OT: Dead woman talkin'

Hugh Jampton said:

Footage from al-Jazeera (!) news show, in which a woman verbally
pummels a fundie imam.
I'd be surprised if she got off the set alive.

http://switch3.castup.net/cunet/gm.asp?ai=214&ar=1050wmv&ak=null

She brings up a good point though... that even though the Holocaust
happened to the Jews, "We have not seen a single Jew blow himself up in
a restaurant," although Muslims do it all the time.

But I think they're giving people ideas about doing it anyway.

I know this is probably an ignorant thing to say, but where is all this
hatred coming from? I mean I know they hate American politics and don't
usually have the same values as Christians do, at least not the same
way of voicing them, but where did all this begin?

Popess Pantiara Evokovitch asked:

Quoted message said:

I know this is probably an ignorant thing to say, but where is all this
hatred coming from? I mean I know they hate American politics and don't
usually have the same values as Christians do, at least not the same
way of voicing them, but where did all this begin?

Sayyid Qutb. (Google the name.)

Bob

Quoted message said:

I know this is probably an ignorant thing to say, but where is all this
hatred coming from? I mean I know they hate American politics and don't
usually have the same values as Christians do, at least not the same
way of voicing them, but where did all this begin?

Also, check out increased US military presence in the Middle East since
1990.

"Hugh Jampton" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I know this is probably an ignorant thing to say, but where is all this
hatred coming from? I mean I know they hate American politics and don't
usually have the same values as Christians do, at least not the same
way of voicing them, but where did all this begin?

Also, check out increased US military presence in the Middle East since
1990.

It began in 1990? 1990 B.C. maybe. It's quite a stretch to blame the USA
for almost archetypal Islamic-Judeo-Christian issues.

All the religeous values are basically identical. It's the real world that
is the problem. If you try to dictate that any group must conform to become
part of a social contract you get turmoil. Pile on economic, racial, and
other variables and over time anything can result.

If the Bob Jones group had been terroristic as well as suicidal the US could
have had several hundred suicide bombers at one time.

Lefty
--
Life is for learning

Quoted message said:

Bob Terwilliger virtualgoth@die_spammer.biz said:

Sayyid Qutb. (Google the name.)

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/front/special/sala.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslim_Brotherhood

nb

Quoted message said:

It began in 1990? 1990 B.C. maybe. It's quite a stretch to blame the USA for almost archetypal Islamic-Judeo-Christian issues.

Point taken. By the way - when did Americans *really* start to have
trouble with the Islamic fundies?

Popess Pantiara Evokovitch said:

Hugh Jampton said:

Footage from al-Jazeera (!) news show, in which a woman verbally
pummels a fundie imam.
I'd be surprised if she got off the set alive.

http://switch3.castup.net/cunet/gm.asp?ai=214&ar=1050wmv&ak=null

She brings up a good point though... that even though the Holocaust
happened to the Jews, "We have not seen a single Jew blow himself up in
a restaurant," although Muslims do it all the time.

But I think they're giving people ideas about doing it anyway.

I know this is probably an ignorant thing to say, but where is all this
hatred coming from? I mean I know they hate American politics and don't
usually have the same values as Christians do, at least not the same
way of voicing them, but where did all this begin?

You're kidding? Even a quick review of Western politics and military
action as it pertains to the Arab world will reveal that Britain and the
U.S. have been exploiting that region (for various reasons; oil among
them) for quite a long time now. For one instance: how do you think
Catholics would feel if Muslims had a military presence in the Holy
City? Yet that's exactly what the U.S. has in Mecca. In fact, getting
that presence out of Mecca is one of the very specific demands Bin Laden
made.

And - although I suppose there haven't been a lot of Jewish people
blowing themselves up - in the early days of the formation of Israel -
when it wasn't a sure thing Israel would ever come to exist - Jewish
groups routinely committed what we would now term "terrorist" acts,
targeting civilians, and women and children of their enemy. It is easy
to forget this, now that they have lots of modern weaponry and the
poltical power, and the economic clout, and only "coincidentally"
slaughter civilians, but people out of power - and desperate for
survival - always tend to resort to similiar things.

dmh

Quoted message said:

Hugh Jampton said:

Quoted message said:

It began in 1990? 1990 B.C. maybe. It's quite a stretch to blame the USA for almost archetypal Islamic-Judeo-Christian issues.

