Bicycling With Panniers to the Grocery Store

"Dave Vandervies" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

At one time I regularly carried a 20-30lb backpack and could handle 40lb
with no problems, and carrying it on a bike wasn't noticeably different
from walking with it.

I'll defer a bit to Dave, who's actually done it often, but I find that much
weight up that high a burden.

I regularly walk with my wife using a 35 lb backpack (which means then walk
at the same speed and I get enough of a workout), but when I've experimented
with this on a bike with the pack on my back it's been uncomfortable.
Sturdily attached to the back rack the same weight is much less noticeable.

I agree that a bike trailer would be the best way to haul
groceries. You can find a used one for no more than a new set of
panniers would cost. The amount you could carry in a trailer would be
far more than in any kind of bag or box on a bike and you wouldn't be
straining the wheels or having control problems. I carried my new
170-lb. TV across town on a bike trailer as well as a table saw.
Try stuffing things like that in bike bags.

Steve McDonald

Steve McDonald said:

I agree that a bike trailer would be the best way to haul
groceries. You can find a used one for no more than a new set of
panniers would cost. The amount you could carry in a trailer would be
far more than in any kind of bag or box on a bike and you wouldn't be
straining the wheels or having control problems. I carried my new
170-lb. TV across town on a bike trailer as well as a table saw.
Try stuffing things like that in bike bags.

I definitely agree that a trailer would be the best way to haul a 170
pound TV or a table saw. (Although I wonder why anyone wastes time
with a TV.)

But I disagree about the groceries. I think it's a case of balancing
benefits and detriments, and for me, there's no way to justify the
trailer. I've had too much success with panniers.

I'll also point out, I tend to be against the idea that one needs all
sorts of special equipment to do ordinary things with a bike. To me,
that sounds too much like the consumerist American Way.

- Frank Krygowski

Tom Keats asked:

Can there be a tendency to jackknife on steep downslopes?
(regarding bike trailers)
-----------------------------------------------------

You betcha! I've had a couple of near-death episodes with
improperly loaded bike trailers in my early days of using them. The
hitch is important, but the critical thing is the distribution of weight
in the trailer. You don't want a great amount of weight placed behind
the axle, especially when going fast downhill. Load it so the weight is
centered slightly ahead of the axle, for best control. I found this out
the hard way, the first time I came ripping down an overpass with a load
stacked a couple feet behind the axle. The trailer went suicidal and
dodged back and forth, finally pulling my bike sideways and actually
ending up in front of me. One bike and one trailer wheel were trashed
and I would have been too, if there had been oncoming traffic on the
road.
However, after learning the dynamics of load placement, I've had no more
control problems. The hazard of popping a wheel up on a curb or hitting
a gopher mound that has spilled out on a path, remain constant things to
avoid. We have giant gopher mounds next to many of our paths and after
a rain, they turn hard as concrete.

Steve McDonald

Thu, 15 Sep 2005 23:26:38 GMT,
<[email hidden]>, "Bill Sornson"

Quoted message said:

Zoot Katz said:

Thu, 15 Sep 2005 01:02:32 -0700, <[email hidden]>,

(Tom Keats) said:

> I want to ride my bicycle (hybrid)to the grocery store once a week.

[snip]

> Any suggestions to make grocery shopping by bicycle easier would be
> appreciated.

Does your grocery store deliver?

Bravo! The best answer so far is a good question.

"What's your excuse for polluting my neighbourhood or killing my pets
and friends with your noisey stinking ugly fossil burners?" -- ZK

But it's OK for delivery vehicles?

Gosh Bill, I guess you're right. There's no difference between one
natural gas fueled delivery van making one trip to eight households
and eight stench spewing scuds making eight ~5 mile round trips to the
grocery store.

There is a small family-owned grocery chain here that does (or at
least, did) offer bicycle delivery as one of your choices.

Since the subject of this tread is panniers for grocery shopping,
you're quoting me out of context. The context of the quote regards
harmlessly disabling SUVs. That has been interpreted by the die-hard
scud slobs as virtual castration. Yet they blithely choose to ignore
the deadly fallout of their self indulgent habituated practice of
running roughshod over others rights to breathe clean air without
being menaced by their filthy ego-fluffing scuds.
--
zk

In article <[email hidden]>,

Mike Kruger said:

"Dave Vandervies" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

At one time I regularly carried a 20-30lb backpack and could handle 40lb
with no problems, and carrying it on a bike wasn't noticeably different
from walking with it.

