The Return of Der Kaiser

So maybe the 2004 TDF will be the battle of the Super-Domestiques! With Heras pulling Lance and Vino
pulling Jan and maybe Nozal pulling Beloki...... Whoa!

"Richard Adams" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Ok, I dunno where 'Der Kaiser' got pasted to Jan, but it makes a headline, I s'pose.

Good news for t-Mobile: Jan returns. Bad news for Vino: Jan returns. While he's a quiet guy and
doesn't tend to complain about things I can't imagine this is a very welcome development for
Vinokourov. To say nothing of the plans of Salvodelli or Cadel Evans. How many leaders does one
team need? The desire of t-mobile to win the TdF looks a bit obsessive at this point. And what of
Zabel? (Sorry, "Erik, old chap, but you'll have to pull Jan's train, no stage wins or points
jerseys for you!"😉

"Richard Adams" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Ok, I dunno where 'Der Kaiser' got pasted to Jan, but it makes a headline, I s'pose.

Good news for t-Mobile: Jan returns. Bad news for Vino: Jan returns. While he's a quiet guy and
doesn't tend to complain about things I can't imagine this is a very welcome development for
Vinokourov.

As good as Vino is he isn't the powerhouse that Jan is, He can't TT and you have to be able to climb
and TT to win Le Tour

To say

Quoted message said:

nothing of the plans of Salvodelli or Cadel Evans.

Who?

How many leaders

Quoted message said:

does one team need? The desire of t-mobile to win the TdF looks a bit obsessive at this point. And
what of Zabel? (Sorry, "Erik, old chap, but you'll have to pull Jan's train,

I have seen Jan lead out Zabel on many occasions

Dave

Dave said:

Quoted message said:

To say nothing of the plans of Salvodelli or Cadel Evans.

Quoted message said:

Who?

Paolo Savoldelli beat Tyler Hamilton to win the Giro last year. Cadel Evans is young, but looks
promissing - he wore the pink jersey for a few days (or just a day? I don't remember).

--
David N. Welton Consulting: dedasys.comdedasys.comOpen ↗ Personal: dedasys.comdavidwOpen ↗ Free
Software: dedasys.comfreesoftwareOpen ↗ Apache Tcl: tcl.apache.orgtcl.apache.orgOpen ↗

David N. Welton said:

Dave said:

Quoted message said:

To say nothing of the plans of Salvodelli or Cadel Evans.

Quoted message said:

Who?

Paolo Savoldelli beat Tyler Hamilton to win the Giro last year.

yeah falling off your bike is a good way to lose a GT.....

Cadel

Quoted message said:

Evans is young, but looks promissing - he wore the pink jersey for a few days (or just a day? I
don't remember).

also had REAL problems staying on his bike, what 3 boken collar bones this year alone? yes, he broke
one of his sandard issue two, twice.

Richard Adams <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Ok, I dunno where 'Der Kaiser' got pasted to Jan, but it makes a headline, I s'pose.

Good news for t-Mobile: Jan returns. Bad news for Vino: Jan returns. While he's a quiet guy and
doesn't tend to complain about things I can't imagine this is a very welcome development for
Vinokourov. To say nothing of the plans of Salvodelli or Cadel Evans. How many leaders does one
team need? The desire of t-mobile to win the TdF looks a bit obsessive at this point. And what of
Zabel? (Sorry, "Erik, old chap, but you'll have to pull Jan's train, no stage wins or points
jerseys for you!"😉

Add Botero to that list of too many chiefs....

"brian roth" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

Add Botero to that list of too many chiefs....

He took himself off AFAIK.

Richard Adams said:

Ok, I dunno where 'Der Kaiser' got pasted to Jan, but it makes a headline, I s'pose.

Good news for t-Mobile: Jan returns. Bad news for Vino: Jan returns. While he's a quiet guy and
doesn't tend to complain about things I can't imagine this is a very welcome development for
Vinokourov. To say nothing of the plans of Salvodelli or Cadel Evans. How many leaders does one
team need? The desire of t-mobile to win the TdF looks a bit obsessive at this point. And what of
Zabel? (Sorry, "Erik, old chap, but you'll have to pull Jan's train, no stage wins or points
jerseys for you!"😉

I hope T-Mobile doesn't become the New York Rangers of cycling, with all that talent and nothing to
show for it. :-)

Richard Adams <[email hidden]> wrote in news:blml2p [email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Ok, I dunno where 'Der Kaiser' got pasted to Jan, but it makes a headline, I s'pose.

Good news for t-Mobile: Jan returns. Bad news for Vino: Jan returns. While he's a quiet guy and
doesn't tend to complain about things I can't imagine this is a very welcome development for
Vinokourov. To say nothing of the plans of Salvodelli or Cadel Evans. How many leaders does one
team need? The desire of t-mobile to win the TdF looks a bit obsessive at this point. And what of
Zabel? (Sorry, "Erik, old chap, but you'll have to pull Jan's train, no stage wins or points
jerseys for you!"😉

Does this mean that Jan is back in the Adidas fold also? Or are they not going to co-sponsor
T-Mobile next year? They all ready stated something to effect of not wanting to sponser a drug user
(Ullrich). Weather the drugs are of the "recreational" or performance enhancing variety didn't seem
to matter.