Point taken. By the way - when did Americans *really* start to have
trouble with the Islamic fundies?

It's a contiuuum: ever since we took over the British role in that area,
the hatred has been building. A military presence in Mecca didn't help,
and our unrelenting and non-critical support for Israel has fanned the
flames. Now that we've got Bush in power (a man whose stupidity renders
him effectivley insane) we are doing things that will ensure that hatred
grows and solidifies for decades to come.

dmh

"Hugh Jampton" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

It began in 1990? 1990 B.C. maybe. It's quite a stretch to blame the USA

for almost archetypal Islamic-Judeo-Christian issues.

Quoted message said:

Point taken. By the way - when did Americans *really* start to have
trouble with the Islamic fundies?

It must have evolved -- America is only 210 years old so involvement might
have started with alliances, like with Britain, moving to economic reasons
with the Industrial Revolution and concommitent need for oil.

I know from Persian friends that they maintained alliances with US during
the Islamic revolution in Iran under Khomeini. That had to do with Persians
vs. Arabs, the Persians being more westernized and secular. That alliance
was based in mutual benefits including the oil.

The variables are nebulous. I just hope the world doesn't homogenize to a
point where all of the cultures are lost for political-economic reasons.
International corporations have little interest in preserving cultures other
than as profit and they seem to rule the roost.

I wouldn't put it past McDs to put a little beef-something into the food
sold to cultures prohibiting beef if it saved them money and was able to be
settled in court once found out.

Lefty
--
Life is for learning
The worst I ever had was wonderful.

Quoted message said:

Bush's stupidity succeeds because it is so easy to relate to by the True
Believers who think in parallel sound-bytes, or rather want to delegate
thinking to bigger hypocrites than themselves. His stupidity is supported by
capitalists in control for its effectiveness (in making them profits). The
thing is, behind the scenes papa Bush and his oil Empire are growing and
profiting --all that money borrowed from China is paying for the war by
buying products and services from the Bush consortium --who do you think
brokers the massive oil requirements for the armed forces. They are laughing
all the way to the bank.

Lefty
--
Life is for learning
The worst I ever had was wonderful

"Dale Houstman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Hugh Jampton said:

Quoted message said:

It began in 1990? 1990 B.C. maybe. It's quite a stretch to blame the

USA for almost archetypal Islamic-Judeo-Christian issues.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Point taken. By the way - when did Americans *really* start to have
trouble with the Islamic fundies?

It's a contiuuum: ever since we took over the British role in that area,
the hatred has been building. A military presence in Mecca didn't help,
and our unrelenting and non-critical support for Israel has fanned the
flames. Now that we've got Bush in power (a man whose stupidity renders
him effectivley insane) we are doing things that will ensure that hatred
grows and solidifies for decades to come.

dmh

"You're kidding? Even a quick review of Western politics and military
action as it pertains to the Arab world will reveal that Britain and
the
U.S. have been exploiting that region (for various reasons; oil among
them) for quite a long time now. For one instance: how do you think
Catholics would feel if Muslims had a military presence in the Holy
City? Yet that's exactly what the U.S. has in Mecca. In fact, getting
that presence out of Mecca is one of the very specific demands Bin
Laden
made."

American troops in Mecca? What the hell are you talking about?

And speaking of Islamic miltary presences, have you been paying
attention to France lately?

"And - although I suppose there haven't been a lot of Jewish people
blowing themselves up - in the early days of the formation of Israel -
when it wasn't a sure thing Israel would ever come to exist - Jewish
groups routinely committed what we would now term "terrorist" acts,
targeting civilians, and women and children of their enemy. It is easy
to forget this, now that they have lots of modern weaponry and the
poltical power, and the economic clout, and only "coincidentally"
slaughter civilians, but people out of power - and desperate for
survival - always tend to resort to similiar things."

Except that those things never happened. They are creations of Islamic
anti-Semites.

You can repeat them ad nauseum. They're still made-up lies.

"It's a contiuuum: ever since we took over the British role in that
area,
the hatred has been building. A military presence in Mecca didn't help,

and our unrelenting and non-critical support for Israel has fanned the
flames. Now that we've got Bush in power (a man whose stupidity renders

him effectivley insane) we are doing things that will ensure that
hatred
grows and solidifies for decades to come."

Once again, there are no American troops in Mecca OR Medina.

Your playing fast and loose with the language tips your hand.

