New invention. Hole less rim

http://www.abc.net.au/newinventors/txt/s1436418.htm

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I just watched this tonight on ABC...

The website says that the rims take upto 220kg loads, does anybody know
the loads for trials rims or any other rims for that matter? This could
be the way to stop that 26/29" rim from taco-ing... and yet... I am
wondering whether this rim would actually make much difference in the
side movement commonly experienced in trials unicycling, or even the
twisting in street and freestyle. Do any experienced engineers out their
have an idea, whether the fact that the rim no longer has holes in it
would greatly increase the horizontal stability of the rim, and on a
whole, the actual wheel itself???

It's almost 12:00pm, so this probably makes no sense... goodnight!

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I also posted a link from the New Inventors website directly to this
thread so that others can see what we were talking about and perhaps the
inventor himself will come and talk to this niche in the b*cycle
industry (if that is what we are a part of).

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ur said:

I just watched this tonight on ABC...

The website says that the rims take upto 220kg loads, does anybody know
the loads for trials rims or any other rims for that matter?

A well-built conventional touring-bike wheel will carry lots more than
that, so IF this is supposed to be stronger than a 'normal' rim, that
is presumably supposed to be some sort of measure of the strength of
an unlaced rim.

If so, it's pretty much irrelevant - because that's not how wheels
work. The combined action of rim and spoke and hub is what matters,
not how one bit behaves on its own. It's also impossible to compare
with other rims unless they actually define what they mean by "take up
to 220kg loads".

Regarding side loads, I'd guess it won't make all that much
difference, because when you're bending something it's the material at
teh extremes that contributes most of teh strength. For bending up
and down, avoiding teh spoke holes MIGHT have a significant effect,
because the holes are at the extreme (top) of the section. Bending
sideways, teh holes are half-way across teh section, and material
there will not be nearly as effective, so taking it out or putting it
back will be not nearly as significant.

But I haven't seen teh section, just the description posted here.

regards, Ian SMith
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It seems very unlikely that this modification makes a significant
difference to the strength of the wheel. The strength of a wheel comes
from the spoke tension, not the rim material; the strength of the rim
material matters only insofar as it's required to support a high level
of spoke tension. From the looks of it, this system would not be able
to support as high a level of spoke tension as a good rim (those inserts
look like they'd want to pull out).

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It says 220kg spoke load. Maybe they mean the spoke tension in Kgf,
which is what spoke tension meters measure. I'm not sure what that
means and how that relates to the weight a wheel can take, but that's
well above the amount normal wheels are built to, which is only up to
150 or so according to Mr Park Tools.

Joe

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It is an interesting idea because of the ability to have different
numbers of spokes.

It won't make the rim lighter, because it has a continuous spoke-rim
interface, rather than selectively placed ones.

It also won't support higher tension, one of the primary aspects of
wheel strength. The limiting factor in spoke tension, for the better
rims, is not hole strength, but brace angle and the rim's torsional
stiffness. These attributes are unaffected by the new idea.

Additionally, it appears to make replacing a nipple/spoke impossible
without rebuilding the entire wheel. This is a no-go item in my mind.

It multiplies the number of parts required to build a wheel.

The only real advantage I see is that it allows the nipple to pivot to
follow the spoke line, but this is not much of an advantage for larger
wheels, especially 3x.

Oh, and it provides lots of advertising space! 🙁

Overall -- two thumbs down.

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It is an interesting idea because of the ability to have different
numbers of spokes.

It won't make the rim lighter, because it has a continuous spoke-rim
interface, rather than selectively placed ones.

It also won't support higher tension, one of the primary aspects of
wheel strength. The limiting factor in spoke tension, for the better
rims, is not hole strength, but brace angle and the rim's torsional
stiffness. These attributes are unaffected by the new idea.

Additionally, it appears to make replacing a nipple/spoke impossible
without rebuilding the entire wheel. This is a no-go item in my mind.

It multiplies the number of parts required to build a wheel.