I'll defer a bit to Dave, who's actually done it often, but I find that much
weight up that high a burden.

I regularly walk with my wife using a 35 lb backpack (which means then walk
at the same speed and I get enough of a workout), but when I've experimented
with this on a bike with the pack on my back it's been uncomfortable.
Sturdily attached to the back rack the same weight is much less noticeable.

I suspect that the key difference between this and my experience is that I
got used to riding a bike and carrying a heavy backpack as a combination,
rather than first getting used to carrying the weight and then starting
to ride the bike with it.

This is an important point that I missed (because I was so used to it
until I stopped carrying a backpack), though: A heavy backpack will
make you top-heavy, both on a bike and on foot (and it's probably more
noticeable on a bike). If you're planning to carry heavy loads, you
should start with carrying lighter loads under the same conditions,
so you can get used to the balancing differences at the same time as
your muscles are getting used to the extra load.

dave

--
Dave Vandervies [email hidden]

That's too much to be a coincidence. There must be an evil plot.
--Joe Moore in the scary devil monastery

"Earl Bollinger" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I want to ride my bicycle (hybrid)to the grocery store once a week.
Roundtrip is about 10 miles with one big hill. I have some questions:

1. Are panniers the best way to carry a week's worth of groceries?
2. Is it relatively easy to ride with 30,40 50 lbs.?
3. Can I easily and quickly remove the rack when the panniers are not
on?
4. How much does it cost to outfit a bike?

Any suggestions to make grocery shopping by bicycle easier would be
appreciated.

My old Huffy Three Speed has a rear rack on it with two Wald folding
pannier baskets on the rear, and a large Wald basket on the front.
I can can carry several bags of groceries on it, along with other large
items like toilet paper, towels, bread, etc.
I made my own small cargo trailer to use on my son's bike, and it can
carry things like a couple, three or four of cases of soft drinks, water,
etc.

Ebay probably has the cheapest trailers, otherwise it is off to your LBS
to see what they can get for you.
Most any trailer would work, you can cram in stuff until you hit their
maximum load rating. But I'd suggest using a loaded trailer on a bike with
some good hill gears as climbing a hill can get pretty hard in some cases.

Here is a photo of my grocery shopping bike http://tinypic.com/dczubd.jpg
It might give you some ideas.

Earl Bollinger said:

"Earl Bollinger" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I want to ride my bicycle (hybrid)to the grocery store once a week.
Roundtrip is about 10 miles with one big hill. I have some questions:

1. Are panniers the best way to carry a week's worth of groceries?
2. Is it relatively easy to ride with 30,40 50 lbs.?
3. Can I easily and quickly remove the rack when the panniers are not
on?
4. How much does it cost to outfit a bike?

Any suggestions to make grocery shopping by bicycle easier would be
appreciated.

My old Huffy Three Speed has a rear rack on it with two Wald folding
pannier baskets on the rear, and a large Wald basket on the front.
I can can carry several bags of groceries on it, along with other large
items like toilet paper, towels, bread, etc.
I made my own small cargo trailer to use on my son's bike, and it can
carry things like a couple, three or four of cases of soft drinks, water,
etc.

Ebay probably has the cheapest trailers, otherwise it is off to your LBS
to see what they can get for you.
Most any trailer would work, you can cram in stuff until you hit their
maximum load rating. But I'd suggest using a loaded trailer on a bike with
some good hill gears as climbing a hill can get pretty hard in some cases.

Here is a photo of my grocery shopping bike http://tinypic.com/dczubd.jpg
It might give you some ideas.

Very nice! Well-thought out and based on experience.

I cannot make out what make/model of rear rack you are using to attach
the collapsible wire baskets to, even when I zoom in. Looks very
sturdy. Care to share?

I have a Fuji aluminum cruiser, Nexus 3-speed, that I'd like to set up
similarly for when I'm in urban areas on trips. Have been looking for
decent fenders for it also.

