Retro Shimano indexing question

Quoted message said:

Guys

I have just picked up an old Colnago 'Super' frame with a 6-speed Dura
Ace (7400) groupset, except for the 105 brake levers and Campag
headset/bottom bracket. I think the frame is late 80s and the groupset
mid-80s??

It has no wheels which is fine as I have my almost unused race wheels
from 1990/91.

My main question is that my wheels have Ultegra hubs with a 7 speed HG
cassette, is the best way to make this work to pick up some Ultegra 7
speed downtube shifters from the period (and add a 7 speed
chain)............I would like Dura Ace ones from the period ideally
(740x 7 speed)but think they used UG cassettes with differant cog/index
spacing.......is this correct??

Also any info on the Colnago tubing would be interesting, it just has a
colnago sticker on it, no mention of SL/SLX etc.

Regards

David

UG sprocket spacing is the same as HG.

Quoted message said:

Guys

I have just picked up an old Colnago 'Super' frame with a 6-speed Dura
Ace (7400) groupset, except for the 105 brake levers and Campag
headset/bottom bracket. I think the frame is late 80s and the groupset
mid-80s??

It has no wheels which is fine as I have my almost unused race wheels
from 1990/91.

My main question is that my wheels have Ultegra hubs with a 7 speed HG
cassette, is the best way to make this work to pick up some Ultegra 7
speed downtube shifters from the period (and add a 7 speed
chain)............I would like Dura Ace ones from the period ideally
(740x 7 speed)but think they used UG cassettes with differant cog/index
spacing.......is this correct??

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/dura-ace.html

Nope. The cog spacing is the same for all Shimano cassettes of a given
number of cogs. What's different about all pre-1997 (pre-7700) DA is
that the shifters and derailers are based on a different amount of
cable travel than anything else.

Since you have a 7400 rear derailer, you only need to find some
7400-era 7 speed DA downtube shifters... which I think means any 7
speed DA shifter, since the post-97 ones were meaninglessly labeled
Ultegra or 105 or just say Shimano, but I'm not 100% about this. This
combination will shift any Shimano 7 speed cassette.

Quoted message said:

Also any info on the Colnago tubing would be interesting, it just has a
colnago sticker on it, no mention of SL/SLX etc.

Regards

David

MSeries said:

UG sprocket spacing is the same as HG.

At least my UG 8x DuraAce spacer feature the same 3mm as all 8x HG
ones.

--
MfG/Best regards
helmut springer

Quoted message said:

Since you have a 7400 rear derailer, you only need to find some
7400-era 7 speed DA downtube shifters... which I think means any 7
speed DA shifter, since the post-97 ones were meaninglessly labeled
Ultegra or 105 or just say Shimano, but I'm not 100% about this.

This should have read "any 7 speed DA DOWNTUBE shifter."

Nate Knutson said:

Since you have a 7400 rear derailer, you only need to find some
7400-era 7 speed DA downtube shifters... which I think means any 7
speed DA shifter, since the post-97 ones were meaninglessly

As the 740? rear derailer have a different geometry they will
perform 8x steps with 9x cable pull. Given that many people shift
7x cassettes with 8x shifters without problems you might give any 9x
Shimano shifter a try...if it works there are 9x downtube shifters
available (happen to be DuraAce, but 9x is all the same pull
anyway).

--
MfG/Best regards
helmut springer

Quoted message said:

Guys

I have just picked up an old Colnago 'Super' frame with a 6-speed Dura
Ace (7400) groupset, except for the 105 brake levers and Campag
headset/bottom bracket. I think the frame is late 80s and the groupset
mid-80s??

It has no wheels which is fine as I have my almost unused race wheels
from 1990/91.

My main question is that my wheels have Ultegra hubs with a 7 speed HG
cassette, is the best way to make this work to pick up some Ultegra 7
speed downtube shifters from the period (and add a 7 speed
chain)............I would like Dura Ace ones from the period ideally
(740x 7 speed)but think they used UG cassettes with differant cog/index
spacing.......is this correct??

Keep the shifters you have, use a HG wheel, spacer on first then 6, 7
or 8s loose cogs, with 7s spacers. Adjust the rear der-go ride.

Quoted message said:

Also any info on the Colnago tubing would be interesting, it just has a
colnago sticker on it, no mention of SL/SLX etc.

Regards

David

"Nate Knutson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Guys

I have just picked up an old Colnago 'Super' frame with a

6-speed Dura

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Ace (7400) groupset, except for the 105 brake levers and

Campag

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

headset/bottom bracket. I think the frame is late 80s and

the groupset

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

mid-80s??

It has no wheels which is fine as I have my almost unused

race wheels

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

from 1990/91.

My main question is that my wheels have Ultegra hubs with a

7 speed HG

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

cassette, is the best way to make this work to pick up some

Ultegra 7

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

speed downtube shifters from the period (and add a 7 speed
chain)............I would like Dura Ace ones from the period

ideally

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

(740x 7 speed)but think they used UG cassettes with differant

cog/index

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

spacing.......is this correct??

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/dura-ace.html

Nope. The cog spacing is the same for all Shimano cassettes of

a given

Quoted message said:

number of cogs. What's different about all pre-1997 (pre-7700)

DA is

Quoted message said:

that the shifters and derailers are based on a different amount

of

Quoted message said:

cable travel than anything else.

Since you have a 7400 rear derailer, you only need to find some
7400-era 7 speed DA downtube shifters... which I think means

any 7

Quoted message said:

speed DA shifter, since the post-97 ones were meaninglessly

labeled

Quoted message said:

Ultegra or 105 or just say Shimano, but I'm not 100% about

this. This

Quoted message said:

combination will shift any Shimano 7 speed cassette.

Quoted message said:

Also any info on the Colnago tubing would be interesting, it

just has a

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

colnago sticker on it, no mention of SL/SLX etc.

The mid-80s Dura Ace 6 and 7 sp cogs were loose and have a
different spline pattern to match the channels on the UG cassette
body. The cassette body also uses a different remover tool, and
upgrading to HG is more expensive than buying a new hub.

If the OP is interested, I have a bunch of 7sp Dura Ace UG cogs,
a very lightly used Dura Ace 7sp hub, a derailleur (I think) and
some DT shifters (I think -- not sure on that one. I could
look).

I much preferred the loose cogs and thought it was a mistake to
go to the riveted-together cogs, although it does yeild some
weight savings. It was nice to have the Fisher-Price stack 'em
up cassette -- sort of like the old Regina Oro days except a lot
better. I quit buying Dura Ace about then because it was ungodly
expensive, it changed every year, and Shimano did not care about
compatability with 600 (Ultegra). -- Jay Beattie

Nate Knutson said:

Nope. The cog spacing is the same for all Shimano cassettes of a given
number of cogs. What's different about all pre-1997 (pre-7700) DA is
that the shifters and derailers are based on a different amount of
cable travel than anything else.

Basically everything DA 8 and less. DA9 and up is in line with the rest of
shimano, DA8 and under isn't.

Jasper