The only real advantage I see is that it allows the nipple to pivot to
follow the spoke line, but this is not much of an advantage for larger
wheels, especially 3x.

Oh, and it provides lots of advertising space! 🙁

Overall -- two thumbs down.

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According to a brief read of the web site linked above, the purpose of
this design is to prevent air leaking through the spoke holes when using
tubeless tires. The benefits for "regular" tires may not be as apparent.

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more here

http://www.velocitywheels.com/zvino.htm

It looks like the inserts hold a nipple in them, so you may be able to
unscrew a broken spoke from the nipple and rescrew in a new one. Maybe
without the bend at the nipple, you've got less chance of breaking that
end of the spoke than at the hub. Supposedly the load is spread over a
larger area of the rim by the way the spokes are attached, does that
make any difference?

Joe

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Quoted message said:

-Originally posted by johnfoss-*
the purpose of this design is to prevent air leaking through the spoke
holes when using tubeless tires. The benefits for "regular" tires may
not be as apparent.*

This benefit is deceptive; the proper rim strip does just as well with
the advantage of being much lighter than the corresponding metal.

joemarshall said:

*more here

http://www.velocitywheels.com/zvino.htm

It looks like the inserts hold a nipple in them, so you may be able to
unscrew a broken spoke from the nipple and rescrew in a new one. *

But how do you get the inserts out to change a nipple?

Quoted message said:

*
Maybe without the bend at the nipple, you've got less chance of
breaking that end of the spoke than at the hub. *

Actually the bend for a typical 700c wheel is very very slight anyway.
And that's not where spokes break, they break at the 90 degree bend near
the head, due to fretting, usually from an undertensioned wheel.

Quoted message said:

*
Supposedly the load is spread over a larger area of the rim by the way
the spokes are attached, does that make any difference? *

Normal good-quality rims have either thickened metal around the spoke
hole, or make use of eyelets, which both accomplish the same thing.
Ditto for the wide-flange nipples I use on the Coker wheels.

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i want to try those Velo plugs.

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An interesting concept for spoke attachment, though I've seen similar
methods for attaching other stuff (that works well), but there's not
nearly enough information for anything other than a cursory evaluation.
I guess they won’t want to give to much info out (patent pending). I've
always considered the traditional method of spoke to rim and spoke to
hub attachment, though perfectly functional, a little antiquated.

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U-Turn said:

*It is an interesting idea because of the ability to have different
numbers of spokes.

It won't make the rim lighter, because it has a continuous spoke-rim
interface, rather than selectively placed ones.

It also won't support higher tension, one of the primary aspects of
wheel strength. The limiting factor in spoke tension, for the better
rims, is not hole strength, but brace angle and the rim's torsional
stiffness. These attributes are unaffected by the new idea.

Additionally, it appears to make replacing a nipple/spoke impossible
without rebuilding the entire wheel. This is a no-go item in my
mind.

It multiplies the number of parts required to build a wheel.

The only real advantage I see is that it allows the nipple to pivot to
follow the spoke line, but this is not much of an advantage for larger
wheels, especially 3x.

Oh, and it provides lots of advertising space! 🙁

Overall -- two thumbs down. *

I think it goes . . .

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Then they honor.

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U-Turn said:

*...
In this case, the inventor appears to be trying to solve a problem
that either 1) does not exist, or 2) only exists for manufacturers.
In this implementation, it appears to add several disadvantages to the
user.
... *

Yes, I think the only immediately significant benefit is that it
eliminates the secondary operation of drilling the spoke holes in the
extrusion before it is rolled into a rim. It will roll more smoothly
without holes also. Both of those things benefit the manufacturer.
At first the idea of being easier to seal for tubeless sounds great.
But, as Dave said, I think rim strips do a good job of that. The
biggest leakage problems seem to be at the tire bead.

It may catch on but it will start with the most popular sizes in the
bicycle market, most of which we don't use anyway.

I do think it looks cool though.

Scott

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