Ephedra Ban - ABC News

"MPressman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Ephedra Users

Upset about the ban?

What's next? Are you stockpiling? Trying to get it elsewhere?

ABC News-20/20 is working on a report about Ephedra and what people are
doing about the impending ban. We would like to hear from you.

Please email Michael Pressman, producer, at

[email hidden]

Sending letters of thanks to the FDA.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

ABC News-20/20 is working on a report about Ephedra and what people are
doing about the impending ban. We would like to hear from you.

Please email Michael Pressman, producer, at

[email hidden]

Sending letters of thanks to the FDA.

I'll be posting a huge list of ephedra substitutes...
(of course most will be more dangerous than ephedra itself,
but that's what happens when you ban things!)

"Greg N" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

ABC News-20/20 is working on a report about Ephedra and what people

are

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

doing about the impending ban. We would like to hear from you.

Please email Michael Pressman, producer, at

[email hidden]

Sending letters of thanks to the FDA.

I'll be posting a huge list of ephedra substitutes...
(of course most will be more dangerous than ephedra itself,
but that's what happens when you ban things!)

Send a copy to the FDA with the subject as:

"Next"

....along with tobacco and alcohol.
Anth

"Mark ProbertJanuary 7, 2004" <[email hidden]> wrote in
message news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Greg N" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>
>
> ABC News-20/20 is working on a report about Ephedra and what people

are

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> doing about the impending ban. We would like to hear from you.
>
>
>
> Please email Michael Pressman, producer, at
>
> [email hidden]

Sending letters of thanks to the FDA.

I'll be posting a huge list of ephedra substitutes...
(of course most will be more dangerous than ephedra itself,
but that's what happens when you ban things!)

Send a copy to the FDA with the subject as:

"Next"

"MPressman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Ephedra Users

Upset about the ban?

What's next? Are you stockpiling? Trying to get it elsewhere?

ABC News-20/20 is working on a report about Ephedra and what people are
doing about the impending ban. We would like to hear from you.

Please email Michael Pressman, producer, at

[email hidden]

Thank you!!

Fernando Bernall, AP
Integrative Therapy Center
Saint Augustine, FL 32084

[posted and emailed]

"MPressman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Ephedra Users

Upset about the ban?

What's next? Are you stockpiling? Trying to get it elsewhere?

ABC News-20/20 is working on a report about Ephedra and what people are
doing about the impending ban. We would like to hear from you.

You should report how this product was allowed on the market
after similar products were banned in 1986. Report how the passing of the
DSHEA in 1994 allowed them on the market again and the bodies started
piling up again.

You should get in touch with Robert Baratz M.D, president of
the National Council Against Health Fraud.

Telephone: (617) 332-3063
E-mail: <[email hidden]>

If stupid people cannot use it safely, why not ban stupid people?
"Nana Weedkiller" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

[posted and emailed]

"MPressman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Ephedra Users

Upset about the ban?

What's next? Are you stockpiling? Trying to get it elsewhere?

ABC News-20/20 is working on a report about Ephedra and what people are
doing about the impending ban. We would like to hear from you.

You should report how this product was allowed on the market
after similar products were banned in 1986. Report how the passing of the
DSHEA in 1994 allowed them on the market again and the bodies started
piling up again.

You should get in touch with Robert Baratz M.D, president of
the National Council Against Health Fraud.

Telephone: (617) 332-3063
E-mail: <[email hidden]>

"mdd" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

If stupid people cannot use it safely, why not ban stupid people?

Why do you ASSume that all of those that died or had serious adverse events
(around 17K known people), that they were stupid? I know of one person who
had a not-too-serious adverse event and he is far from stupid.

Quoted message said:

"Nana Weedkiller" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

[posted and emailed]

"MPressman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Ephedra Users

Upset about the ban?

What's next? Are you stockpiling? Trying to get it elsewhere?

ABC News-20/20 is working on a report about Ephedra and what people

are

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

doing about the impending ban. We would like to hear from you.

You should report how this product was allowed on the market
after similar products were banned in 1986. Report how the passing of

the

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

DSHEA in 1994 allowed them on the market again and the bodies started
piling up again.

You should get in touch with Robert Baratz M.D, president of
the National Council Against Health Fraud.

Telephone: (617) 332-3063
E-mail: <[email hidden]>

"Mark ProbertJanuary 8, 2004" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

"mdd" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

If stupid people cannot use it safely, why not ban stupid people?

Why do you ASSume that all of those that died or had serious adverse events
(around 17K known people), that they were stupid? I know of one person who
had a not-too-serious adverse event and he is far from stupid.

