Fake Protein Supplements?

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Please name for me a whey protein that uses only brown sugar or even
regular sugar for sweetening and I'll happily endorse it.

The brown sugar I've seen is just white sugar + molasses. Is there something
else?

But I do support you in a lot of what you're saying. We just can't possibly
try to create a good diet by isolating compounds in powder form and putting
together a diet with them. It's like pretending we know all there is to know
about how the body processes food (I certainly don't, and I don't believe
even the best nutritionist out there does), and that we can do better than
nature. People make this mistake in all areas of science by becoming too
specialized in one subject and ignoring the context. But I do believe
there's value in whey and other supplements as long as they're only taken as
supplements in situations where it may be appropriate, making up only a
minor portion of our daily intake. There's just so many things in real food
that we're missing out on if we rely heavily on calorie-rich supplements. We
could certainly consume whey as a source of protein, but that's not
nutrition, not healthy, and someone consuming 1000 calories a day in whey is
missing out on the nutrition he'd be getting by eating real foods to make up
his daily protein intake.

The real problem, as I see it, is consumers buy lots and lots of whey and
take it like a magic formula that rationalizes an otherwise crappy diet.

David

--
Adamant Barbell
Unyielding steel, built for abuse
www.adamantbarbell.com

In article <[email hidden]>,

Dave said:

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Please name for me a whey protein that uses only brown sugar or even
regular sugar for sweetening and I'll happily endorse it.

The brown sugar I've seen is just white sugar + molasses. Is there something
else?

Change that to raw or turbinado sugar and yes, there is a difference.
--
Peace, Om

Remove _ to validate e-mails.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a Son of a [censored]" -- Jack Nicholson

(Will Brink) said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Quoted message said:

Let me try to go through this point by point with what I know or what
I think I know...

Quoted message said:

I generally define the best way of eating as to eat the foods with the
lowest profit margins and that spoil soon. These foods have more
nutrients per ounce.

Proft margin has zero to do with nutrient density nor does how fast the
food spoils.

Wow. So fresh foods are no different from canned, pulverized or frozen
foods? Or anything else done to it.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Whey protein is cheap as hell and the source of
it is from cows that aren't grass fed.

Some are some are not.

Which whey maker uses grass fed, pasture raised cows? I'd love to know
this.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Here is an article on vit A and absorption
of protein:http://www.westonaprice.org/men/vitaminabodybuilding.html

A worthless source as weston price is worthless info for non science types
who are fooled by their BS and agendas. The article is also worthless.

So these are worthless citations?
Livera, et al., "Regulation and Perturbation of Testicular Functions
by Vitamin A" (Review), Reproduction (2002) 124, 173-180
Nayyar, et. al., "Alterations in binding characteristics of peripheral
benzodiazepine receptors in testes by vitamin A deficiency in guinea
pigs," Mol Cell Biochem. 2000 Aug;211(1-2):47-50
Bishop, et. al., "The effect of nutritional factors on sex hormone
levels in male twins," Genet Epidemiol. 1988;5(1):43-59.
Zadik, et. al., "Vitamin A and iron supplementation is as efficient as
hormonal therapy in constitutionally delayed children," Clin
Endocrinol (Oxf). 2004 Jun; 60(6):682-7.
McCormick, et. al., "Chemoprevention of rat prostate carcinogenesis by
9-cis-retinoic acid," Cancer Res. 1999 Feb 1;59(3):521-4.
Furusho, et. al., "Tissue specific-distribution and metabolism of
vitamin A are affected by dietary protein levels in rats," Int J Vitam
Nutr Res. 1998;68(5):287-92
Narbonne, et. al., "Protein metabolism in vitamin A deficient rats.
II. Protein synthesis in striated muscle," Ann Nutr Aliment.
1978;32(1):59-75.
Stio, et. al., "Synergistic effect of vitamin D derivatives and
retinoids on C2C12 skeletal muscle cells," IUBMB Life. 2002 Mar;53(3):
175-81

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

The article which you wrote doesn't have any citations. Please provide
these and we can discuss further.

