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Time magazine article: Gastric Bypass Lowers Risk of Death

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General fitness, health and nutrition
Published
24 August 2007
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2 September 2007
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Staci
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  1. Great news for the morbidly obese!

    http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1655367,00.html

    Wednesday, Aug. 22, 2007
    Gastric Bypass Lowers Risk of Death
    By Sora Song

    Whether one regards bariatric surgery — last-resort weight-loss operations
    such as gastric bypass and stomach stapling — as an essential treatment for
    obesity or as a failure of the fat person's will, the fact is, it works.
    Studies have shown that after surgery, patients often lose 50% or more of
    their excess weight — and keep it off — and symptoms of obesity-related
    conditions like diabetes, high blood pressure, high cholesterol and sleep
    apnea are improved or eliminated altogether. Now, two new studies in the
    New England Journal of Medicine (NEJM) show another long-term benefit: a
    lower risk of death.

    The larger of the two studies — the largest of its kind — led by
    researchers at the University of Utah School of Medicine, looked
    specifically at gastric bypass surgery, also known as Roux-en-Y gastric
    bypass, which accounts for 80% of all bariatric surgeries in the U.S. The
    operation involves creating a small walnut-size pouch at the top of the
    stomach, which is then stapled off and connected to the small intestine
    lower down than usual; the result is that patients can eat only an ounce of
    food at a time, and the food bypasses most of the stomach and the top part
    of the intestine, limiting the number of calories the body absorbs.

    In the Utah study, researchers compiled data on 15,850 severely obese
    people, half of whom had undergone gastric bypass surgery between 1984 and
    2002, and half who were from the general population and had had no surgical
    intervention for obesity. Overall, researchers found, the surgery patients
    were 40% less likely to die from any cause during a mean 7 years of
    follow-up, compared with the obese controls. What's more, the mortality
    rate attributable to obesity-related disease was 52% lower on the whole in
    the surgery group: after gastric bypass, patients were 92% less likely to
    die from diabetes, 59% less likely to die from coronary artery disease, and
    60% less likely to be killed by cancer.

    Results like these have got some doctors intrigued enough to start thinking
    about bariatric surgery as a treatment for conditions other than obesity
    —especially diabetes. A growing body of research suggests that the surgery
    may reverse the disease, a potential solution that could help some 20
    million American diabetics. Though the current NEJM study did not
    specifically study the impact of bariatric surgery on diabetes, it did
    reveal a 92% reduced risk of death from the disease in surgery patients
    —findings that support what has been emerging in other experiments. "In
    more than 80% of patients who are severely obese and have diabetes and then
    have gastric bypass surgery, the diabetes is cured," says Ted Adams,
    professor of cardiovascular genetics at the University of Utah School of
    Medicine and lead author of the new study. "The interesting thing is that
    the resolution of diabetes happens within a few weeks following surgery,
    long before patients have lost their weight." Like some other researchers
    in the field, Adams believes that the surgery triggers other biological
    mechanisms, separate from weight loss — perhaps an interruption of a
    crucial biochemical pathway or a change in the release of certain hormones
    in the stomach or small intestine — that may have powerful effects on
    diabetes.

    "The gastric-bypass patient is really providing a source of intriguing
    research related to all kinds of disease treatment as well as weight gain
    and weight loss," says Adams.

    The second study, led by researchers at Gothenburg University in Sweden,
    involved 4,047 obese volunteers, 2,010 who underwent some form of bariatric
    surgery and 2,037 who received conventional obesity treatment, including
    lifestyle intervention, behavior modification or no treatment at all. Ten
    years after surgery, researchers report, the bariatric surgery patients had
    lost more weight and had a 24% lower risk of death than the comparison
    group. Though the overall number of subjects in this study is much smaller
    than the first, the results confirm general benefits of bariatric surgery,
    and gastric bypass in particular: after 10 years, bypass patients had
    maintained a 25% weight loss, compared to a 16% loss in patients who had
    stomach stapling, and 14% in those who underwent a banding procedure.

