Road Cycling · Public discussion

Murraysville biking incident

Email address hidden · 2007-07-12T14:06:35+00:00

http://www.velonews.com/news/fea/7615.0.html Motorists who force confrontation deserve 'special justice' Editor: While the rider bears some responsibility for his reaction to the coward behind the wheel, it's typically the motorist who initiates the ugly confrontation. The "it's all about me safely hiding in my three-ton SUV" attitude is becoming all too endemic in our society. If I were to hold a loaded gun to the head of a motorist who threatens my life with his SUV, my ass is rightfully getting hauled to the pokey. Seems to me the ape who uses his vehicle as a weapon should be treated the same way. Until that happens, the legal system offers little protection for us, and the cowardly motorists who willfully puts our lives at risk deserve whatever special brand of justice comes their way. Fred Baldassare Murrysville, Pennsylvania What this article did not state is that Fred not only gave the driver the finger after the motorist passed him, but confronted the driver two more times and harrassed him till the driver got fed up and threatened to kick his ass. Seems like Baldassare needs to control himself a bit rather than think of "special justice" on motorists.

Started by Email address hidden · 12 July 2007 · Last activity 1 September 2007 · 21 posts · 1,817 views

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Original section: Road Cycling
Published: 12 July 2007
Last activity: 1 September 2007
Original author: Email address hidden
Posts: 21
Discussion status: Public discussion
Total views: 1,817
Views / 30 days: 0

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Original post
Email address hidden
Archived post

12 July 2007, 14:06 UTC #1

http://www.velonews.com/news/fea/7615.0.html
Motorists who force confrontation deserve 'special justice'
Editor: While the rider bears some responsibility for his reaction to
the coward behind the wheel, it's typically the motorist who
initiates
the ugly confrontation. The "it's all about me safely hiding in my
three-ton SUV" attitude is becoming all too endemic in our society.
If I were to hold a loaded gun to the head of a motorist who
threatens
my life with his SUV, my ass is rightfully getting hauled to the
pokey. Seems to me the ape who uses his vehicle as a weapon should be
treated the same way. Until that happens, the legal system offers
little protection for us, and the cowardly motorists who willfully
puts our lives at risk deserve whatever special brand of justice
comes
their way.
Fred Baldassare
Murrysville, Pennsylvania
What this article did not state is that Fred not only gave the driver
the finger after the motorist passed him, but confronted the driver
two more times and harrassed him till the driver got fed up and
threatened to kick his ass. Seems like Baldassare needs to control
himself a bit rather than think of "special justice" on motorists.

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Crescentius Vespasianus
Archived post

9 August 2007, 14:02 UTC #2

Quoted message said:
Quoted message said:
Motorists who force confrontation deserve 'special justice'
Editor: While the rider bears some responsibility for his reaction to
the coward behind the wheel, it's typically the motorist who
initiates
the ugly confrontation. The "it's all about me safely hiding in my
three-ton SUV" attitude is becoming all too endemic in our society.
If I were to hold a loaded gun to the head of a motorist who
threatens
my life with his SUV, my ass is rightfully getting hauled to the
pokey. Seems to me the ape who uses his vehicle as a weapon should be
treated the same way. Until that happens, the legal system offers
little protection for us, and the cowardly motorists who willfully
puts our lives at risk deserve whatever special brand of justice
comes
their way.

--------------------
I've had my share of harrassement, the
latest was a fast food coke cup full of
ice thrown at me (he missed, like they
always do), but nothing compares to the
harressement you get on a kayak in an
area infested with jet skis. They are
drawn to you like a magnet, it's
amazing. So it has nothing to do with
sharing the road, as in the ocean there
is plenty of room for everyone. It's
about, I'm more powerful than you,
because I'm on a heavy jet ski, and
you're simply in a light kayak. It's
some kind of flaw in the human character.