Formatting of the article is messed up for some reason. On another site:

http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag97/nov-report97.html

Others can be seen here:

Effects of one of the sub fractions found in whey not found in other proteins:

http://www.brinkzone.com/articledetails.php?acatid=3&aid=99

Possible effects of whey on weight loss:

http://www.brinkzone.com/articledetails.php?acatid=3&aid=11

Pretty much everything you need to know about whey:

http://www.brinkzone.com/articledetails.php?acatid=3&aid=25

Those are just a sample BTW.

I agree that whey is fantastic and it is WHEY better in its original
form before it is pulverized and/or cooked.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Whey can be made at home far cheaper
than buying a powder. Don't know how? Get raw milk and make yogurt,
then drain the liquid. This would have to be the best whey ever!
Second best, use regular milk. Third best, buy yogurt.

You're ignorant of the topic.

I am ignorant on the topic of whey? Have you ever made your own whey?
If a cow is pasture fed, on pesticide free grass, and you milk it,
culture it to become yogurt,
drain the liquid whey out.... are you telling me that WPI or
hydrolyzed protein is healthier than this?
What about all of the other nutrients in this liquid that haven't even
been discovered yet? And that perhaps
make the whey work even better? Or whey maybe works better directly in
the yogurt? Or even better, perhaps it works
better in the raw milk?! Healthy whole foods are always better than
an isolated form stripped from their origin.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Vince definitely was a character. He knew a lot. Not all. And I agree
that he sure thought he knew it all.

I have no idea what you are talking about or who Vince is.

You don't know who Vince Gironda was? Have you studied the history of
bodybuilding and nutrition?
Your ignorance of Vince Gironda is revealing.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Not sure why you think the westonaprice folks are nuts. Please give me
an example as opposed to a general attack on them.

Their info is generally BS and that's easy enough to figure out by a
simple read of their material.

Still waiting for an example.
Have you read "Nutrition and Physical Degeneration" by Dr. Price?
This book is so insightful that it would be an understatement to say
anything else.
This is the basis of the http://www.westonaprice.org folks.

Tom
http://www.itspuresoap.com

Here is the study I couldn't find regarding CLA and eating more
organic foods for anyone interested

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed&cmd=Retrieve&dopt=AbstractPlus&list_uids=17349086&query_hl=1&itool=pubmed_docsum

Tom
http://www.itspuresoap.com

Quoted message said:

(Will Brink) said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Let me try to go through this point by point with what I know or what
I think I know...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I generally define the best way of eating as to eat the foods with the
lowest profit margins and that spoil soon. These foods have more
nutrients per ounce.

Quoted message said:

Proft margin has zero to do with nutrient density nor does how fast the
food spoils.

Wow. So fresh foods are no different from canned, pulverized or frozen
foods? Or anything else done to it.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Whey protein is cheap as hell and the source of
it is from cows that aren't grass fed.

Quoted message said:

Some are some are not.

Which whey maker uses grass fed, pasture raised cows? I'd love to know
this.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Here is an article on vit A and absorption
of protein:http://www.westonaprice.org/men/vitaminabodybuilding.html

Quoted message said:

A worthless source as weston price is worthless info for non science types
who are fooled by their BS and agendas. The article is also worthless.

So these are worthless citations?
Livera, et al., "Regulation and Perturbation of Testicular Functions
by Vitamin A" (Review), Reproduction (2002) 124, 173-180
Nayyar, et. al., "Alterations in binding characteristics of peripheral
benzodiazepine receptors in testes by vitamin A deficiency in guinea
pigs," Mol Cell Biochem. 2000 Aug;211(1-2):47-50
Bishop, et. al., "The effect of nutritional factors on sex hormone
levels in male twins," Genet Epidemiol. 1988;5(1):43-59.
Zadik, et. al., "Vitamin A and iron supplementation is as efficient as
hormonal therapy in constitutionally delayed children," Clin
Endocrinol (Oxf). 2004 Jun; 60(6):682-7.
McCormick, et. al., "Chemoprevention of rat prostate carcinogenesis by
9-cis-retinoic acid," Cancer Res. 1999 Feb 1;59(3):521-4.
Furusho, et. al., "Tissue specific-distribution and metabolism of
vitamin A are affected by dietary protein levels in rats," Int J Vitam
Nutr Res. 1998;68(5):287-92
Narbonne, et. al., "Protein metabolism in vitamin A deficient rats.
II. Protein synthesis in striated muscle," Ann Nutr Aliment.
1978;32(1):59-75.
Stio, et. al., "Synergistic effect of vitamin D derivatives and
retinoids on C2C12 skeletal muscle cells," IUBMB Life. 2002 Mar;53(3):
175-81

