Is anyone familiar with this make+model of folding bike?

Drake said:

Is anyone familiar with this make+model of folding bike?:

http://tinyurl.com/yakd9b

It's a bit heavy at 18kg, but apart from that, are they any good? If
not, what are it's setbacks, drawbacks, etc?

I like the look of the 26" alloy wheels and all-round suspension, but
I know that a photo doesn't tell the whole story.

I'd appreciate any input as I'm thinking of buying one, at around
£100, all incl.

Not familiar with it.
BUT, even so, ALL the cheap bike alarm bells ring.

1) £100 for a full suspension bike-shaped-object (its not a bike). It will
be rubbish; rubbish parts, rubbish build quality, no support when bits fall
off. Heavy and won't work well.
Decent bikes without suspension start nearer £200 (some argue £150, others
£250). Suspension then adds to the price.

2) It folds as well. Oh dear. So as well as suspension which won't work, it
has a hinge to fail in the middle.

3) Its heavy at 18kg. Yes, very heavy. At least 50% more than it should
weigh. So as well as being rubbish to ride, you'll put your back out trying
to lift it.

Sorry, but you're going to have to spend quite a bit more than £100 for a
folding bike which works. Even second hand, I think your budget needs to
rise.

Try the Dahon range; they have models which are not particularly expensive
and actually work. You'll find stuff from about £300, though not full
suspension at that price.
www.dahon.co.uk
http://www.foldingbikes.co.uk/

- Nigel

--
Nigel Cliffe,
Webmaster at http://www.2mm.org.uk/

Quoted message said:

I'd appreciate any input as I'm thinking of buying one, at around
£100, all incl.

Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

"vernon" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I'd appreciate any input as I'm thinking of buying one, at around
£100, all incl.

Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'm not normally one to dismiss cheap bikes out of hand but the one you are
eyeing up is really awful. Just about every component would lower the value
of any bike it was transferred to. The gears, suspension, frame, forks,
chainring, wheels, seat and brakes are at the cheapest end of the 'el
cheapo' (TM) scale the brakes cables might just be worth retaining.. I just
might be tempted to buy one for someone that I really hated.....

"Nigel Cliffe" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Drake wrote:

Quoted message said:

Try the Dahon range; they have models which are not particularly expensive
and actually work. You'll find stuff from about £300, though not full
suspension at that price.
www.dahon.co.uk
http://www.foldingbikes.co.uk/

Or the Compass Marine, which is under £100. I think someone on this NG said
it was OK a while ago, although I've never ridden one.

AtoB magazine says:

A to B tip: Unless you're looking for a rare top-end model, our advice is to
ignore the Dahon brand altogether and go for a cheaper 'badge-engineered'
model. Our top buy at the moment is a German-market 20-inch Dahon with a
Compass Marine badge for just £70. Why pay more? Dahons bikes have also been
copied by Neobike.

Peter

Quoted message said:

I'd appreciate any input as I'm thinking of buying one, at around
£100, all incl.

Problems

At this price point various bits are likely to be substandard:

- The suspension probably won't have a lockout, so will soak up a lot of
your energy on the road with 'bob'
- The suspension will degrade in effectiveness fairly quickly
- The things that hold the pedals to the cranks (spindles?) are likely to
be made of a form of cheese and bend
- [censored] bearings with little in the way of weather proofing means hubs etc
may wear out quickly
- There *may* be flex in the frame, which would again suck energy that
could otherwise be put into forwards motion.
- The gears aren't the best, so will be rather slow in shifting, and
require relatively frequent fiddling if you want to use all the gears, or
don't want annoying rattling noises from the chain
- The wheels are likely to be fairly bad at staying true - they may start
rubbing brake blocks etc quite soon.

Also, it weighs a ton! The weight, plus suspension = s-l-o-w acceleration.

