Update on French anti-Americanism during TdF

hah !

"Robert Chung" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

From CBSnews.com, on the postponement of the California recall election:

"The decision stunned and outraged Davis' challengers. 'It's authoritarian,' said Republican state
Sen. [Tom] McClintock. 'It's un-American. It's French.' "

Quoted message said:

"The decision stunned and outraged Davis' challengers. 'It's authoritarian,' said Republican state
Sen. [Tom] McClintock. 'It's un-American. It's French.' "

Yea, I saw the interview on TV. More fuel for the fire, I guess.

Dave

"Robert Chung" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

From CBSnews.com, on the postponement of the California recall election:

"The decision stunned and outraged Davis' challengers. 'It's authoritarian,' said Republican state
Sen. [Tom] McClintock. 'It's un-American. It's French.' "

No doubt about it, the French are un-American. And Americans are un-French! They must be plucking
state senators straight out of JPL these days.

---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (grisoft.comgrisoft.comOpen ↗).
Version: 6.0.516 / Virus Database: 313 - Release Date: 01/09/2003

Robert Chung said:

From CBSnews.com, on the postponement of the California recall election:

"The decision stunned and outraged Davis' challengers. 'It's authoritarian,' said Republican state
Sen. [Tom] McClintock. 'It's un-American. It's French.' "

I wonder how he kisses his wife.

"Robert Chung" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

From CBSnews.com, on the postponement of the California recall

election:

Quoted message said:

"The decision stunned and outraged Davis' challengers. 'It's authoritarian,' said Republican state
Sen. [Tom] McClintock. 'It's un-American. It's French.' "

Famous old joke line form Mark Twain.

In article said:

From CBSnews.com, on the postponement of the California recall election:

"The decision stunned and outraged Davis' challengers. 'It's authoritarian,' said Republican state
Sen. [Tom] McClintock. 'It's un-American. It's French.' "

____________________________________________________________________________
Attorney Charles Diamond, who represents Sacramento recall leader Ted Costa, called the decision
"wrong headed" and said Costa has not yet decided on his next move.

"The fight has just begun," Diamond told Reuters. "If (punch cards) were good enough to elect our
president we don't see why not they're not good enough to elect our Governor."
_____________________________________________________________________________
Sorry, the link to the rest of the article is now broken.

--
tanx, Howard

"Head of a cat, body of a monkey, Here comes a plague upon the land." The Billy Nayer Show

remove YOUR SHOES to reply, ok?

trg said:

They must be plucking state senators straight out of JPL these days.

Jet Propulsion Lab? I don't get it.

Howard Kveck <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

In article said:

From CBSnews.com, on the postponement of the California recall election:

"The decision stunned and outraged Davis' challengers. 'It's authoritarian,' said Republican
state Sen. [Tom] McClintock. 'It's un-American. It's French.' "

____________________________________________________________________________
Attorney Charles Diamond, who represents Sacramento recall leader Ted Costa, called the decision
"wrong headed" and said Costa has not yet decided on his next move.

"The fight has just begun," Diamond told Reuters. "If (punch cards) were good enough to elect our
president we don't see why not they're not good enough to elect our Governor."
_____________________________________________________________________________
Sorry, the link to the rest of the article is now broken.

Diamond was wrong - the Supreme Court "elected" the president. Or, more appropriately, the right
wing thereof.

Well, at least the short-sighted policies/plans of the current administration are biting them in the
ass - hard - right before the election. Not that I like to watch my fellow citizens suffer, but I'm
praying for an economic downturn.

Christ, I bust a gut every time I watch W screw up his face and try to look mean and Texan. I loved
it when he said that HE (yes, the money's coming out of his pocket!) would spend whatever it took
and sacrifice as many of our patriotic armed forces servants to achieve his goals in Iraq.

I wonder, when all is said and done, how many will have died since the Son of a Bush's victory
declaration? And, how long will it take for groups unfriendly to the US to take over the
government there?

Sorry, I thought this thread would at least be tenuously connected to cycling but then found I had
to add my own valueless input to a thread already devoid of cycling content.

App

I wonder how many people you think were murdered in cold blood in the World Trade Centers.
Apparently a couple hundred soldiers lost trying to eliminate the supporters of terrorism is so much
to pay that you are more willing to allow thousands of innocent non-combatants to die in their
stead. Let me congradulate your courage.

