A bike noise, like a geiger counter

dgk said:

I can't track it down, and it only happens sometimes. Trek 7100 ($300
hybrid, the low end, with 14,000 miles or so on it). It really sounds
just like one of those geiger counters in a bad scifi flick. Hmm.
Geiger is one of those words with e before i without a c. Must be
someone's name.

Anyway, I've tried putting my hand all over the bike trying to see
what would stop it, and it seems to be from the front fork. That
useless shock is pretty much frozen so perhaps it's coming from that.
I can't find any cracks in the frame, but I'm getting a bit afraid
that it's going to collapse under me.

Time to drag it to a LBS I think. Any ideas as to what it is?

I had a ticking noise only when pedelling. Finally found the chain was
a little too close to the front derailuer. A little adjustment fixed
things.

--
-------------------------------------------------------
"Every day is Saturday when you're retired."

Bob Burns
Mill Hall PA
(email is a spamtrap)

Bob Burns said:

dgk said:

I can't track it down, and it only happens sometimes. Trek 7100 ($300
hybrid, the low end, with 14,000 miles or so on it). It really sounds
just like one of those geiger counters in a bad scifi flick. Hmm.
Geiger is one of those words with e before i without a c. Must be
someone's name.

Anyway, I've tried putting my hand all over the bike trying to see
what would stop it, and it seems to be from the front fork. That
useless shock is pretty much frozen so perhaps it's coming from that.
I can't find any cracks in the frame, but I'm getting a bit afraid
that it's going to collapse under me.

Time to drag it to a LBS I think. Any ideas as to what it is?

I had a ticking noise only when pedelling. Finally found the chain was
a little too close to the front derailuer. A little adjustment fixed
things.

No, this one does it whether I'm pedaling or not.

dgk said:

I can't track it down, and it only happens sometimes. Trek 7100 ($300
hybrid, the low end, with 14,000 miles or so on it). It really sounds
just like one of those geiger counters in a bad scifi flick. Hmm.
Geiger is one of those words with e before i without a c. Must be
someone's name.

Anyway, I've tried putting my hand all over the bike trying to see
what would stop it, and it seems to be from the front fork. That
useless shock is pretty much frozen so perhaps it's coming from that.
I can't find any cracks in the frame, but I'm getting a bit afraid
that it's going to collapse under me.

Time to drag it to a LBS I think. Any ideas as to what it is?

Derailleur hitting a spoke, sometimes?

HTH

--Karen D.

dgk said:

Bob Burns said:

dgk said:

I can't track it down, and it only happens sometimes. Trek 7100
($300 hybrid, the low end, with 14,000 miles or so on it). It
really sounds just like one of those geiger counters in a bad scifi
flick. Hmm. Geiger is one of those words with e before i without a
c. Must be someone's name.

Anyway, I've tried putting my hand all over the bike trying to see
what would stop it, and it seems to be from the front fork. That
useless shock is pretty much frozen so perhaps it's coming from
that. I can't find any cracks in the frame, but I'm getting a bit
afraid that it's going to collapse under me.

Time to drag it to a LBS I think. Any ideas as to what it is?

I had a ticking noise only when pedelling. Finally found the chain
was a little too close to the front derailuer. A little adjustment
fixed things.

No, this one does it whether I'm pedaling or not.

Cyclometer pickup being tapped by spokes?

Bill Sornson said:

dgk said:

Bob Burns said:

dgk wrote:
> I can't track it down, and it only happens sometimes. Trek 7100
> ($300 hybrid, the low end, with 14,000 miles or so on it). It
> really sounds just like one of those geiger counters in a bad scifi
> flick. Hmm. Geiger is one of those words with e before i without a
> c. Must be someone's name.
>
> Anyway, I've tried putting my hand all over the bike trying to see
> what would stop it, and it seems to be from the front fork. That
> useless shock is pretty much frozen so perhaps it's coming from
> that. I can't find any cracks in the frame, but I'm getting a bit
> afraid that it's going to collapse under me.
>
> Time to drag it to a LBS I think. Any ideas as to what it is?
I had a ticking noise only when pedelling. Finally found the chain
was a little too close to the front derailuer. A little adjustment
fixed things.

