Back Pedal Brakes-Why not in England?

"Brian Millson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I understand that backpedal brakes are unusual in Britain. Is there any
particular reason for this? They seem to work well enough and don't tie
up
the hands so much.

Brian Millson

Because it's staggeringly easy to use ordinary brakes????

Cheers, helen s

"Brian Millson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I understand that backpedal brakes are unusual in Britain. Is there any
particular reason for this? They seem to work well enough and don't tie
up
the hands so much.

My experience with them is limited but I've never come across one that
offers half the braking power of a conventional rim brake. That and the
fact that you can't flick the pedals back to align them for mounting etc.
mean that I don't miss them at all (I spent some years in the US as a
child).

Tim

Brian Millson said:

About a week ago I got a Bauer Trisalu and I have had a great time with
it-put on 150 kilometres in the last 10 days. I live in a British Forces
community here in Germany and I have had quite a few comments - not only on
the cycle itself but also on the back pedal brakes (there are front
handbrakes) which are common here as well as Canada where I am from.

I understand that backpedal brakes are unusual in Britain. Is there any
particular reason for this? They seem to work well enough and don't tie up
the hands so much.

Two reasons really. One is brakes on the back wheel have very little
braking effect because the weight transfers onto the front wheel during
braking. And for that you have to give up the ability to flip the
pedals backwards to where you want them.

--
Tony

"I did make a mistake once - I thought I'd made a mistake but I hadn't"
Anon

in message <[email hidden]>, Brian Millson

(') said:

About a week ago I got a Bauer Trisalu and I have had a great time with
it-put on 150 kilometres in the last 10 days. I live in a British
Forces community here in Germany and I have had quite a few comments -
not only on the cycle itself but also on the back pedal brakes (there
are front handbrakes) which are common here as well as Canada where I
am from.

I understand that backpedal brakes are unusual in Britain. Is there
any
particular reason for this? They seem to work well enough and don't
tie up the hands so much.

We have these things called hills - you may have heard of them.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

;; An enamorata is for life, not just for weekends.

Brian Millson said:

About a week ago I got a Bauer Trisalu and I have had a great time with
it-put on 150 kilometres in the last 10 days. I live in a British Forces
community here in Germany and I have had quite a few comments - not only on
the cycle itself but also on the back pedal brakes (there are front
handbrakes) which are common here as well as Canada where I am from.

I understand that backpedal brakes are unusual in Britain. Is there any
particular reason for this? They seem to work well enough and don't tie up
the hands so much.

wot the others said, plus it's down to demand; Last time I rode in
Holland 99% of the bikes I saw were sit up and beg boneshakers or
hybrids; you would not find a BBB to fit most of the road bikes and
MTB's over here. Plus we have hills in the UK ;-)

Brian Millson said:

I understand that backpedal brakes are unusual in Britain. Is there any
particular reason for this? They seem to work well enough and don't tie up
the hands so much.

Brian Millson

Nay, tis devilry from the New World !

He be a witch,burn him !!!

Brian Millson said:

I understand that backpedal brakes are unusual in Britain. Is there any
particular reason for this? They seem to work well enough and don't tie
up the hands so much.

I've got one British (English even!) bike with backpedal rear brake. It
works OK within the context of a single speed, local use only, bike. For
any stop that I can see in advance I use the back brake -- thinking about
where I want the pedals to be for starting off again. For an emergency
stop I use the front and sort out the pedals afterwards.

Overall it takes some practice to make a clean stop with a back-pedal
brake, where "clean" includes being able to set off again without messing
about. For a cyclist who habitually "scoots" to start off it makes no
difference.

Of the derailleur equipped bikes I ride most, one can be started off in
almost any gear and have a rapid change down as soon as moving, but
another _must_ be started in a pretty low gear and so needs some rapid
changing while the brakes are applied before stopping.

Mike

Brian Millson said:

About a week ago I got a Bauer Trisalu and I have had a great
time with it-put on 150 kilometres in the last 10 days. I
live in a British Forces community here in Germany and I have
had quite a few comments - not only on the cycle itself but
also on the back pedal brakes (there are front handbrakes)
which are common here as well as Canada where I am from.

I understand that backpedal brakes are unusual in Britain. Is
there any particular reason for this? They seem to work well
enough and don't tie up the hands so much.

Brian Millson

I used to have one back in the '70s, I think it was a Polish import.
--
the.Mark

Brian Millson said:

I understand that backpedal brakes are unusual in Britain. Is there any
particular reason for this? They seem to work well enough and don't tie up
the hands so much.

Apart from the vast difference in breaking power that was already
mentioned, speed is also a matter for me. In urban traffic I want to
be able to break very quickly, and backpedalling would just take too
long.

Maybe it comes down to the speed of cycling.

Robert

"Brian Millson" wrote ...

Quoted message said:

About a week ago I got a Bauer Trisalu and I have had a great time with
it-put on 150 kilometres in the last 10 days. I live in a British Forces
community here in Germany and I have had quite a few comments - not only
on
the cycle itself but also on the back pedal brakes (there are front
handbrakes) which are common here as well as Canada where I am from.

