opinions on "jamis xenith" and "kestrel talon sl"

Can't speak to the Jamis, but I've ridden a Kestrel 200 sci (the 'father' of Talon) for several years now. Kestrel makes fabulous carbon fiber frames - light and zippy. In addition to carbon's signature road vibration damping effects while still maintaining the 'feel' of the road, I've notice the rear triangle is very stiff - i.e., instant acceleration. There's some vertical compliance in the frame, making it comfortable for longer rides, and it doubles nicely as a time trial bike if you're so inclined.

Jamis fans speak up now...

I've ridden a jamis eclipse the last 3 years and love it. Its strong, pretty agile and quick.

I'll try to be politically correct here and not offend anyone. Be aware that a Kestrel Talon is not very American. It's manufactured by Martec in Taiwan - no bad thing because some of their stuff is very good but clearly may not be what you were thinking ? You can have a 'Pedalforce' for much less money - same bike but without the (expensive) Kestrel logo.
To be fair, Kestrel do, I believe, provide an excellent warranty which goes some way toward justifying the higher price tag.
Please no abuse from Kestrel owners - last time I looked at the Martec website they actually pictured a 'talon' complete with Kestrel stickers !

Quoted post said:

Originally posted by old&slow
I'll try to be politically correct here and not offend anyone. Be aware that a Kestrel Talon is not very American. It's manufactured by Martec in Taiwan - no bad thing because some of their stuff is very good but clearly may not be what you were thinking ? You can have a 'Pedalforce' for much less money - same bike but without the (expensive) Kestrel logo.
To be fair, Kestrel do, I believe, provide an excellent warranty which goes some way toward justifying the higher price tag.
Please no abuse from Kestrel owners - last time I looked at the Martec website they actually pictured a 'talon' complete with Kestrel stickers !

I have inspected the PedalForce ZX2 up close and personal, measured and weighed it and everything was to their published spec's. The PedalForce is a true monocoque frame with no gussets or lugs--it is a beautiful, continuously laid up frame much like the Look KG486. At the LBS I thought they had the PedalForce when I saw the KG486, but it was not the case! It is about as close to a clone of the 486 as you'll get and the layup and finish are fantastic.

I can tell you these are NOT the Kestrel, EPX, or other frames being mentioned, although they might be manufactured by Martec--they just aren't any of those on their website. I'll let you all know how mine works out.

In the meanwhile I talked with a Frenchman, who weighs 100kg (I asked). He built his PedalForce up with a DuraAce9 group and did expert level riding all summer with racing friends. He reported zero durability problems and was very impressed with the ride and climbing ability. He was very pleased and his friends were reportedly thinking of building their own.