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Email address hidden
Archived post

10 August 2007, 04:51 UTC #3

Quoted post said:
http://www.velonews.com/news/fea/7615.0.html
Motorists who force confrontation deserve 'special justice'
Editor: While the rider bears some responsibility for his reaction to
the coward behind the wheel, it's typically the motorist who
initiates
the ugly confrontation. The "it's all about me safely hiding in my
three-ton SUV" attitude is becoming all too endemic in our society.
If I were to hold a loaded gun to the head of a motorist who
threatens
my life with his SUV, my ass is rightfully getting hauled to the
pokey. Seems to me the ape who uses his vehicle as a weapon should be
treated the same way. Until that happens, the legal system offers
little protection for us, and the cowardly motorists who willfully
puts our lives at risk deserve whatever special brand of justice
comes
their way.
FredBaldassare
Murrysville, Pennsylvania
What this article did not state is thatFrednot only gave the driver
the finger after the motorist passed him, but confronted the driver
two more times and harrassed him till the driver got fed up and
threatened to kick his ass. Seems likeBaldassareneeds to control
himself a bit rather than think of "special justice" on motorists.
Wow, what a total fabrication...but I suppose that's easy to do when
you don't sign your post and hide behind some anonymous name like
[email hidden]
First off, the post by Fred Baldassare (me) was sent to VeloNews in
reply to posts about motorists who intentionally put cyclists at
risk. This post to VeloNews was made at least one year before the
incident Mr. hydratwo refers to, and therefore, had nothing to do with
the incident. What Mr. hydratwo does not tell you is that the
incident he refers to started when some ape tried to run me off the
road with his car. After I gave the ape the finger (Mr. hydratwo got
that part right), I called the police. After tracking him down, the
police interviewed said ape and decided formal charges were warranted,
including reckless endangerment. Although the ape's lawyer attempted
to have the charges dismissed, the district magistrate ruled against
him and decided the charges filed by the police were warranted.
Eventually, (thanks to my compassion), the serious offense of reckless
endangerment was dropped, however, the reckless driving offense and
disorderly conduct charges stuck and said ape paid those fines along
with court costs.
To Mr. Hydratwo, don't you know that it is cowardly and total bad form
to:
1) talk trash about someone and get the story totally wrong. 2) and
then not have the courage to even sign your name...pitiful. - Fred
B.

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Tom Kunich
Archived post

10 August 2007, 13:10 UTC #4

Fred, thanks for putting yourself out to that extent. It's all too common
for the cowards on this group to shoot their mouths off and hide behind
anonymity.

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Tom Kunich
Archived post

10 August 2007, 13:12 UTC #5

"Crescentius Vespasianus" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Quoted message said:

It's about, I'm more powerful than you, because I'm on a heavy jet ski,
and you're simply in a light kayak. It's some kind of flaw in the human
character.
It's pretty amazing how frightened they get when you chase them down and
grab them by the scruff of the neck and shove their face in dogshit. Somehow
it just brings out the "He's such a ruffian" in them.

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Email address hidden
Archived post

12 August 2007, 17:29 UTC #6

Tom Kunich' cyclintom@yahoo. com said:
Fred, thanks for putting yourself out to that extent. It's all too common
for the cowards on this group to shoot their mouths off and hide behind
anonymity.
The article is the article. Don't like it screw you Tom. Seems a
logical thing to ask what is this "special justice" that Fred desires.

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Bill C
Archived post

12 August 2007, 20:29 UTC #7

Quoted post said:
Tom Kunich' cyclintom@yahoo. com said:
Fred, thanks for putting yourself out to that extent. It's all too common
for the cowards on this group to shoot their mouths off and hide behind
anonymity.
The article is the article. Don't like it screw you Tom. Seems a
logical thing to ask what is this "special justice" that Fred desires.
What "special justice"? An automobile is as much a deadly weapon as a
firearm. The criminal use of them should be treated the same, but for
some reason autos get a free pass, which is BS. My weapon of choice to
inflict injury shouldn't matter one damned bit, but it does.
Bill C

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Tom Kunich
Archived post

13 August 2007, 01:34 UTC #8

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Quoted message said:
Tom Kunich' cyclintom@yahoo. com said:
Fred, thanks for putting yourself out to that extent. It's all too common
for the cowards on this group to shoot their mouths off and hide behind
anonymity.
The article is the article. Don't like it screw you Tom. Seems a
logical thing to ask what is this "special justice" that Fred desires.
Here's the bottom line you brave soul - if you threaten a cop with your car
it is called vehicular assault, it's a felony and police officers have the
right to defend themselves with deadly force against the perpetrator.
The "special justice" we're looking for is for police to have as much
concern about the general bicycling public being assaulted by vehicles as
themselves.
If you threaten a person with an motor vehicle you should be locked up.