No, this one does it whether I'm pedaling or not.

Cyclometer pickup being tapped by spokes?

As a joke once some guys I know pulled the seatpost out of a guy's bike
while he wasn't looking an tossed a spoke down in there and then
replaced the seatpost. Talk about a hard to troubleshoot clicking noise
while riding! I think he ended up in Bellevue.

Joseph

dgk said:

I can't track it down, and it only happens sometimes. Trek 7100 ($300
hybrid, the low end, with 14,000 miles or so on it). It really sounds
just like one of those geiger counters in a bad scifi flick. Hmm.
Geiger is one of those words with e before i without a c. Must be
someone's name.

Anyway, I've tried putting my hand all over the bike trying to see
what would stop it, and it seems to be from the front fork. That
useless shock is pretty much frozen so perhaps it's coming from that.
I can't find any cracks in the frame, but I'm getting a bit afraid
that it's going to collapse under me.

Time to drag it to a LBS I think. Any ideas as to what it is?

If it happens both pedaling and not, it may be some loose spokes
chafing each other.

Ticking noises can be hard to track down. I recently fixed a clicking
on my bike I was convinced was the seat. It only clicked when I pedaled
while seated, no other time. I though maybe it was a loose crank-arm,
but was baffled by why no noise standing, only seated. But it turned
out to be from where the shifter cable housing goes into the boss on
the downtube. When I wiggled the bars just a bit (as when pedaling) it
would click. Standing wobbled too much to click I guess.

How much radioactivity is your bike registering?

Joseph

Quoted message said:

As a joke once some guys I know pulled the seatpost out of a guy's
bike while he wasn't looking an tossed a spoke down in there and then
replaced the seatpost. Talk about a hard to troubleshoot clicking
noise while riding! I think he ended up in Bellevue.

Now that's cruel! <eg>

Only thing is, aren't most seat tubes open at the bottom for drainage?
Seems like it's at least possible that the spoke could get wound around the
BB or something and do some damage...or am I just paranoid?!?

Bill "what was -- who said that?" S.

Bill Sornson said:

Quoted message said:

As a joke once some guys I know pulled the seatpost out of a guy's
bike while he wasn't looking an tossed a spoke down in there and then
replaced the seatpost. Talk about a hard to troubleshoot clicking
noise while riding! I think he ended up in Bellevue.

Now that's cruel! <eg>

Only thing is, aren't most seat tubes open at the bottom for drainage?
Seems like it's at least possible that the spoke could get wound around the
BB or something and do some damage...or am I just paranoid?!?

Bill "what was -- who said that?" S.

This was back in the days when there was a plastic sleeve down there.
Today it would have an even less chance of getting wound around the
spindle. But if it somehow did, at best I suppose it could wear some
sort of stress riser in the spindle after a million revolutions which
might lead to spindle failure which if you believe the manuals that
come with bike parts could result in serious injury or death.

The only damage it did was to his mental health. He was a very finicky
sort of guy. I think they only let him go a few days.

Joseph

Quoted message said:

dgk said:

I can't track it down, and it only happens sometimes. Trek 7100 ($300
hybrid, the low end, with 14,000 miles or so on it). It really sounds
just like one of those geiger counters in a bad scifi flick. Hmm.
Geiger is one of those words with e before i without a c. Must be
someone's name.

Anyway, I've tried putting my hand all over the bike trying to see
what would stop it, and it seems to be from the front fork. That
useless shock is pretty much frozen so perhaps it's coming from that.
I can't find any cracks in the frame, but I'm getting a bit afraid
that it's going to collapse under me.

Time to drag it to a LBS I think. Any ideas as to what it is?

If it happens both pedaling and not, it may be some loose spokes
chafing each other.