If I were him, I would rather ride a Huffy and live the $15K dream than go back to those losers who
had counted him out during his darkest hours. Its kind of like if USPS lost their sponsorship and
Lance had to go back to Cofidis. But, I guess E2.5 * 10^6 / year can make just about anyone swallow
their pride. Kind of sad... oh well.

Also, I was wondering why Bianchi doesn't sponsor T-Mobile? I know they just signed a deal with
Giant, but what about before.

- Boyd S.

"Jason Spaceman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Richard Adams said:

Ok, I dunno where 'Der Kaiser' got pasted to Jan, but it makes a headline, I s'pose.

Good news for t-Mobile: Jan returns. Bad news for Vino: Jan returns. While he's a quiet guy and
doesn't tend to complain about things I can't imagine this is a very welcome development for
Vinokourov. To say nothing of the plans of Salvodelli or Cadel Evans. How many leaders does one
team need? The desire of t-mobile to win the TdF looks a bit obsessive at this point. And what of
Zabel? (Sorry, "Erik, old chap, but you'll have to pull Jan's train, no stage wins or points
jerseys for you!"😉

I hope T-Mobile doesn't become the New York Rangers of cycling, with all that talent and nothing
to show for it. :-)

Ya mean like this year? Vino had a great year, and Zabel did well for a guy that should be looking
in to retiring. Other than that, they have to be disappointed and the fact that they were obviously
so desperate to bring back the good times via Ullrich seems to me they share that view.

Ullrich was just as much a hot property when they let him go as he is now. It is the condition of
the team that has changed. Gabby must be very proud.

[email hidden] (brian roth) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Richard Adams <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Ok, I dunno where 'Der Kaiser' got pasted to Jan, but it makes a headline, I s'pose.

Good news for t-Mobile: Jan returns. Bad news for Vino: Jan returns. While he's a quiet guy and
doesn't tend to complain about things I can't imagine this is a very welcome development for
Vinokourov. To say nothing of the plans of Salvodelli or Cadel Evans. How many leaders does one
team need? The desire of t-mobile to win the TdF looks a bit obsessive at this point. And what
of Zabel? (Sorry, "Erik, old chap, but you'll have to pull Jan's train, no stage wins or points
jerseys for you!"😉

Add Botero to that list of too many chiefs....

WHO?? Is that the same Botero who hides in his parents attic from Colombian Kidnappers all year
long. Did he even leave Colombia this year?? What a Headcase. I believe a salary refund might be
appropriate in this situation.

The only race Zabel wins is to the rocking chair ahead of SimpleMario. Sometimes I wonder if you
guys read race results five years back to talk about who's on top. So that means we can expect to
talk about the 2003 bike racers in the year 2008 here.

"Nick Burns" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Jason Spaceman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Richard Adams said:

Ok, I dunno where 'Der Kaiser' got pasted to Jan, but it makes a headline, I s'pose.

Good news for t-Mobile: Jan returns. Bad news for Vino: Jan returns. While he's a quiet guy and
doesn't tend to complain about things I can't imagine this is a very welcome development for
Vinokourov. To say nothing of the plans of Salvodelli or Cadel Evans. How many leaders does one
team need? The desire of t-mobile to win the TdF looks a bit obsessive at this point. And what
of Zabel? (Sorry, "Erik, old chap, but you'll have to pull Jan's train, no stage wins or points
jerseys for you!"😉

I hope T-Mobile doesn't become the New York Rangers of cycling, with all that talent and nothing
to show for it. :-)

Ya mean like this year? Vino had a great year, and Zabel did well for a guy that should be looking
in to retiring.

Why should Zabel be looking to retiring? He's #2 in the UCI rankings.

"ronde chumpion" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

The only race Zabel wins is to the rocking chair ahead of SimpleMario. Sometimes I wonder if you
guys read race results five years back to talk about who's on top. So that means we can expect to
talk about the 2003 bike racers in the year 2008 here.

Dumbass -

Zabel isn't what he was, but he's not ready for the rocking chair either.

cyclingnews.comroad.phpOpen ↗

UCI rankings as of September 28, 2003 Elite men

1 Paolo Bettini (Ita) Quick.Step-Davitamon 2,096.75 pts 2 Erik Zabel (Ger) Team Telekom 1,993.75 3
Alessandro Petacchi (Ita) Fassa Bortolo 1,856.00 4 Davide Rebellin (Ita) Gerolsteiner 1,774.00 5
Gilberto Simoni (Ita) Team Saeco 1,752.00 6 Alexandre Vinokourov (Kaz) Team Telekom 1,693.50 7 Lance
Armstrong (USA) US Postal presented by Berry Floor 1,521.00 8 Iban Mayo Diez (Spa) Euskaltel-Euskadi
1,425.00 9 Alejandro Valverde Belmonte (Spa) Kelme-Costa Blanca 1,366.00 10 Tyler Hamilton (USA)
Team CSC 1,363.20

"Kurgan Gringioni" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

Why should Zabel be looking to retiring? He's #2 in the UCI rankings.

