awful lot of 'hit from behind' instances lately, enough
for me to replace my rearview with a larger mirror.

Figure it out. There can only be one direction for the strike to occur, whereas the three remaining
directions hold more potential conflicts. usroads.comri970805.htmOpen ↗

Most commonly a cyclist struck from behind is travelling without adequate lighting on unlit roads.
--
zk

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

Thu, 17 Jul 2003 17:42:53 GMT, <[email hidden]>, [email hidden]

(John Bartley K7AAY (ex-KGH2126)) said:

Quoted message said:

The second important thing is an active front light. The third one is an active back light (of
the steady kind).

Why steady and not blinkies?

Blinkies aren't legal in some European countries, like France. Secondly, they don't allow drivers
to judge distance accurately. They've great for attracting attention but a steady light, in
addition to the blinked is safer and may be required by local laws.

Recently our MVA has been amended to permit blinkies with integral reflectors as legally
fulfilling the requirement for bicycle to display a red reflector and a tail light to the rear.

Who are these IDIOTS that put them on the front too?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Remember that most of the dangers will come from the front of you, not from the back.

Can you source proof of that? We've had an awful lot of 'hit from behind' instances lately,
enough for me to replace my rearview with a larger mirror.

Figure it out. There can only be one direction for the strike to occur, whereas the three
remaining directions hold more potential conflicts.
usroads.comri970805.htmOpen ↗

Most commonly a cyclist struck from behind is travelling without adequate lighting on unlit roads.

Which is exactly why he wants reflectors on the back of his cape. Things coming from the sides and
the front have a much better chance of being seen and avoided by the rider than someone coming up
from behind.

--
Dave Kerber Fight spam: remove the ns_ from the return address before replying!

REAL programmers write self-modifying code.

I had a bicycle poncho once. I was in a parking lot somewhere, it started to rain, I got the poncho
out of my pannier and put it on, rode ten feet, got off the bike and put it back into the pannier.

When I turned my head to look back, all I saw was the inside of the hood.

But it *was* bright yellow. This was back when you could assemble a custom assortment of cogs on
your freewheel, and trade parts back and forth between different bicycles, and wheels were measured
in inches.

(I switched to dressing in silk and wool from the skin out so I wouldn't mind getting wet.)

Joy Beeson, who now regards fifteen miles as a long ride.
--
home.earthlink.net~joybeesonOpen ↗ -- needlework home.earthlink.net~beeson n3fOpen ↗ --
Writers' Exchange joy beeson at earthlink dot net

J. Bruce Fields said:

I'm skeptical of hoods as I don't want something that'd obstruct my side-to-side vision, but maybe
someone with a hood can explain how they work around that problem.

A tight-fitting hood with a drawstring tying under the chin to keep it firm around your face, will
turn with your head and not obscure your vision. It also doesn't blow back in the wind and keeps the
rain out better, so I would incoroprate such a feature in my design of the ideal rainwear. But
you're right, I have hooded anoraks which are like horse-blinkers, huge visibility reducers.

Elisa Roselli Ile de France

Zoot Katz said:

Blinkies aren't legal in some European countries, like France.

It's true, I was told they were ruled out because motorists found them more distracting
than helpful.

Elisa Roselli Ile de France

David Kerber said:

Which is exactly why he wants reflectors on the back of his cape. Things coming from the sides and
the front have a much better chance of being seen and avoided by the rider than someone coming up
from behind.

Thank you. Reflectors are in addition to good lights, not instead of, so I don't see why there's an
issue. Besides, I love reflector tape - it's all magical and sparkly like the sequins on my fairy
tutus when I was a kid.

Elisa Roselli Ile de France

Penny S. said:

here's just some of the cycle gear I have made specialtyoutdoors.compgallery.htmOpen ↗
specialtyoutdoors.comflowerjersey.jpgOpen ↗
specialtyoutdoors.comwildjerseyf.jpgOpen ↗

You coyld become a cottage industry! I love the purple boots!

Elisa Roselli Ile de France