The Source of Allopathic Medicine

"Dave Wickware" <[email hidden]> wrote in news:rL7nc.102234
[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Van Leeuwenhoek revolutionized the microscope. Through his work, in the

17th

Quoted message said:

century, he was the first to discover the existence of bacteria, blood
cells, sperm cells and more.

His most notable experiment uncovered a mystery that has not yet been
answered. He took a sample of
stagnant water and observed many little creatures through his

microscope.

Quoted message said:

Next he collected a sample of
clean rainwater and saw nothing in it. He sealed the samples in

sterilized

Quoted message said:

pipettes and continued to view them through his microscope. Day after

day he

Quoted message said:

saw nothing. Finally, on day four, he observed that the same creatures

that

Quoted message said:

he had seen in the stagnant water had made their way into his sealed
containers. He was the first person to ever witness spontaneous

generation.

Quoted message said:

He had witnessed the creation of life without a mommy and daddy. The

obvious

Quoted message said:

question is, where did these germs come from. This question has never
been answered to this day, although the experiment is easily recreated.

It was in the 19th century that the "germ theory" was developed by Louis
Pasteur. It hypothesizes that all
infections and contageous disorders are caused by germs. This theory
presupposes that the blood is sterile
until invaded. This theory is still held by modern-day bacteriologists.

Another 19th century biologist named Antoine Beauchamps, challenged

Pasteurs

Quoted message said:

theory by putting forth one of his own. He called it the "pleomorphic
theory". He discovered that the blood was not sterile, but
that it contained microbes that he named "microzymas". If an individual
became sick, these microbes would alter their state. Although Pasteur
expressed a firm belief that the blood was sterile in healthy people, it

was

Quoted message said:

easily seen that microzymas existed in healthy people. Beauchamps

believed

Quoted message said:

that disease came from within the body. The environment or "terrain" of

the

Quoted message said:

body, not the germ itselfr, dictated whether or not we got sick.

Pasteur successfully promoted his "germ theory" while discrediting
Beauchamps "pleomorphic theory".
This was the fork in the road. The "germ theory" became accepted and has
been passionately defended by those people who have chosen to tie their
credibility to it. Forty years after the development of his "germ

theory"

Quoted message said:

Pasteur recanted with the words, "the microbe is nothing, the terrain is
everything." It was too late,
allopathic medicine has been entrenched ever since.

Were you born stupid or did you aspire to it?

r

--
Nothing beats the bandwidth of a station wagon filled with DLT tapes.

"Rich.Andrews" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Dave Wickware" <[email hidden]> wrote in news:rL7nc.102234
[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Van Leeuwenhoek revolutionized the microscope. Through his work, in the

17th

Quoted message said:

century, he was the first to discover the existence of bacteria, blood
cells, sperm cells and more.

His most notable experiment uncovered a mystery that has not yet been
answered. He took a sample of
stagnant water and observed many little creatures through his

microscope.

Quoted message said:

Next he collected a sample of
clean rainwater and saw nothing in it. He sealed the samples in

sterilized

Quoted message said:

pipettes and continued to view them through his microscope. Day after

day he

Quoted message said:

saw nothing. Finally, on day four, he observed that the same creatures

that

Quoted message said:

he had seen in the stagnant water had made their way into his sealed
containers. He was the first person to ever witness spontaneous

generation.

Quoted message said:

He had witnessed the creation of life without a mommy and daddy. The

obvious

Quoted message said:

question is, where did these germs come from. This question has never
been answered to this day, although the experiment is easily recreated.

It was in the 19th century that the "germ theory" was developed by Louis
Pasteur. It hypothesizes that all
infections and contageous disorders are caused by germs. This theory
presupposes that the blood is sterile
until invaded. This theory is still held by modern-day bacteriologists.

Another 19th century biologist named Antoine Beauchamps, challenged

Pasteurs

Quoted message said:

theory by putting forth one of his own. He called it the "pleomorphic
theory". He discovered that the blood was not sterile, but
that it contained microbes that he named "microzymas". If an individual
became sick, these microbes would alter their state. Although Pasteur
expressed a firm belief that the blood was sterile in healthy people, it

was

Quoted message said:

easily seen that microzymas existed in healthy people. Beauchamps

believed

Quoted message said:

that disease came from within the body. The environment or "terrain" of

the

Quoted message said:

body, not the germ itselfr, dictated whether or not we got sick.

Pasteur successfully promoted his "germ theory" while discrediting
Beauchamps "pleomorphic theory".
This was the fork in the road. The "germ theory" became accepted and has
been passionately defended by those people who have chosen to tie their
credibility to it. Forty years after the development of his "germ

theory"

Quoted message said:

Pasteur recanted with the words, "the microbe is nothing, the terrain is
everything." It was too late,
allopathic medicine has been entrenched ever since.