"Appkiller" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Howard Kveck <[email hidden]> wrote in message

news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

In article said:

From CBSnews.com, on the postponement of the California recall

election:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

"The decision stunned and outraged Davis' challengers. 'It's authoritarian,' said Republican
state Sen. [Tom] McClintock.

'It's

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

un-American. It's French.' "

______________________________________________________________________
______

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Attorney Charles Diamond, who represents Sacramento recall leader

Ted Costa,

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

called the decision "wrong headed" and said Costa has not yet

decided on his

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

next move.

"The fight has just begun," Diamond told Reuters. "If (punch

cards) were good

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

enough to elect our president we don't see why not they're not

good enough to

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

elect our Governor."

______________________________________________________________________
_______

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Sorry, the link to the rest of the article is now broken.

Diamond was wrong - the Supreme Court "elected" the president. Or, more appropriately, the right
wing thereof.

Well, at least the short-sighted policies/plans of the current administration are biting them
in the ass - hard - right before the election. Not that I like to watch my fellow citizens
suffer, but

I'm

Quoted message said:

praying for an economic downturn.

Christ, I bust a gut every time I watch W screw up his face and try

to

Quoted message said:

look mean and Texan. I loved it when he said that HE (yes, the money's coming out of his pocket!)
would spend whatever it took and sacrifice as many of our patriotic armed forces servants to
achieve his goals in Iraq.

I wonder, when all is said and done, how many will have died since

the

Quoted message said:

Son of a Bush's victory declaration? And, how long will it take for groups unfriendly to the US to
take over the government there?

Sorry, I thought this thread would at least be tenuously connected

to

Quoted message said:

cycling but then found I had to add my own valueless input to a

thread

Quoted message said:

already devoid of cycling content.

App

Tom Kunich said:

I wonder how many people you think were murdered in cold blood in the World Trade Centers.
Apparently a couple hundred soldiers lost trying to eliminate the supporters of terrorism is so
much to pay that you are more willing to allow thousands of innocent non-combatants to die in
their stead. Let me congradulate your courage.

Why are you linking WTC and Iraq? It must be inconvenient having the President undercut your
argument on the same day that you make it.

In article said:

Tom Kunich said:

I wonder how many people you think were murdered in cold blood in the World Trade Centers.
Apparently a couple hundred soldiers lost trying to eliminate the supporters of terrorism is so
much to pay that you are more willing to allow thousands of innocent non-combatants to die in
their stead. Let me congradulate your courage.

Why are you linking WTC and Iraq? It must be inconvenient having the President undercut your
argument on the same day that you make it.

I guess someone should have told Cheney before he went on Press the Meat last Sunday. It's mighty
curious that they are changing to this new tack now after all the time they spent alluding to the
"linkage" between AQ and Iraq in the run into the war. Especially curious considering the "70% of
Americans believe there's a connection" poll numbers.

startribune.com4101486.htmlOpen ↗

--
tanx, Howard

"Head of a cat, body of a monkey, Here comes a plague upon the land." The Billy Nayer Show

remove YOUR SHOES to reply, ok?

"Robert Chung" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Tom Kunich said:

I wonder how many people you think were murdered in cold blood in

the

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

World Trade Centers. Apparently a couple hundred soldiers lost

trying

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

to eliminate the supporters of terrorism is so much to pay that

you

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

are more willing to allow thousands of innocent non-combatants to

die

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

in their stead. Let me congradulate your courage.

Why are you linking WTC and Iraq? It must be inconvenient having the President undercut your
argument on the same day that you make it.

You seem to have a little trouble linking a man who was paying off terrorists all over the middle
east with encouraging terrorism everywhere. But I see this sort of argument all the time.

Clinton blindly shooting the entire US compliment of cruise missles into Iraq when they in fact had
a dozen targets at the most was a strong show of force but Bush accomplishing the removal of a
bloody handed murderer is somehow bad.

Tell you what Robert, why don't you stand in the middle of Bagdad and tell the inhabitants there
that they were better off without the United States decimating Hussein and his forces.