Ticking noises can be hard to track down. I recently fixed a clicking
on my bike I was convinced was the seat. It only clicked when I pedaled
while seated, no other time. I though maybe it was a loose crank-arm,
but was baffled by why no noise standing, only seated. But it turned
out to be from where the shifter cable housing goes into the boss on
the downtube. When I wiggled the bars just a bit (as when pedaling) it
would click. Standing wobbled too much to click I guess.

How much radioactivity is your bike registering?

Joseph

I'm wearing lead-lined clothing. It sure adds to the weight though.

<[email hidden]> wrote: (clip) How much radioactivity is your
bike registering?
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
This may be an important question. Doctors often diagnose problems by the
way their patients describe pain, verbally and with hand motions. To me,
the sound of a Geiger counter is a sort of rushing, crackling, irregular
noise made up of a lot of beats, which may come very fast, or only
occasionally. I don't think the sound of something hitting the spokes would
ever be described that way. I think it is likely a ball bearing that is
failing--they can produce irregular clicky sounds like this.

Leo Lichtman said:

<[email hidden]> wrote: (clip) How much radioactivity is your
bike registering?
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
This may be an important question. Doctors often diagnose problems by the
way their patients describe pain, verbally and with hand motions. To me,
the sound of a Geiger counter is a sort of rushing, crackling, irregular
noise made up of a lot of beats, which may come very fast, or only
occasionally. I don't think the sound of something hitting the spokes would
ever be described that way. I think it is likely a ball bearing that is
failing--they can produce irregular clicky sounds like this.

That's what I was getting at with my silly joke. To me a Geiger counter
has a very scratchy, staticy sound. (Not that I have ever heard one
other than ina movie.) Not exactly the pink-pink-pink... of a loose
crankset or something.

Joseph

"dgk" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I can't track it down, and it only happens sometimes. Trek 7100 ($300
hybrid, the low end, with 14,000 miles or so on it). It really sounds
just like one of those geiger counters in a bad scifi flick. Hmm.
Geiger is one of those words with e before i without a c. Must be
someone's name.

Possible, but unlikely: Does the tube have slime in it? When it gets old,
this stuff can turn solid and rattle as you ride.

Possible, but unlikely: Check that there's not a leaf, pine needle or other
foreign object stuck in the fork where it can rub against the tire.

Suggestion: Swap wheels so you can see if it is wheel related or not. If it
is, swap tire&tube to see if it's tire and tube related. That may help
narrow it down.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geiger_counter
"Hans Geiger developed a device (what would later be called the "Geiger
counter"😉 in 1908 together with Ernest Rutherford. This counter was only
capable of detecting alpha particles. In 1928, Geiger and Walther Müller (a
PhD student of Geiger) improved the counter so that it could detect all
kinds of ionizing radiation.

The current version of the "Geiger counter" is called the halogen counter.
It was invented in 1947 by Sidney H. Liebson (Phys. Rev. 72, 602-608
(1947)). It has superseded the earlier Geiger counter because of its much
longer life. The devices also possessed a lower operating voltage."

Mike Kruger said:

"dgk" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I can't track it down, and it only happens sometimes. Trek 7100 ($300
hybrid, the low end, with 14,000 miles or so on it). It really sounds
just like one of those geiger counters in a bad scifi flick. Hmm.
Geiger is one of those words with e before i without a c. Must be
someone's name.

Possible, but unlikely: Does the tube have slime in it? When it gets old,
this stuff can turn solid and rattle as you ride.

Possible, but unlikely: Check that there's not a leaf, pine needle or other
foreign object stuck in the fork where it can rub against the tire.

He could always do what we kids used to do in my day...put some playing
cards so they flap on every spoke and play motorcycle. After they put
the straight jacket on him he can explain it was to cover that 'other'
noise.

Quoted message said:

Suggestion: Swap wheels so you can see if it is wheel related or not. If it
is, swap tire&tube to see if it's tire and tube related. That may help
narrow it down.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geiger_counter
"Hans Geiger developed a device (what would later be called the "Geiger
counter"😉 in 1908 together with Ernest Rutherford. This counter was only
capable of detecting alpha particles. In 1928, Geiger and Walther Müller (a
PhD student of Geiger) improved the counter so that it could detect all
kinds of ionizing radiation.

