Will Cipo be able to beat Petacchi?

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Colin Campbell
Does anyone think that Super Mario will come to the Vuelta with the condition required to top
Alessandro? (Does Petacchi have a nickname yet, by the way?)

Is the Lion King history?

I thought that at the Giro, Cipollini was coming into top shape, and was again competitive with
Petacchi when the "terminator" stage occurred, and he went down. I never did hear whether his
injuries were at all serious. He sure looked as if he went into the barriers harder than Ullrich did
in the time trial. [/QUOTE

At the begining of the Giro, I thought Cipo was done. By the end of the giro, Cipo was coming in to form, however. More importantly, Cipo may have gotten beat by Petacchi, but Cipo was a lot closer to Petacchi than any of the sprinters in the TDF were. Personally, I think that Cipo will be in terrible shape. He will get dropped on anything that even resembles an ant hill. If he gets a leadout he could be ok, but Petacchi's top end is higher.

"lazysegall" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Originally posted by Colin Campbell Does anyone think that Super Mario will come to the Vuelta
with the condition required to top Alessandro? (Does Petacchi have a nickname yet, by the way?)

Is the Lion King history?

I thought that at the Giro, Cipollini was coming into top shape, and was again competitive with
Petacchi when the "terminator" stage occurred, and he went down. I never did hear whether his
injuries were at all serious. He sure looked as if he went into the barriers harder than Ullrich
did in the time trial. [/QUOTE

At the begining of the Giro, I thought Cipo was done. By the end of the giro, Cipo was coming in
to form, however. More importantly, Cipo may have gotten beat by Petacchi, but Cipo was a lot
closer to Petacchi than any of the sprinters in the TDF were.

That's not surprising. The Lion Queen has an entire team dedicated toward conserving his energy
during the race and giving him a leadout at the end.

Petacchi had to fight the other sprinters for position, then come around The Lion Queen.

Quoted post said:

Originally posted by Kurgan Gringion
"lazysegall" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Originally posted by Colin Campbell Does anyone think that Super Mario will come to the Vuelta
with the condition required to top Alessandro? (Does Petacchi have a nickname yet, by the way?)

Is the Lion King history?

I thought that at the Giro, Cipollini was coming into top shape, and was again competitive with
Petacchi when the "terminator" stage occurred, and he went down. I never did hear whether his
injuries were at all serious. He sure looked as if he went into the barriers harder than Ullrich
did in the time trial. [/QUOTE

At the begining of the Giro, I thought Cipo was done. By the end of the giro, Cipo was coming in
to form, however. More importantly, Cipo may have gotten beat by Petacchi, but Cipo was a lot
closer to Petacchi than any of the sprinters in the TDF were.

That's not surprising. The Lion Queen has an entire team dedicated toward conserving his energy
during the race and giving him a leadout at the end.

Petacchi had to fight the other sprinters for position, then come around The Lion Queen.

He will still have his escort in the vuelta.

"lazysegall" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Kurgan Gringion said:

"lazysegall" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

news:3f5-

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

[email hidden]:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Originally posted by Colin Campbell Does anyone think that Super

Mario

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Quoted message said:

will come to the Vuelta with the condition required to top

Alessandro?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

(Does Petacchi have a nickname yet, by the way?)

Is the Lion King history?

I thought that at the Giro, Cipollini was coming into top shape, and was again competitive
with Petacchi when the "terminator" stage occurred, and he went down. I never did hear
whether his injuries

were

Quoted message said:

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at all serious. He sure looked as if he went into the barriers harder than Ullrich did in
the time trial. [/QUOTE

At the begining of the Giro, I thought Cipo was done. By the end of the giro, Cipo was
coming in to form, however. More importantly, Cipo may have gotten beat by Petacchi, but
Cipo was a lot closer to Petacchi than any of the sprinters in the TDF were.

That's not surprising. The Lion Queen has an entire team dedicated toward conserving his
energy during the race and giving him a leadout at the end. Petacchi had to fight the other
sprinters for position, then come

around

Quoted message said:

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The Lion Queen.

He will still have his escort in the vuelta.

the point is that is why Cipo did better than the other sprinters.

This year, it doesn't seem like he's better. How about that race where Friere pipped him at the line
after he threw up his hands? That didn't used to happen to him, because he has so much power
relative to everyone else. His time may be over - we'll find out next year.

