Death on my local TT course

David Martin said:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/4140952.stm

Man, 72, dies in cycle time trial

Sad, but...

Quoted message said:

Of course, people will blame cycling and ignore the many hundreds of 72
year olds who die of a heart attack every year in Scotland..

....they will also ignore the large numbers who don't even make it to
seventy two but might have done if they'd exercised more.

Colin

Colin Blackburn said:

David Martin said:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/4140952.stm

Man, 72, dies in cycle time trial

Sad, but...

Quoted message said:

Of course, people will blame cycling and ignore the many hundreds of 72
year olds who die of a heart attack every year in Scotland..

...they will also ignore the large numbers who don't even make it to
seventy two but might have done if they'd exercised more.

ISTR they made mutterings about banning the L2B after one 47yo died
pushing up Ditchling Beacon (1 heart attack out of 27000 riders being
probably much less than the UK average for the day)

MartinM said:

Colin Blackburn said:

David Martin said:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/4140952.stm

Man, 72, dies in cycle time trial

Sad, but...

Quoted message said:

Of course, people will blame cycling and ignore the many hundreds of 72
year olds who die of a heart attack every year in Scotland..

...they will also ignore the large numbers who don't even make it to
seventy two but might have done if they'd exercised more.

ISTR they made mutterings about banning the L2B after one 47yo died
pushing up Ditchling Beacon (1 heart attack out of 27000 riders being
probably much less than the UK average for the day)

ISTR a friend involved in organising a scout Jamboree and expecting
3000+ attendees for 5 days. They anticipated needing counsellors to
deal with 10 close relative deaths during that period (a function of
the age and relationship of the attendees.)

One of the major failings of modern society is that they don't
understand statistics.

...d

"David Martin" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/4140952.stm

Man, 72, dies in cycle time trial
A 72-year-old man who was taking part in a five mile timed cycle event
in Fife has collapsed and died.
The man, from Glenrothes, collapsed while leaving the hamlet of
Giffordtown on the west side of Ladybank.

Emergency services were called after the man, who has not been named by
police, came off his bike shortly before 2000 BST on Wednesday.

The man was found to be dead when the ambulance crew arrived. There
were no other vehicles involved.

--

Of course, people will blame cycling and ignore the many hundreds of 72
year olds who die of a heart attack every year in Scotland..

Not a bad way to go -- doing something you love when bang, the grim reaper
taps you on the shoulder. No extended pain/goodbyes/getting your affairs in
order.

Sympathy to his family.

T

Tony W said:

Not a bad way to go -- doing something you love when bang, the
grim reaper taps you on the shoulder. No extended
pain/goodbyes/getting your affairs in order.

Agreed. Being fit and active enough to race bikes into your 70s also
has something to be said for it. We're all living on borrowed time.

Quoted message said:

Sympathy to his family.

Of course. When someone is apparently very fit the shock of a sudden
death must be that much greater for the relatives.

--
Dave...

in message <[email hidden]>, Tony W

(') said:

"David Martin" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/4140952.stm

Man, 72, dies in cycle time trial
A 72-year-old man who was taking part in a five mile timed cycle event
in Fife has collapsed and died.
The man, from Glenrothes, collapsed while leaving the hamlet of
Giffordtown on the west side of Ladybank.

Emergency services were called after the man, who has not been named
by police, came off his bike shortly before 2000 BST on Wednesday.

The man was found to be dead when the ambulance crew arrived. There
were no other vehicles involved.

Of course, people will blame cycling and ignore the many hundreds of
72 year olds who die of a heart attack every year in Scotland..

Not a bad way to go -- doing something you love when bang, the grim
reaper
taps you on the shoulder. No extended pain/goodbyes/getting your
affairs in order.

Sympathy to his family.

You beat me to it. I would not at all mind going that way.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

'Victories are not solutions.'
;; John Hume, Northern Irish politician, on Radio Scotland 1/2/95
;; Nobel Peace Prize laureate 1998; few have deserved it so much

"Simon Brooke" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

in message <[email hidden]>, Tony W

(') said:

"David Martin" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/4140952.stm

Man, 72, dies in cycle time trial
A 72-year-old man who was taking part in a five mile timed cycle event
in Fife has collapsed and died.
The man, from Glenrothes, collapsed while leaving the hamlet of
Giffordtown on the west side of Ladybank.

Emergency services were called after the man, who has not been named
by police, came off his bike shortly before 2000 BST on Wednesday.

The man was found to be dead when the ambulance crew arrived. There
were no other vehicles involved.

Of course, people will blame cycling and ignore the many hundreds of
72 year olds who die of a heart attack every year in Scotland..

Not a bad way to go -- doing something you love when bang, the grim
reaper
taps you on the shoulder. No extended pain/goodbyes/getting your
affairs in order.

Sympathy to his family.

You beat me to it. I would not at all mind going that way.

At 72? Or is next week okay too?

I want to live forever .. and not get old. But then I'll miss all the fun
things you can do when you get old ... (swearing at people, not needing to
use McDonalds loos if I need a wee, etc etc)

Simon Brooke said:

You beat me to it. I would not at all mind going that way.

Wot Simon and Dave said. A similar thing happened to an acquaintance last
year: URL:http://www.wisil.recumbents.com/wisil/murphy/billmurphy.htm

--
Dave Larrington - <http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk/>
Although the hippopotamus hath no sting in its tail, the wise man would
rather be seated upon the back of a bee.

Tony W said:

Not a bad way to go -- doing something you love when bang, the grim reaper
taps you on the shoulder. No extended pain/goodbyes/getting your affairs in
order.

Sympathy to his family.