Maybe your friend is just a little bit stupid. Or maybe the adverse
effects are directly related to the stupidity of those who use it. For
example:

If you're overweighted, are lazy, eat lots of cookies and milk, and
then try some stupid over the counter supplement with ephedra and
caffeine, and here let's remember that it was never ephedra by itself
that has cause the side effects. There were other substances such as
caffeine found in green tea. Imagine the effect of caffeine and
ephedra together. Hey, that's better than mama's little yellow
helpers! Hey, is cafeeine being banned also? Hell no! the coffe
industry is kind of powerful. So, and I digressed, the stupid customer
takes this supplement, well he/she gets stupid results!

Now, you've got some stupid athlete. That's right, just cause you can
pitch a ball really fast don't make that smart. And you want to stay
in "shape" and take some stupid over the counter supplement, which the
stupid guy over the GNC's counter said it was good for him, what do
you think is going to happen? You got it! Stupid side effects.

Now we have your friend, who is far from stupid. He's still stupid but
far from it. You see, stupidity is a matter of distance. Some are
close and others far. Stupid nonetheless, and he takes just a little
ephedra. He then reads the directions and sees that there's caffeine
and other stuff he can't really pronounce, and says "hey, what am I,
Stupid? Hell no! am far from stupid. Think I'll stop! So he, because
he's far from stupid (read-a little stupid) stops on time and only
gets, as you said "not too serious adverse events"

Hell too much water is bad for you! Let's ban the damn thing!

http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2003/06/08/1055010871581.html

So Mark, before you make some stupid statement about the subject. Do
some research. Don't leave it at the hands of the stupid folks at the
FDA. Think for yourself; it would be stupid of you not to.

Stupidly Yours,

Pete

"pete" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Mark ProbertJanuary 8, 2004" <[email hidden]> wrote

in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

"mdd" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

If stupid people cannot use it safely, why not ban stupid people?

Why do you ASSume that all of those that died or had serious adverse

events

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

(around 17K known people), that they were stupid? I know of one person

who

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

had a not-too-serious adverse event and he is far from stupid.

Maybe your friend is just a little bit stupid. Or maybe the adverse
effects are directly related to the stupidity of those who use it. For
example:

If you're overweighted, are lazy, eat lots of cookies and milk, and
then try some stupid over the counter supplement with ephedra and
caffeine, and here let's remember that it was never ephedra by itself
that has cause the side effects. There were other substances such as
caffeine found in green tea. Imagine the effect of caffeine and
ephedra together. Hey, that's better than mama's little yellow
helpers! Hey, is cafeeine being banned also? Hell no! the coffe
industry is kind of powerful. So, and I digressed, the stupid customer
takes this supplement, well he/she gets stupid results!

Now, you've got some stupid athlete. That's right, just cause you can
pitch a ball really fast don't make that smart. And you want to stay
in "shape" and take some stupid over the counter supplement, which the
stupid guy over the GNC's counter said it was good for him, what do
you think is going to happen? You got it! Stupid side effects.

Now we have your friend, who is far from stupid. He's still stupid but
far from it. You see, stupidity is a matter of distance. Some are
close and others far. Stupid nonetheless, and he takes just a little
ephedra. He then reads the directions and sees that there's caffeine
and other stuff he can't really pronounce, and says "hey, what am I,
Stupid? Hell no! am far from stupid. Think I'll stop! So he, because
he's far from stupid (read-a little stupid) stops on time and only
gets, as you said "not too serious adverse events"

Hell too much water is bad for you! Let's ban the damn thing!

http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2003/06/08/1055010871581.html

So Mark, before you make some stupid statement about the subject. Do
some research. Don't leave it at the hands of the stupid folks at the
FDA. Think for yourself; it would be stupid of you not to.

Stupidly Yours,

After reading your post, I take it back. Stupidity is rampant.

"Mark ProbertJanuary 8, 2004" <[email hidden]> wrote in

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

So Mark, before you make some stupid statement about the subject. Do
some research. Don't leave it at the hands of the stupid folks at the
FDA. Think for yourself; it would be stupid of you not to.

Stupidly Yours,

After reading your post, I take it back. Stupidity is rampant.

Thanks, good to see you come around and I'm glad to help. 🙂)

Pete

Please educate me:

Instead of banning products, why can't the FDA mandate that unregulated
products be packaged with a bright red warning label saying "USE AT YOUR OWN
RISK" and an insert listing the risks just like they require for
prescription meds? And as with tobacco and alcohol, make them dispensed by
a clerk that makes sure you are an adult and not an idiot.