In article <[email hidden]>, "Tom Kunich"

Quoted message said:

"Robert Chung" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Tom Kunich said:

I wonder how many people you think were murdered in cold blood in

the

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

World Trade Centers. Apparently a couple hundred soldiers lost

trying

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

to eliminate the supporters of terrorism is so much to pay that

you

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

are more willing to allow thousands of innocent non-combatants to

die

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

in their stead. Let me congradulate your courage.

Why are you linking WTC and Iraq? It must be inconvenient having the President undercut your
argument on the same day that you make it.

You seem to have a little trouble linking a man who was paying off terrorists all over the middle
east with encouraging terrorism everywhere. But I see this sort of argument all the time.

There's -far- more hard evidence available that the biggest financial supporters of terrorists in
the middle east are (and have been) in Saudi Arabia.

Quoted message said:

Clinton blindly shooting the entire US compliment of cruise missles into Iraq when they in fact
had a dozen targets at the most was a strong show of force but Bush accomplishing the removal of a
bloody handed murderer is somehow bad.

What I've seen and read indicates that military brass thought that the cruise missile operation
of Anthony Zinni was rather successful. But since it happened during the dark days of Clinton, it
must not have been any good, right?

Quoted message said:

Tell you what Robert, why don't you stand in the middle of Bagdad and tell the inhabitants there
that they were better off without the United States decimating Hussein and his forces.

You've jumped from "it's about the weapons" to "it's about the liberation" as a justification
even faster than W. For another perspective, try this one: "For the last six months I have
participated in what I believe to be the great modern lie: Operation Iraqi Freedom." First line
in a commentary written by a US soldier in Iraq, printed in today's LA Times:

<latimes.comla oe predmore17sep17,1,1681259.sOpen ↗
tory?coll=la-news-comment-opinions>

--
tanx, Howard

"Head of a cat, body of a monkey, Here comes a plague upon the land." The Billy Nayer Show

remove YOUR SHOES to reply, ok?

Tom Kunich said:

"Robert Chung" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Tom Kunich said:

I wonder how many people you think were murdered in cold blood in

the

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

World Trade Centers. Apparently a couple hundred soldiers lost

trying

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

to eliminate the supporters of terrorism is so much to pay that

you

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

are more willing to allow thousands of innocent non-combatants to

die

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

in their stead. Let me congradulate your courage.

Why are you linking WTC and Iraq? It must be inconvenient having the President undercut your
argument on the same day that you make it.

You seem to have a little trouble linking a man who was paying off terrorists all over the middle
east with encouraging terrorism everywhere. But I see this sort of argument all the time.

Clinton blindly shooting the entire US compliment of cruise missles into Iraq when they in fact
had a dozen targets at the most was a strong show of force but Bush accomplishing the removal of a
bloody handed murderer is somehow bad.

It wasn't WHAT Bush did. It's really hard to argue against removing Saddam. It was HOW he did it.
Because it's really hard to argue against removing Saddam, we should have been able to pull it off
without any trouble, along with the rest of the world.

Quoted message said:

Tell you what Robert, why don't you stand in the middle of Bagdad and tell the inhabitants there
that they were better off without the United States decimating Hussein and his forces.

Hey, if he did that in the middle of Baghdad or several other cities in the Sunni Triangle, it's
quite possible he'd get cheered. Things do suck in large parts of Iraq, and the Iraqis (in those
parts) don't like it.

--
--
Lynn Wallace xmission.com~lawallOpen ↗ "I'm not proud. We really haven't done everything we
could to protect our customers. Our products just aren't engineered for security." --Microsoft VP in
charge of Windows OS Development, Brian Valentine.

"Tom Kunich" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

"Robert Chung" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Tom Kunich said:

I wonder how many people you think were murdered in cold blood in

the

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

World Trade Centers. Apparently a couple hundred soldiers lost

trying

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

to eliminate the supporters of terrorism is so much to pay that

you

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

are more willing to allow thousands of innocent non-combatants to

die

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

in their stead. Let me congradulate your courage.

Why are you linking WTC and Iraq? It must be inconvenient having the President undercut your
argument on the same day that you make it.

You seem to have a little trouble linking a man who was paying off terrorists all over the middle
east with encouraging terrorism everywhere. But I see this sort of argument all the time.