Were you born stupid or did you aspire to it?

r

If you watched him from the start you would realise that this level of
stupidity requires daily practice to maintain.

--
The Spider Web is to catch spam.
Brush it aside to email me.

Doug

In article <[email hidden]>,

Dave Wickware said:

Van Leeuwenhoek revolutionized the microscope.

By inventing it, as it happens. Can't get much more revolutionary
than that.

Quoted message said:

Through his work, in the 17th century, he was the first to discover
the existence of bacteria, blood cells, sperm cells and more.

Quoted message said:

His most notable experiment uncovered a mystery that has not yet been
answered. He took a sample of stagnant water and observed many little
creatures through his microscope. Next he collected a sample of
clean rainwater and saw nothing in it. He sealed the samples in
sterilized pipettes and continued to view them through his
microscope. Day after day he saw nothing. Finally, on day four, he
observed that the same creatures that he had seen in the stagnant
water had made their way into his sealed containers. He was the first
person to ever witness spontaneous generation. He had witnessed the
creation of life without a mommy and daddy. The obvious question is,
where did these germs come from. This question has never been
answered to this day, although the experiment is easily recreated.

The obvious answer (obvious to people smarter than Spammin' Dave,
which means most people) is that (a) his microscope wasn't powerful
enough to see everything in the water, and (b) his sterile technique
wasn't adequate. Pasteur did an elegant experiment that showed that
spontaneous generation was nonsense. Spammin' Dave has apparently not
heard of this experiment. I read about it when I was in elementary
school. Perhaps when Spammin' Dave makes it through elementary school
he'll have read about it also.

Quoted message said:

It was in the 19th century that the "germ theory" was developed by
Louis Pasteur. It hypothesizes that all infections and contageous
disorders are caused by germs. This theory presupposes that the blood
is sterile until invaded. This theory is still held by modern-day
bacteriologists.

Quite rightly. Although the blood is never entirely sterile, though
it's pretty close. If it were sterile, we wouldn't need macrophages
and so on.

Quoted message said:

Another 19th century biologist named Antoine Beauchamps, challenged
Pasteurs theory by putting forth one of his own. He called it the
"pleomorphic theory". He discovered that the blood was not sterile,
but that it contained microbes that he named "microzymas". If an
individual became sick, these microbes would alter their
state. Although Pasteur expressed a firm belief that the blood was
sterile in healthy people, it was easily seen that microzymas existed
in healthy people. Beauchamps believed that disease came from within
the body. The environment or "terrain" of the body, not the germ
itselfr, dictated whether or not we got sick.

This theory was reasonable enough at the time, but we now know that
bacteria do not, in fact, change their forms the way Bechamp thought
they did. He was done in by the limitations of microscopy of his
era.

Quoted message said:

Pasteur successfully promoted his "germ theory" while discrediting
Beauchamps "pleomorphic theory".

Lucky for us. Who knows how many people would have died had
researchers wasted a lot of time following Bechamp's false trail.

Quoted message said:

This was the fork in the road. The "germ theory" became accepted and has
been passionately defended by those people who have chosen to tie their
credibility to it. Forty years after the development of his "germ theory"
Pasteur recanted with the words, "the microbe is nothing, the terrain is
everything." It was too late,

And for how many more years will this bogus "quotation" of Pasteur be
repeated by altie know-nothings?

-- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net
These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct.
"If I have not seen as far as others, it is because giants
were standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson, MIT)

"Dave Wickware" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Davey, stick to plagiarizing.

"David Wright" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Dave Wickware said:

Van Leeuwenhoek revolutionized the microscope.

By inventing it, as it happens. Can't get much more revolutionary
than that.

Actually you are incorrect (surprise-surprise) again. The inventor of the
microscope was
a Dutchman by the name of Zacharias Jansenn.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Through his work, in the 17th century, he was the first to discover
the existence of bacteria, blood cells, sperm cells and more.

Quoted message said:

His most notable experiment uncovered a mystery that has not yet been
answered. He took a sample of stagnant water and observed many little
creatures through his microscope. Next he collected a sample of
clean rainwater and saw nothing in it. He sealed the samples in
sterilized pipettes and continued to view them through his
microscope. Day after day he saw nothing. Finally, on day four, he
observed that the same creatures that he had seen in the stagnant
water had made their way into his sealed containers. He was the first
person to ever witness spontaneous generation. He had witnessed the
creation of life without a mommy and daddy. The obvious question is,
where did these germs come from. This question has never been
answered to this day, although the experiment is easily recreated.