I understand that backpedal brakes are unusual in Britain. Is there any
particular reason for this? They seem to work well enough and don't tie
up
the hands so much.

Brian Millson

I remember Sachs Torpedo 3 speed hubs w/ backpedal (coaster) brakes from a
childhood in Germany in the late '60s/early '70s. I also remember Bauer
bicycles being well thought of back then, thanks for bringing back the
memories.

As I remember, the effectiveness of the backpedal brakes varied pretty
widely depending on which of the gears the hub was in, and when the bike was
in 3rd gear and moving fast the brakes were at their weakest. Backpedal
brakes are a great low maintenance system for trundling about slowly on
gravel bikepaths, but anyone who cycles in traffic or moves at more than 20
km/h will quickly appreciate the faster response and greater stopping power
of a brake that stops the front wheel.
--
mark

Brian Millson said:

About a week ago I got a Bauer Trisalu and I have had a great time with
it-put on 150 kilometres in the last 10 days. I live in a British Forces
community here in Germany and I have had quite a few comments - not only on
the cycle itself but also on the back pedal brakes (there are front
handbrakes) which are common here as well as Canada where I am from.

I understand that backpedal brakes are unusual in Britain. Is there any
particular reason for this? They seem to work well enough and don't tie up
the hands so much.

Because they are generally [censored] ans suitable for trundling around town.
Of course there is a good argument that the UK could do with more
"trundling around town" bikes (and indeed TAT cycling) but the the
industry is focussed on wannabe racers.

James

In message <[email hidden]>, Robert Kiessling
<[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

Brian Millson said:

I understand that backpedal brakes are unusual in Britain. Is there any
particular reason for this? They seem to work well enough and don't tie up
the hands so much.

Apart from the vast difference in breaking power that was already
mentioned,

I had back pedal brake (in a Sachs super 7 hub gear hub) on my utility
bike (a converted MTB) that I used in London and Leeds. I'm not sure I
agree with the comment about braking power, I could quite easily lock up
the back wheel with mine. Remember, we are talking about the back brake,
if you want to stop quickly you need to employ the front brake anyway.

Quoted message said:

speed is also a matter for me. In urban traffic I want to
be able to break very quickly, and backpedalling would just take too
long.

Maybe it comes down to the speed of cycling.

I found a back pedal brake to be excellent for urban traffic jamming,
and cycling at fair lick, not just pootling. IME a lot of the time you
don't need to be braking hard, what's required is more gentle braking
to adjust the speed to match the traffic, slow you down as you approach
lights, or while waiting for the approaching gap to overtake something.

Coaster brakes are excellent for this, I really missed mine around town
when I swopped onto my tourer. you do need to practice with them for bit
though to get sued to them, and I think it does encourage a slightly
different style of riding - possibly a bit smoother, which si no bad
thing.

Now they aren't good emergency brake, but then no rear brake is, when
the time comes to stop quickly, the front brake needs employing anyway.

And for utility/town bikes they have the advantage of extremely low
maintenance, and of working just as well when pouring rain or in foot
of snow. disks are good, but I never felt so safe on a rim braked bike
as I did on my hub braked bike (it had front drum brake as well) around
town in the rain.

I only stopped using mine when I started towing kiddie trailer around
Yorkshire and felt the need for some lower gears. I still it and may
yet put it back on the bike, now I live in the land of pimples (aka
Cambridgeshire....)

Re the op's question. I think the reason they aren't common in the uk is
the lack of much of utility cycling culture in most of the uk - which
si where the market is for these I imagine. so even when people do by
bikes for around town journeys etc. they often end up buying bikes
which are sub optimal for their use often because hub gears, and hub
brakes , back pedal brakes just aren't seen on most bikes
--
Chris French

On 28/8/05 00:13, in article [email hidden], "chris

French said:

I had back pedal brake (in a Sachs super 7 hub gear hub) on my utility
bike (a converted MTB) that I used in London and Leeds. I'm not sure I
agree with the comment about braking power, I could quite easily lock up
the back wheel with mine. Remember, we are talking about the back brake,
if you want to stop quickly you need to employ the front brake anyway.

Quoted message said:

speed is also a matter for me. In urban traffic I want to
be able to break very quickly, and backpedalling would just take too
long.

Maybe it comes down to the speed of cycling.

I found a back pedal brake to be excellent for urban traffic jamming,
and cycling at fair lick, not just pootling. IME a lot of the time you
don't need to be braking hard, what's required is more gentle braking
to adjust the speed to match the traffic, slow you down as you approach
lights, or while waiting for the approaching gap to overtake something.

Coaster brakes are excellent for this, I really missed mine around town
when I swopped onto my tourer. you do need to practice with them for bit
though to get sued to them, and I think it does encourage a slightly
different style of riding - possibly a bit smoother, which si no bad
thing.