Geezer Boy

On Thu, 15 Sep 2005 19:06:27 -0700, [email hidden] (Steve

McDonald) said:

Tom Keats asked:

Can there be a tendency to jackknife on steep downslopes?
(regarding bike trailers)
-----------------------------------------------------

You betcha! I've had a couple of near-death episodes with
improperly loaded bike trailers in my early days of using them. The
hitch is important, but the critical thing is the distribution of weight
in the trailer. You don't want a great amount of weight placed behind
the axle, especially when going fast downhill. Load it so the weight is
centered slightly ahead of the axle, for best control. I found this out
the hard way, the first time I came ripping down an overpass with a load
stacked a couple feet behind the axle. The trailer went suicidal and
dodged back and forth, finally pulling my bike sideways and actually
ending up in front of me. One bike and one trailer wheel were trashed
and I would have been too, if there had been oncoming traffic on the
road.
However, after learning the dynamics of load placement, I've had no more
control problems. The hazard of popping a wheel up on a curb or hitting
a gopher mound that has spilled out on a path, remain constant things to
avoid. We have giant gopher mounds next to many of our paths and after
a rain, they turn hard as concrete.

Steve McDonald

What model trailer do you use and what bike do you pull it with?

G.B.

Dave Vandervies said:

Note that backpacks aren't great for large crushable things (like,
say, bread), so you might want to have some way to carry those on the
bike anyways.

All it takes is to pack intelligently -- soft items on top. I usually put the
canned goods on the bottom, followed by meat and/or produce, then bread or fresh
fish or eggs on top. I also have a backpack with a second pocket that just
holds a carton of 18 eggs.

While it may be more comfortable to carry large/heavy loads in panniers or a
trailer, remember some riders are bigger and heavier than most of us with a full
backpack, and they seem to do just fine.

Matt O.

Leo Lichtman said:

You may also experience a slight problem when climbing the steep hill, with
a load. I'm not referring to the obvious thing about pedalling uphill with
extra weight. The only time I rode with heavily loaded panniers, I found
that it was pretty easy to float the front wheel, due to the extra mass over
the rear wheel. Climbing a steep hill will make this more of a problem.

Ah, yes. I remember a couple weeks ago I was bringing home a couple
cubic feet of compost and top soil on my grocery bike. I managed to
keep the front wheel down except when I was going up a short steep hill
that was probably about a 12% grade. I gave up in a very short amount
of time and just walked it. Next time, definitely the trailer for
that bit.

--
Dane Buson - z u v e m b i @ u n i x b i g o t s . o r g
"He is one of those people who would be enormously improved by death."
-H. H. Munro

In article <[email hidden]>,

Matt O'Toole said:

Dave Vandervies said:

Note that backpacks aren't great for large crushable things (like,
say, bread), so you might want to have some way to carry those on the
bike anyways.

All it takes is to pack intelligently -- soft items on top.

Unless you have a rigid backpack (which might not be a bad idea, but
isn't all that common), they'll still get crushed when the weight of
the stuff in the bottom pulls the fabric at the top tight. It's still
"good enough" if you don't mind slightly squished bread, but not as good
as if you carry them separately instead of putting them in the backpack.

dave

--
Dave Vandervies [email hidden]
If you have any trouble sounding condescending, find a Unix user to show
you how it's done.
--Attributed to Scott Adams

"Dave Vandervies" wrote: (clip) It's still "good enough" if you don't mind
slightly squished bread, but not as good as if you carry them separately
instead of putting them in the backpack.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I would consider a backpack is less jarring to the contents than either
panniers or a trailer. For instance, I would definitely carry my camera or
my bananas in my backpack. Knees make wonderful shock absorbers.

"Geezer Boy" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Earl Bollinger said:

"Earl Bollinger" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
>I want to ride my bicycle (hybrid)to the grocery store once a week.
> Roundtrip is about 10 miles with one big hill. I have some questions:
>
> 1. Are panniers the best way to carry a week's worth of groceries?
> 2. Is it relatively easy to ride with 30,40 50 lbs.?
> 3. Can I easily and quickly remove the rack when the panniers are not
> on?
> 4. How much does it cost to outfit a bike?
>
>
> Any suggestions to make grocery shopping by bicycle easier would be
> appreciated.
>

My old Huffy Three Speed has a rear rack on it with two Wald folding
pannier baskets on the rear, and a large Wald basket on the front.
I can can carry several bags of groceries on it, along with other large
items like toilet paper, towels, bread, etc.
I made my own small cargo trailer to use on my son's bike, and it can
carry things like a couple, three or four of cases of soft drinks,
water,
etc.