And YOUR answer is?

Quoted message said:

The obvious answer (obvious to people smarter than Spammin' Dave,
which means most people) is that (a) his microscope wasn't powerful
enough to see everything in the water, and (b) his sterile technique
wasn't adequate. Pasteur did an elegant experiment that showed that
spontaneous generation was nonsense. Spammin' Dave has apparently not
heard of this experiment. I read about it when I was in elementary
school. Perhaps when Spammin' Dave makes it through elementary school
he'll have read about it also.

I guess senility syndrome has made you forget the point of it?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

It was in the 19th century that the "germ theory" was developed by
Louis Pasteur. It hypothesizes that all infections and contageous
disorders are caused by germs. This theory presupposes that the blood
is sterile until invaded. This theory is still held by modern-day
bacteriologists.

Quite rightly. Although the blood is never entirely sterile, though
it's pretty close. If it were sterile, we wouldn't need macrophages
and so on.

Spoken with true ignorance. Anyone who is bright enough to know how
to look at a live blood sample through a microscope can see that is total
nonsense.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Another 19th century biologist named Antoine Beauchamps, challenged
Pasteurs theory by putting forth one of his own. He called it the
"pleomorphic theory". He discovered that the blood was not sterile,
but that it contained microbes that he named "microzymas". If an
individual became sick, these microbes would alter their
state. Although Pasteur expressed a firm belief that the blood was
sterile in healthy people, it was easily seen that microzymas existed
in healthy people. Beauchamps believed that disease came from within
the body. The environment or "terrain" of the body, not the germ
itselfr, dictated whether or not we got sick.

This theory was reasonable enough at the time, but we now know that
bacteria do not, in fact, change their forms the way Bechamp thought
they did. He was done in by the limitations of microscopy of his
era.

Quoted message said:

Pasteur successfully promoted his "germ theory" while discrediting
Beauchamps "pleomorphic theory".

Lucky for us. Who knows how many people would have died had
researchers wasted a lot of time following Bechamp's false trail.

All of us who understand that he was quite correct then and is still today,
are able to assist people in being healed. You should read my book when
its finished. You likely won't understand it because you would need to
throw away your personal system of protective beliefs and I'm sure you
would be lost without having someone dictate what to believe.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

This was the fork in the road. The "germ theory" became accepted and has
been passionately defended by those people who have chosen to tie their
credibility to it. Forty years after the development of his "germ theory"
Pasteur recanted with the words, "the microbe is nothing, the terrain is
everything." It was too late,

And for how many more years will this bogus "quotation" of Pasteur be
repeated by altie know-nothings?

I must admit I wasn't there. But if he did say it, he was correct.

In article <[email hidden]>,

Dave Wickware said:

"David Wright" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Dave Wickware said:

Van Leeuwenhoek revolutionized the microscope.

By inventing it, as it happens. Can't get much more revolutionary
than that.

Actually you are incorrect (surprise-surprise) again. The inventor of the
microscope was a Dutchman by the name of Zacharias Jansenn.

My mistake. Leeuwenhoek was the first to see protozoa and bacteria.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Through his work, in the 17th century, he was the first to discover
the existence of bacteria, blood cells, sperm cells and more.

Quoted message said:

His most notable experiment uncovered a mystery that has not yet been
answered. He took a sample of stagnant water and observed many little
creatures through his microscope. Next he collected a sample of
clean rainwater and saw nothing in it. He sealed the samples in
sterilized pipettes and continued to view them through his
microscope. Day after day he saw nothing. Finally, on day four, he
observed that the same creatures that he had seen in the stagnant
water had made their way into his sealed containers. He was the first
person to ever witness spontaneous generation. He had witnessed the
creation of life without a mommy and daddy. The obvious question is,
where did these germs come from. This question has never been
answered to this day, although the experiment is easily recreated.

And YOUR answer is?

My answer was in the next paragraph. Apparently you were so eager to
claim I was wrong that you failed to notice it. There's not much I
can do about that.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

The obvious answer (obvious to people smarter than Spammin' Dave,
which means most people) is that (a) his microscope wasn't powerful
enough to see everything in the water, and (b) his sterile technique
wasn't adequate. Pasteur did an elegant experiment that showed that
spontaneous generation was nonsense. Spammin' Dave has apparently not
heard of this experiment. I read about it when I was in elementary
school. Perhaps when Spammin' Dave makes it through elementary school
he'll have read about it also.

I guess senility syndrome has made you forget the point of it?