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

The article which you wrote doesn't have any citations. Please provide
these and we can discuss further.

Quoted message said:

Formatting of the article is messed up for some reason. On another site:

Quoted message said:

http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag97/nov-report97.html

Quoted message said:

Others can be seen here:

Quoted message said:

Effects of one of the sub fractions found in whey not found in other proteins:

Quoted message said:

http://www.brinkzone.com/articledetails.php?acatid=3&aid=99

Quoted message said:

Possible effects of whey on weight loss:

Quoted message said:

http://www.brinkzone.com/articledetails.php?acatid=3&aid=11

Quoted message said:

Pretty much everything you need to know about whey:

Quoted message said:

http://www.brinkzone.com/articledetails.php?acatid=3&aid=25

Quoted message said:

Those are just a sample BTW.

I agree that whey is fantastic and it is WHEY better in its original
form before it is pulverized and/or cooked.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Whey can be made at home far cheaper
than buying a powder. Don't know how? Get raw milk and make yogurt,
then drain the liquid. This would have to be the best whey ever!
Second best, use regular milk. Third best, buy yogurt.

Quoted message said:

You're ignorant of the topic.

I am ignorant on the topic of whey? Have you ever made your own whey?
If a cow is pasture fed, on pesticide free grass, and you milk it,
culture it to become yogurt,
drain the liquid whey out.... are you telling me that WPI or
hydrolyzed protein is healthier than this?
What about all of the other nutrients in this liquid that haven't even
been discovered yet? And that perhaps
make the whey work even better? Or whey maybe works better directly in
the yogurt? Or even better, perhaps it works
better in the raw milk?! Healthy whole foods are always better than
an isolated form stripped from their origin.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Vince definitely was a character. He knew a lot. Not all. And I agree
that he sure thought he knew it all.

Quoted message said:

I have no idea what you are talking about or who Vince is.

You don't know who Vince Gironda was? Have you studied the history of
bodybuilding and nutrition?
Your ignorance of Vince Gironda is revealing.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Not sure why you think the westonaprice folks are nuts. Please give me
an example as opposed to a general attack on them.

Quoted message said:

Their info is generally BS and that's easy enough to figure out by a
simple read of their material.

Still waiting for an example.
Have you read "Nutrition and Physical Degeneration" by Dr. Price?
This book is so insightful that it would be an understatement to say
anything else.
This is the basis of thehttp://www.westonaprice.orgfolks.

Tomhttp://www.itspuresoap.com

In article <[email hidden]>,

Quoted message said:

(Will Brink) said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Quoted message said:

Let me try to go through this point by point with what I know or what
I think I know...

Quoted message said:

I generally define the best way of eating as to eat the foods with the
lowest profit margins and that spoil soon. These foods have more
nutrients per ounce.

Proft margin has zero to do with nutrient density nor does how fast the
food spoils.

Wow.

For you, I guess this basic info leads to a "wow" conclusion.

Quoted message said:

So fresh foods are no different from canned, pulverized or frozen
foods? Or anything else done to it.

For nutrient density, no. Do you even understand what nutrient density is?
It appears you don't.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Whey protein is cheap as hell and the source of
it is from cows that aren't grass fed.

Some are some are not.

Which whey maker uses grass fed, pasture raised cows? I'd love to know
this.