Ebay probably has the cheapest trailers, otherwise it is off to your LBS
to see what they can get for you.
Most any trailer would work, you can cram in stuff until you hit their
maximum load rating. But I'd suggest using a loaded trailer on a bike
with
some good hill gears as climbing a hill can get pretty hard in some
cases.

Here is a photo of my grocery shopping bike http://tinypic.com/dczubd.jpg
It might give you some ideas.

Very nice! Well-thought out and based on experience.

I cannot make out what make/model of rear rack you are using to attach
the collapsible wire baskets to, even when I zoom in. Looks very
sturdy. Care to share?

I have a Fuji aluminum cruiser, Nexus 3-speed, that I'd like to set up
similarly for when I'm in urban areas on trips. Have been looking for
decent fenders for it also.

Geezer Boy

Thanks, the bike works great for shopping and stuff. If you aren't in a big
hurry you can ride it tem miles or so out and back no problem.
Fortunately for me here in Grapevine Texas, most all the stores of interest
are within three miles in any direction.
A while back I was at the LBS and they had this "Krytponite" brand rack on a
clearance sale.
I never knew they made racks, but it is really heavy duty. I think the frame
and axle might bend before the rack breaks.

Earl Bollinger said:

"Earl Bollinger" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Here is a photo of my grocery shopping bike tinypic.comdczubd.jpgOpen ↗
It might give you some ideas.

I like the collapsible basket panniers... Does anyone have a good source for them?

Quoted message said:

How much can you get into a back pack? Would I be able to ride 5 miles
with 20-30 lb. no problem without hurting myself? This sounds like the
best cost/time effective idea.

If you don't want to spend $ on the panniers yet just go for a backpack
plus rack. A rack is cheap (I bought mine for $15 Cdn at MEC), and with
a couple bungee cords you can attach things that aren't backpack
friendly (case of pop or beer, big pack of toilet paper) or deal with
the overflow of the backpack. Many stores give away their empty
cardboard boxes, if you are buying too much for the backpack grab one
and bungee to the rack.

dgregory57 said:

Earl Bollinger said:

"Earl Bollinger" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Here is a photo of my grocery shopping bike
http://tinypic.com/dczubd.jpg
It might give you some ideas.

I like the collapsible basket panniers... Does anyone have a good
source for them?

http://www.bikepartsusa.com/product_info.phtml?p=01-85561&large=1

"dgregory57" <[email hidden]> wrote in
message news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Earl Bollinger said:

"Earl Bollinger" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Here is a photo of my grocery shopping bike
http://tinypic.com/dczubd.jpg
It might give you some ideas.

I like the collapsible basket panniers... Does anyone have a good
source for them?

Those are Wald folding baskets. I bought 2 for my daughter at $15 each last
month at a local shop.
Here's an on-line link:
http://store.yahoo.com/penncyclebuy/508-009.html

How does it attach to the rack? Does it attach to a standard bike rack?
It is good for heavy things like gallon containers of Gatorade?

Mike Kruger said:

"dgregory57" <[email hidden]> wrote in
message news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Earl Bollinger said:

"Earl Bollinger" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Here is a photo of my grocery shopping bike
http://tinypic.com/dczubd.jpg
It might give you some ideas.

I like the collapsible basket panniers... Does anyone have a good
source for them?

Those are Wald folding baskets. I bought 2 for my daughter at $15 each last
month at a local shop.
Here's an on-line link:
http://store.yahoo.com/penncyclebuy/508-009.html

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

How does it attach to the rack? Does it attach to a standard bike rack?
It is good for heavy things like gallon containers of Gatorade?

Mike Kruger said:

"dgregory57" <[email hidden]> wrote in
message news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Earl Bollinger Wrote:
> "Earl Bollinger" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
> news:[email hidden]...
>
> Here is a photo of my grocery shopping bike
> http://tinypic.com/dczubd.jpg
> It might give you some ideas.
I like the collapsible basket panniers... Does anyone have a good
source for them?

Those are Wald folding baskets. I bought 2 for my daughter at $15 each
last
month at a local shop.
Here's an on-line link:
http://store.yahoo.com/penncyclebuy/508-009.html

You have to have a bike rack on your bike already to attach the Wald folding
baskets to.
The baskets comes with some clamps and nuts and bolts, washers and stuff.
But amazingly enough, you can use plastic ZIP ties, as they work quite well
too.
But after a few years the plastic ZIP ties might break down from ultraviolet
radiation exposure though.