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Michael Press
Archived post

13 August 2007, 01:50 UTC #9

In article
<[email hidden]>,
Bill C said:
Quoted post said:
Tom Kunich' cyclintom@yahoo. com said:
Fred, thanks for putting yourself out to that extent. It's all too common
for the cowards on this group to shoot their mouths off and hide behind
anonymity.
The article is the article. Don't like it screw you Tom. Seems a
logical thing to ask what is this "special justice" that Fred desires.
What "special justice"? An automobile is as much a deadly weapon as a
firearm. The criminal use of them should be treated the same, but for
some reason autos get a free pass, which is BS. My weapon of choice to
inflict injury shouldn't matter one damned bit, but it does.
When someone is creeping about your property,
try ambushing them with a 4x4.
Yes, this is a cheap shot, but I could not resist.
--
Michael Press

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Bill C
Archived post

13 August 2007, 11:13 UTC #10

Michael Press said:
In article
<[email hidden]>,
Bill C said:
Quoted post said:
On Aug 10, 9:10?am, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com> wrote:
Quoted message said:
Quoted message said:
> Fred, thanks for putting yourself out to that extent. It's all too common
> for the cowards on this group to shoot their mouths off and hide behind
> anonymity.
Quoted message said:
Quoted message said:
The article is the article. Don't like it screw you Tom. Seems a
logical thing to ask what is this "special justice" that Fred desires.
Quoted message said:
What "special justice"? An automobile is as much a deadly weapon as a
firearm. The criminal use of them should be treated the same, but for
some reason autos get a free pass, which is BS. My weapon of choice to
inflict injury shouldn't matter one damned bit, but it does.
When someone is creeping about your property,
try ambushing them with a 4x4.
Yes, this is a cheap shot, but I could not resist.
--
Michael Press
I actually prefer a baseball bat or a chair since the firearms are
seriously locked up, in a safe, unloaded, and would take forever to
get to. With kids in the house, and living in a low crime area that's
my choice and one I'm very comfortable with. Parents whose kids get
their hands on the guns should be prosecuted for every charge possible
IMO especially those stories of preteen kids who get them. Reckless
endangerment of a child would be a great start.
I've actually heard and read of riders carrying on rides. That's
pretty paranoid, unless they're a cop or something. It's not like you
read tons of stories where riders need to, and could reasonably,
defend themselves from a threat of deadly force with a firearm.
I have never seen stats, but I'd guess that better than 95% of the
injuries to cyclist are accidental, absolutely stupid and careless
maybe, but not intentional.
My working theory if I'm harrassed and/or threatened is to get the
hell out of the line of fire, get off the bike, or escape somewhere
the vehicle can't/won't go, and call the copswith a description and
plate number. If the cops do nothing then, go see the Mayor, write to
the newspaper,and general raise hell publicly. Military training, and
common sense both say "reduce the threat" first.
I don't know of any place cyclists are assaulted and injured
intentionally on a regular, frequent basis. The place I've had the
most incidents was when I was living in Orlando. I was crashed on both
of the first two rides there, but both times by tourists who were semi-
lost and distracted.
Bill C

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Email address hidden
Archived post