"Kurgan Gringioni" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

the point is that is why Cipo did better than the other sprinters.

This year, it doesn't seem like he's better. How about that race where

Friere

Quoted message said:

pipped him at the line after he threw up his hands? That didn't used to happen to him, because he
has so much power relative to everyone else. His time may be over - we'll find out next year.

Is that the point? I do not think so. How many sprinters can you name with a better palmares?

Thanks

Whiney [censored] Disease appears to have infected everyone as the season winds down. And Cipo, and the
Vuelta organizers. Last year Giovanni Lombardi won a good Vuelta stage after Cipo dropped out.
Frequently that would be enough to bring the team back - every time some marginal French team wins a
TdF stage, it gets them an invite for next year. The Vuelta organizers played brinkmanship to make
sure Cipo would show.

BTW, Petacchi would have finished the Giro this year but for getting time-cut, and he finished the
Vuelta last year. Yes, that means he climbed the Angliru. I don't know how many team cars he had to
hang on to do it, but he did.

"Nick Burns" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Kurgan Gringioni" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

the point is that is why Cipo did better than the other sprinters.

This year, it doesn't seem like he's better. How about that race where

Friere

Quoted message said:

pipped him at the line after he threw up his hands? That didn't used to happen to him, because
he has so much power relative to everyone else.

His

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

time may be over - we'll find out next year.

Is that the point? I do not think so. How many sprinters can you name with

a

Quoted message said:

better palmares?

Dumbass -

I'm talking this year.

This year, The Lion Queen is way, way off his previous self. The only reason he's looked better vs.
Petacchi than the other sprinters is his leadout train.

In article <[email hidden]>, "Kurgan Gringioni"

Quoted message said:

This year, it doesn't seem like he's better. How about that race where Friere pipped him at the
line after he threw up his hands? That didn't used to happen to him, because he has so much power
relative to everyone else. His time may be over - we'll find out next year.

He did renew his contract for two more years, as per:
<http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/?id=2003/sep03/sep04news>, so if he's lost it, then it's gonna
be a long couple of years. Cipo does not seem to be projecting the same hyper-confident attitude
he has in the past.

--
tanx, Howard

"Head of a cat, body of a monkey, Here comes a plague upon the land." The Billy Nayer Show

remove YOUR SHOES to reply, ok?

In article said:

Whiney [censored] Disease appears to have infected everyone as the season winds down. And Cipo, and
the Vuelta organizers. Last year Giovanni Lombardi won a good Vuelta stage after Cipo dropped out.
Frequently that would be enough to bring the team back - every time some marginal French team wins
a TdF stage, it gets them an invite for next year.

Simply being a French team is usually enough to get an invitation to the TdF, but you are
correct: a stage win increases the likelyhood dramatically.

--
tanx, Howard

"Head of a cat, body of a monkey, Here comes a plague upon the land." The Billy Nayer Show

remove YOUR SHOES to reply, ok?

There's no doubt about it that Petacchi is the next Cipo. But first Cipo will have to move aside and
he ain't about to do that. It ought to be an exciting couple of years as Petacchi discovers that
Cipo will be as fast as he is and the deciding point will be the leadout and/or the guy with the
most cunning.

So, how many spring classics has Petachi won?

"Howard Kveck" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
"Kurgan Gringioni" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

This year, it doesn't seem like he's better. How about that race

where Friere

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

pipped him at the line after he threw up his hands? That didn't

used to

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

happen to him, because he has so much power relative to everyone

else. His

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

time may be over - we'll find out next year.

He did renew his contract for two more years, as per:
<http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/?id=2003/sep03/sep04news>, so if

he's lost it,

Quoted message said:

then it's gonna be a long couple of years. Cipo does not seem to be

projecting

Quoted message said:

the same hyper-confident attitude he has in the past.

--
tanx, Howard

"Head of a cat, body of a monkey, Here comes a plague upon the

land."

Quoted message said:

The Billy Nayer Show

remove YOUR SHOES to reply, ok?

"Kurgan Gringioni" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

Dumbass -

I'm talking this year.

This year, The Lion Queen is way, way off his previous self. The only

reason

Quoted message said:

he's looked better vs. Petacchi than the other sprinters is his leadout train.

