York-Edinburgh ?410k

MartinM said:

MSeries (and anyone else FTM); are you still keen on doing this? no
great hurry to arrange a date but would be nice to have a rough idea so
I can make the most of any cheap fares before they go up.

Yes. I was thinking of May/June next year to take advantage of the long
days especially further north. When is your preference ? Sooner ? I am
fit enough now but don't think I want to be riding all night in the
middle of nowhere in the autumn/winter

MSeries said:

MartinM said:

MSeries (and anyone else FTM); are you still keen on doing this? no
great hurry to arrange a date but would be nice to have a rough idea so
I can make the most of any cheap fares before they go up.

Yes. I was thinking of May/June next year to take advantage of the long
days especially further north. When is your preference ? Sooner ? I am
fit enough now but don't think I want to be riding all night in the
middle of nowhere in the autumn/winter

May / June is fine, avoiding the Bank hols. Probably late May best for
me. We were talking about this at the TotH, the concensus was it would
have to be a hostel dart to qualify as an official event (but it will
not qualify as part of a SR, they need to be calendered or Perm).
Presumably there is a hostel at the Edinburgh end?

MartinM said:

MSeries said:

MartinM said:

MSeries (and anyone else FTM); are you still keen on doing this? no
great hurry to arrange a date but would be nice to have a rough idea so
I can make the most of any cheap fares before they go up.

Yes. I was thinking of May/June next year to take advantage of the long
days especially further north. When is your preference ? Sooner ? I am
fit enough now but don't think I want to be riding all night in the
middle of nowhere in the autumn/winter

May / June is fine, avoiding the Bank hols. Probably late May best for
me. We were talking about this at the TotH, the concensus was it would
have to be a hostel dart to qualify as an official event (but it will
not qualify as part of a SR, they need to be calendered or Perm).
Presumably there is a hostel at the Edinburgh end?

There are several hostels in Edniburgh and one in York. I believe YH
Darts can start from a hostel rather than finish, do they have to end
or start at home though or is that simply an example so once can get
some points for a ride to a hostel weekend. I emailed Sheila Simpson
who 'manages' the DIY Perms (in the Perms section of the website it has
a page for DIY 400) and she said such a ride would qualify for points,
I didn't ask about SR series though.

Late May might be OK, I did the West Yorks DA 400 to Spurn Head this
year in late May and if it or a replacement runs next year will be
doing it again. We'll sort exact day when the calendar comes out if
thats Ok with you.

MSeries said:

There are several hostels in Edniburgh and one in York. I believe YH
Darts can start from a hostel rather than finish, do they have to end
or start at home though or is that simply an example so once can get
some points for a ride to a hostel weekend. I emailed Sheila Simpson
who 'manages' the DIY Perms (in the Perms section of the website it has
a page for DIY 400) and she said such a ride would qualify for points,
I didn't ask about SR series though.

Late May might be OK, I did the West Yorks DA 400 to Spurn Head this
year in late May and if it or a replacement runs next year will be
doing it again. We'll sort exact day when the calendar comes out if
thats Ok with you.

How much route planning would need to be done before hand? ie location
of suitable controls, especially at night, and would you be planning
night first or last? It would possibly be better to start off in the
evening and ride through the night first. Controls/refuelling may be
more problematic at odd hours as you get further north unless you
follow the major road routes (A1/M6/A7 etc.)

Time to start pitching in known good cafe's? If you are going through
Galashiels, then 'The Ginger Jar' is a nice spot, and would be a great
last stop before the finish. It's just as you leave Galashiels on the
A7 towards Edinburgh.

...d

MSeries said:

Late May might be OK, I did the West Yorks DA 400 to Spurn Head this
year in late May and if it or a replacement runs next year will be
doing it again. We'll sort exact day when the calendar comes out if
thats Ok with you.

yes fitting in around other rides will be the issue, plus I want to do
the Marmotte so would like to leave about a month between the two. I do
not intend to use the hostels but as long as they are open I think you
can use them as controls

David Martin said:

MSeries said:

There are several hostels in Edniburgh and one in York. I believe YH
Darts can start from a hostel rather than finish, do they have to end
or start at home though or is that simply an example so once can get
some points for a ride to a hostel weekend. I emailed Sheila Simpson
who 'manages' the DIY Perms (in the Perms section of the website it has
a page for DIY 400) and she said such a ride would qualify for points,
I didn't ask about SR series though.