13 August 2007, 14:55 UTC #11

Bill C said:
I actually prefer a baseball bat or a chair since the firearms are
seriously locked up, in a safe, unloaded, and would take forever to
get to. With kids in the house, and living in a low crime area that's
my choice and one I'm very comfortable with. Parents whose kids get
their hands on the guns should be prosecuted for every charge possible
IMO especially those stories of preteen kids who get them. Reckless
endangerment of a child would be a great start.
Word, word, word.
Quoted message said:
I've actually heard and read of riders carrying on rides. That's
pretty paranoid, unless they're a cop or something.
One policeman I know says "I'm a cop. I can carry. I don't".
Quoted message said:
It's not like you
read tons of stories where riders need to, and could reasonably,
defend themselves from a threat of deadly force with a firearm.
And that's why!
Quoted message said:
I have never seen stats, but I'd guess that better than 95% of the
injuries to cyclist are accidental, absolutely stupid and careless
maybe, but not intentional.
IME, the "intentionals" exist but they mostly just want to get you to
back down.
There's a famous local story of a couple of decades ago where a pretty
severely harrassed rider pulled on the two rednecks in the pickup
truck. They "ran" away, got the local cop, and the bikie went to jail,
lost his gun.
Quoted message said:
My working theory if I'm harrassed and/or threatened is to get the
hell out of the line of fire, get off the bike, or escape somewhere
the vehicle can't/won't go, and call the copswith a description and
plate number.
You're batting 1000 today, Bill.
Quoted message said:
If the cops do nothing then, go see the Mayor, write to
the newspaper,and general raise hell publicly. Military training, and
common sense both say "reduce the threat" first.
Not to mention not engaging with an enemy of unknown capability/
intent...
Before cell phones, I had a couple of incidents where some motoized
[censored] was obviously trying to get me into an inferior position,
alone and unwitnessed. I went to the nearest phone (a really seedy
package liquor store one time, any port in a storm), called, and
waited until the cops came. You bet.
More recently, I've found that asswholes (beings constructed entirely
from rectal tissue) are impressed with cell phones. Especially since
they know their pictures can be taken and recorded. It's a new era in
bikie-driver relations, take advantage of it! --D-y

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Email address hidden
Archived post

14 August 2007, 00:53 UTC #12

Tom Kunich' cyclintom@yahoo. com said:
<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Quoted message said:
Tom Kunich' cyclintom@yahoo. com said:
Fred, thanks for putting yourself out to that extent. It's all too common
for the cowards on this group to shoot their mouths off and hide behind
anonymity.
Quoted message said:
The article is the article. Don't like it screw you Tom. Seems a
logical thing to ask what is this "special justice" that Fred desires.
Here's the bottom line you brave soul - if you threaten a cop with your car
it is called vehicular assault, it's a felony and police officers have the
right to defend themselves with deadly force against the perpetrator.
The "special justice" we're looking for is for police to have as much
concern about the general bicycling public being assaulted by vehicles as
themselves.
If you threaten a person with an motor vehicle you should be locked up.
That's not "special justice" but enforcing existing laws.

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Tom Kunich
Archived post

14 August 2007, 01:24 UTC #13

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Quoted message said:
Tom Kunich' cyclintom@yahoo. com said:
<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Quoted message said:
On Aug 10, 9:10?am, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com> wrote:
> Fred, thanks for putting yourself out to that extent. It's all too
> common
> for the cowards on this group to shoot their mouths off and hide
> behind
> anonymity.
Quoted message said:
The article is the article. Don't like it screw you Tom. Seems a
logical thing to ask what is this "special justice" that Fred desires.
Here's the bottom line you brave soul - if you threaten a cop with your
car
it is called vehicular assault, it's a felony and police officers have
the
right to defend themselves with deadly force against the perpetrator.
The "special justice" we're looking for is for police to have as much
concern about the general bicycling public being assaulted by vehicles as
themselves.
If you threaten a person with an motor vehicle you should be locked up.
That's not "special justice" but enforcing existing laws.
No flocking kidding!