It is about time for him to write his last contract. It is up to him of course, but all things
considered, his last race can't be too far off. Don't get me wrong, he has been one of the most
respected pros for his entire career and I share that respect. The point is that his best years have
past and he only has a few years left, at the most. Deutsche Telekom needs to start building for its
future. Back to Zabel, I said the same thing about Museeuw several years ago and am very happy I was
proved wrong if only for a short time. Personally, I love it when guys in their late 30s win big
races, especially any of the monuments.

"Kurgan Gringioni" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Why should Zabel be looking to retiring? He's #2 in the UCI rankings.

I agree - I think Zabel will enjoy Museeuw-like longevity, and without Museeuw-like controversy.

-Sonarrat.

it's funny, no one calls him "Kaiser" in Germany (The only Kaiser was Kaiser Franz Beckenbauer, the
soccer player)

Richard Adams a écrit:

Quoted message said:

Ok, I dunno where 'Der Kaiser' got pasted to Jan, but it makes a headline, I s'pose.

Good news for t-Mobile: Jan returns. Bad news for Vino: Jan returns. While he's a quiet guy and
doesn't tend to complain about things I can't imagine this is a very welcome development for
Vinokourov. To say nothing of the plans of Salvodelli or Cadel Evans. How many leaders does one
team need? The desire of t-mobile to win the TdF looks a bit obsessive at this point. And what of
Zabel? (Sorry, "Erik, old chap, but you'll have to pull Jan's train, no stage wins or points
jerseys for you!"😉

Nick Burns said:

"brian roth" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

Add Botero to that list of too many chiefs....

He took himself off AFAIK.

Telekom made it clear that he was to train for 2004 _with the team_ so that means and end to his
special home-grown training, whatever it was. Someone mentioned he was trying to do some special
altitude training on his own. I could consider that "Camping at 14,000 feet", with beer, a battery
powered TV, etc.

Nick Burns said:

"Jason Spaceman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Richard Adams said:

Ok, I dunno where 'Der Kaiser' got pasted to Jan, but it makes a headline, I s'pose.

Good news for t-Mobile: Jan returns. Bad news for Vino: Jan returns. While he's a quiet guy and
doesn't tend to complain about things I can't imagine this is a very welcome development for
Vinokourov. To say nothing of the plans of Salvodelli or Cadel Evans. How many leaders does one
team need? The desire of t-mobile to win the TdF looks a bit obsessive at this point. And what of
Zabel? (Sorry, "Erik, old chap, but you'll have to pull Jan's train, no stage wins or points
jerseys for you!"😉

I hope T-Mobile doesn't become the New York Rangers of cycling, with all that talent and nothing
to show for it. :-)

Ya mean like this year? Vino had a great year, and Zabel did well for a guy that should be looking
in to retiring. Other than that, they have to be disappointed and the fact that they were
obviously so desperate to bring back the good times via Ullrich seems to me they share that view.

Ullrich was just as much a hot property when they let him go as he is now. It is the condition of
the team that has changed. Gabby must be very proud.

Zabel winning the points jersey in the Vuelta and, today, winning Paris-Tours says he's
still a force.

ronde chumpion said:

[email hidden] (brian roth) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Richard Adams <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Ok, I dunno where 'Der Kaiser' got pasted to Jan, but it makes a headline, I s'pose.

Good news for t-Mobile: Jan returns. Bad news for Vino: Jan returns. While he's a quiet guy and
doesn't tend to complain about things I can't imagine this is a very welcome development for
Vinokourov. To say nothing of the plans of Salvodelli or Cadel Evans. How many leaders does one
team need? The desire of t-mobile to win the TdF looks a bit obsessive at this point. And what of
Zabel? (Sorry, "Erik, old chap, but you'll have to pull Jan's train, no stage wins or points
jerseys for you!"😉

Add Botero to that list of too many chiefs....

WHO?? Is that the same Botero who hides in his parents attic from Colombian Kidnappers all year
long. Did he even leave Colombia this year?? What a Headcase. I believe a salary refund might be
appropriate in this situation.

The only race Zabel wins is to the rocking chair ahead of SimpleMario. Sometimes I wonder if you
guys read race results five years back to talk about who's on top. So that means we can expect to
talk about the 2003 bike racers in the year 2008 here.

You haven't followed cycling in September, have you? Zabel took the points jersey at the Vuelta.
Today he beat Peta into Tours.

You've got egg on your face.

"Nick Burns" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Ya mean like this year? Vino had a great year, and Zabel did well

for a guy

Quoted message said:

that should be looking in to retiring.

You look pretty stupid now don't you? Big surprise, that.