Commuting by bike not cost effective?

[email hidden] wrote in news:1185210053.584439.204400@
57g2000hsv.googlegroups.com:

Quoted message said:

This weekend I biked the 12 miles to work to see if it could be done.
It took around 1 hour and a half, however, I noticed this is really
not going to save me any money. The reason is the cost to replace my
1000 calories burned will be more than the $3 gas it costs me to get
to work.

Very unlikely that you're burning 1000 calories in 1.5 hours at less than
10mph.

Quoted message said:

But someone if just fooling himself if they think they are
saving any money by biking, no?

I save a lot of money by biking to work: my wife and I don't have
to buy a second car, maintain it, insure it, and put gas in it.
There are many reasons that it is convenient for us to have one
car, but a second car would be an unnecessary expense.
--
A bicycle is one of the world's beautiful machines, beautiful machines
are art, and art is civilisation, good living, and balm to the soul.
--Elisa Francesca Roselli

Quoted message said:

This weekend I biked the 12 miles to work to see if it could be done.
It took around 1 hour and a half, however, I noticed this is really
not going to save me any money. The reason is the cost to replace my
1000 calories burned will be more than the $3 gas it costs me to get
to work.

I can see the benefits if you are over-weight and need to lose
weight. But someone if just fooling himself if they think they are
saving any money by biking, no?

First stop thinking about it as the /money/ saved in fuel for your motor
vehicle.
Second I don't think you are going to need to replace those calories
that you do burn. And I don't think it's 1000
Third think of it as an investment in your long term physical health.

Just A User said:

Third think of it as an investment in your long term physical

health.
I agree with this, however, even if I burned just 500 calories, that
is basically 2 sports drinks which typically cost $1.50 each at my
cafetaria..

I just found it somewhat surprising that biking to work really would
not save me any money and that gas is quite cheap for what it does.

Quoted message said:

This weekend I biked the 12 miles to work to see if it could be done.
It took around 1 hour and a half, however, I noticed this is really
not going to save me any money. The reason is the cost to replace my
1000 calories burned will be more than the $3 gas it costs me to get
to work.

I can see the benefits if you are over-weight and need to lose
weight. But someone if just fooling himself if they think they are
saving any money by biking, no?

Not driving a motor vehicle saves you more than just gas $$$, a fact that you
would soon realize if you would have a real go at cycling.

Quoted message said:

Just A User said:

Third think of it as an investment in your long term physical

health.
I agree with this, however, even if I burned just 500 calories, that
is basically 2 sports drinks which typically cost $1.50 each at my
cafetaria..

I just found it somewhat surprising that biking to work really would
not save me any money and that gas is quite cheap for what it does.

Well what I was trying to say, is I don't think you need to refuel your
body right away. And to avoid paying $1.50 from your cafeteria keep
somethings in your locker / desk at work. You can get cheaper fuel for
your body.

In article <[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

This weekend I biked the 12 miles to work to see if it could be done.
It took around 1 hour and a half, however, I noticed this is really
not going to save me any money. The reason is the cost to replace my
1000 calories burned will be more than the $3 gas it costs me to get
to work.

Unless there's something unusual about your bike or your geography, it
seems unlikely that you'd burn 1000 calories on a 12 mile ride.
Especially at that slow of a pace.

The slowest pace I have numbers for is 12mph. At that rate, assuming
you weigh 200 lbs, you'd be burning around 41 calories per mile, or 492
for the 12 mile ride. That's under 1000 calories for the 24-mile round
trip, assuming you boost your speed significantly.

It also seems unlikely that adding the equivalent of a stick of butter,
or a cup of rice, to your daily diet would cost $3.00 unless you buy all
your food at expensive restaurants with small servings.

Also, your car's variable operating expenses include more than fuel,
e.g. tire wear, engine maintenance, oil changes, insurance, etc.

And the financial benefits of cycling include more than the fuel you
save. For most people, regular exercise will mean lower health care
expenditures and less work missed due to illness.

--
[email hidden] is Joshua Putnam
<http://www.phred.org/~josh/>
Updated Infrared Photography Gallery:
<http://www.phred.org/~josh/photo/ir.html>

Quoted message said:

This weekend I biked the 12 miles to work to see if it could be done.
It took around 1 hour and a half, however, I noticed this is really
not going to save me any money. The reason is the cost to replace my
1000 calories burned will be more than the $3 gas it costs me to get
to work.

I can see the benefits if you are over-weight and need to lose
weight. But someone if just fooling himself if they think they are
saving any money by biking, no?

