Flying Lights

Stephen Harding wrote:
.....

Quoted message said:

Next I have three examples of the Cateye EL300 (???)
which is a nice, AA battery powered light on a sliding
mount that makes a good hand held flashlight if needed
(e.g. night time flats).

These lights have plastic 'L' rails at their bottoms
which slide into a groove in the mount attached to a
home made light bar at the fork crown of three of my
bikes.

During the course of this year, rough riding has caused
the 'L' to slowly be chipped away to the point it is
nearly an 'I' resulting in the light flying off the
mount when a root heave or pothole is encountered. One
of the lights is now unmountable because of the rail
chipping and the two others have become quite loose to
the point that I expect them to go flying the next jarring
encounter. ...
I love these little AA battery powered lights, but their mounting
components (the plastic itself) just isn't holding up to really
rough riding.

I've had a similar problem with the plastic mounts used for the GPS
that I've been using instead of a cyclometer for the last 8 years. I
switched back to a rubberband mounting system which has proven to be
more reliable although it does require periodic replacement of the
rubberbands as they deteriorate from UV exposure. I believe the same
method could supplement the Cateye light mounts that you're using.
Loop a rubberband over the front of the light when it's on the plastic
mount, then loop the band under the handlebar and finally around the
rear portion of the light. This is similar to the O-ring mount used by
Dinotte for their small lights. I'd recommend using two rubberbands
for added strength and redundancy. These should hold the light down on
the mount and reduce the forces that are causing them to chip and
crack.

Although the rubberbands deteriorate fairly quickly this hasn't been a
problem since the daily newspaper has anticipated my needs perfectly.
Every sunny day (when there's the UV exposure problem) they deliver a
brand new rubberband. And on rainy days they drop off a plastic shoe
cover.

Stephen Harding said:

...

I have no idea how to fix these lights. I'm thinking some
fiberglass cloth and resin or perhaps epoxy buildup that I
can "machine" with a dremel to reconstitute the 'L' rail
for mounting. Perhaps I can make some sort of metal mount.

I'm having trouble visualizing the shape of the bits, but I'd certainly
prefer metal. For various repairs on other goods, I've done plastic
welding, epoxy, etc. But it's usually easier to use metal, at least
for me.

Quoted message said:

Anyone else had problems with these type lights flying off under
jarring, rough road conditions?

Yes, a few times. I use generator lights almost exclusively these
days, but I have a small collection of old battery lights that are
"loaners" for the night rides I sometimes lead. But a couple of those
have exploded on pothole impacts. Other riders that bring their own
lights have had similar bad luck.

Quoted message said:

I love these little AA battery powered lights, but their mounting
components (the plastic itself) just isn't holding up to really
rough riding.

Is there any chance your homemade mounting bar can incorporate a little
suspension?

I've got an antique oil-powered bike headlight, probably from the
1890s. It mounts to a parallelogram, spring-loaded suspension device
(sort of like a rear derailleur's parallelogram, but re-oriented.)
Maybe you can contrive something a little simpler.

Quoted message said:

While I love the B&M 6V headlights, I haven't been too impressed
with their construction. Their web page says the lights are made
of "non-corrosive material" which I must now presume is mere
marketspeak for "cheap plastic"!

Yep. The worldwide tendency for all consumer goods has been toward
inexpensive, but unrepairable plastic. #*%!!

- Frank Krygowski

Stephen Harding said:

I have three types of lights I use on my bikes, and
multiple examples on each.
......

SMH

If I was losing lights that often, I think I'd have switched to
helmet-mounted lights already.

Perhaps: make some kind of a setup for mounting "regular" lights on your
helmet. (-One HID is all the light you'll need, but all the tiny HID
helmet-lights have remote battery packs that can still go flying on solo
trips-)
~

"Stephen Harding" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:KLF5h.1814$%U.989@trndny07...

Quoted message said:

I have three types of lights I use on my bikes, and
multiple examples on each.

Primary lighting for commuting are B&M Dymotec 6V
generator with a B&M Lumotec plus 3W headlight. I
have three examples of these lights and all three
of the detachable lenses have gone flying off the
base at some time in the last three months due to
rough road or bike path.

Haven't had this problem, but I have a Bisy light with my B&M generator, not
a Lumotec.