Late May might be OK, I did the West Yorks DA 400 to Spurn Head this
year in late May and if it or a replacement runs next year will be
doing it again. We'll sort exact day when the calendar comes out if
thats Ok with you.

How much route planning would need to be done before hand? ie location
of suitable controls, especially at night, and would you be planning
night first or last? It would possibly be better to start off in the
evening and ride through the night first. Controls/refuelling may be
more problematic at odd hours as you get further north unless you
follow the major road routes (A1/M6/A7 etc.)

Time to start pitching in known good cafe's? If you are going through
Galashiels, then 'The Ginger Jar' is a nice spot, and would be a great
last stop before the finish. It's just as you leave Galashiels on the
A7 towards Edinburgh.

I know almost nothing about any of the route so am easy with whatever.
Nenthead and Alston is probably the only place I know. My intention
would be to get to Edinburgh around lunchtime to allow plenty of time
to get a flight home.

David Martin said:

MSeries said:

There are several hostels in Edniburgh and one in York. I believe YH
Darts can start from a hostel rather than finish, do they have to end
or start at home though or is that simply an example so once can get
some points for a ride to a hostel weekend. I emailed Sheila Simpson
who 'manages' the DIY Perms (in the Perms section of the website it has
a page for DIY 400) and she said such a ride would qualify for points,
I didn't ask about SR series though.

Late May might be OK, I did the West Yorks DA 400 to Spurn Head this
year in late May and if it or a replacement runs next year will be
doing it again. We'll sort exact day when the calendar comes out if
thats Ok with you.

How much route planning would need to be done before hand? ie location
of suitable controls, especially at night, and would you be planning
night first or last? It would possibly be better to start off in the
evening and ride through the night first. Controls/refuelling may be
more problematic at odd hours as you get further north unless you
follow the major road routes (A1/M6/A7 etc.)

Time to start pitching in known good cafe's? If you are going through
Galashiels, then 'The Ginger Jar' is a nice spot, and would be a great
last stop before the finish. It's just as you leave Galashiels on the
A7 towards Edinburgh.

..d

The intention is to ride the LEL route, joining at Hovingham or maybe
east of York. Thorne to Dalkieth is 410km so if we wanted to do at
least 400 we'd have to do a few wiggles to get the ks in. When I did
LEL I started at Thorne at 08:30 and passed through Canonbie at about
21:30. There was only one control after that before Dalkeith, I reckon
we can use atm receipts from Innerleithen instead. Really though with a
linear route what proof do they need that we didn't take a short cut ?
Our proscribe route will be shortest here anyway. If we didn't care
about getting AUK point we'd not have to worry about controls at all,
nor worry about the extra wiggles to clock up 400km.

I was considering starting off around 21:00, so it would be getting
light as we started getting to the more remote and picturesque places.
Then we'd be passing through the most isolated places during the
daytime. 400km has taken me around 22 hours (20h 45m & 22h 40m) so we'd
arrive early evening with a 21:00 start which would be perfect.

One of the motivations for this ride is to re-ride the LEL route and
'enjoy' the scenary. A three day event was touted at first, maybe I'll
ride home in three days or perhaps 2 and do 2x200km YH darts. Mmmm.

finally I ahve been thinking about the Marmotte for next year too.

MSeries said:

The intention is to ride the LEL route, joining at Hovingham or maybe
east of York. Thorne to Dalkieth is 410km so if we wanted to do at
least 400 we'd have to do a few wiggles to get the ks in. When I did
LEL I started at Thorne at 08:30 and passed through Canonbie at about
21:30. There was only one control after that before Dalkeith, I reckon
we can use atm receipts from Innerleithen instead. Really though with a
linear route what proof do they need that we didn't take a short cut ?
Our proscribe route will be shortest here anyway. If we didn't care
about getting AUK point we'd not have to worry about controls at all,
nor worry about the extra wiggles to clock up 400km.

I was considering starting off around 21:00, so it would be getting
light as we started getting to the more remote and picturesque places.
Then we'd be passing through the most isolated places during the
daytime. 400km has taken me around 22 hours (20h 45m & 22h 40m) so we'd
arrive early evening with a 21:00 start which would be perfect.