That's the conundrum. Sudden death, great for the dying, absolutely the
worst for the family who find someone suddenly gone, feelings of guilt
and so much unsaid or undone. Drawn out death, [censored] for the dying but
family have time to say their goodbyes, do or say what they feel they
need to and come to terms with them going.

--
Tony

"I did make a mistake once - I thought I'd made a mistake but I hadn't"
Anon

Simon Brooke said:

You beat me to it. I would not at all mind going that way.

Well, I've extended myself beyond my own 'safe' capabilities
in the mountains (with backpack rather than bike) many times.
Sometimes I've been more than a little unsure of my survival,
but I consciously take the view that I'd rather go that way
than under some drunken cager, let alone after a long and
debilitating illness.

--
Nick Kew

On Thu, 11 Aug 2005 09:32:15 +0100 someone who may be Colin
Blackburn <[email hidden]> wrote this:-

Quoted message said:

...they will also ignore the large numbers who don't even make it to
seventy two

Indeed. There is going to be a funeral for one tomorrow, Robin Cook.

--
David Hansen, Edinburgh | PGP email preferred-key number F566DA0E
I will always explain revoked keys, unless the UK government
prevents me by using the RIP Act 2000.

There's only one thing in life that is certain - death. And what a way to
go, doing something you enjoy. Can any of us ask for any better? Doesn't
make it any easier for his family & friends though. Condolences to them. As
an aside, I wonder how many of every day's deaths that occur where no third
parties are involved actually get a full write up in the press - so yes,
people will probably blame cycling... erronously.

helen s

"David Martin" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Of course, people will blame cycling and ignore the many hundreds of 72
year olds who die of a heart attack every year in Scotland..

..d

And it's entirely possible that at least some of the anti-TT school of
thought within cycling will seek to blame TT-ing specifically. This comment
is *not* aimed at any individual here.

Cheers, helen s

wafflycat said:

"David Martin" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Of course, people will blame cycling and ignore the many hundreds of 72
year olds who die of a heart attack every year in Scotland..

..d

And it's entirely possible that at least some of the anti-TT school of
thought within cycling will seek to blame TT-ing specifically. This comment
is *not* aimed at any individual here.

I should point out that this unfortunate incident occurred not more
than a kilometer or so away from where four young people died when
their vehicle left the highway and rolled into the adjacent field.
I know which one I would prefer..

I actually get a kind of satisfaction looking at the obits column in
Cycle.. especially at the ages.

...d

"Tony Raven" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Sympathy to his family.

That's the conundrum. Sudden death, great for the dying, absolutely the
worst for the family who find someone suddenly gone, feelings of guilt
and so much unsaid or undone. Drawn out death, [censored] for the dying but
family have time to say their goodbyes, do or say what they feel they
need to and come to terms with them going.

Having nursed my Mum I would still go for the do it quick method --
particularly if doing something you love.

T

Quoted message said:

OK, it would be sad for the people left behind, but less
sad than watching me decline into senility or suffer pain.

On the contrary - I think I speak for a great many people here when I
say that we have been greatly enjoying watching your *continuing*
decline into senility. :-)

--
Peter Headland

Simon Brooke said:

That's the thing about dying suddenly - you don't know about it, so
you don't know it's going to happen, and you don't know it has
happened. I'd be happy for that to happen any time. OK, it would be
sad for the people left behind, but less sad than watching me decline
into senility or suffer pain.

"Suddenly" is often not actually instantaneous, though. There may be a
couple of minutes or just a few seconds while conscious to realise there
is a real chance of dying any moment.

I had an experience which left me unable to breathe for a couple of
minutes (except I didn't know I would be all right again in a couple of
minutes!). I was desperately wishing for time to get my thoughts in
order, say goodbye to people and to enjoy a calm slow peaceful death
instead of an extremely quick one full of the ultimate panic. I wasn't
ready!!! I don't know, maybe in a way this is as bad for the victim as a
slow painful death.

~PB

wafflycat said:

There's only one thing in life that is certain - death. And what a way to
go, doing something you enjoy.

Absolutely; I always get the "one day you'll kill yourself" from my mum
at the end of a long or strenuous ride, well if it's going to happen
it's almost as likely to happen sitting in front of the TV and I know
which I'd rather do. Many heart attack victims are the ones who don't
do enough cardio-vascular exercise for most of their life then overdo
it.
Still a great shame for the poor bloke and his family though, he
probably felt fit as a fiddle.

in message <[email hidden]>, Pete Biggs

(') said:

Simon Brooke said:

That's the thing about dying suddenly - you don't know about it, so
you don't know it's going to happen, and you don't know it has
happened. I'd be happy for that to happen any time. OK, it would be
sad for the people left behind, but less sad than watching me decline
into senility or suffer pain.

"Suddenly" is often not actually instantaneous, though. There may be a
couple of minutes or just a few seconds while conscious to realise
there is a real chance of dying any moment.

Been there, done that, the time I broke my back. Of course, I got lucky
that time - luckier than it's reasonable to expect to be, given that I
wasn't just not killed, I was also not paralysed..

Quoted message said:

I had an experience which left me unable to breathe for a couple of
minutes (except I didn't know I would be all right again in a couple of
minutes!). I was desperately wishing for time to get my thoughts in
order, say goodbye to people and to enjoy a calm slow peaceful death
instead of an extremely quick one full of the ultimate panic. I wasn't
ready!!! I don't know, maybe in a way this is as bad for the victim as
a slow painful death.

I learned when my father died that there is merit on being on good terms
with the world, because you sometimes don't get the opportunity to bury
old and no longer useful hatchets. I don't do grudges any more.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

;; ... exposing the violence incoherent in the system...