Nope. But I see that you have plagiarized yet another piece of text
in a subsequent posting and I'll get to that in a separate reply.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

It was in the 19th century that the "germ theory" was developed by
Louis Pasteur. It hypothesizes that all infections and contageous
disorders are caused by germs. This theory presupposes that the blood
is sterile until invaded. This theory is still held by modern-day
bacteriologists.

Quite rightly. Although the blood is never entirely sterile, though
it's pretty close. If it were sterile, we wouldn't need macrophages
and so on.

Spoken with true ignorance. Anyone who is bright enough to know how
to look at a live blood sample through a microscope can see that is total
nonsense.

You do post a great deal of total nonsense, Spammin' Dave, and I am
hopeful that you are now becoming aware of that.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Another 19th century biologist named Antoine Beauchamps, challenged
Pasteurs theory by putting forth one of his own. He called it the
"pleomorphic theory". He discovered that the blood was not sterile,
but that it contained microbes that he named "microzymas". If an
individual became sick, these microbes would alter their
state. Although Pasteur expressed a firm belief that the blood was
sterile in healthy people, it was easily seen that microzymas existed
in healthy people. Beauchamps believed that disease came from within
the body. The environment or "terrain" of the body, not the germ
itselfr, dictated whether or not we got sick.

This theory was reasonable enough at the time, but we now know that
bacteria do not, in fact, change their forms the way Bechamp thought
they did. He was done in by the limitations of microscopy of his
era.

Quoted message said:

Pasteur successfully promoted his "germ theory" while discrediting
Beauchamps "pleomorphic theory".

Lucky for us. Who knows how many people would have died had
researchers wasted a lot of time following Bechamp's false trail.

All of us who understand that he was quite correct then and is still today,

You don't understand anything, Spammin' Dave, except how to quote
people who are just as confused and ignorant as you are. If Bechamp's
idea of pleomorphism was correct, it'd be trivial to demonstrate
today. Yet it's not being done, even though it would make the
reputation of whoever did it.

Quoted message said:

are able to assist people in being healed. You should read my book when
its finished. You likely won't understand it because you would need to
throw away your personal system of protective beliefs and I'm sure you
would be lost without having someone dictate what to believe.

As opposed to your illustrious self, who mostly posts unattributed
quotations of other people. Gosh, I'm so impressed. And you're going
to write a book, so that your vast grasp of misinformation can be
recorded for posterity. That's nice.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

This was the fork in the road. The "germ theory" became accepted and has
been passionately defended by those people who have chosen to tie their
credibility to it. Forty years after the development of his "germ theory"
Pasteur recanted with the words, "the microbe is nothing, the terrain is
everything." It was too late,

And for how many more years will this bogus "quotation" of Pasteur be
repeated by altie know-nothings?

I must admit I wasn't there. But if he did say it, he was correct.

We went through all this recently. The supposed quotation is as
fictitious as Mrs O'Leary's cow causing the Great Chicago Fire.

-- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net
These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct.
"If I have not seen as far as others, it is because giants
were standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson, MIT)

Quoted message said:

Subject: The Source of Allopathic Medicine
From: "Dave Wickware" [email hidden]
Date: 5/8/04 12:18 PM Eastern Daylight Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]

True enough.

However, those in science and medicine never counted on business men creating a
medical monopoly based upon Pasteur's lies. Thus, we have allopathic medicine
and all the laws from the federal level to the state level to the local level
to protect the monopoly's right to profit from our diseases.

DrC PhD

Quoted message said:

Van Leeuwenhoek revolutionized the microscope. Through his work, in the 17th
century, he was the first to discover the existence of bacteria, blood
cells, sperm cells and more.

His most notable experiment uncovered a mystery that has not yet been
answered. He took a sample of
stagnant water and observed many little creatures through his microscope.
Next he collected a sample of
clean rainwater and saw nothing in it. He sealed the samples in sterilized
pipettes and continued to view them through his microscope. Day after day he
saw nothing. Finally, on day four, he observed that the same creatures that
he had seen in the stagnant water had made their way into his sealed
containers. He was the first person to ever witness spontaneous generation.
He had witnessed the creation of life without a mommy and daddy. The obvious
question is, where did these germs come from. This question has never
been answered to this day, although the experiment is easily recreated.

It was in the 19th century that the "germ theory" was developed by Louis
Pasteur. It hypothesizes that all
infections and contageous disorders are caused by germs. This theory
presupposes that the blood is sterile
until invaded. This theory is still held by modern-day bacteriologists.