The current version of the "Geiger counter" is called the halogen counter.
It was invented in 1947 by Sidney H. Liebson (Phys. Rev. 72, 602-608
(1947)). It has superseded the earlier Geiger counter because of its much
longer life. The devices also possessed a lower operating voltage."

Wasn't there also something called the scintillator or something like
that back in the early 60's? I have a vague memory of Uranium
prospectors using that and being featured in Popular Science.
My memory could be all wet or the scintillator could be one of those
inventions like the 100 MPG carburetor that never really happened.
Sort of like 'Cold Fusion' about 10-15 years back.
I do know that Alpha and Beta radiation don't have that much penetrating
power, what with Alpha being a nucleus and Beta pretty much a high speed
electron. If you have an airtight suit you can pretty much walk through
an Alpha / Beta radiation field with impunity as long as you don't
breath it. Not so with high intensity Gamma where you can be dead and
not even feel anything for a day or more.
Oooops, not bike related.
Bill Baka

Leo Lichtman said:

<[email hidden]> wrote: (clip) How much radioactivity is your
bike registering?
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
This may be an important question. Doctors often diagnose problems by the
way their patients describe pain, verbally and with hand motions. To me,
the sound of a Geiger counter is a sort of rushing, crackling, irregular
noise made up of a lot of beats, which may come very fast, or only
occasionally. I don't think the sound of something hitting the spokes would
ever be described that way. I think it is likely a ball bearing that is
failing--they can produce irregular clicky sounds like this.

That's exactly it. There isn't a regular sound, and it seems to be
ampliflied when I have the detachable front fender attached.

Mike Kruger said:

"dgk" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I can't track it down, and it only happens sometimes. Trek 7100 ($300
hybrid, the low end, with 14,000 miles or so on it). It really sounds
just like one of those geiger counters in a bad scifi flick. Hmm.
Geiger is one of those words with e before i without a c. Must be
someone's name.

Possible, but unlikely: Does the tube have slime in it? When it gets old,
this stuff can turn solid and rattle as you ride.

No slime in the tube.

Quoted message said:

Possible, but unlikely: Check that there's not a leaf, pine needle or other
foreign object stuck in the fork where it can rub against the tire.

I'll have to take a closer look at the fork and the bearings. I think
that it is the front end.

Quoted message said:

Suggestion: Swap wheels so you can see if it is wheel related or not. If it
is, swap tire&tube to see if it's tire and tube related. That may help
narrow it down.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geiger_counter
"Hans Geiger developed a device (what would later be called the "Geiger
counter"😉 in 1908 together with Ernest Rutherford. This counter was only
capable of detecting alpha particles. In 1928, Geiger and Walther Müller (a
PhD student of Geiger) improved the counter so that it could detect all
kinds of ionizing radiation.

The current version of the "Geiger counter" is called the halogen counter.
It was invented in 1947 by Sidney H. Liebson (Phys. Rev. 72, 602-608
(1947)). It has superseded the earlier Geiger counter because of its much
longer life. The devices also possessed a lower operating voltage."

dgk said:

That's exactly it. There isn't a regular sound, and it seems to be
ampliflied when I have the detachable front fender attached.

Aluminum nipples? I had a wheel with aluminum nipples that creaked and
sounded a lot like chain rub on the front derailleur. Oil helped for a
while but it always came back. Try another wheel in your bike, and this
wheel in another bike to help isolate the source.

On 6 Jul 2006 08:42:52 -0700, "Veloise" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

dgk said:

I can't track it down, and it only happens sometimes. Trek 7100 ($300
hybrid, the low end, with 14,000 miles or so on it). It really sounds
just like one of those geiger counters in a bad scifi flick. Hmm.
Geiger is one of those words with e before i without a c. Must be
someone's name.

Anyway, I've tried putting my hand all over the bike trying to see
what would stop it, and it seems to be from the front fork. That
useless shock is pretty much frozen so perhaps it's coming from that.
I can't find any cracks in the frame, but I'm getting a bit afraid
that it's going to collapse under me.