Benefits

- £100 is quite cheap, so if it gets nicked it's not too bad
- Looks the part (ok, only to the layman)
- Comfy ride - with the suspension and the wide, low pressure tyres you
won't feel the road
- You'll really appreciate the difference if/when you upgrade to a good
bike

If I were you I wouldn't touch it with a barge pole. Going second hand
will get you something better, though folders tend to be butt ugly/a bit
silly looking.

I'd definately recommend something with mudguards thobut.

In article <[email hidden]>

Drake said:

Is anyone familiar with this make+model of folding bike?:

http://tinyurl.com/yakd9b

It's a bit heavy at 18kg, but apart from that, are they any good? If
not, what are it's setbacks, drawbacks, etc?

I like the look of the 26" alloy wheels and all-round suspension, but
I know that a photo doesn't tell the whole story.

I'd appreciate any input as I'm thinking of buying one, at around
£100, all incl.

If you only want something to stick in the boot and ride a couple of
miles from the park-and-ride to work, and you don't have to carry it up
any stairs when you get there, then I suppose it might be viable, but do
you really need suspension for that sort of trip? It's basically a £65
bicycle shaped object that someone has stuck a hinge on. Calling it
'Commuter' is a bit of a stretch as it doesn't have a rack or mudguards,
and they will be tricky to fit because of the suspension. Given a
choice between that bike and an old 3-speed folder I'd take the 3-speed
and keep the change.

Drake said:

Is anyone familiar with this make+model of folding bike?:

Rubbish. Forget it.

Prompted by another poster on this thread, I had a look at the Compass
Marine. It looks like a competent folder for £70! Dahon by another name,
apparently:

http://www.compass24.com/cgi-bin/abnetshop.pl?basket=ukffxmiusoklbseaknrtbfpcfdqifsnhsaniextxblxso&nummernliste=997450

http://tinyurl.com/y6xofz

Thank you for the responses....

On Thu, 19 Oct 2006 21:06:06 +0100, Rob Morley <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

If you only want something to stick in the boot and ride a couple of
miles from the park-and-ride to work, and you don't have to carry it up
any stairs when you get there, then I suppose it might be viable,

Really, all I need it for on a regular basis is to ride 2 miles to the
beach where I go jogging. Then back home again. It would also be used
for rare uses such as riding one mile back home after taking the car
for its annual MOT test, etc. I don't have any stairs to carry it up.

Quoted message said:

but do you really need suspension for that sort of trip?

Probably not. I'm more curious than anything... It *sounds* like a
desirable feature, but I took note of the comments about it absorbing
energy.

Quoted message said:

Given a
choice between that bike and an old 3-speed folder I'd take the 3-speed
and keep the change.

I like the low-maintenance of 3-speed in-hub gears, but all the
examples I've seen have at best only 20" wheels, which, together with
the lack of any suspension, sounds like the kind of ride I wouldn't
look forward to much, for that ride to the beach and back - being as
I'm kind of old-ish (by most cyclist's standards) and not very fit or
light in weight.

I might want to ride the bike *on* the beach too... (that's why those
big wheels and tyres look good to me)... though I know it's inviting
rust... But it's probably better to mess up a £100 bike with rust than
a £300 one, right?

Drake

In article said:

"Nigel Cliffe" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Drake wrote:

Quoted message said:

Try the Dahon range; they have models which are not particularly expensive
and actually work. You'll find stuff from about £300, though not full
suspension at that price.
www.dahon.co.uk
http://www.foldingbikes.co.uk/

Or the Compass Marine, which is under £100. I think someone on this NG said
it was OK a while ago, although I've never ridden one.

http://www.compass24.com

MartinM bought one and seems to have wished he hadn't:
http://groups.google.co.uk/group/uk.rec.cycling/msg/13de64f905017497

Though his main objection seems to be the backpedal brake, so the moral
there would seem to be if you hate backpedal brakes, don't buy a bike
advertised as having one. Though to be fair, you can't know that you
hate backpedal brakes until you've ridden a bike that has one.

in message <[email hidden]>, Drake

(') said:

Thank you for the responses....