Quoted message said:

Next I have three examples of the Cateye EL300 (???)
which is a nice, AA battery powered light on a sliding
mount that makes a good hand held flashlight if needed
(e.g. night time flats).

These lights have plastic 'L' rails at their bottoms
which slide into a groove in the mount attached to a
home made light bar at the fork crown of three of my
bikes.

During the course of this year, rough riding has caused
the 'L' to slowly be chipped away to the point it is
nearly an 'I' resulting in the light flying off the
mount when a root heave or pothole is encountered. One
of the lights is now unmountable because of the rail
chipping and the two others have become quite loose to
the point that I expect them to go flying the next jarring
encounter. I carry one in the side mesh of my handlebar
bag as backup since I no longer trust the mount.

I have no idea how to fix these lights. I'm thinking some
fiberglass cloth and resin or perhaps epoxy buildup that I
can "machine" with a dremel to reconstitute the 'L' rail
for mounting. Perhaps I can make some sort of metal mount.

I have several Cateye models which all use the same mounting you describe.
However, there seems to be minor differences, probably due to the mold used.
This means that while the light will fit into the mounting, it may not get
the proper "click" in the spring lever. Without that "click" in, the light
can slide off when a rough patch is hit.

I haven't noticed the 'L' rails themselves being chipped away. I have
noticed, though, that there's only so many times the light can fall off onto
the road before it's ruined.

As to what to do: I have no idea how one would fix the L rails in a way that
would work. I would think the only secure way might be to glue the mounting
and the light together, carefully making sure you don't glue it together so
you can't replace the batteries. This has the big disadvantage that you can
no longer remove the light easily.

peter said:

Although the rubberbands deteriorate fairly quickly this hasn't been a
problem since the daily newspaper has anticipated my needs perfectly.
Every sunny day (when there's the UV exposure problem) they deliver a
brand new rubberband. And on rainy days they drop off a plastic shoe
cover.

We don't get rubber bands anymore. The newspapers are always
delivered in shoe covers (too often in the kiddie size) due to the
neighbors' obsession with lawn sprinklers.
--
Typoes are a feature, not a bug.
Some gardening required to reply via email.
Words processed in a facility that contains nuts.

Stephen Harding said:

I have three types of lights I use on my bikes, and
multiple examples on each.

Primary lighting for commuting are B&M Dymotec 6V
generator with a B&M Lumotec plus 3W headlight. I
have three examples of these lights and all three
of the detachable lenses have gone flying off the
base at some time in the last three months due to
rough road or bike path.

While I have found the lenses after each incident,
the small halogen bulb is usually AWOL when lense
is back on the bike.

I've remedied this problem (I hope) by drilling a
hole with a small stainless screw at the clamp point
that prevents the lense from twisting off under rough,
jarring road conditions.

Next I have three examples of the Cateye EL300 (???)
which is a nice, AA battery powered light on a sliding
mount that makes a good hand held flashlight if needed
(e.g. night time flats).

These lights have plastic 'L' rails at their bottoms
which slide into a groove in the mount attached to a
home made light bar at the fork crown of three of my
bikes.

During the course of this year, rough riding has caused
the 'L' to slowly be chipped away to the point it is
nearly an 'I' resulting in the light flying off the
mount when a root heave or pothole is encountered. One
of the lights is now unmountable because of the rail
chipping and the two others have become quite loose to
the point that I expect them to go flying the next jarring
encounter. I carry one in the side mesh of my handlebar
bag as backup since I no longer trust the mount.

I have one of the Cateye EL300 lights but only clip it one at night and
only do my rough riding during the day. With 4 NiMH batteries at 1.2
volts it isn't as bright as with 1.5 volt alkalines but I never have to
buy batteries. Put the light in you pocket or accessory pouch during the
day.
Bill Baka

Quoted message said:

I have no idea how to fix these lights. I'm thinking some
fiberglass cloth and resin or perhaps epoxy buildup that I
can "machine" with a dremel to reconstitute the 'L' rail
for mounting. Perhaps I can make some sort of metal mount.

Finally, on Friday, my long used Planet Bike AA powered
headlight went flying after encountering a pothole on the
road. I heard a "clanking" noise and looked over the various
attachments on the bike to see what had gone missing. There
appeared to be nothing.