From what I've read, there are many more deaths due to Tylenol yet it's
still legal to buy over the counter!

Gary

"Nana Weedkiller" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

[posted and emailed]

"MPressman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Ephedra Users

Upset about the ban?

What's next? Are you stockpiling? Trying to get it elsewhere?

ABC News-20/20 is working on a report about Ephedra and what people are
doing about the impending ban. We would like to hear from you.

You should report how this product was allowed on the market
after similar products were banned in 1986. Report how the passing of the
DSHEA in 1994 allowed them on the market again and the bodies started
piling up again.

You should get in touch with Robert Baratz M.D, president of
the National Council Against Health Fraud.

Telephone: (617) 332-3063
E-mail: <[email hidden]>

Gary said:

Please educate me:

Instead of banning products, why can't the FDA mandate that unregulated
products be packaged with a bright red warning label saying "USE AT YOUR OWN
RISK" ...

Because the natural progress of things is for liberty to yield and
government to gain ground.

-- Ron
http://ron.dotson.net/

You guys are stupid. How many people died last year from Epehdra?
300?? Thousands die from Aspirin and other OTC drugs like that every
year, but the DEA nail this one

"Gary" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Please educate me:

Instead of banning products, why can't the FDA mandate that unregulated
products be packaged with a bright red warning label saying "USE AT YOUR

OWN

Quoted message said:

RISK" and an insert listing the risks just like they require for
prescription meds?

The FDA is hamstrung by a law, DSHEA, passed through the lobbying efforts of
the dietary supplement industry, that prevents just this. Thus, the FDA must
wait until the dead bodies are stacked up like firewood before they can act,
and the only act they can do is to yank the chemcials off of the shelf.

DSHEA does not require the dietary supplement manufacturers to sumbits
reports of adverse events to the FDA. The industry is fighting tooth and
nail to prevent amending the law to require the maufacturers to submit such
reports. IOW, the industry still wants to hide out as long as possible and
rake in their gadzillions of dollars selling murderous brews.

Quoted message said:

And as with tobacco and alcohol, make them dispensed by
a clerk that makes sure you are an adult and not an idiot.

When you invent an 'idiotometer' you will be a very rich man.

Quoted message said:

From what I've read, there are many more deaths due to Tylenol yet it's
still legal to buy over the counter!

Can you post it?

And, Tylenol, when taken as on the package is not deadly. The supplement
manufacturers were so sloppy in their quality control that some of the
ephedra pills contains 3X the listed amount, so, someone who was following
direction could get a serious dose and wind up in thehospital or morgue.

"[email hidden]" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

You guys are stupid. How many people died last year from Epehdra?
300?? Thousands die from Aspirin and other OTC drugs like that every
year, but the DEA nail this one

When calling someone stupid, it is best not to point out that you may be
making a self-referential post.

It was not the DEA but the FDA.

"Mark ProbertJanuary 11, 2004" <[email hidden]> wrote
in message news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Gary" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Please educate me:

Instead of banning products, why can't the FDA mandate that unregulated
products be packaged with a bright red warning label saying "USE AT YOUR

OWN

Quoted message said:

RISK" and an insert listing the risks just like they require for
prescription meds?

The FDA is hamstrung by a law, DSHEA, passed through the lobbying efforts

of

Quoted message said:

the dietary supplement industry, that prevents just this. Thus, the FDA

must

Quoted message said:

wait until the dead bodies are stacked up like firewood before they can

act,

Quoted message said:

and the only act they can do is to yank the chemcials off of the shelf.

DSHEA does not require the dietary supplement manufacturers to sumbits
reports of adverse events to the FDA. The industry is fighting tooth and
nail to prevent amending the law to require the maufacturers to submit

such

Quoted message said:

reports. IOW, the industry still wants to hide out as long as possible and
rake in their gadzillions of dollars selling murderous brews.

Quoted message said:

And as with tobacco and alcohol, make them dispensed by
a clerk that makes sure you are an adult and not an idiot.

When you invent an 'idiotometer' you will be a very rich man.

Quoted message said:

From what I've read, there are many more deaths due to Tylenol yet it's
still legal to buy over the counter!

Can you post it?

And, Tylenol, when taken as on the package is not deadly. The supplement
manufacturers were so sloppy in their quality control that some of the
ephedra pills contains 3X the listed amount, so, someone who was following
direction could get a serious dose and wind up in thehospital or morgue.

Then the problem is with the manufacturers, not the product? Why not close
those manufacturers? Why ban the product? It is used for weight control, no?
Might we follow the money? A lot to be made in the weight control biz in the
US.