As others have pointed out, there seem to be some problems with your
numbers. First, biking at 8 mph (from your data) doesn't burn that
many calories. Second, you're omitting all but the gas cost from
running your vehicle. The IRS figures more like 40 cents per mile, or
closer to $5 for your one-way trip. Third, it would be silly to
replace those calories by buying expensive stuff. If it's just
calories you want, eat bread & jelly.

But more important, your rationale is really a rationale for never
exercising at all! By your logic, nobody should ever use their
muscles - they should just lay around in front of a TV (or computer!)
and get some sort of power assist any time they needed to move their
body. Aside from the absurdity, the problem with that strategy is
that you'll likely send your medical bills through the roof. Just one
quadruple bypass will eat up any "savings" from your strategy.

So the point is, your body needs exercise. You can get it by jogging
on a treadmill in your basement, or by lifting heavy weights and
putting them down again, over and over... or you can get your
necessary exercise by doing something practical - getting to work.

Furthermore, if you are smart enough to exercise, you save time by
having your bike commute replace your car commute. Time in a car is
totally wasted, and then basement exercise time is wasted. Get your
exercise on the way to work. Save time overall.

Finally, there's a lot to be said for experiencing the world by being
out in it, instead of seeing it through glass.

See http://www.bicyclinglife.com/NewsAndViews/philosophy.htm

- Frank Krygowski

Quoted message said:

This weekend I biked the 12 miles to work to see if it could be done.
It took around 1 hour and a half, however, I noticed this is really
not going to save me any money. The reason is the cost to replace my
1000 calories burned will be more than the $3 gas it costs me to get
to work.

Errr, it costs far more than gas to keep a car on the road. I hope
you're calcuting it at the IRS rate. I think it's $0.45 a mile
currently. Your costs will vary up or down depending on a host of
factors of course.

I save vast amounts of money by biking to work because it means my
family doesn't need a second car. Plus I get exercise that I would not
get otherwise (I have a sedentary job). I would have to get a gym
membership or something similar, and the amount of wasted time would be
large.

Quoted message said:

I can see the benefits if you are over-weight and need to lose
weight. But someone if just fooling himself if they think they are
saving any money by biking, no?

Not really, but it can of course vary case by case. In my case, and
many other people I know, it can save a lot of money. I save even more
because I can do all my bike maintenance myself. Something that cannot
be said (without great expense) of most modern automobiles.

Though, really I ride because I like cycling and I don't like to drive.
Among other reasons.

--
Dane Buson - [email hidden]
In my experience, if you have to keep the lavatory door shut by extending
your left leg, it's modern architecture.
-- Nancy Banks Smith

sally said:

Very unlikely that you're burning 1000 calories in 1.5 hours at

less > than 10mph.

I checked bikely.com and here are some stats:

Total climb: 417ft
Total descent: 702ft

Quoted message said:

I can see the benefits if you are over-weight and need to lose
weight. But someone if just fooling himself if they think they are
saving any money by biking, no?

The actual cost of driving a vehicle is more than just gasoline. You
need to consider maintenance costs as well. The national average is
roughly 50 cents per mile (see, e.g., http://www.piercetransit.org/rideshare/costs.htm).
So your actual cost for driving 24 miles to work and back is closer to
$12/day.

In addition, a cyclist is usually going to burn less than 400 calories
over 12 miles (see http://www.faqs.org/faqs/bicycles-faq/part5/section-12.html).
So your total for the day should be less than 1000 calories. But if
it costs you $3 to replenish the calories, you're still saving $9/
day. And if you're just a little bit frugal, you can do better than
that.

- JR

I live 1.5 miles from work! I am looking to add a second bike to be
able to commute to and from as I will not only save money on gas, wear
and tear and helping with the enviornment, but the time spent on the
bike will aid in, reducing stress and keeping me fit.

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

This weekend I biked the 12 miles to work to see if it could be
done.
It took around 1 hour and a half, however, I noticed this is really
not going to save me any money. The reason is the cost to replace
my
1000 calories burned will be more than the $3 gas it costs me to
get
to work.

I can see the benefits if you are over-weight and need to lose
weight. But someone if just fooling himself if they think they are
saving any money by biking, no?

Well protein or carbohydrate gives about 4 calories per gram, fat
about 9. Dry crusts of bread might be the cost effective way to get
calories.

What % fat is your body? What would you like it to be? (Don't ask
me the same question. I don't even want to think about it. Weight
loss to your ideal weight is not guaranteed.)