Upon getting to work, I realized my Planet Bike light no
longer had an interior to it (a tray holding the four AA
batteries that slide into the light body). Only the exterior
shell of the light remained (attached) to the bike! I'll look
for it on the road Monday when I retrace Friday's route to work.

Anyone else had problems with these type lights flying off under
jarring, rough road conditions? The bike path I sometimes use
for part of my commute route has really degraded in recent years
with vicious "root heaves". I can end up almost with a headache
with the jarring. The main road (Rt 9 in Western MA) isn't much
better. It's been under construction for widening the last
couple years and won't be done for another year. The bike path
is supposed to be repaved in the next year or so.

I love these little AA battery powered lights, but their mounting
components (the plastic itself) just isn't holding up to really
rough riding.

While I love the B&M 6V headlights, I haven't been too impressed
with their construction. Their web page says the lights are made
of "non-corrosive material" which I must now presume is mere
marketspeak for "cheap plastic"!

SMH

Stephen Harding said:

I have three types of lights I use on my bikes, and
multiple examples on each.

Primary lighting for commuting are B&M Dymotec 6V
generator with a B&M Lumotec plus 3W headlight. I
have three examples of these lights and all three
of the detachable lenses have gone flying off the
base at some time in the last three months due to
rough road or bike path.

While I have found the lenses after each incident,
the small halogen bulb is usually AWOL when lense
is back on the bike.

I've remedied this problem (I hope) by drilling a
hole with a small stainless screw at the clamp point
that prevents the lense from twisting off under rough,
jarring road conditions.

Next I have three examples of the Cateye EL300 (???)
which is a nice, AA battery powered light on a sliding
mount that makes a good hand held flashlight if needed
(e.g. night time flats).

These lights have plastic 'L' rails at their bottoms
which slide into a groove in the mount attached to a
home made light bar at the fork crown of three of my
bikes.

During the course of this year, rough riding has caused
the 'L' to slowly be chipped away to the point it is
nearly an 'I' resulting in the light flying off the
mount when a root heave or pothole is encountered. One
of the lights is now unmountable because of the rail
chipping and the two others have become quite loose to
the point that I expect them to go flying the next jarring
encounter. I carry one in the side mesh of my handlebar
bag as backup since I no longer trust the mount.

I have no idea how to fix these lights. I'm thinking some
fiberglass cloth and resin or perhaps epoxy buildup that I
can "machine" with a dremel to reconstitute the 'L' rail
for mounting. Perhaps I can make some sort of metal mount.

Finally, on Friday, my long used Planet Bike AA powered
headlight went flying after encountering a pothole on the
road. I heard a "clanking" noise and looked over the various
attachments on the bike to see what had gone missing. There
appeared to be nothing.

Upon getting to work, I realized my Planet Bike light no
longer had an interior to it (a tray holding the four AA
batteries that slide into the light body). Only the exterior
shell of the light remained (attached) to the bike! I'll look
for it on the road Monday when I retrace Friday's route to work.

Anyone else had problems with these type lights flying off under
jarring, rough road conditions? The bike path I sometimes use
for part of my commute route has really degraded in recent years
with vicious "root heaves". I can end up almost with a headache
with the jarring. The main road (Rt 9 in Western MA) isn't much
better. It's been under construction for widening the last
couple years and won't be done for another year. The bike path
is supposed to be repaved in the next year or so.

I love these little AA battery powered lights, but their mounting
components (the plastic itself) just isn't holding up to really
rough riding.

While I love the B&M 6V headlights, I haven't been too impressed
with their construction. Their web page says the lights are made
of "non-corrosive material" which I must now presume is mere
marketspeak for "cheap plastic"!

SMH

I had some trouble with a battery powered LED headlight, when the
'attach' area got broken in a wreck, so I made some rubber bands (they
actually look more like chains) from bike innertubes. With a pair of
scissors, I cut pieces of tube into rings, about 1/8" - 3/16" wide,
then loop them into each other to make a chain.

Each ring then has a little knot between it and the next ring. The
chain can then be whatever length you want and when you tie then two
ends of the chain together, you can have whatever degree of tension
that you need.

The Butyl tubes seem to UV a LOT more slowly than 'rubber bands'.

Lewis.

*****

peter said:

Stephen Harding wrote:
....