    In both studies, surgery patients had an overall lowered risk of death, but
    an interesting finding in the Utah study shows that these patients were 58%
    more likely to die from other causes, such as suicide and accidents. The
    authors speculate that as people lose weight and become more active, they
    also become more prone to accidents, which may up their risk of death.
    Surgery patients may also have pre-existing psychological problems — a
    history of abuse, perhaps — that can't be resolved by losing weight. "There
    have been some studies reporting that following bariatric surgery, some
    individuals may be more prone to chemical dependency, such as increased
    alcohol use," says Adams. "There's some speculation that certain addictive
    behaviors that are in place before the surgery — with food, for example —
    are transferred to alcohol or another addictive behavior."

    "Hopefully this research will stimulate additional evaluation of what the
    optimal approach is for evaluating candidates for this surgery," says
    Adams. "I think we should never lose track of the importance of individual
    evaluation of benefits and risks."

    Last year, an estimated 177,600 patients underwent bariatric surgery, a
    figure that's likely to grow as Americans get fatter and fatter. Though
    modern surgery techniques have become more sophisticated, less invasive and
    safer than in the past, the bariatric procedure still carries all the risks
    of any other operation. Patients have a .5% to 1% chance of death. The risk
    of gallstones goes up. Sometimes a second surgery is necessary. And all
    patients must be careful to make up for vitamin and mineral deficiencies.
    The surgery isn't for everyone; current guidelines recommend it as a last
    resort, only for the morbidly obese who have a BMI of 40 and higher, or for
    the obese with a BMI of 35 and higher plus a serious weight-related illness
    like diabetes or hypertension.

  2. Staci said:

    Great news for the morbidly obese!

    Quoted message said:

    http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1655367,00.html

    Quoted message said:

    Wednesday, Aug. 22, 2007
    Gastric Bypass Lowers Risk of Death
    By Sora Song

    Quoted message said:

    Whether one regards bariatric surgery - last-resort weight-loss
    operations such as gastric bypass and stomach stapling - as an
    essential treatment for obesity or as a failure of the fat person's
    will, the fact is, it works.

    So does not shovelling so much food into your mouth,
    and that approach has zero risk of complications.

    Quoted message said:

    Studies have shown that after surgery, patients often
    lose 50% or more of their excess weight - and keep it off

    So does not shovelling so much food into your mouth,
    and that approach has zero risk of complications.

    Quoted message said:

    - and symptoms of obesity-related conditions like diabetes,
    high blood pressure, high cholesterol and sleep apnea are
    improved or eliminated altogether. Now, two new studies
    in the New England Journal of Medicine (NEJM) show
    another long-term benefit: a lower risk of death.

    So does not shovelling so much food into your mouth,
    and that approach has zero risk of complications.

    Quoted message said:

    The larger of the two studies - the largest of its kind - led by
    researchers at the University of Utah School of Medicine, looked
    specifically at gastric bypass surgery, also known as Roux-en-Y
    gastric bypass, which accounts for 80% of all bariatric surgeries in
    the U.S. The operation involves creating a small walnut-size pouch
    at the top of the stomach, which is then stapled off and connected
    to the small intestine lower down than usual; the result is that
    patients can eat only an ounce of food at a time, and the food
    bypasses most of the stomach and the top part of the intestine,
    limiting the number of calories the body absorbs.

    Quoted message said:

    In the Utah study, researchers compiled data on 15,850 severely obese
    people, half of whom had undergone gastric bypass surgery between
    1984 and 2002, and half who were from the general population and had
    had no surgical intervention for obesity. Overall, researchers found,
    the surgery patients were 40% less likely to die from any cause
    during a mean 7 years of follow-up, compared with the obese controls.
    What's more, the mortality rate attributable to obesity-related
    disease was 52% lower on the whole in the surgery group: after
    gastric bypass, patients were 92% less likely to die from diabetes,
    59% less likely to die from coronary artery disease, and 60% less
    likely to be killed by cancer.

    Results like these have got some doctors intrigued enough to start
    thinking about bariatric surgery as a treatment for conditions other
    than obesity -especially diabetes. A growing body of research
    suggests that the surgery may reverse the disease, a potential
    solution that could help some 20 million American diabetics. Though
    the current NEJM study did not specifically study the impact of
    bariatric surgery on diabetes, it did reveal a 92% reduced risk of
    death from the disease in surgery patients -findings that support
    what has been emerging in other experiments. "In more than 80% of
    patients who are severely obese and have diabetes and then have
    gastric bypass surgery, the diabetes is cured," says Ted Adams,
    professor of cardiovascular genetics at the University of Utah School
    of Medicine and lead author of the new study. "The interesting thing
    is that the resolution of diabetes happens within a few weeks
    following surgery, long before patients have lost their weight." Like
    some other researchers in the field, Adams believes that the surgery
    triggers other biological mechanisms, separate from weight loss -
    perhaps an interruption of a crucial biochemical pathway or a change
    in the release of certain hormones in the stomach or small intestine
    - that may have powerful effects on diabetes.