Time to drag it to a LBS I think. Any ideas as to what it is?

Derailleur hitting a spoke, sometimes?

HTH

--Karen D.

Nah, that would be a fairly regular sort of sound, Well, then again
maybe. I'm going to have a friend ride next to me and try to identify
where the noise is coming from.

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Bill Sornson said:

dgk said:

On Thu, 06 Jul 2006 12:19:21 GMT, Bob Burns
<[email hidden]> wrote:

> dgk wrote:
>> I can't track it down, and it only happens sometimes. Trek 7100
>> ($300 hybrid, the low end, with 14,000 miles or so on it). It
>> really sounds just like one of those geiger counters in a bad scifi
>> flick. Hmm. Geiger is one of those words with e before i without a
>> c. Must be someone's name.
>>
>> Anyway, I've tried putting my hand all over the bike trying to see
>> what would stop it, and it seems to be from the front fork. That
>> useless shock is pretty much frozen so perhaps it's coming from
>> that. I can't find any cracks in the frame, but I'm getting a bit
>> afraid that it's going to collapse under me.
>>
>> Time to drag it to a LBS I think. Any ideas as to what it is?
> I had a ticking noise only when pedelling. Finally found the chain
> was a little too close to the front derailuer. A little adjustment
> fixed things.

No, this one does it whether I'm pedaling or not.

Cyclometer pickup being tapped by spokes?

As a joke once some guys I know pulled the seatpost out of a guy's bike
while he wasn't looking an tossed a spoke down in there and then
replaced the seatpost. Talk about a hard to troubleshoot clicking noise
while riding! I think he ended up in Bellevue.

Joseph

haha haha hahahaahhahahhhaaaaahhhhh! ...[censored]!

"dgk" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I can't track it down, and it only happens sometimes. Trek 7100 ($300
hybrid, the low end, with 14,000 miles or so on it). It really sounds
just like one of those geiger counters in a bad scifi flick. Hmm.
Geiger is one of those words with e before i without a c. Must be
someone's name.

Anyway, I've tried putting my hand all over the bike trying to see
what would stop it, and it seems to be from the front fork. That
useless shock is pretty much frozen so perhaps it's coming from that.
I can't find any cracks in the frame, but I'm getting a bit afraid
that it's going to collapse under me.

Time to drag it to a LBS I think. Any ideas as to what it is?

Number of causes, some of these wont show up until weight is applied:

1. A bad bearing in the front hub. Spin the wheel and feel for roughness
or vibration.

2. A loose front spoke will click in the hub or spoke broken at the
nipple will click in the rim. Puck all of your spokes to make sure that
they are properly tensioned.

3. Something loose inside a box rim, perhaps an indication of imminent
failure or just a small stone.

4. A bent rim brushing the brake pad.

5. A loose headset. Lock the front brake while sitting stationary on the
bike. Try to rock the bike slightly backward and forward. If you feel a
click your headset may need to be adjusted. Cheap bikes used cheap
headsets that weren't hard enough to keep the ball bearings from
brinelling pits into the races. It's usually the bottom race where the
most thrust gets applied that goes first.

6. A cracked steering tube or a bad braze or weld at the crown. Danger -
if this is the problem replace the fork immediately. The treads in the
steering tube on older style forks were a perfect place for stress
risers to start. There's less than 1mm (.030-.040) of wall thickness in
the tube a the bottom of the threads. That's one reason why most newer
stems have minimum insertion makers so that you don't expand the wedge
in the threaded area.

Twice I had the joy of holding the disconnected handlebars when a
steering tube broke: once on one of my own bikes and once on a customers
bike that I was test riding. I was lucky that I was going slow enough to
safely stop the bikes both times. I also had an old cast aluminum stem
fail on me while riding.

Before I ride anyone else's bike, I always lift the front wheel a little
a rotate the bars back and forth and then I lock the front brakes and
rock it to make sure that the front end is solid. It only takes a few
seconds and most people don't even notice what I'm doing.

Good luck,

Chas.