Quoted message said:

Next I have three examples of the Cateye EL300 (???)
which is a nice, AA battery powered light on a sliding
mount that makes a good hand held flashlight if needed
(e.g. night time flats).

These lights have plastic 'L' rails at their bottoms
which slide into a groove in the mount attached to a
home made light bar at the fork crown of three of my
bikes.

During the course of this year, rough riding has caused
the 'L' to slowly be chipped away to the point it is
nearly an 'I' resulting in the light flying off the
mount when a root heave or pothole is encountered. One
of the lights is now unmountable because of the rail
chipping and the two others have become quite loose to
the point that I expect them to go flying the next jarring
encounter. ...
I love these little AA battery powered lights, but their mounting
components (the plastic itself) just isn't holding up to really
rough riding.

I've had a similar problem with the plastic mounts used for the GPS
that I've been using instead of a cyclometer for the last 8 years. I
switched back to a rubberband mounting system which has proven to be
more reliable although it does require periodic replacement of the
rubberbands as they deteriorate from UV exposure. I believe the same
method could supplement the Cateye light mounts that you're using.
Loop a rubberband over the front of the light when it's on the plastic
mount, then loop the band under the handlebar and finally around the
rear portion of the light. This is similar to the O-ring mount used by
Dinotte for their small lights. I'd recommend using two rubberbands
for added strength and redundancy. These should hold the light down on
the mount and reduce the forces that are causing them to chip and
crack.

Although the rubberbands deteriorate fairly quickly this hasn't been a
problem since the daily newspaper has anticipated my needs perfectly.
Every sunny day (when there's the UV exposure problem) they deliver a
brand new rubberband. And on rainy days they drop off a plastic shoe
cover.

Well the rubber bands seem like a fair idea for keeping the
light mount rails from being stressed too much. I'll give
it a try on the non-broken lights and see how that does. (I
too have plenty of rubber band mount bands and shoe covers!)

Not certain how I'll repair the rails that are already
broken. I'm thinking marine epoxy with the high density
filler might be a good option, then "machine" out some
rails.

Probably add rubberbands/inner tube wrappers to reduce the
stress.

SMH

Quoted message said:

Is there any chance your homemade mounting bar can incorporate a little
suspension?

I don't think so. I had lights mounted on flex stem bikes for a
while and never liked the up and down movement of the light beam
with the handlebars.

Wouldn't imagine a flexing light bar would move as much as a flexing
handlebar, but I still would prefer a fairly fixed light bar. I
have wrapped the bar in inner tube to help dampen vibration a bit
but it doesn't accommodate jarring from road pot holes or bike path
root heaves.

SMH

DougC said:

Stephen Harding said:

I have three types of lights I use on my bikes, and
multiple examples on each.
......

SMH

If I was losing lights that often, I think I'd have switched to
helmet-mounted lights already.

I rarely wear a helmet. I do have the head strap lights and I
suppose I could always switch to that style light instead of
actual mounted ones.

My primary lights are two generator driven lights, and one
home made 12V 20W light driven by a motorcycle battery for
winter use.

The small AA detachable lights are primarily for backup and
hand held flashlight use, so the headband type battery light
might be a better option.

SMH

Stephen Harding said:

I have three types of lights I use on my bikes, and
multiple examples on each.

<snip>

It's very true about the quality of the attachment system on many
bicycle lights.

On my folding bicycle I've been using a TwoFish Lock Block
(http://www.twofish.biz/bike.html) with a Streamlight Strion
(http://www.streamlight.com/product/product.aspx?pid=3) and haven't had
any problems with the fragile mounting mechanisms that most lights use.
It's an extremely bright light, small, and lightweight, and can be
focused from spot to flood, but it only runs for about 80 minutes per
charge.

It's a trade-off in the design of bicycle lights. If you want them to be
easily removable, for theft prevention, and to make it easy for bulb
changes and/or battery changes, then you rely on funky latches, screw on
or snap-on lenses, etc.

On my previous commute bike, I had a pair of 14W lamps that I attached
permanently, and I used industrial quality connectors to the battery.
The tail-light was also permanently attached. I never had to worry about
pieces flying off as I rode over bumps.