Another 19th century biologist named Antoine Beauchamps, challenged Pasteurs
theory by putting forth one of his own. He called it the "pleomorphic
theory". He discovered that the blood was not sterile, but
that it contained microbes that he named "microzymas". If an individual
became sick, these microbes would alter their state. Although Pasteur
expressed a firm belief that the blood was sterile in healthy people, it was
easily seen that microzymas existed in healthy people. Beauchamps believed
that disease came from within the body. The environment or "terrain" of the
body, not the germ itselfr, dictated whether or not we got sick.

Pasteur successfully promoted his "germ theory" while discrediting
Beauchamps "pleomorphic theory".
This was the fork in the road. The "germ theory" became accepted and has
been passionately defended by those people who have chosen to tie their
credibility to it. Forty years after the development of his "germ theory"
Pasteur recanted with the words, "the microbe is nothing, the terrain is
everything." It was too late,
allopathic medicine has been entrenched ever since.

Dave Wickware said:

Forty years after the development of his "germ theory"
Pasteur recanted with the words, "the microbe is nothing, the terrain is
everything."

Lie.

See http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/pasteur.htm

--
Peter Bowditch
The Millenium Project http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles
The Green Light http://www.ratbags.com/greenlight
Quintessence of the Loon http://www.ratbags.com/loon
To email me use my first name only at ratbags.com

Quoted message said:

From: Peter Bowditch [email hidden]

Quoted message said:

Lie.

Quoted message said:

http://www.ratbags.

Lies there indeed. Proven liar and deceiver Peter Bowditch.

<snip spam>

Jan

"Peter Bowditch" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Dave Wickware said:

Forty years after the development of his "germ theory"
Pasteur recanted with the words, "the microbe is nothing, the terrain is
everything."

Lie.

See http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/pasteur.htm

Excellent.

"Jan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

From: Peter Bowditch [email hidden]

Quoted message said:

Lie.

Quoted message said:

http://www.ratbags.

Lies there indeed. Proven liar and deceiver Peter Bowditch.

Jan Drew is well known to snip and edit to change meaning. Anytime one reads
her posts, they should always read the original.

"Jan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

From: Peter Bowditch [email hidden]

Quoted message said:

Lie.

Quoted message said:

http://www.ratbags.

Lies there indeed. Proven liar and deceiver Peter Bowditch.

No lie, and no proof. Your naked accusation is a lie itself until you back
it up with proof.

Exodus 20:16

Sin no more, Jan.

--Rich

In article <[email hidden]>,

M.a.r.k P.r.o.b.e.r.t-May 10 said:

"Jan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

From: Peter Bowditch [email hidden]

Quoted message said:

Lie.

Quoted message said:

http://www.ratbags.

Lies there indeed. Proven liar and deceiver Peter Bowditch.

Jan Drew is well known to snip and edit to change meaning. Anytime one reads
her posts, they should always read the original.

This is why I don't read her posts -- I don't have to watch her lie by
omission. And you should cut back, Mark -- you're getting way too
emotional about what she writes. She's a nut, rememeber? What were
you expecting her to write -- something sensible?

-- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net
These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct.
"If I have not seen as far as others, it is because giants
were standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson, MIT)

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: The Source of Allopathic Medicine
From: [email hidden] (David Wright)
Date: 5/10/2004 5:08 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

In article <[email hidden]>,
M.a.r.k P.r.o.b.e.r.t-May 10, 2004 <M.a.r.k P.r.o.b.e.r.t

Quoted message said:

"Jan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

>From: Peter Bowditch [email hidden]

>Lie.

>http://www.ratbags.

Lies there indeed. Proven liar and deceiver Peter Bowditch.

Jan Drew is well known to snip and edit to change meaning. Anytime one reads
her posts, they should always read the original.

It is noted Andrew Kingoff's name isn't mentioned. Ho hum.

Quoted message said:

This is why I don't read her posts -- I don't have to watch her lie by
omission. And you should cut back, Mark -- you're getting way too
emotional about what she writes. She's a nut, rememeber? What were
you expecting her to write -- something sensible?

Indeed, David doesn't care to hear about the many problems within organized
medicine. However he is totally correct about Mark.

Now for the proof of lies on Peter's website.

There are THREE lies in the Three dead children story. All RHREE about the Ben
Kolb tragedy.

These are your EXACT words:

*Some proponents of "alternative medicine" have tried to make an issue out of
Ben's death, apparently on the basis that a mistake made by real doctors
somehow has something to do with children dying because pretend doctors treat
them with snake oil.*

These are mine:

So far you haven't been able to copy and paste where you got that idea.

And you can't, can you Peter?

So that is LIE # 1.