On Thu, 19 Oct 2006 21:06:06 +0100, Rob Morley <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

If you only want something to stick in the boot and ride a couple of
miles from the park-and-ride to work, and you don't have to carry it up
any stairs when you get there, then I suppose it might be viable,

Really, all I need it for on a regular basis is to ride 2 miles to the
beach where I go jogging. Then back home again. It would also be used
for rare uses such as riding one mile back home after taking the car
for its annual MOT test, etc. I don't have any stairs to carry it up.

Quoted message said:

but do you really need suspension for that sort of trip?

Probably not. I'm more curious than anything... It *sounds* like a
desirable feature, but I took note of the comments about it absorbing
energy.

It is a potentially desirable feature, but engineering it properly is very
expensive indeed, and bad suspension is a lot worst than no suspension. In
bikes from £2,000 upwards, full suspension can be very good indeed, but
you still lock it out when you take the bike onto the road (good
suspension always has lockout).

Quoted message said:

I like the low-maintenance of 3-speed in-hub gears, but all the
examples I've seen have at best only 20" wheels, which, together with
the lack of any suspension, sounds like the kind of ride I wouldn't
look forward to much, for that ride to the beach and back - being as
I'm kind of old-ish (by most cyclist's standards) and not very fit or
light in weight.

Look at
http://www.edinburgh-bicycle.co.uk/catalogue/detail.cfm?ID=22638
http://tinyurl.com/ykumxn [Ridgeback Neutron]
http://www.specialized.com/bc/SBCBkModel.jsp?spid=18028

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

'You cannot put "The Internet" into the Recycle Bin.'

Peter wrote on 19/10/2006 20:48 +0100:

Quoted message said:

Or the Compass Marine, which is under £100. I think someone on this NG said
it was OK a while ago, although I've never ridden one.

It doesn't seem to be available any more.

--
Tony

"Anyone who conducts an argument by appealing to authority is not using
his intelligence; he is just using his memory."
- Leonardo da Vinci

In article <[email hidden]>

Drake said:

Thank you for the responses....

On Thu, 19 Oct 2006 21:06:06 +0100, Rob Morley <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

If you only want something to stick in the boot and ride a couple of
miles from the park-and-ride to work, and you don't have to carry it up
any stairs when you get there, then I suppose it might be viable,

Really, all I need it for on a regular basis is to ride 2 miles to the
beach where I go jogging. Then back home again. It would also be used
for rare uses such as riding one mile back home after taking the car
for its annual MOT test, etc. I don't have any stairs to carry it up.

My ordinary bikes fit in the back of the car - they hang out the back
and I have to hold the hatch down with a bungee cord, but if it's only
for a couple of miles a year ...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

but do you really need suspension for that sort of trip?

Probably not. I'm more curious than anything... It *sounds* like a
desirable feature, but I took note of the comments about it absorbing
energy.

Unless you're regularly riding on cobbles or heavily potholed roads you
can't really justify suspension on a road bike, and you can't really
justify cheap'n'nasty suspension on any bike - it's a case of fashion
winning over form. A rigid bike with wide tyres should make most road
surfaces bearable.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Given a
choice between that bike and an old 3-speed folder I'd take the 3-speed
and keep the change.

I like the low-maintenance of 3-speed in-hub gears, but all the
examples I've seen have at best only 20" wheels, which, together with
the lack of any suspension,

A lot of them have sprung saddles, which takes the sting out of the
small wheels.

Quoted message said:

sounds like the kind of ride I wouldn't
look forward to much, for that ride to the beach and back - being as
I'm kind of old-ish (by most cyclist's standards) and not very fit or
light in weight.

There's an old Raleigh called the Bomber that's not very fit or light in
weight too, fat 26" wheels and a 3-speed hub - they're a bit of a rarity
now though, and probably quite collectable. :-)
Giant used to make some nice classic beach cruisers with hub gears and
aluminium alloy frames, but the closest they do now is the Sedona
comfort range which has derailleurs and suspension forks. :-(

Quoted message said:

I might want to ride the bike *on* the beach too... (that's why those
big wheels and tyres look good to me)... though I know it's inviting
rust... But it's probably better to mess up a £100 bike with rust than
a £300 one, right?