    "The gastric-bypass patient is really providing a source of intriguing
    research related to all kinds of disease treatment as well as weight
    gain and weight loss," says Adams.

    The second study, led by researchers at Gothenburg University in
    Sweden, involved 4,047 obese volunteers, 2,010 who underwent some
    form of bariatric surgery and 2,037 who received conventional obesity
    treatment, including lifestyle intervention, behavior modification or
    no treatment at all. Ten years after surgery, researchers report, the
    bariatric surgery patients had lost more weight and had a 24% lower
    risk of death than the comparison group. Though the overall number of
    subjects in this study is much smaller than the first, the results
    confirm general benefits of bariatric surgery, and gastric bypass in
    particular: after 10 years, bypass patients had maintained a 25%
    weight loss, compared to a 16% loss in patients who had stomach
    stapling, and 14% in those who underwent a banding procedure.

    In both studies, surgery patients had an overall lowered risk of
    death, but an interesting finding in the Utah study shows that these
    patients were 58% more likely to die from other causes, such as
    suicide and accidents. The authors speculate that as people lose
    weight and become more active, they also become more prone to
    accidents, which may up their risk of death. Surgery patients may
    also have pre-existing psychological problems - a history of abuse,
    perhaps - that can't be resolved by losing weight. "There have been
    some studies reporting that following bariatric surgery, some
    individuals may be more prone to chemical dependency, such as
    increased alcohol use," says Adams. "There's some speculation that
    certain addictive behaviors that are in place before the surgery -
    with food, for example - are transferred to alcohol or another
    addictive behavior."

    "Hopefully this research will stimulate additional evaluation of what
    the optimal approach is for evaluating candidates for this surgery,"
    says Adams. "I think we should never lose track of the importance of
    individual evaluation of benefits and risks."

    Last year, an estimated 177,600 patients underwent bariatric surgery,
    a figure that's likely to grow as Americans get fatter and fatter.
    Though modern surgery techniques have become more sophisticated, less
    invasive and safer than in the past, the bariatric procedure still
    carries all the risks of any other operation. Patients have a .5% to
    1% chance of death. The risk of gallstones goes up. Sometimes a
    second surgery is necessary. And all patients must be careful to make
    up for vitamin and mineral deficiencies. The surgery isn't for
    everyone; current guidelines recommend it as a last resort, only for
    the morbidly obese who have a BMI of 40 and higher, or for the obese
    with a BMI of 35 and higher plus a serious weight-related illness
    like diabetes or hypertension.

  3. Staci said:

    Great news for the morbidly obese!

    http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1655367,00.html

    Wednesday, Aug. 22, 2007
    Gastric Bypass Lowers Risk of Death
    By Sora Song

    Whether one regards bariatric surgery — last-resort weight-loss
    operations such as gastric bypass and stomach stapling — as an
    essential treatment for obesity or as a failure of the fat person's
    will, the fact is, it works. Studies have shown that after surgery,
    patients often lose 50% or more of their excess weight — and keep it
    off — and symptoms of obesity-related conditions like diabetes, high
    blood pressure, high cholesterol and sleep apnea are improved or
    eliminated altogether. Now, two new studies in the New England
    Journal of Medicine (NEJM) show another long-term benefit: a lower
    risk of death.

    The larger of the two studies — the largest of its kind — led by
    researchers at the University of Utah School of Medicine, looked
    specifically at gastric bypass surgery, also known as Roux-en-Y
    gastric bypass, which accounts for 80% of all bariatric surgeries in
    the U.S. The operation involves creating a small walnut-size pouch at
    the top of the stomach, which is then stapled off and connected to
    the small intestine lower down than usual; the result is that
    patients can eat only an ounce of food at a time, and the food
    bypasses most of the stomach and the top part of the intestine,
    limiting the number of calories the body absorbs.