My bike club has an annual XMAS lights ride, and it's always funny-sad
to see the pieces of lights flying off during the ride. By the end of
the ride, it's lucky if half the bikes still have functioning lights.

I've come to appreciate the simplicity of the Lock Block and a
self-contained, Li-Ion powered, high-power flashlight. I guess the
police know something about flashlights.

SMS said:

On my folding bicycle I've been using a TwoFish Lock Block
(http://www.twofish.biz/bike.html)

TwoFish products are great. I don't understand why more bike shops don't
carry them.

Quoted message said:

with a Streamlight Strion
(http://www.streamlight.com/product/product.aspx?pid=3) and haven't had
any problems with the fragile mounting mechanisms that most lights use.
It's an extremely bright light, small, and lightweight, and can be
focused from spot to flood, but it only runs for about 80 minutes per
charge.

Even the cheapest AA "Maglight" type flashlights are as good as dedicated
bike lights. I have one that's better than my Cateye Micro. I got it
for free with a Gilette razor. I have yet to find a convenient way to
attach it to my bike though. My LBS does not sell TwoFish products!

Quoted message said:

It's a trade-off in the design of bicycle lights. If you want them to be
easily removable, for theft prevention, and to make it easy for bulb
changes and/or battery changes, then you rely on funky latches, screw on
or snap-on lenses, etc.

There's no reason these items can't be rugged enough.

Matt O.

Quoted message said:

Even the cheapest AA "Maglight" type flashlights are as good as dedicated
bike lights. I have one that's better than my Cateye Micro. I got it
for free with a Gilette razor. I have yet to find a convenient way to
attach it to my bike though. My LBS does not sell TwoFish products!

You mean besides a thick elastic band. worked on my flashlights.

Matt O'Toole said:

Even the cheapest AA "Maglight" type flashlights are as good as dedicated
bike lights. I have one that's better than my Cateye Micro. I got it
for free with a Gilette razor. I have yet to find a convenient way to
attach it to my bike though. My LBS does not sell TwoFish products!

This is true in general, but for a very bright light (>5W, >75 lumens)
there aren't many small flashlights that qualify. The good thing about
MagLights, and Streamlights (non-LED) is the adjustable beam. This
really is useful when cycling.

Quoted message said:

There's no reason these items can't be rugged enough.

There are many reasons why the manufacturers choose to not make them
rugged enough. There are design trade-offs that are made. I realized
this as I installed batteries into a Blackburn Mars 2.0 taillight, which
requires three screws to be removed to install the batteries. They could
have done a design with snaps, or screw-on covers, reducing reliability
in favor of ease of use.

SMS said:

Matt O'Toole said:

Even the cheapest AA "Maglight" type flashlights are as good as
dedicated bike lights. I have one that's better than my Cateye Micro.
I got it for free with a Gilette razor. I have yet to find a
convenient way to attach it to my bike though. My LBS does not sell
TwoFish products!

This is true in general, but for a very bright light (>5W, >75 lumens)
there aren't many small flashlights that qualify. The good thing about
MagLights, and Streamlights (non-LED) is the adjustable beam. This
really is useful when cycling.

The little Maglight I have about matches the Cateye Micro watt for watt
(2.4W). The difference is, the Maglight's beam pattern is round, the
Cateye's square. But adjusted to the same width, the Maglight is more
even and noticeably brighter.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

There's no reason these items can't be rugged enough.

There are many reasons why the manufacturers choose to not make them
rugged enough. There are design trade-offs that are made.

It's not always an active choice. C'mon, admit it, not everyone is all
that great at what they do.

More bike industry abuse -- today I went to the LBS to get a new bulb for
my Cateye, and they wanted almost 9 bucks for it. If Radio Shack had one
in stock (they didn't), it would have been $1.25.

Matt O.

Matt O'Toole said:

Even the cheapest AA "Maglight" type flashlights are as good as dedicated
bike lights. I have one that's better than my Cateye Micro. I got it
for free with a Gilette razor. I have yet to find a convenient way to
attach it to my bike though. My LBS does not sell TwoFish products!

LBS's don't sell a lot of stuff, you have to order the more esoteric
stuff on-line.

The TwoFish products are not widely sold, even on-line.

In article <KLF5h.1814$%U.989@trndny07>,

Stephen Harding said:

I have three types of lights I use on my bikes, and
multiple examples on each.