As you don't understand even basic concepts like nutrient density, I fail
to see how the info will do you any good.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Here is an article on vit A and absorption
of protein:http://www.westonaprice.org/men/vitaminabodybuilding.html

A worthless source as weston price is worthless info for non science types
who are fooled by their BS and agendas. The article is also worthless.

So these are worthless citations?

In the context of this thread and conversation,Yup.

Quoted message said:

I agree that whey is fantastic and it is WHEY better in its original
form before it is pulverized and/or cooked.

Again, you dont know the data or the science. All the studies cited in
those aticles are using concentrates or isolates processed.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

You're ignorant of the topic.

I am ignorant on the topic of whey?

Yes, every comment you have made proves that.

All natural-Feel-good-how-you-make yogurt-goofyness snipped.

Now move along.

--
Will @ www.BrinkZone.com

"It twas ever thus! " - Mr Natural

In article <[email hidden]>,

Quoted message said:

Here is the study I couldn't find regarding CLA and eating more
organic foods for anyone interested

Did anyone claim organic foods were bad in this thread or do you always
just throw out random stuff unrlated to the topic of the thread?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> Here is an article on vit A and absorption

No, it is not. Your reading skills are worse than your science. Show me in
the article where it talks about ABSORPTION of vitamin A.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

So these are worthless citations?

From the article:

"athletes and body builders may be able to achieve similar results from
their training by taking high-vitamin cod liver oil and eating foods rich
in vitamin A on a regular basis as others receive from the common practice
of supplementing with testosterone precursors."

That's very funny! Vitamin A is = to anabolic steroids.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Still waiting for an example.

I just gave you one. If they allow that type of BS to be published on
their site...they are well known for fabricating things and or simply
getting the science wrong to support their agenda's

--
Will @ www.BrinkZone.com

"It twas ever thus! " - Mr Natural

Okay so isolates or concentrates were used. Obviously the nutrient
density is higher. But then again you've probably never heard of the
brix of food either. Again, which whey makers use grass fed, pesticide
free, hormone free cows? I'd love to know this. Vitamin A deficiency
from eating low fat proteins is not a wise move for your health. Good
luck! I'm done.

Tom
http://www.itspuresoap.com

(Will Brink) said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Quoted message said:

(Will Brink) said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

[email hidden] wrote:
> Let me try to go through this point by point with what I know or what
> I think I know...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> I generally define the best way of eating as to eat the foods with the
> lowest profit margins and that spoil soon. These foods have more
> nutrients per ounce.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Proft margin has zero to do with nutrient density nor does how fast the
food spoils.

Quoted message said:

Wow.

For you, I guess this basic info leads to a "wow" conclusion.

Quoted message said:

So fresh foods are no different from canned, pulverized or frozen
foods? Or anything else done to it.

For nutrient density, no. Do you even understand what nutrient density is?
It appears you don't.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>Whey protein is cheap as hell and the source of
> it is from cows that aren't grass fed.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Some are some are not.

Quoted message said:

Which whey maker uses grass fed, pasture raised cows? I'd love to know
this.

As you don't understand even basic concepts like nutrient density, I fail
to see how the info will do you any good.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> Here is an article on vit A and absorption
> of protein:http://www.westonaprice.org/men/vitaminabodybuilding.html

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

A worthless source as weston price is worthless info for non science types
who are fooled by their BS and agendas. The article is also worthless.

Quoted message said:

So these are worthless citations?

In the context of this thread and conversation,Yup.

Quoted message said:

I agree that whey is fantastic and it is WHEY better in its original
form before it is pulverized and/or cooked.

Again, you dont know the data or the science. All the studies cited in
those aticles are using concentrates or isolates processed.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

You're ignorant of the topic.

Quoted message said:

I am ignorant on the topic of whey?

Yes, every comment you have made proves that.

All natural-Feel-good-how-you-make yogurt-goofyness snipped.

Now move along.

--
Will @www.BrinkZone.com

"It twas ever thus! " - Mr Natural

Quoted message said:

Healthy whole foods are always better than
an isolated form stripped from their origin.