"I wouldn't put it past McDs to put a little beef-something into the
food
sold to cultures prohibiting beef if it saved them money and was able
to be
settled in court once found out."

This already happened in India. they said their fries were beef-free.

Then, OOPS! They had beef tallow in them.

Lefty said:

or rather want to delegate
thinking to bigger hypocrites than themselves. His stupidity i

Please...let's tie this together with cooking....our main focus in
this forum.

Lefty said:

Bush's stupidity succeeds because it is so easy to relate to by the True
Believers who think in parallel sound-bytes, or rather want to delegate
thinking to bigger hypocrites than themselves. His stupidity is supported by
capitalists in control for its effectiveness (in making them profits). The
thing is, behind the scenes papa Bush and his oil Empire are growing and
profiting --all that money borrowed from China is paying for the war by
buying products and services from the Bush consortium --who do you think
brokers the massive oil requirements for the armed forces. They are laughing
all the way to the bank.

Lefty

His stupidity also succeeds (until recently) because we have a
bought-and-paid-for media "empire" which exists only for profit, and
knows which side its bread is buttered on. Journalism has a lot to
answer for in the high crimes and misdemeanors arena, as well as
citizens who are satisfied to be mere consumers. It is unfortunate for
us all that the black hole that is Bush is surrounded by intelligent men
with the ethics of slime mold. And it is ALWAYS a matter of "follow the
money trail."

dmh

The Bishop said:

"You're kidding? Even a quick review of Western politics and military
action as it pertains to the Arab world will reveal that Britain and
the
U.S. have been exploiting that region (for various reasons; oil among
them) for quite a long time now. For one instance: how do you think
Catholics would feel if Muslims had a military presence in the Holy
City? Yet that's exactly what the U.S. has in Mecca. In fact, getting
that presence out of Mecca is one of the very specific demands Bin
Laden
made."

American troops in Mecca? What the hell are you talking about?

There is an American military presence all over Saudi Arabia.

Quoted message said:

And speaking of Islamic miltary presences, have you been paying
attention to France lately?

Yes I have. Of course, we weren't discussing that.

Quoted message said:

"And - although I suppose there haven't been a lot of Jewish people
blowing themselves up - in the early days of the formation of Israel -
when it wasn't a sure thing Israel would ever come to exist - Jewish
groups routinely committed what we would now term "terrorist" acts,
targeting civilians, and women and children of their enemy. It is easy
to forget this, now that they have lots of modern weaponry and the
poltical power, and the economic clout, and only "coincidentally"
slaughter civilians, but people out of power - and desperate for
survival - always tend to resort to similiar things."

Except that those things never happened. They are creations of Islamic
anti-Semites.

No - they are facts. Just because you don't like them doesn't mean they
are not facts.

Quoted message said:

You can repeat them ad nauseum. They're still made-up lies.

And you can say so all you want, but they still remain facts.

dmj

Quoted message said:

Hugh Jampton said:

Footage from al-Jazeera (!) news show, in which a woman verbally
pummels a fundie imam.
I'd be surprised if she got off the set alive.

http://switch3.castup.net/cunet/gm.asp?ai=214&ar=1050wmv&ak=null

Actually, this was reported on a couple of weeks ago.

She has become a celebrity of sorts, for her truthful views.

Maybe someone is protecting her, you never can tell.

<paul>

Quoted message said:

Hugh Jampton said:

Footage from al-Jazeera (!) news show, in which a woman verbally
pummels a fundie imam.
I'd be surprised if she got off the set alive.

http://switch3.castup.net/cunet/gm.asp?ai=214&ar=1050wmv&ak=null

Actually, this was reported on a couple of weeks ago.

She has become a celebrity of sorts, for her truthful views.

Maybe someone is protecting her, you never can tell.

<paul>

<<Once again, there are no American troops in Mecca OR Medina.>>

Thats becuase they were moved out after the fall of Bagdahd.

By the way, the US is now building permanent bases in Iraq.

Huge facilities that shadow anything we had in Europe in the cold war.

Even if the new Iraq government tells us to leave, the Bushies will
find an excuse to stay.

Thus fullfilling a prophecy made by Osoma Bin Laden back in the 1990's.
The the USA was planning to invade a oil rich Arab Nation, to establish
permant bases and to steal the Arab's oil.

Now many moderate Muslims who once ignored Bin Laden, will see him as
telling the truth.