One of the motivations for this ride is to re-ride the LEL route and
'enjoy' the scenary. A three day event was touted at first, maybe I'll
ride home in three days or perhaps 2 and do 2x200km YH darts. Mmmm.

Makes more sense to do the scenic bits in daylight, from my experience
of night rides, you want access to 24 hour garages etc and preferably a
good well surfaced road (I have no dynamo just LED lights) the early
hours are usually fairly traffic free on main roads. So that would
involve an around midnight arrival at Edinburgh. That would avoid me
having to find anywhere to stay as well. That's not the way most 400's
run but they do the scenic bit during the day. And good PBP practice,
the tourists start at 2200 and go all through the night and the next
day.

Quoted message said:

finally I ahve been thinking about the Marmotte for next year too.

MartinM said:

Makes more sense to do the scenic bits in daylight, from my experience
of night rides, you want access to 24 hour garages etc and preferably a
good well surfaced road (I have no dynamo just LED lights) the early
hours are usually fairly traffic free on main roads. So that would
involve an around midnight arrival at Edinburgh. That would avoid me
having to find anywhere to stay as well. That's not the way most 400's
run but they do the scenic bit during the day. And good PBP practice,
the tourists start at 2200 and go all through the night and the next
day.

OK thats the start time decided then. !! What day of week ? Saturday or
Friday ? doesn't matter to me, I'll take one day off work anyway maybe
two. Where do you live Martin ? How would you travel to York ? We don't
have to start at York, could start at my house, Morley near Leeds or
even Thorne near Doncaster, the proper LEL start (not very glamourous
actually). I'll have plenty of time to think about controls between now
and May next year.

MSeries said:

MartinM said:

Makes more sense to do the scenic bits in daylight, from my experience
of night rides, you want access to 24 hour garages etc and preferably a
good well surfaced road (I have no dynamo just LED lights) the early
hours are usually fairly traffic free on main roads. So that would
involve an around midnight arrival at Edinburgh. That would avoid me
having to find anywhere to stay as well. That's not the way most 400's
run but they do the scenic bit during the day. And good PBP practice,
the tourists start at 2200 and go all through the night and the next
day.

OK thats the start time decided then. !! What day of week ? Saturday or
Friday ? doesn't matter to me, I'll take one day off work anyway maybe
two. Where do you live Martin ? How would you travel to York ? We don't
have to start at York, could start at my house, Morley near Leeds or
even Thorne near Doncaster, the proper LEL start (not very glamourous
actually). I'll have plenty of time to think about controls between now
and May next year.

I'm about 10 k from Gatwick Airport, Friday night is best from a
ride/flight home POV but will be expensive on the train to York/Leeds
wherever as they seem to charge double on Fridays. I can reduce the
cost a bit by going SnailRail to Peterborough and changing. Not sure
about Hull Trains whether they are any use, have never even used GNER.

in message <[email hidden]>,

MSeries (') said:

I was considering starting off around 21:00, so it would be getting
light as we started getting to the more remote and picturesque places.
Then we'd be passing through the most isolated places during the
daytime. 400km has taken me around 22 hours (20h 45m & 22h 40m) so we'd
arrive early evening with a 21:00 start which would be perfect.

One of the motivations for this ride is to re-ride the LEL route and
'enjoy' the scenary. A three day event was touted at first, maybe I'll
ride home in three days or perhaps 2 and do 2x200km YH darts. Mmmm.

I've been thinking I might be up for york-edinburgh as well. I'm not as
fast as you two, but I don't mind being dropped. But if I can encourage
someone else who'd be doing around 12.5mph/20kmh to take part it would
be more pleasant with company.

Like you, I've ridden those hills overnight (Newcastleton, near Cannonbie
to Glentress near Peebles) on another event, and while it was quite
enjoyable to do it at night it would be nice to actually see them...

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

;; I'll have a proper rant later, when I get the time.

Simon Brooke said:

in message <[email hidden]>,

MSeries (') said:

I was considering starting off around 21:00, so it would be getting
light as we started getting to the more remote and picturesque places.
Then we'd be passing through the most isolated places during the
daytime. 400km has taken me around 22 hours (20h 45m & 22h 40m) so we'd
arrive early evening with a 21:00 start which would be perfect.