Yep. There it is. The classic moronic statement of the natural foods
luddites.

For instance, you wouldn't want to do any evil "processing and
denaturing" with the tropical world's most prominent food starch
source: cassava. It would get rid of the yummy, natural cyanide!

People like you are a Darwin Award waiting to happen.

[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

(Will Brink) said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Quoted message said:

Let me try to go through this point by point with what I know or what
I think I know...

Quoted message said:

I generally define the best way of eating as to eat the foods with the
lowest profit margins and that spoil soon. These foods have more
nutrients per ounce.

Proft margin has zero to do with nutrient density nor does how fast the
food spoils.

Wow. So fresh foods are no different from canned, pulverized or frozen
foods? Or anything else done to it.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Whey protein is cheap as hell and the source of
it is from cows that aren't grass fed.

Some are some are not.

Which whey maker uses grass fed, pasture raised cows? I'd love to know
this.

Who cares? That has ZERO to do with the protein content or protein value.
You don't eat protein looking for essential fatty acids.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Here is an article on vit A and absorption
of protein:http://www.westonaprice.org/men/vitaminabodybuilding.html

A worthless source as weston price is worthless info for non science
types
who are fooled by their BS and agendas. The article is also worthless.

So these are worthless citations?
Livera, et al., "Regulation and Perturbation of Testicular Functions
by Vitamin A" (Review), Reproduction (2002) 124, 173-180
Nayyar, et. al., "Alterations in binding characteristics of peripheral
benzodiazepine receptors in testes by vitamin A deficiency in guinea
pigs," Mol Cell Biochem. 2000 Aug;211(1-2):47-50
Bishop, et. al., "The effect of nutritional factors on sex hormone
levels in male twins," Genet Epidemiol. 1988;5(1):43-59.
Zadik, et. al., "Vitamin A and iron supplementation is as efficient as
hormonal therapy in constitutionally delayed children," Clin
Endocrinol (Oxf). 2004 Jun; 60(6):682-7.
McCormick, et. al., "Chemoprevention of rat prostate carcinogenesis by
9-cis-retinoic acid," Cancer Res. 1999 Feb 1;59(3):521-4.
Furusho, et. al., "Tissue specific-distribution and metabolism of
vitamin A are affected by dietary protein levels in rats," Int J Vitam
Nutr Res. 1998;68(5):287-92
Narbonne, et. al., "Protein metabolism in vitamin A deficient rats.
II. Protein synthesis in striated muscle," Ann Nutr Aliment.
1978;32(1):59-75.
Stio, et. al., "Synergistic effect of vitamin D derivatives and
retinoids on C2C12 skeletal muscle cells," IUBMB Life. 2002 Mar;53(3):
175-81

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

The article which you wrote doesn't have any citations. Please provide
these and we can discuss further.

Formatting of the article is messed up for some reason. On another site:

http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag97/nov-report97.html

Others can be seen here:

Effects of one of the sub fractions found in whey not found in other
proteins:

http://www.brinkzone.com/articledetails.php?acatid=3&aid=99

Possible effects of whey on weight loss:

http://www.brinkzone.com/articledetails.php?acatid=3&aid=11

Pretty much everything you need to know about whey:

http://www.brinkzone.com/articledetails.php?acatid=3&aid=25

Those are just a sample BTW.

I agree that whey is fantastic and it is WHEY better in its original
form before it is pulverized and/or cooked.

Once again, who cares what YOU think? You are yet another anonymous moron
who obviously has an agenda here.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Whey can be made at home far cheaper
than buying a powder. Don't know how? Get raw milk and make yogurt,
then drain the liquid. This would have to be the best whey ever!
Second best, use regular milk. Third best, buy yogurt.

You're ignorant of the topic.

I am ignorant on the topic of whey? Have you ever made your own whey?

Why do you keep bringing up things that have ZERO to do with the topic?