"mdd" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Mark ProbertJanuary 11, 2004" <[email hidden]> wrote
in message news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Gary" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Please educate me:

Instead of banning products, why can't the FDA mandate that

unregulated

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

products be packaged with a bright red warning label saying "USE AT

YOUR

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

OWN

Quoted message said:

RISK" and an insert listing the risks just like they require for
prescription meds?

The FDA is hamstrung by a law, DSHEA, passed through the lobbying

efforts

Quoted message said:

of

Quoted message said:

the dietary supplement industry, that prevents just this. Thus, the FDA

must

Quoted message said:

wait until the dead bodies are stacked up like firewood before they can

act,

Quoted message said:

and the only act they can do is to yank the chemcials off of the shelf.

DSHEA does not require the dietary supplement manufacturers to sumbits
reports of adverse events to the FDA. The industry is fighting tooth and
nail to prevent amending the law to require the maufacturers to submit

such

Quoted message said:

reports. IOW, the industry still wants to hide out as long as possible

and

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

rake in their gadzillions of dollars selling murderous brews.

Quoted message said:

And as with tobacco and alcohol, make them dispensed by
a clerk that makes sure you are an adult and not an idiot.

When you invent an 'idiotometer' you will be a very rich man.

Quoted message said:

From what I've read, there are many more deaths due to Tylenol yet

it's

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

still legal to buy over the counter!

Can you post it?

And, Tylenol, when taken as on the package is not deadly. The supplement
manufacturers were so sloppy in their quality control that some of the
ephedra pills contains 3X the listed amount, so, someone who was

following

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

direction could get a serious dose and wind up in thehospital or morgue.

Then the problem is with the manufacturers, not the product? Why not close
those manufacturers? Why ban the product? It is used for weight control,

no?

Quoted message said:

Might we follow the money? A lot to be made in the weight control biz in

the

Quoted message said:

US.

The problem is with the law. The FDA is hamstrung and the manufacturers want
it that way, and that is why they are fighting the amendments so hard.

"mdd" <[email hidden]> wrote in news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

"Mark ProbertJanuary 11, 2004" <[email hidden]>
wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

The FDA is hamstrung by a law, DSHEA, passed through the lobbying
efforts

of

Quoted message said:

the dietary supplement industry, that prevents just this. Thus, the
FDA

must

Quoted message said:

wait until the dead bodies are stacked up like firewood before they
can

act,

Quoted message said:

and the only act they can do is to yank the chemcials off of the
shelf.

DSHEA does not require the dietary supplement manufacturers to
sumbits reports of adverse events to the FDA. The industry is
fighting tooth and nail to prevent amending the law to require the
maufacturers to submit

such

Quoted message said:

reports. IOW, the industry still wants to hide out as long as
possible and rake in their gadzillions of dollars selling murderous
brews.

[snip]

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

And, Tylenol, when taken as on the package is not deadly. The
supplement manufacturers were so sloppy in their quality control that
some of the ephedra pills contains 3X the listed amount, so, someone
who was following direction could get a serious dose and wind up in
thehospital or morgue.

Then the problem is with the manufacturers, not the product? Why not
close those manufacturers? Why ban the product? It is used for weight
control, no? Might we follow the money? A lot to be made in the weight
control biz in the US.

Mark answered your "why not" above. Under the DSHEA, the FDA simply
*doesn't have* the option you want it to exercise. It has no authority to
do so. Its only legal options are to do nothing, or to order ephedra off
the market period. It does *not have* the authority to require
manufacturers of ephedra supplements to follow good manufacturing practices
and to shut down manufacturers who don't follow them. It does *not have*
the authority to require package inserts or warning levels. It does *not
have* the authority to regulate dietary supplements for purity or dosage
level. It *cannot* do any of those things unless Congress rewrites the
DSHEA.

The FDA is an agency of the executive branch of the US government. Under
our Constitution, federal agencies can't simply do as they please, even if
doing so would be considered the Right Thing by most people. They can only
do what Congress authorizes them to do. For the most part, that's a Good
Thing; our government is supposed to be "a government of laws, not men."
But in this case, it means that the FDA has its hands tied behind its back
by special-interest legislation. I wouldn't put it past the authors of the
DSHEA to have deliberately intended that the only possible regulation of
supplements would be extremely draconian and thus so unpopular as to stir
up public sentiment against any such attempts.

Once again, the DSHEA *prevents* the FDA from taking action against the
"bad apples." I suggest you complain to Senator Hatch's office.