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Email address hidden
Archived post

14 August 2007, 21:27 UTC #14

Tom Kunich' cyclintom@yahoo. com said:
<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Quoted message said:
Tom Kunich' cyclintom@yahoo. com said:
<[email hidden]> wrote in message
Quoted message said:
Quoted message said:
news:[email hidden]...
Quoted message said:
Quoted message said:
> On Aug 10, 9:10?am, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com> wrote:
>> Fred, thanks for putting yourself out to that extent. It's all too
>> common
>> for the cowards on this group to shoot their mouths off and hide
>> behind
>> anonymity.
Quoted message said:
Quoted message said:
> The article is the article. Don't like it screw you Tom. Seems a
> logical thing to ask what is this "special justice" that Fred desires.
Quoted message said:
Quoted message said:
Here's the bottom line you brave soul - if you threaten a cop with your
car
it is called vehicular assault, it's a felony and police officers have
the
right to defend themselves with deadly force against the perpetrator.
Quoted message said:
Quoted message said:
The "special justice" we're looking for is for police to have as much
concern about the general bicycling public being assaulted by vehicles as
themselves.
Quoted message said:
Quoted message said:
If you threaten a person with an motor vehicle you should be locked up.
Quoted message said:
That's not "special justice" but enforcing existing laws.
No flocking kidding!- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
Tom:
Do you take pleasure in being such a flocking [censored]?

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Tom Kunich
Archived post

15 August 2007, 03:13 UTC #15

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Quoted message said:
Tom Kunich' cyclintom@yahoo. com said:
<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Quoted message said:
On Aug 12, 9:34?pm, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com> wrote:
> <[email hidden]> wrote in message
Quoted message said:
>news:[email hidden]...
Quoted message said:
> > On Aug 10, 9:10?am, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com> wrote:
> >> Fred, thanks for putting yourself out to that extent. It's all too
> >> common
> >> for the cowards on this group to shoot their mouths off and hide
> >> behind
> >> anonymity.
Quoted message said:
> > The article is the article. Don't like it screw you Tom. Seems a
> > logical thing to ask what is this "special justice" that Fred
> > desires.
Quoted message said:
> Here's the bottom line you brave soul - if you threaten a cop with
> your
> car
> it is called vehicular assault, it's a felony and police officers have
> the
> right to defend themselves with deadly force against the perpetrator.
Quoted message said:
> The "special justice" we're looking for is for police to have as much
> concern about the general bicycling public being assaulted by vehicles
> as
> themselves.
Quoted message said:
> If you threaten a person with an motor vehicle you should be locked
> up.
Quoted message said:
That's not "special justice" but enforcing existing laws.
No flocking kidding!- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
Tom:
Do you take pleasure in being such a flocking [censored]?
Excuse me but aren't you the stupid jackass who thinks that asking the cops
to enforce THE LAW is "special justice"?

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Email address hidden
Archived post

15 August 2007, 21:52 UTC #16

Tom Kunich' cyclintom@yahoo. com said:
<[email hidden]> wrote in messagenews:[email hidden]...
Quoted message said:
Tom Kunich' cyclintom@yahoo. com said:
<[email hidden]> wrote in message
Quoted message said:
Quoted message said:
news:[email hidden]...
Quoted message said:
Quoted message said:
> On Aug 12, 9:34?pm, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com> wrote:
>> <[email hidden]> wrote in message
Quoted message said:
Quoted message said:
>>news:[email hidden]...
Quoted message said:
Quoted message said:
>> > On Aug 10, 9:10?am, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com> wrote:
>> >> Fred, thanks for putting yourself out to that extent. It's all too
>> >> common
>> >> for the cowards on this group to shoot their mouths off and hide
>> >> behind
>> >> anonymity.
Quoted message said:
Quoted message said:
>> > The article is the article. Don't like it screw you Tom. Seems a
>> > logical thing to ask what is this "special justice" that Fred
>> > desires.
Quoted message said:
Quoted message said:
>> Here's the bottom line you brave soul - if you threaten a cop with
>> your
>> car
>> it is called vehicular assault, it's a felony and police officers have
>> the
>> right to defend themselves with deadly force against the perpetrator.
Quoted message said:
Quoted message said:
>> The "special justice" we're looking for is for police to have as much
>> concern about the general bicycling public being assaulted by vehicles
>> as
>> themselves.
Quoted message said:
Quoted message said:
>> If you threaten a person with an motor vehicle you should be locked
>> up.
Quoted message said:
Quoted message said:
> That's not "special justice" but enforcing existing laws.
Quoted message said:
Quoted message said:
No flocking kidding!- Hide quoted text -
Quoted message said:
Quoted message said:
- Show quoted text -
Quoted message said:
Tom:
Quoted message said:
Do you take pleasure in being such a flocking [censored]?
Excuse me but aren't you the stupid jackass who thinks that asking the cops
to enforce THE LAW is "special justice"?- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
Tom:
If you get your head out of your ass and read the posts you would see
what is Fred's defination of "special justice" above what the current
police would do.
"It's pretty amazing how frightened they get when you chase them down
and
grab them by the scruff of the neck and shove their face in dogshit.
Somehow
it just brings out the "He's such a ruffian" in them."
-Tom Kunich (see earlier post)
So does this mean you suggest shoving their faces in dogshit?