Quoted message said:

If a cow is pasture fed, on pesticide free grass, and you milk it,
culture it to become yogurt,
drain the liquid whey out.... are you telling me that WPI or
hydrolyzed protein is healthier than this?

Why don't you stick to the topic at hand?

Quoted message said:

What about all of the other nutrients in this liquid that haven't even
been discovered yet? And that perhaps
make the whey work even better? Or whey maybe works better directly in
the yogurt? Or even better, perhaps it works
better in the raw milk?! Healthy whole foods are always better than
an isolated form stripped from their origin.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Vince definitely was a character. He knew a lot. Not all. And I agree
that he sure thought he knew it all.

I have no idea what you are talking about or who Vince is.

You don't know who Vince Gironda was? Have you studied the history of
bodybuilding and nutrition?
Your ignorance of Vince Gironda is revealing.

Why do you think Vince Gironda is some kind of worldy authority? Vince also
claimed that squats made your hips wide. NO ONE cares about the ideas of
Vince Gironda. Why do you look into Will's background before you keep
foaming at the mouth? How many publications have you been published in?
Compare that to Will.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Not sure why you think the westonaprice folks are nuts. Please give me
an example as opposed to a general attack on them.

Their info is generally BS and that's easy enough to figure out by a
simple read of their material.

Still waiting for an example.
Have you read "Nutrition and Physical Degeneration" by Dr. Price?
This book is so insightful that it would be an understatement to say
anything else.
This is the basis of the http://www.westonaprice.org folks.

Tom
http://www.itspuresoap.com

Tom,
You are a brainwashed lemming who knows NOTHING about these topics. You get
your info from biased sources and you really don't understand what you are
saying.

[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Okay so isolates or concentrates were used. Obviously the nutrient
density is higher. But then again you've probably never heard of the
brix of food either. Again, which whey makers use grass fed, pesticide
free, hormone free cows? I'd love to know this.

Once again, what does that have to do with ANYTHING? Your claim is that the
protein will be lacking in CLA. Once again, who cares? NO ONE is using Whey
protein to obtain any essential fatty acids. Why don't you address something
that is related to the truth?

Vitamin A deficiency

Quoted message said:

from eating low fat proteins is not a wise move for your health. Good
luck! I'm done.

Tom
http://www.itspuresoap.com

This has to be one of THE most ludicrous claims that I have ever read in
Usenet. I'll take Will's knowledge over yours any day of the week.

--
Robert Schuh
"Everything that elevates an individual above the herd and
intimidates the neighbour is henceforth called evil; and
the fair, modest, submissive and conforming mentality,
the mediocrity of desires attains moral designations and honors"
- Nietzsche

http://www.hardbopdrums.com/

In article <[email hidden]>,

Quoted message said:

Okay so isolates or concentrates were used. Obviously the nutrient
density is higher. But then again you've probably never heard of the
brix of food either. Again, which whey makers use grass fed, pesticide
free, hormone free cows?

All you need to know about hormones in whey:

http://www.brinkzone.com/articledetails.php?acatid=3&aid=14

BTW, there is no such thing as a "hormone free cow"

Quoted message said:

I'd love to know this. Vitamin A deficiency
from eating low fat proteins is not a wise move for your health.

More BS.

Quoted message said:

Good
luck! I'm done.

Promise?

--
Will @ www.BrinkZone.com

"It twas ever thus! " - Mr Natural

In article <[email hidden]>, JMW

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Healthy whole foods are always better than
an isolated form stripped from their origin.

Yep. There it is. The classic moronic statement of the natural foods
luddites.

For instance, you wouldn't want to do any evil "processing and
denaturing" with the tropical world's most prominent food starch
source: cassava. It would get rid of the yummy, natural cyanide!

Uranium is natural also....

Quoted message said:

People like you are a Darwin Award waiting to happen.

We have pretty much stopped natural selection in humans which is why we
have ended up where we are today.