Primary lighting for commuting are B&M Dymotec 6V
generator with a B&M Lumotec plus 3W headlight. I
have three examples of these lights and all three
of the detachable lenses have gone flying off the
base at some time in the last three months due to
rough road or bike path.

While I have found the lenses after each incident,
the small halogen bulb is usually AWOL when lense
is back on the bike.

I've remedied this problem (I hope) by drilling a
hole with a small stainless screw at the clamp point
that prevents the lense from twisting off under rough,
jarring road conditions.

That might work. Maybe additional security could be
provided by a drop of non-setting cement on top of the
screw head. A few weeks ago the lens & reflector assembly
of my antiquated Union headlight went clattering onto the
asphalt; the retaining screw had finally worked its way out.
It's just a short, pointy, coarse-threaded screw that goes
in a hole punched in sheet metal. I guess bad securing
systems are nothing new. Fortunately the mishap occurred
during daylight. Maybe I should have smeared the screw
threads with a little blue Lok-Tite.

[snip]

Quoted message said:

Next I have three examples of the Cateye EL300 (???)
which is a nice, AA battery powered light on a sliding
mount that makes a good hand held flashlight if needed
(e.g. night time flats).

These lights have plastic 'L' rails at their bottoms
which slide into a groove in the mount attached to a
home made light bar at the fork crown of three of my
bikes.

[snip]

Quoted message said:

Finally, on Friday, my long used Planet Bike AA powered
headlight went flying after encountering a pothole on the
road. I heard a "clanking" noise and looked over the various
attachments on the bike to see what had gone missing. There
appeared to be nothing.

Upon getting to work, I realized my Planet Bike light no
longer had an interior to it (a tray holding the four AA
batteries that slide into the light body). Only the exterior
shell of the light remained (attached) to the bike! I'll look
for it on the road Monday when I retrace Friday's route to work.

Considering the relative inexpensiveness of such lights, I assume
there are corresponding low manufacturing costs such that quality
control isn't much of a consideration. IOW, when it eventually
breaks, it is expected/hoped we just bite the bullet and
buy a new one. I'm on my second Planet Bike Beamr-3, myself.
The first one exploded something like your own PB light -- the
front section is the assembly which contains the LEDs, and is also
the battery access. One day it just shot off with the AA cells
following, MIRV-like. The second Beamr-3 has outlived the first
by almost two years. Maybe there's a "luck of the draw" component
involved in getting a better (or worse) cheap light of the same
make and model.

I have the worst luck with rear blinkies.

cheers,
Tom

--
-- Nothing is safe from me.
Above address is just a spam midden.
I'm really at: tkeats [curlicue] vcn [point] bc [point] ca

"SMS" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

It's a trade-off in the design of bicycle lights. If you want them to be
easily removable, for theft prevention, and to make it easy for bulb
changes and/or battery changes, then you rely on funky latches, screw on
or snap-on lenses, etc.

I use strips of duck tape as an extra means of holding LED lights to their
housings. I don't remove lights, though, for theft prevention. I only need
to get at the inside of them for changing batteries, and the LED lights I
have don't need a lot of battery replacement. Duck tape does a pretty good
job of reinforcement, but isn't permanent like using glue.

The generator light is on there pretty securely; it doesn't require the
addition of the tape.

--
Warm Regards,

Claire Petersky
http://www.bicyclemeditations.org/
See the books I've set free at: http://bookcrossing.com/referral/Cpetersky

Claire Petersky said:

"SMS" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

It's a trade-off in the design of bicycle lights. If you want them to be
easily removable, for theft prevention, and to make it easy for bulb
changes and/or battery changes, then you rely on funky latches, screw on
or snap-on lenses, etc.

I use strips of duck tape as an extra means of holding LED lights to their
housings.

Duct, not Duck. G-d, I hate doing funky stuff like that. On my CatEye
TL-LD1000, I used two thin cable ties, and drilled small holes in the
mount on the rear rach, in order to attach the light more securely, even
though it had never fallen off. There is no gooey mess with cable ties.

It was great when bicycles had threaded headsets, and all came with a
steel front reflector bracket. This was the perfect secure place to
attach a front light, much better than all the various methods of
attaching to the handlebars, besides being in a better location for
illuminating the road.