    In the Utah study, researchers compiled data on 15,850 severely obese
    people, half of whom had undergone gastric bypass surgery between
    1984 and 2002, and half who were from the general population and had
    had no surgical intervention for obesity. Overall, researchers found,
    the surgery patients were 40% less likely to die from any cause
    during a mean 7 years of follow-up, compared with the obese controls.
    What's more, the mortality rate attributable to obesity-related
    disease was 52% lower on the whole in the surgery group: after
    gastric bypass, patients were 92% less likely to die from diabetes,
    59% less likely to die from coronary artery disease, and 60% less
    likely to be killed by cancer.

    Results like these have got some doctors intrigued enough to start
    thinking about bariatric surgery as a treatment for conditions other
    than obesity —especially diabetes. A growing body of research
    suggests that the surgery may reverse the disease, a potential
    solution that could help some 20 million American diabetics. Though
    the current NEJM study did not specifically study the impact of
    bariatric surgery on diabetes, it did reveal a 92% reduced risk of
    death from the disease in surgery patients —findings that support
    what has been emerging in other experiments. "In more than 80% of
    patients who are severely obese and have diabetes and then have
    gastric bypass surgery, the diabetes is cured," says Ted Adams,
    professor of cardiovascular genetics at the University of Utah School
    of Medicine and lead author of the new study. "The interesting thing
    is that the resolution of diabetes happens within a few weeks
    following surgery, long before patients have lost their weight." Like
    some other researchers in the field, Adams believes that the surgery
    triggers other biological mechanisms, separate from weight loss —
    perhaps an interruption of a crucial biochemical pathway or a change
    in the release of certain hormones in the stomach or small intestine
    — that may have powerful effects on diabetes.

    "The gastric-bypass patient is really providing a source of intriguing
    research related to all kinds of disease treatment as well as weight
    gain and weight loss," says Adams.

    The second study, led by researchers at Gothenburg University in
    Sweden, involved 4,047 obese volunteers, 2,010 who underwent some
    form of bariatric surgery and 2,037 who received conventional obesity
    treatment, including lifestyle intervention, behavior modification or
    no treatment at all. Ten years after surgery, researchers report, the
    bariatric surgery patients had lost more weight and had a 24% lower
    risk of death than the comparison group. Though the overall number of
    subjects in this study is much smaller than the first, the results
    confirm general benefits of bariatric surgery, and gastric bypass in
    particular: after 10 years, bypass patients had maintained a 25%
    weight loss, compared to a 16% loss in patients who had stomach
    stapling, and 14% in those who underwent a banding procedure.

    In both studies, surgery patients had an overall lowered risk of
    death, but an interesting finding in the Utah study shows that these
    patients were 58% more likely to die from other causes, such as
    suicide and accidents. The authors speculate that as people lose
    weight and become more active, they also become more prone to
    accidents, which may up their risk of death. Surgery patients may
    also have pre-existing psychological problems — a history of abuse,
    perhaps — that can't be resolved by losing weight. "There have been
    some studies reporting that following bariatric surgery, some
    individuals may be more prone to chemical dependency, such as
    increased alcohol use," says Adams. "There's some speculation that
    certain addictive behaviors that are in place before the surgery —
    with food, for example — are transferred to alcohol or another
    addictive behavior."

    "Hopefully this research will stimulate additional evaluation of what
    the optimal approach is for evaluating candidates for this surgery,"
    says Adams. "I think we should never lose track of the importance of
    individual evaluation of benefits and risks."

    Last year, an estimated 177,600 patients underwent bariatric surgery,
    a figure that's likely to grow as Americans get fatter and fatter.
    Though modern surgery techniques have become more sophisticated, less
    invasive and safer than in the past, the bariatric procedure still
    carries all the risks of any other operation. Patients have a .5% to
    1% chance of death. The risk of gallstones goes up. Sometimes a
    second surgery is necessary. And all patients must be careful to make
    up for vitamin and mineral deficiencies. The surgery isn't for
    everyone; current guidelines recommend it as a last resort, only for
    the morbidly obese who have a BMI of 40 and higher, or for the obese
    with a BMI of 35 and higher plus a serious weight-related illness
    like diabetes or hypertension.

    This study is a lie that was bought and paid for by the healthcare and
    diet industries. Don't mutilate yourself for vanity's sake!

    --

  4. "Rod Speed" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Staci said:

    Great news for the morbidly obese!