I think possibly the reason back pedal brakes are not liked in the UK is
that they are considered damnably UnEnglish. I have been in the UK on and
off for 23 years and am a citizen now and it does strike me sometimes how
resistant people can be to good ideas from other places. Been trying for
years to convince sister-in-law (Chinese but living in Yorkshire for 30
years) about the benefits of hardwood flooring.

Quoted message said:

And for utility/town bikes they have the advantage of extremely low
maintenance, and of working just as well when pouring rain or in foot
of snow. disks are good, but I never felt so safe on a rim braked bike
as I did on my hub braked bike (it had front drum brake as well) around
town in the rain.

Really, utility/town bikes are just the thing for most people.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Re the op's question. I think the reason they aren't common in the uk is
the lack of much of utility cycling culture in most of the uk - which
si where the market is for these I imagine. so even when people do by
bikes for around town journeys etc. they often end up buying bikes
which are sub optimal for their use often because hub gears, and hub
brakes , back pedal brakes just aren't seen on most bikes

Having lived in a lot of places around England over the years-Cambridge,
London, Wiltshire and my own home county of North Yorkshire and other parts
of the world too- it does strike me how many people have the wrong cycle for
what they do. I lived near the Rockies in Canada for a couple of years-good
place for a mountain bike, good place for 4 wheel drive-yet I see more of
both in London. You do not need a Range Rover to do the School run in
Chelsea!! SUV = Supremely Useless Vehicle :-). It does seem to be part of
the posing culture.

They do seem to be a bit more sensible in this part of the world
(Dutch/German border) with step-thru upright city bikes. Certainly not the
thing for everyone but I think it would suit most cyclists in their day to
day cycling.

BTW Velo Vision has done an excellent article this month testing City Bikes.

I have found the back pedal brake easy to use and excellent for coasting.
But then again I have known nothing else, but I like it.

Brian Millson

chris French said:

And for utility/town bikes they have the advantage of extremely low
maintenance, and of working just as well when pouring rain or in foot
of snow. disks are good, but I never felt so safe on a rim braked bike
as I did on my hub braked bike (it had front drum brake as well)
around town in the rain.

Roller brakes have the same advantages as coasters without interfering
with back-pedalling.

~PB

In message <[email hidden]>, Pete Biggs
<[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

chris French said:

And for utility/town bikes they have the advantage of extremely low
maintenance, and of working just as well when pouring rain or in foot
of snow. disks are good, but I never felt so safe on a rim braked bike
as I did on my hub braked bike (it had front drum brake as well)
around town in the rain.

Roller brakes have the same advantages as coasters without interfering
with back-pedalling.

I now have one on the bike instead. It does shares the advantages of
being enclosed, and of having low maintenance, but it doesn't have the
advantage of being pedal operated, which I do like for my coaster brake.

And I don't think it such a good brake.
--
Chris French

Brian Millson said:

I understand that backpedal brakes are unusual in Britain. Is there any
particular reason for this? They seem to work well enough and don't tie up
the hands so much.

Sturmey used to do a Tricoaster (3-speed + back pedal brake) but the
fashion for derailleur gears put paid to that. You'll only find a few
bikes with coaster brakes in the UK 'cos most people want more than 1
gear. I have a couple of bikes with coaster brakes - one's a Cresswell
Micro with a Sachs 2-speed coaster hub, t'other is a track racing
machine dating from about 1900.

--
Andrew

Brian Millson said:

I think possibly the reason back pedal brakes are not liked in the UK is
that they are considered damnably UnEnglish.

Makes sense (as an explanation).

Backpedal brakes have many advantages, from reduced maintenance and
hassle, to reduced risk of catastrophic failure, to being operated
by the strongest and most reliable muscles in the body rather than
fingers that can suffer and lose power on a big downhill, in the
cold, etc. But I guess "foreign" outweighs all of that.

--
Nick Kew

Nick Kew said:

Brian Millson said:

I think possibly the reason back pedal brakes are not liked in the UK is
that they are considered damnably UnEnglish.

Makes sense (as an explanation).

Backpedal brakes have many advantages, from reduced maintenance and
hassle, to reduced risk of catastrophic failure, to being operated
by the strongest and most reliable muscles in the body rather than
fingers that can suffer and lose power on a big downhill, in the
cold, etc. But I guess "foreign" outweighs all of that.

No doubt they are all Rover drivers :-))

Why do some Englishman think that cycles with backpedal brakes only have one
gear????

Brian

In message <[email hidden]>, Naqerj
<[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

Brian Millson said:

I understand that backpedal brakes are unusual in Britain. Is there
any
particular reason for this? They seem to work well enough and don't tie up
the hands so much.

Sturmey used to do a Tricoaster (3-speed + back pedal brake) but the
fashion for derailleur gears put paid to that. You'll only find a few
bikes with coaster brakes in the UK 'cos most people want more than 1
gear.

That's fine, my Sachs hub gear/coaster brake has 7. Even in a hilly city
like Leeds that was a sufficient number/range of gears.

--
Chris French