Then you stated:

You can read about Ben athttp://www.krupnicklaw.com/site/press/healing.htm This
site belongs tot he lawyers who represented Ben's parents at the time. The
attitude ofthe parents' lawyers stands in stark contrast to the way "

(My words below)

So far you haven't been able to copy and paste WHERE or WHO had this stark
contrast.

And you can't, can you Peter?

So that is LIE # 2

You also stated:

"alternative medicine" supporters attempt to demonise the people who made a
tragic mistake.

(My words below)

So far, you haven't been able to copy and paste who demonized anyone.

And you can't, can you Peter?

So that is LIE # 3

Here is WHAT I posted:

From: Jan ([email hidden])
Subject: Re: A Lesson from Ben
Newsgroups: misc.health.alternative
View: Complete Thread (21 articles) |
Date: 2002-01-02 11:01:59 PST

<snipping to the *only* thing said about the doctor>

Yes. They did the right thing and my heart goes out to the doctor, and all
those involved. The parents in turn also did the right thing and dropped the
lawsuit. I was indeed very sad for everyone. This is why I started my post with
this sentence.

This post is NOT intended to go after any *ONE* individual.

NO demonizing whatsoever.

Jan

PS Peter Moran just did the same thing in a post today.

(Jan) said:

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: The Source of Allopathic Medicine
From: [email hidden] (David Wright)
Date: 5/10/2004 5:08 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

In article <[email hidden]>,
M.a.r.k P.r.o.b.e.r.t-May 10, 2004 <M.a.r.k P.r.o.b.e.r.t

Quoted message said:

"Jan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
> >From: Peter Bowditch [email hidden]
>
> >Lie.
>
> >http://www.ratbags.
>
> Lies there indeed. Proven liar and deceiver Peter Bowditch.

Jan Drew is well known to snip and edit to change meaning. Anytime one reads
her posts, they should always read the original.

It is noted Andrew Kingoff's name isn't mentioned. Ho hum.

Ben Kingsley, Kurt Cobain, Stephen Hawking, Leo Tolstoy, Miles Davis,
Artemis Ward, Rupert Sheldrake, Sir John Guilgud, Tina Turner, Bill
Gates, Isaac Newton, Isaac Hayes, Hayes Gordon, Douglas Macarthur,
Joan Miro, Carole King, Mel Gibson, Nigel Mansell, Patrick Swayze, ...

Have I mentioned enough people who have nothing to do with this?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

This is why I don't read her posts -- I don't have to watch her lie by
omission. And you should cut back, Mark -- you're getting way too
emotional about what she writes. She's a nut, rememeber? What were
you expecting her to write -- something sensible?

Indeed, David doesn't care to hear about the many problems within organized
medicine. However he is totally correct about Mark.

Now for the proof of lies on Peter's website.

There are THREE lies in the Three dead children story. All RHREE about the Ben
Kolb tragedy.

These are your EXACT words:

*Some proponents of "alternative medicine" have tried to make an issue out of
Ben's death, apparently on the basis that a mistake made by real doctors
somehow has something to do with children dying because pretend doctors treat
them with snake oil.*

These are mine:

So far you haven't been able to copy and paste where you got that idea.

And you can't, can you Peter?

So that is LIE # 1.

http:[email hidden]&lr=&as_drrb=b&as_mind=1&as_minm=1&as_miny=2002&as_maxd=31&as_maxm=1&as_maxy=2002&hl=en

http://tinyurl.com/2k8js

Results 1 - 10 of about 85 from 1 Jan 2002 to 31 Jan 2002 for ben kolb
group:misc.health.alternative author:[email hidden]. (0.54
seconds)

This was the first month in which Jan mentioned Ben Kolb. In that
month alone, Jan brought up the tragic death of Ben as a way of either
diverting the conversation or of supporting "alternative medicine" in
threads related to Hulda Clark, the slimebag who exploited Thomas
Navarro and threw him in the garbage after he died, noni juice,
stevia, vaccinations in general, murderer Alan Yurko, cancer quackery,
Accutane and youth suicide, amalgam fillings, Stephen Barrett, the
Gutless Anonymous Liar, magnets, Mannatech, someone with an AIDS cure,
....

It's almost enough to make you say 'Some proponents of "alternative
medicine" have tried to make an issue out of Ben's death, apparently
on the basis that a mistake made by real doctors somehow has something
to do with children dying because pretend doctors treat them with
snake oil'

Quoted message said:

Then you stated:

You can read about Ben athttp://www.krupnicklaw.com/site/press/healing.htm This
site belongs tot he lawyers who represented Ben's parents at the time. The
attitude ofthe parents' lawyers stands in stark contrast to the way "

Actually, what it says on my site is:

When I first went to the web site of the lawyers who acted for Ben
Kolb's parents in their negotiations with the hospital, I expected to
find some ambulance chasers in full flight. Instead, when I looked
there I was pleasantly surprised to find a balanced and sensitive
approach to the incident and the doctors who were as much a part of
the tragedy as the parents. The attitude of the parents' lawyers
stands in stark contrast to the way "alternative medicine" supporters
attempt to demonise the people who made a tragic mistake.