    Quoted message said:

    http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1655367,00.html

    I think it's quite depressing. There are too many fat people
    who have died from WLS, and others who had a lower quality of life as
    a result of it. And not all of them keep a great deal of weight off.
    The body adjusts.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    Whether one regards bariatric surgery - last-resort weight-loss
    operations such as gastric bypass and stomach stapling - as an
    essential treatment for obesity or as a failure of the fat


    person's

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    will, the fact is, it works.

    So does not shovelling so much food into your mouth,
    and that approach has zero risk of complications.

    Doesn't work, though, unless you're the type of person who
    typically shovels a lot of food into your mouth. I know you'd like to
    believe that every (or almost every) fat person does so, but it's not
    true.

    Robin

  5. Don't mess with the kishkes.

  6. Robin King <[email hidden]> wrote

    Quoted message said:

    Rod Speed <[email hidden]> wrote

    Quoted message said:

    Staci <[email hidden]> wrote

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    Great news for the morbidly obese!

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1655367,00.html

    Quoted message said:

    I think it's quite depressing. There are too many fat people who have died from WLS,

    Plenty more who have died from morbid obesity.

    Quoted message said:

    and others who had a lower quality of life as a result of it.

    Plenty more who have a lower quality of life from morbid obesity.

    Quoted message said:

    And not all of them keep a great deal of weight off. The body adjusts.

    It cant 'adjust' when the surgery prevents them from shovelling much into their mouths.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    Whether one regards bariatric surgery - last-resort weight-loss
    operations such as gastric bypass and stomach stapling - as an
    essential treatment for obesity or as a failure of the fat person's
    will, the fact is, it works.

    Quoted message said:

    So does not shovelling so much food into your mouth,
    and that approach has zero risk of complications.

    Quoted message said:

    Doesn't work, though, unless you're the type of person
    who typically shovels a lot of food into your mouth.

    Wrong. I dont shovel a lot of food into my mouth and lost 10% of my body
    weight in a month just by eating less, and have maintained that lower body
    weight. In fact it continues to drop, because I dont eat so much.

    Quoted message said:

    I know you'd like to believe that every (or almost every) fat person does so, but it's not true.

    Fraid so, they shovel more into their mouth than they burn, it really is that simple.

  7. Rod Speed said:

    Fraid so, they shovel more into their mouth than they burn, it really
    is that simple.

    I know many people who weigh over 400 pounds who eat 600 to 800
    calories a day.

    --

  8. Real BBW <[email hidden]> wrote

    Quoted message said:

    Rod Speed wrote

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    Fraid so, they shovel more into their mouth than they burn, it really is that simple.

    Quoted message said:

    I know many people who weigh over 400 pounds who eat 600 to 800 calories a day.

    If they arent losing weight, they are STILL shovelling more into their mouths than they burn.

    You dont see any fat people in concentration camps for years except the guards.

    There might just be a reason for that.

  9. Rod Speed said:

    Real BBW <[email hidden]> wrote

    Quoted message said:

    Rod Speed wrote

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    Fraid so, they shovel more into their mouth than they burn, it
    really is that simple.

    Quoted message said:

    I know many people who weigh over 400 pounds who eat 600 to 800
    calories a day.

    If they arent losing weight, they are STILL shovelling more into
    their mouths than they burn.

    You dont see any fat people in concentration camps for years except
    the guards.

    There might just be a reason for that.

    Fat people were gassed as soon as they entered the camp. Nazis were
    fat bashers of the worst kind.

    --

  10. Real BBW <[email hidden]> wrote

    Quoted message said:

    Rod Speed wrote

    Quoted message said:

    Real BBW <[email hidden]> wrote

    Quoted message said:

    Rod Speed wrote

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    > Fraid so, they shovel more into their mouth
    > than they burn, it really is that simple.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    I know many people who weigh over 400 pounds who eat 600 to 800 calories a day.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    If they arent losing weight, they are STILL
    shovelling more into their mouths than they burn.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    You dont see any fat people in concentration camps for years except the guards.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    There might just be a reason for that.

    Quoted message said:

    Fat people were gassed as soon as they entered the camp.

    Wrong.

    Quoted message said:

    Nazis were fat bashers of the worst kind.

    There have been a hell of a lot more concentration camps than just the ones the Nazis setup too.

    Most recently in Yugoslavia.