Clinton blindly shooting the entire US compliment of cruise missles into Iraq when they in fact
had a dozen targets at the most was a strong show of force but Bush accomplishing the removal of a
bloody handed murderer is somehow bad.

Tell you what Robert, why don't you stand in the middle of Bagdad and tell the inhabitants there
that they were better off without the United States decimating Hussein and his forces.

That's fine, except that Bush didn't justify the invasion as an excerise in altruism. Since
Saddam didn't have major ties with ao Qaeda, and since Anti-American sentiment has only
increased since the US began to occupy Iraq, it is quite likely that innocent US civilians are
LESS safe from terrorist attack than they were before

Tom Kunich said:

Tell you what Robert, why don't you stand in the middle of Bagdad and tell the inhabitants there
that they were better off without the United States decimating Hussein and his forces.

Tell you what Tom, why don't you go find the mother of one of the GIs who has been killed in Iraq
and tell her she's better off and, by they way, she owes $290 next year as her part of the $87
billion? Be sure to tell the father that he owes $290, too. Tell you what Tom, why don't you go
stand in the middle of a kindergarten class in the US and tell those kids that each of them owes
$290 just for next year, and that you'll be back later to ask for more? So Tom, did you stand up at
California's Republican convention last weekend and ask that a head tax be imposed on every man,
woman, and child in the US next year to cover the $87 billion?

"Howard Kveck" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

There's -far- more hard evidence available that the biggest financial
supporters of terrorists in the middle east are (and have been) in Saudi

Arabia.

That's been evident all along. 15 of 19 9/11 terrorists, Al Qaeda being an exiled Saudi
organization, Wahhabist fundamentalism being the sect of Al Qaeda, etc.

It's kind of sick that Saudi Arabia is being given a free pass on 9/11.

Quoted message said:

"For the last six months I have participated in what I believe to be the

great

Quoted message said:

modern lie: Operation Iraqi Freedom." First line in a commentary written by a US soldier in Iraq,
printed in

today's

Quoted message said:

LA Times:

I've talked to 2 soldiers. One on family emergency leave from Iraq, the other returned. The first
one was soooooooo bummed at going back (sat next to him on a commercial flight). The second one was
glad to be home, but he was still a little freaked out. You could see it in his eyes. If people were
shooting at me, I'd be freaked out too. It's not pretty.

Bush's popularity has been dropping - down to 52%. I think the Iraq situation which not long ago was
his greatest victory, could be his undoing in the 2004 elections. When the soldiers come home in
that state of mind - it travels and it has more of an effect than press conferences, tax cuts or
pork barrel spending.

One thing I'll give credit to W for. Yesterday he finally was upfront about Iraq not being connected
to 9/11. He waited too long though - should have done it before the war.

Isidor Gunsberg schreef:

Quoted message said:

That's fine, except that Bush didn't justify the invasion as an excerise in altruism. Since
Saddam didn't have major ties with ao Qaeda, and since Anti-American sentiment has only
increased since the US began to occupy Iraq, it is quite likely that innocent US civilians are
LESS safe from terrorist attack than they were before

That's an obvious interpretation. But OTOH, nowadays Iraq seems a potent black hole where most
Qaeda-related energy is sucked into. So less of 'em are probably working on western plans.

This is an example of how spin and lies related to a 'clash of civilisations' become
self-fullfilling prophecies. Now baathists and qaeda ARE working together.

In article said:

Tom Kunich said:

"Robert Chung" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Tell you what Robert, why don't you stand in the middle of Bagdad and tell the inhabitants there
that they were better off without the United States decimating Hussein and his forces.

Hey, if he did that in the middle of Baghdad or several other cities in the Sunni Triangle, it's
quite possible he'd get cheered. Things do suck in large parts of Iraq, and the Iraqis (in those
parts) don't like it.

Even the Iraqis who were against Saddam the entire time and were glad he's gone are starting to
say that if things don't improve pronto, they will take up arms against the US. They're
beginning to see the US as an occupying force, not liberators. The lack of planning for the
aftermath is stunning.
--
tanx, Howard

"Gentlemen! You can't fight in here! This is the War Room." George C. Scott, Dr. Strangelove

remove YOUR SHOES to reply, ok?