Quoted message said:

(My words below)

So far you haven't been able to copy and paste WHERE or WHO had this stark
contrast.

And you can't, can you Peter?

So that is LIE # 2

You also stated:

"alternative medicine" supporters attempt to demonise the people who made a
tragic mistake.

(My words below)

So far, you haven't been able to copy and paste who demonized anyone.

And you can't, can you Peter?

So that is LIE # 3

Here is WHAT I posted:

From: Jan ([email hidden])
Subject: Re: A Lesson from Ben
Newsgroups: misc.health.alternative
View: Complete Thread (21 articles) |
Date: 2002-01-02 11:01:59 PST

<snipping to the *only* thing said about the doctor>

Yes. They did the right thing and my heart goes out to the doctor, and all
those involved. The parents in turn also did the right thing and dropped the
lawsuit. I was indeed very sad for everyone. This is why I started my post with
this sentence.

This post is NOT intended to go after any *ONE* individual.

NO demonizing whatsoever.

Jan

PS Peter Moran just did the same thing in a post today.

85 mentions of Ben Kolb in one month. But no demonising.

--
Peter Bowditch
The Millenium Project http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles
The Green Light http://www.ratbags.com/greenlight
Quintessence of the Loon http://www.ratbags.com/loon
To email me use my first name only at ratbags.com

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: The Source of Allopathic Medicine
From: Peter Bowditch [email hidden]
Date: 5/10/2004 9:15 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

(Jan) said:

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: The Source of Allopathic Medicine
From: [email hidden] (David Wright)
Date: 5/10/2004 5:08 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

In article <[email hidden]>,
M.a.r.k P.r.o.b.e.r.t-May 10, 2004 <M.a.r.k P.r.o.b.e.r.t
[email hidden]> wrote:
>
>"Jan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
>news:[email hidden]...
>> >From: Peter Bowditch [email hidden]
>>
>> >Lie.
>>
>> >http://www.ratbags.
>>
>> Lies there indeed. Proven liar and deceiver Peter Bowditch.
>
>Jan Drew is well known to snip and edit to change meaning. Anytime one

reads

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>her posts, they should always read the original.

It is noted Andrew Kingoff's name isn't mentioned. Ho hum.

Ben Kingsley, Kurt Cobain, Stephen Hawking, Leo Tolstoy, Miles Davis,
Artemis Ward, Rupert Sheldrake, Sir John Guilgud, Tina Turner, Bill
Gates, Isaac Newton, Isaac Hayes, Hayes Gordon, Douglas Macarthur,
Joan Miro, Carole King, Mel Gibson, Nigel Mansell, Patrick Swayze, ...

Have I mentioned enough people who have nothing to do with this?

Weaseling again.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

This is why I don't read her posts -- I don't have to watch her lie by

Quoted message said:

omission. And you should cut back, Mark -- you're getting way too
emotional about what she writes. She's a nut, rememeber? What were
you expecting her to write -- something sensible?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Indeed, David doesn't care to hear about the many problems within organized
medicine. However he is totally correct about Mark.

Now for the proof of lies on Peter's website.

Quoted message said:

There are THREE lies in the Three dead children story. All RHREE about the
Ben

Quoted message said:

Kolb tragedy.

These are your EXACT words:

Quoted message said:

Some proponents of "alternative medicine" have tried to make an issue out of

Quoted message said:

Ben's death, apparently on the basis that a mistake made by real doctors
somehow has something to do with children dying because pretend doctors

treat

Quoted message said:

them with snake oil.*

Quoted message said:

These are mine:

Quoted message said:

So far you haven't been able to copy and paste where you got that idea.

And you can't, can you Peter?

So that is LIE # 1.

Quoted message said:

http://groups.google.com/groups?as_q=ben%20kolb&safe=images&ie=UTF-8&oe=U

[email hidden]&lr=&
as_drrb=b&as_mind=1&as_minm=1&as_miny=2002&as_maxd=31&as_maxm=1&as_maxy

Quoted message said:

=2002&hl=en

http://tinyurl.com/2k8js

OOPs, you snipped and didn;t mention it, trying to change the meaning???