  11. Quoted message said:

    If they arent losing weight, they are STILL shovelling more into their mouths than they burn.
    You dont see any fat people in concentration camps for years except the guards.
    There might just be a reason for that.

    Should weight loss be so important that people should volunteer for a
    concentration camp style diet in order to lose weight? Are you honestly
    proposing that the fat should only eat a bare minimum until we lose
    weight? Skinny people or more efficient food metabolizors actually eat
    for pleasure, far exceeding the bare caloric minimum. Is that pleasure
    off limits to the fat?

    Orlando

  12. Orlando Enrique Fiol said:
    Quoted message said:

    If they arent losing weight, they are STILL shovelling more into their
    mouths than they burn.
    You dont see any fat people in concentration camps for years except the
    guards.
    There might just be a reason for that.

    Should weight loss be so important that people should volunteer for a
    concentration camp style diet in order to lose weight? Are you honestly
    proposing that the fat should only eat a bare minimum until we lose
    weight? Skinny people or more efficient food metabolizors actually eat
    for pleasure, far exceeding the bare caloric minimum. Is that pleasure
    off limits to the fat?

    If "skinny people or more efficient food metabolizors" were " far exceeding
    the bare caloric minimum", wouldn't they become fat, or do you believe in
    the fat fairy and magic nosegoblins?

  13. (Jose) said:
    Orlando Enrique Fiol said:
    Quoted message said:

    If they arent losing weight, they are STILL shovelling more into their
    mouths than they burn.
    You dont see any fat people in concentration camps for years except the
    guards.
    There might just be a reason for that.

    Quoted message said:

    Should weight loss be so important that people should volunteer for a
    concentration camp style diet in order to lose weight? Are you honestly
    proposing that the fat should only eat a bare minimum until we lose
    weight? Skinny people or more efficient food metabolizors actually eat
    for pleasure, far exceeding the bare caloric minimum. Is that pleasure
    off limits to the fat?

    If "skinny people or more efficient food metabolizors" were " far exceeding
    the bare caloric minimum", wouldn't they become fat, or do you believe in
    the fat fairy and magic nosegoblins?

    Let me explain. Modern Physics has postulated the existence of
    strange "worm holes" that run thru-out the universe and that perform
    amazing feats that provide explanations for otherwise inexplicable
    phenomenon.
    See, there are wormholes everywhere in the hidden realm that
    transmit food calories out of the bodies of some lucky thin people -
    who gorge constantly and joyfully on "whatever they want to eat" - and
    pumps the calories straight into the bodies of doomed fat people who
    are painfully enduring near starvation diets.

  14. Orlando Enrique Fiol <[email hidden]> wrote

    Quoted message said:
    Rod Speed said:

    Real BBW <[email hidden]> wrote

    Quoted message said:

    Rod Speed wrote

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    > Fraid so, they shovel more into their mouth than they burn, it really is that simple.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    I know many people who weigh over 400 pounds who eat 600 to 800 calories a day.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    If they arent losing weight, they are STILL shovelling more into their mouths than they burn.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    You dont see any fat people in concentration camps for years except the guards.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    There might just be a reason for that.

    Quoted message said:

    Should weight loss be so important that people should volunteer
    for a concentration camp style diet in order to lose weight?

    Corse not. Thats the evidence that they are shovelling
    more food into their mouths than they burn.

    Quoted message said:

    Are you honestly proposing that the fat should only eat a bare minimum until we lose weight?

    Nope, that will produce significant medical problems.

    Quoted message said:

    Skinny people or more efficient food metabolizors actually
    eat for pleasure, far exceeding the bare caloric minimum.

    Irrelevant to whether they exceed the amount they BURN.

    Quoted message said:

    Is that pleasure off limits to the fat?

    What is being discussed is the MORBIDLY OBSESE, not the fat.

  15. "Jose" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    If "skinny people or more efficient food metabolizors" were " far


    exceeding

    Quoted message said:

    the bare caloric minimum", wouldn't they become fat, or do you


    believe in

    Quoted message said:

    the fat fairy and magic nosegoblins?