Dumbass,

So what? My point was that put any other sprinter next to him and look at longevity. The guy has
been winning sprints for close to 2 decades. Most sprinters peak for a few years. The great might
win sprints for ten years. Cipo was his 41st and 42nd Giro sprints while 37 years old. That is
impressive. You may not be impressed, but you are obviously biased to the point of making your
opinion irrelevant.

In article <[email hidden]>, "Tom Kunich"

Quoted message said:

There's no doubt about it that Petacchi is the next Cipo. But first Cipo will have to move aside
and he ain't about to do that. It ought to be an exciting couple of years as Petacchi discovers
that Cipo will be as fast as he is and the deciding point will be the leadout and/or the guy with
the most cunning.

True, Cipo will not move aside willingly. The point I was making is that, based on his results
for the year, his time -may- be over now (as noted by Henry). Who knows, he may come back as
strong as ever next year. He always used to just ooze confidence - something that I haven't seen
much this year. I don't remember him just throwing in the towel mid-sprint like this:
cyclingnews.comgiro03Open ↗ Petacchi still has time to develop
further as a rider.

--
tanx, Howard

"Head of a cat, body of a monkey, Here comes a plague upon the land." The Billy Nayer Show

remove YOUR SHOES to reply, ok?

"Nick Burns" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Kurgan Gringioni" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

Dumbass -

I'm talking this year.

This year, The Lion Queen is way, way off his previous self. The only

reason

Quoted message said:

he's looked better vs. Petacchi than the other sprinters is his leadout train.

Dumbass,

So what? My point was that put any other sprinter next to him and look at longevity.

Dumbass -

The poster I originally responded to talked about how at the Giro "Cipo was closer to Petacchi than
any of the sprinters in the TDF were".

You came in in the middle and are trying to make a straw man.

"Kurgan Gringioni" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

Dumbass -

The poster I originally responded to talked about how at the Giro "Cipo

was

Quoted message said:

closer to Petacchi than any of the sprinters in the TDF were".

You came in in the middle and are trying to make a straw man.

You can call it "a straw man" but I am responding to your persistent exaggeration WRT Cipo, simply
because you don't care for him.

Cipo won.

Petacchi pulled out only 3km into stage one TTT. Mario finished but didn't start stage 2.

So Mario won.

-Bruce

"Bruce" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Cipo won.

Petacchi pulled out only 3km into stage one TTT. Mario finished but

didn't

Quoted message said:

start stage 2.

So Mario won.

Petacchi's still in the race. Quaranta pulled out 3 km into the TTT, but that was no
surprise either.

Everyone, including the organisers, knew that Cipo was going to pull out early. Strange that the
organisers made such a fuss over it. Maybe Perdiguero, Scarponi or Lombardi will win a stage now.

Jeff

oops.

-Bruce

"Jeff Jones" <jeff@cyclingnews-punt-com> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

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"Bruce" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

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Cipo won.

Petacchi pulled out only 3km into stage one TTT. Mario finished but

didn't

Quoted message said:

start stage 2.

So Mario won.

Petacchi's still in the race. Quaranta pulled out 3 km into the TTT, but that was no
surprise either.

Everyone, including the organisers, knew that Cipo was going to pull out early. Strange that the
organisers made such a fuss over it. Maybe Perdiguero, Scarponi or Lombardi will win a stage now.

Jeff

Bruce said:

Cipo won.

Petacchi pulled out only 3km into stage one TTT. Mario finished but didn't start stage 2.

No ... QUARANTA pulled out 3km into the stage one TTT.

Quoted message said:

So Mario won.

-Bruce

--
Steven L. Sheffield stevens at veloworks dot com veloworks at worldnet dot ay tea tee dot net bellum
pax est libertas servitus est ignoratio vis est ess ay ell tea ell ay kay ee sea aye tee why you ti
ay aitch aitch tee tea pea colon [for word] slash [four ward] slash double-you double-yew double-ewe
dot veloworks dot com [four word] slash

"Steven L. Sheffield" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
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Quoted message said:

Bruce said:

Cipo won.

Petacchi pulled out only 3km into stage one TTT. Mario finished but

didn't

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

start stage 2.

No ... QUARANTA pulled out 3km into the stage one TTT.

Goddamm, Bruce has his head up his ass.