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Tom Kunich
Archived post

15 August 2007, 23:58 UTC #17

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Quoted message said:
On Aug 14, 11:13?pm, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com> wrote:
If you get your head out of your ass and read the posts you would see
what is Fred's defination of "special justice" above what the current
police would do.
"It's pretty amazing how frightened they get when you chase them down
and grab them by the scruff of the neck and shove their face in dogshit.
Somehow it just brings out the "He's such a ruffian" in them."
So does this mean you suggest shoving their faces in dogshit?
Maybe you ought to think before you write. That's about as likely as you
ever showing the slightest good sense.
Bicyclists wouldn't get nearly so angry if the cops did their jobs.
For instance: I came up to a stop light in San Francisco that crossed a big
wide park-like avenue with grass verges and center. There was a cop parked
on the sidewalk and I stopped right next to his window.
Two cyclists came up to the stop light going in the opposite direction.
There was two lanes over there, a right turn only lane and a straight/left
turn lane. The were going straight so they pulled into the center/straight
lane.
A truck driver came up behind them and laid on the horn then screamed, "If
you don't get out of my way I'm going to KILL YOU!!!"
I turned to look at the cop and said, "What are you going to do about that?"
He said, "Nothing," started his car, pulled around the corner and drove off
so that he wouldn't have to witness a murder.
Luckily the dipshit truck driver saw the cop as he drove away and decided
not to murder anyone today.
Next time I hope that's you on a bike on the other side of the street.

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Tom Kunich
Archived post

19 August 2007, 21:01 UTC #18

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Quoted message said:
Tom Kunich' cyclintom@yahoo. com said:

Next time I hope that's you on a bike on the other side of the street.
So you wish me bad luck next time I am biking?
So you believe that story illustrates BAD LUCK? No wonder you can't
understand the slightest thing about all of this.

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Email address hidden
Archived post

20 August 2007, 21:31 UTC #19

Tom Kunich' cyclintom@yahoo. com said:
<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Quoted message said:
On Aug 15, 7:58?pm, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com> wrote:
Quoted message said:
Quoted message said:
Next time I hope that's you on a bike on the other side of the street.
Quoted message said:
So you wish me bad luck next time I am biking?
So you believe that story illustrates BAD LUCK? No wonder you can't
understand the slightest thing about all of this.
Are you really this stupid or do you just not bother to read the posts?

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Tom Kunich
Archived post

21 August 2007, 00:43 UTC #20

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Quoted message said:
Tom Kunich' cyclintom@yahoo. com said:
<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Quoted message said:
On Aug 15, 7:58?pm, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com> wrote:
Quoted message said:
> Next time I hope that's you on a bike on the other side of the street.
Quoted message said:
So you wish me bad luck next time I am biking?
So you believe that story illustrates BAD LUCK? No wonder you can't
understand the slightest thing about all of this.
Are you really this stupid or do you just not bother to read the posts?
If I were you I wouldn't talk about someone else being stupid. Aren't you
the one that thinks that being put in the position of understanding why a
cyclist would be angry at being assaulted by a motorist is a personal
threat?

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