Depending on your beach it may be that the fattest tyres you'll find on
a regular bike won't be fat enough. Rust needn't be too much of a
problem if you rinse the bike off and give it a squirt of WD40, but sand
and derailleur gears really don't mix well. A better bike will have
better seals on the various bearings (cheap bikes mostly don't have any
seals to speak of) so will better tolerate beach riding.

"Drake" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Thank you for the responses....

On Thu, 19 Oct 2006 21:06:06 +0100, Rob Morley <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

If you only want something to stick in the boot and ride a couple of
miles from the park-and-ride to work, and you don't have to carry it up
any stairs when you get there, then I suppose it might be viable,

Really, all I need it for on a regular basis is to ride 2 miles to the
beach where I go jogging. Then back home again. It would also be used
for rare uses such as riding one mile back home after taking the car
for its annual MOT test, etc. I don't have any stairs to carry it up.

If that's all you want it for, why not buy a hybrid (if it's on-road to the
beach) or mountain bike (if it's off-road) - you'll get something very
suitable for around £200 new.

And jog back from the garage...

Peter

In article said:

Peter wrote on 19/10/2006 20:48 +0100:

Quoted message said:

Or the Compass Marine, which is under £100. I think someone on this NG said
it was OK a while ago, although I've never ridden one.

It doesn't seem to be available any more.

It went away, but it's back now.
http://www.compass24.com/cgi-bin/abnetshop.pl?basket=xqcaeutxxvntoqxallmgpkorbjvhmbwdcggwrpxpktvsa&ARTNR=997450
(if that doesn't work, just click "bicycles" from the front page)

In article said:

Quoted message said:

Depending on your beach it may be that the fattest tyres you'll find on
a regular bike won't be fat enough.

3.7 inch tyres: http://www.surlybikes.com/parts/endomorph.html

You won't fit them in a standard frame though.
http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=180382 is a custom snow bike using them.

(http://www.surlybikes.com/pugsley.html is Surly's frame for fat tyres)

In article <[email hidden]>

Alan Braggins said:

In article said:

Quoted message said:

Depending on your beach it may be that the fattest tyres you'll find on
a regular bike won't be fat enough.

3.7 inch tyres: http://www.surlybikes.com/parts/endomorph.html

You won't fit them in a standard frame though.
http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=180382 is a custom snow bike using them.

(http://www.surlybikes.com/pugsley.html is Surly's frame for fat tyres)

I know - that's why I said "the fattest tyres you'll find on a regular
bike".

Rob Morley said:

In article <[email hidden]>
Drake <[email hidden]> wrote:

Please Drake
Dont buy a cheap folding bike, Folders need to have extra high quality
because everything is put under strain small wheels, limited gears etc

--
zzapper
A Mini-Internet Business for less than $5 that you can set up in less
than 5
minutes!!
http://www.twodollars.biz/?a=532036

In article <[email hidden]>

zzapper said:

Rob Morley said:

In article <[email hidden]>
Drake <[email hidden]> wrote:

Please Drake
Dont buy a cheap folding bike, Folders need to have extra high quality
because everything is put under strain small wheels, limited gears etc

Please zzapper
Learn how to post.

in message <[email hidden]>, Rob Morley

(') said:

Giant used to make some nice classic beach cruisers with hub gears and
aluminium alloy frames, but the closest they do now is the Sedona
comfort range which has derailleurs and suspension forks.  :-(

Au contraire, Giant still make some really nice stylish beachcruisery sort
of bikes in their 'fashion' range. They're sold in 'girly' colours and
with 'girly' accessories, but they're well made and I think stylish and
come with hub gears:
http://www.giant-bicycles.com/uk/030.000.000/030.011.000.asp?model=10704

or with derailleur:
http://www.giant-bicycles.com/uk/030.000.000/030.011.000.asp?model=10703

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

;; part time troll.