One of the motivations for this ride is to re-ride the LEL route and
'enjoy' the scenary. A three day event was touted at first, maybe I'll
ride home in three days or perhaps 2 and do 2x200km YH darts. Mmmm.

I've been thinking I might be up for york-edinburgh as well. I'm not as
fast as you two, but I don't mind being dropped. But if I can encourage
someone else who'd be doing around 12.5mph/20kmh to take part it would
be more pleasant with company.

I have no problem with that average speed. I will be carrying a fair
amount of gear (which makes a change), have put a Carrthingy on my Xmas
list.

Simon Brooke said:

in message <[email hidden]>,

MSeries (') said:

I was considering starting off around 21:00, so it would be getting
light as we started getting to the more remote and picturesque places.
Then we'd be passing through the most isolated places during the
daytime. 400km has taken me around 22 hours (20h 45m & 22h 40m) so we'd
arrive early evening with a 21:00 start which would be perfect.

One of the motivations for this ride is to re-ride the LEL route and
'enjoy' the scenary. A three day event was touted at first, maybe I'll
ride home in three days or perhaps 2 and do 2x200km YH darts. Mmmm.

I've been thinking I might be up for york-edinburgh as well. I'm not as
fast as you two, but I don't mind being dropped. But if I can encourage
someone else who'd be doing around 12.5mph/20kmh to take part it would
be more pleasant with company.

I am also tempted and should then be about the same pace as Simon..
It is a big undertaking for me so I am most definitely not definite..

I like the idea of doing the scenic bits in daylight. Maybe a good idea
would be to sort out the possible cafe's/truckstops first and then see
how the time fits around that?

...d

Simon Brooke said:

I've been thinking I might be up for york-edinburgh as well. I'm not as
fast as you two, but I don't mind being dropped. But if I can encourage
someone else who'd be doing around 12.5mph/20kmh to take part it would
be more pleasant with company.

That will be me then. I've just been chatting to Mrs B re a PBP attempt
year after next, looks like it is very definitely "ON" so I need to get
some proper miles in.

Keep me in the loop!

bfn,

Tony B

Just found Thorne (actually I know it from old gricing days) how far is
it from Dalkeith?

ignore that just seen; 410k, Well I'd be happy to do that, it is the
whole Northern LEL route after all. And easy to get to.

David Martin said:

I like the idea of doing the scenic bits in daylight. Maybe a good idea
would be to sort out the possible cafe's/truckstops first and then see
how the time fits around that?

..d

Thats the next part of my project and will give me some focus for
forays over the next few months in the N Yorks/Co Durham section. The
route crosses the A1 near Londonderry Truckstop (I think) so that might
do instead of Hovingham. Barnard Castle will surely have ATMs which
could be used to replace the Eppleby control.

I'll make a webpage to record the ideas and progress.

20kph overall average inc stops is actually about my pace. So long as
we get within the time limit of 27 hours I don't care how long it takes
us.

in message <[email hidden]>,

MartinM (') said:

Just found Thorne (actually I know it from old gricing days) how far is
it from Dalkeith?

Messing with autoroute I get a minimum of 380.6Km.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

'You cannot put "The Internet" into the Recycle Bin.'

in message <[email hidden]>,

MSeries (') said:

David Martin said:

I like the idea of doing the scenic bits in daylight. Maybe a good
idea would be to sort out the possible cafe's/truckstops first and
then see how the time fits around that?

Thats the next part of my project and will give me some focus for
forays over the next few months in the N Yorks/Co Durham section. The
route crosses the A1 near Londonderry Truckstop (I think) so that might
do instead of Hovingham. Barnard Castle will surely have ATMs which
could be used to replace the Eppleby control.

I'll make a webpage to record the ideas and progress.

20kph overall average inc stops is actually about my pace.

Yeah. I was meaning 20Km/h whilst rolling... I would not be able to keep
up at 20Km/h including stops.

Quoted message said:

So long as
we get within the time limit of 27 hours I don't care how long it takes
us.

TBH, 27 hours for 410Km doesn't seem that challenging for a one-off. It
gives us 3 hours 30 minutes 'stop' time given a 20Km/h rolling speed. I
wouldn't imagine we'd want to stop for very long - when you've been off
the bike for half an hour, getting back on begins to get daunting.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

;; Human history becomes more and more a race between
;; education and catastrophe.
H.G. Wells, "The Outline of History"