--
Will @ www.BrinkZone.com

"It twas ever thus! " - Mr Natural

Quoted message said:

All protein powders are [censored]. Stick with real food. Protein powders
will actually pull fat soluble vitamins right out of you. AND all of
them have some sort of synthetic sugar. Eat liver! One of nature's
wonder foods. Vince Gironda knew a lot of stuff way before anybody
else! Also, check out the folks athttp://www.westonaprice.org-
really spot on for maximizing your health!

Tomhttp://www.itspuresoap.com

Vince Gironda, eh? Interesting...he was one of them Golden-Age-of-
Bodybuilding icons, I understand...now you have me wondering about
them old-timers!

It's funny you claim whey protein powders to be [censored]...this was the
very Spiel or sales pitch behind a Dorian Yates Approved protein
supplement ad in the muscle magazines! It was the one titled "WHAT
(T)WHEY DON'T WANT YOU TO KNOW"....

Dave said:

<[email hidden]> wrote in message

news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Please name for me a whey protein that uses only brown sugar or even
regular sugar for sweetening and I'll happily endorse it.

The brown sugar I've seen is just white sugar + molasses. Is there something
else?

But I do support you in a lot of what you're saying. We just can't possibly
try to create a good diet by isolating compounds in powder form and putting
together a diet with them. It's like pretending we know all there is to know
about how the body processes food (I certainly don't, and I don't believe
even the best nutritionist out there does), and that we can do better than
nature. People make this mistake in all areas of science by becoming too
specialized in one subject and ignoring the context. But I do believe
there's value in whey and other supplements as long as they're only taken as
supplements in situations where it may be appropriate, making up only a
minor portion of our daily intake. There's just so many things in real food
that we're missing out on if we rely heavily on calorie-rich supplements. We
could certainly consume whey as a source of protein, but that's not
nutrition, not healthy, and someone consuming 1000 calories a day in whey is
missing out on the nutrition he'd be getting by eating real foods to make up
his daily protein intake.

The real problem, as I see it, is consumers buy lots and lots of whey and
take it like a magic formula that rationalizes an otherwise crappy diet.

David

--
Adamant Barbell
Unyielding steel, built for abusewww.adamantbarbell.com

Well, I'm going to try some protein powder and see if it helps any. I
never saw the point to them, but I guess it's like trying a new
exercise, just something to do to see if it's any "fun" -- for
example, I've only started doing squats and deadlifts last week! I
especially enjoy deadlifts! They used to feel awkward to me -- and I
still have to really mind my back and all -- but I so enjoy the sheer
power that's involved! The bench press is nothing compared to the
deadlift! The deadlift's like a cardio exercise, almost! The squat's
okay, fun for the novelty factor. Funny thing, I think the deadlift's
harder, though some folks seem to think the squat's the "King of
Exercises."

Anyway, the more I learn about supplementation, the more I find myself
looking at good ol' fashioned whole foods again! I guess I'm bored
and trying protein and creatine powders will be an interesting
experiment -- but I've gained new-found respect for home cookin'!

Cubit said:

What do they cut it with?
Talcum powder?

Well, I'm asking, amn't I?

Like how, for example, many glucosamine supplements were found to have
contained less than the amount claimed on the label -- Lord knows what
filler they could have used!

http://www.goaskalice.columbia.edu/3956.html

Quoted post said:

Better yet, don't buy protein supplements. If you want more protein
eat some nonfat egg whites at 3 gms per egg white. This makes them low
calorie as well. One body builder I know just eats some canned tuna
when he wants more protein. This fixation with getting protein is not
warranted by the research. It probably won't hurt you but it is a
waste of money. Protein is EASY to get in food...all you could
possibly want, even for us vegetarians. dkw

True: Bill Pearl and Albert Beckles were vegetarian bodybuilders who
were champs!

I think I'll give it a shot, just for fun...I used to dismiss them,
but suddenly they've become new toys for me...I'm going to play with
protein and creatine powders this summer and see what happens. But
it's funny how the more I try to read up about supplements the more I
come back to whole foods! Nothing beats the original, eh. =)

Tom Anderson said:

Prisoner at War said:

Yes, whey protein does seem cheap these days -- surprised so many
college students are still living on ramen noodles! -- but that only
means the profits would be even greater for unscrupulous companies.