    If those are the only two options, I'd still have to say "no"
    to both. It's not just that a few skinny people can eat like maniacs
    and have trouble gaining. There was a prisoner study many years ago in
    which prisoners tried to gain weight. They stopped exercising and ate
    as much as they could. While most of them did gain, it was not very
    much, and it came off without trying when the study was over.
    You seem to think that most people could gain any amount of
    weight, given an unlimited food supply. Ain't gonna happen. But it
    sure appears that way to people who are struggling to lose a
    significant amount of weight or to keep it off.

    Robin

  16. "Staci" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    Great news for the morbidly obese!

    http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1655367,00.html

    Wednesday, Aug. 22, 2007
    Gastric Bypass Lowers Risk of Death
    By Sora Song

    I find the subject line interesting. It occurs to me that we all have a
    100% risk of death. It's not a risk, it's a certainty, and something none
    of us can do anything to change. If I have a gastric bypass, my risk of
    death is the same as if I don't. Maybe Sora Song is referring to deferring
    the inevitable?

    My grandmother died this morning at the age of 100 years, 9 months, and 18
    days.

    --
    Sherry
    lowcarb.owly.net

  17. UsenetID said:

    My grandmother died this morning at the age of 100 years, 9 months, and 18
    days.

    My condolences on your loss.

    --
    http://www.ornery-geeks.org/consulting/

  18. Real BBW said:


    I know many people who weigh over 400 pounds who eat 600 to 800
    calories a day.

    Mary responds: I'm sympathetic - I do know that there are obese people
    who have gotten there slowly, and not by eating huge amounts daily,
    and I do believe that gastric bypass has a place. My former technician
    at work was a lovely lady who weighed over 400 pounds at age 50 and
    had a bypass - and really, I do think it saved her life. Her health
    was failing, she was miserable, and nothing else was working. It
    really was the option of last resort - the desperate measure to pull
    her back from the brink.

    However, I do NOT believe there are people who weigh 400 pounds who
    eat 600-800 calories daily. It takes more than that just to keep them
    alive - i.e. they need more calories than a normal weight individual
    just to stay alive sitting doing nothing. I know with my technician,
    she went to very great lengths to hide what she ate. I think part of
    it was her huge humiliation around eating and her inability to really
    control it, and a big factor was also denial.

    Mary G.

  19. Quoted message said:

    You seem to think that most people could gain any amount of
    weight, given an unlimited food supply. Ain't gonna happen. But it
    sure appears that way to people who are struggling to lose a
    significant amount of weight or to keep it off.

    Aside from some health issues compelling me to end up with less weight
    placed on my problematic left foot, I've pretty much resolved to ignore
    all social or aesthetic pressure to lose weight. I'm happy with my
    body; I'd just like to be skinner so that my left foot doesn't strain
    under so much weight. In that sense, my goal and motives are quite
    simplistic. I couldn't imagine being a woman and having weight tied
    into a sense of beauty or the ability to "catch a man".

    Orlando

  20. Robin King said:

    "Jose" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    If "skinny people or more efficient food metabolizors" were " far


    exceeding

    Quoted message said:

    the bare caloric minimum", wouldn't they become fat, or do you


    believe in

    Quoted message said:

    the fat fairy and magic nosegoblins?

    If those are the only two options, I'd still have to say "no"
    to both. It's not just that a few skinny people can eat like maniacs
    and have trouble gaining. There was a prisoner study many years ago in
    which prisoners tried to gain weight. They stopped exercising and ate
    as much as they could. While most of them did gain, it was not very
    much, and it came off without trying when the study was over.
    You seem to think that most people could gain any amount of
    weight, given an unlimited food supply. Ain't gonna happen. But it
    sure appears that way to people who are struggling to lose a
    significant amount of weight or to keep it off.

    Robin

    The problem with so called "prisoners study" and all other "thin
    people cannot gain weight" fairy tales is that they overlook the
    strength of normal appetite control. Eating more than ones body wants
    is intensely unpleasant. You simply don't do it and if someone tries
    to force you to you look for ways to hide the fact of the non-eating.
    The unpleasantness from over-eating is at least as strong as hunger -
    that is if you have a "healthy appetite".
    If the weather got colder and peoples daily water intake
    requirements fell by half, what would we say to someone who became
    water-logged who blamed the cold weather for "reducing how much he
    sweat"? I mean, why should it matter how much you sweat (ie- what your
    metabolism is) if you have an appropriate thirst/hunger control
    mechanism?
    No. Fat people are feeding something other than a hunger for
    nutrition.

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