There are a few extras to think about. Car tires or bike tires, for
example. If you are to be more than just a fair weather cyclist, you
will need rain gear, cold weather gear, and lights.

If you really want to beak your budget, get a Moulton double pylon
bike. The going price is about 6000GBP now - double that to get
dollars

Gasoline here in Britain is more expensive than it is in the USA. My
local supermarket sells gasoline and Evian water at about the same
price, but you do get free bottles with the water.

Jeremy Parker

Jeremy Parker

Drop your membership at the gym. That will bring your cash flow back into
balance. And you'll save money on the food you won't have to eat to replace
the stationary bike calories.

BTW, you can buy a lot of potatoes for $3.00, if that's how you want to look
at it.

For comparison, here's another silly form of personal economics: going to a
prostitute once in a while is cheaper than going out on dates, and certainly
cheaper than having a wife and family.

Quoted message said:

This weekend I biked the 12 miles to work to see if it could be done.
It took around 1 hour and a half, however, I noticed this is really
not going to save me any money. The reason is the cost to replace my
1000 calories burned will be more than the $3 gas it costs me to get
to work.

I can see the benefits if you are over-weight and need to lose
weight. But someone if just fooling himself if they think they are
saving any money by biking, no?

P. J. O'Rourke noted this in one of his books, when he was talking about
how inefficient pedicabs in Bangladesh or India or some other country
were. The calories in a gallon of gasoline far outnumber the calories in
any amount of food you can buy for the price of a gallon of gasoline.
And exercise depletes vitamins, so you can't simply buy a pound of
butter and suck that down.

------

If you bought a bicycle motor kit and put that on the bicycle, you could
get to work at ~30 mph and it would only cost around six cents for
gasoline (at roughly 200 mpg). -Assuming such motorized bicycles were
legal where you are of course, which they might not be.

{...I am firmly convinced that locales that only allow ELECTRIC
motorized bicycles are locales that most-certainly want the entire
concept to fail. Why don't they require everyone there to use electric
cars as well? because electric cars aren't nearly as practical to use as
petroleum-fueled cars are, and they all know this. And so it goes, with
bicycles as well... they want to keep bicycles as impractical as
possible, to prevent them from taking up valuable road space}
~

In article <[email hidden]>,

Quoted message said:

This weekend I biked the 12 miles to work to see if it could be done.
It took around 1 hour and a half, however, I noticed this is really
not going to save me any money. The reason is the cost to replace my
1000 calories burned will be more than the $3 gas it costs me to get
to work.

I can see the benefits if you are over-weight and need to lose
weight. But someone if just fooling himself if they think they are
saving any money by biking, no?

1. post your route (or a close approximation) on a google map so your
time/distance can be evaluated.

2. Calculate your car cost by using the IRS standard mileage rate (i use
this because it's a convenient metric, and we can be fairly assured that the
gov't is not inflating the cost of vehicle usage)

3. What do you drive, how far do you drive and what is your mileage? Do you
actually measure this or are you just guessing.

4. Who says you need to spend $3 to replace the metabolic hit of a 90
minute/3 mile ride? That doesn't seem credible, unless there's something
special about your ride.

In article <[email hidden]>,

Quoted message said:

sally said:

Very unlikely that you're burning 1000 calories in 1.5 hours at

less > than 10mph.

I checked bikely.com and here are some stats:

Total climb: 417ft
Total descent: 702ft

That's not really very much hills. One could craft such a ride here in the
Fox Valley area, easily, over a 12 mile course, and take a lot less than 90
minutes to travel it.

Also, what kind of bike are you riding? Is it in good shape, tires inflated
properly? MTB with knobbies? Do you do much riding? Are you "in shape"

"max" wrote clip) 4. Who says you need to spend $3 to replace the
metabolic hit of a 90 minute/3 mile ride? (clip)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Good point. If you're comparing two numbers, and they're BOTH wrong,
well....

Just A User said:

Quoted message said:

Just A User said:

Third think of it as an investment in your long term physical

health.
I agree with this, however, even if I burned just 500 calories, that
is basically 2 sports drinks which typically cost $1.50 each at my
cafetaria..

I just found it somewhat surprising that biking to work really would
not save me any money and that gas is quite cheap for what it does.

Well what I was trying to say, is I don't think you need to refuel your
body right away. And to avoid paying $1.50 from your cafeteria keep
somethings in your locker / desk at work. You can get cheaper fuel for
your body.

And better fuel.