No it doesn't. It means exactly the opposite.

I think you're assuming that they'd get sued and lose money. But good
luck trying to do that on your own. Besides, a fly-by-night operation
wouldn't care: it'd simply declare bankruptcy, while the principals go
off and start up another venture.

Anyway, do they exist? Are there protein powders which aren't really
protein, or somehow otherwise rip-offs? For example, 33% of
glucosamine supps had been found to contain less than the amount
claimed on the labels: http://www.goaskalice.columbia.edu/3956.html.

Quoted message said:

tom

--
Miscellaneous Terrorists: Ducks | Bird Flu | Avian flu | Jimbo Wales |
Backstreet Boys | The Al Queda Network | Tesco -- Uncyclopedia

Prisoner at War said:

Here's a hint, gomer: go to a coed gym.

Are you referring to the middle school gym classes where you stalk
14-year-old latinas, chomo?

So what is natural bodybuilding, and how can I use its principles to
build muscle fast?

Well, natural bodybuilding is a way to build muscle and get a great
body without the use of drugs or substances.

But there are important steps to take so that you get real results
with your training, not just small results.

In this article, let's look at these principles of how to build muscle
naturally.

Natural Bodybuilding Tip Number 1

The safest and healthiest way to build muscle tissue is through using
a bodybuilding workout that actually works.

That is, one that uses sets and supersets in such a way that properly
stimulates muscle and gets a real 'pump' instead of one that does not
do this.

By using a technique and program that stimulates the muscle group
about once every 5-7 days, you'll avoid overtraining.

But the exercises has to be ones that are effective, not too
isolating.

You will see the difference in no time, and begin to feel the great
effects that come from it as well, when you use a bodybuilding workout
routine that works.

Natural Bodybuilding Tip Number 2

Proper nutrition is needed to building muscle and not gaining fat.

Muscle requires more calories and protein to maintain its current
size. A diet rich in protein can help to achieve this.

The carbs? Use low GI carbs.

The oils? Use the helahy ones such as fish oil and olive oil. Olive
oil (use extra virgin as this is where the antioxidants are) as it (a
monounsaturated oil) stimulates natural testosterone production, and
fish oil is good as a natural anti-inflammatory for repair, and to
allow fat loss, amongst all its other benefits such as on the heart.

And proteins: Use lean sources of protein such as fish, chicken,
yoghurt, egg.

Depending on your body type, this may not be a huge increase in
nutrients, but is whatever your body needs to maintain more muscle,
but not so excessive that you start to gain fat.

Natural Bodybuilding Tip Number 3

As an option, you can take some natural supplements such as whey
protein powder, creatine or glutamine, or a combination of these.

With a very good body building plan you won't need to worry too much
about these supplements, they're only a bit of a boost.

The main emphasis here about natural bodybuilding is that you can gain
muscle naturally with naturally occuring nutrients, without the need
for steroids.

Because your gains are based on sound principles of a good workout and
a good diet, then it's sustainable and you get all the benefits.

So there you have it.

These are the solid tips to building muscle the natural way, and to do
it in a sustainable way.

The main thing is to use a workout that works, as this is the basis
for muscle growth, stimulation of metabolism to burn fat, and makes
the whole program work.

------------------------------------------------------------------
Abdu Galama is a personal coach from France. Do you use this 7
strategies to lose fat ? Visit my googlepages for free :
http://diet.cardio.googlepages.com

Jealous old fart, always with the fourteen year-old latinas!!!! I
can't believe how you keep bringing that up like a jealous little kid
brother!

Just face the facts, man: even their moms like me! The one thing
girls can't do is keep a secret -- but I'm still here! And that burns
you up, doesn't it? Burns you up that someone is living the life of a
free man, not constrained by phony Judeo-Christian morality.

JMW, please learn to enjoy life, and live it to the fullest.

JMW said:

Are you referring to the middle school gym classes where you stalk
14-year-old latinas, chomo?