Quoted message said:

Results 1 - 10 of about 85 from 1 Jan 2002 to 31 Jan 2002 for ben kolb
group:misc.health.alternative author:[email hidden]. (0.54
seconds)

Quoted message said:

This was the first month in which Jan mentioned Ben Kolb. In that
month alone,

Yes, because you kept on lying. Furthermore the number of posts does not erase
your lies.

Quoted message said:

Jan brought up the tragic death of Ben as a way of either
diverting the conversation or of supporting "alternative medicine"

Wrong. I brought it up because you insisted on lying. I also told you I would
bring it up EVERTIME you so desperately looked for a death from alternative
medicine.

Quoted message said:

in
threads related to Hulda Clark, the slimebag who exploited Thomas
Navarro and threw him in the garbage after he died, noni juice,
stevia, vaccinations in general, murderer Alan Yurko, cancer quackery,
Accutane and youth suicide, amalgam fillings, Stephen Barrett, the
Gutless Anonymous Liar, magnets,

Mannatech, someone with an AIDS cure,

Desperately looking or ways to cover you lies? Lying with the
above,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

You are once again lying. Ben Kolb was not mention in some of your list.

Quoted message said:

It's almost enough to make you say 'Some proponents of "alternative
medicine" have tried to make an issue out of Ben's death, apparently
on the basis that a mistake made by real doctors somehow has something
to do with children dying because pretend doctors treat them with
snake oil'

No, no, that won't work, you made up the lies RIGHT after I posted it, NOT
after it was further discussed.

I posted it on Jan. 3rd, you lies were posted on Jan 8th. So once again your
game of deceiving is clear.

Quoted message said:

Then you stated:

Quoted message said:

You can read about Ben athttp://www.krupnicklaw.com/site/press/healing.htm

This

Quoted message said:

site belongs tot he lawyers who represented Ben's parents at the time. The
attitude ofthe parents' lawyers stands in stark contrast to the way "

Quoted message said:

Actually, what it says on my site is:

Actually I posted your exact words from your post.

Quoted message said:

When I first went to the web site of the lawyers who acted for Ben
Kolb's parents in their negotiations with the hospital, I expected to
find some ambulance chasers in full flight. Instead, when I looked
there I was pleasantly surprised to find a balanced and sensitive
approach to the incident and the doctors who were as much a part of
the tragedy as the parents. The

The attitude of the parents' lawyers

Quoted message said:

stands in stark contrast to the way "alternative medicine" supporters
attempt to demonise the people who made a tragic mistake.

Which was and is a lie.

Quoted message said:

(My words below)

Quoted message said:

So far you haven't been able to copy and paste WHERE or WHO had this stark
contrast.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

And you can't, can you Peter?

So that is LIE # 2

You also stated:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

"alternative medicine" supporters attempt to demonise the people who made a
tragic mistake.

(My words below)

So far, you haven't been able to copy and paste who demonized anyone.

Quoted message said:

And you can't, can you Peter?

Quoted message said:

So that is LIE # 3

Here is WHAT I posted:

Quoted message said:

From: Jan ([email hidden])

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: A Lesson from Ben
Newsgroups: misc.health.alternative
View: Complete Thread (21 articles) |
Date: 2002-01-02 11:01:59 PST

<snipping to the *only* thing said about the doctor>

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Yes. They did the right thing and my heart goes out to the doctor, and all
those involved. The parents in turn also did the right thing and dropped the
lawsuit. I was indeed very sad for everyone. This is why I started my post

with

Quoted message said:

this sentence.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

This post is NOT intended to go after any *ONE* individual.

NO demonizing whatsoever.

Jan

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

PS Peter Moran just did the same thing in a post today.

Quoted message said:

85 mentions of Ben Kolb in one month. But no demonising.

That's correct. All those posts were because of YOUR lies.And NOT ONE SINGLE
WORD was said by me of demonizing, quite the opposite as I have proven.

You LIED, it is clear to see and you know it.

Jan

<snip spam>

"David Wright" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
M.a.r.k P.r.o.b.e.r.t-May 10, 2004 <M.a.r.k P.r.o.b.e.r.t

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

"Jan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

>From: Peter Bowditch [email hidden]

>Lie.

>http://www.ratbags.

Lies there indeed. Proven liar and deceiver Peter Bowditch.

Jan Drew is well known to snip and edit to change meaning. Anytime one

reads

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

her posts, they should always read the original.

This is why I don't read her posts -- I don't have to watch her lie by
omission. And you should cut back, Mark -- you're getting way too
emotional about what she writes. She's a nut, rememeber? What were
you expecting her to write -- something sensible?

As I have said before, callme Don Quixote.

Hope springs eternal.