Re. VicRoads bike hazard - an update

Halcyon said:

Spoke to VicRoads again today and the situation is thus: It appears that
there was a disconnect between the planning and construction stage of
the rumble strips at the Avenel/Nagambie rd. rail crossing; in other
words a stuffup, .

.....(snip)...........

Many thanks for those who got involved in this issue as I think VicRoads
got the message from other quarters as well.

Halcyon

sad they stuffed up, good they recognise that and are working on it!

still on their thoughts on the LHS for the access pathway, I think their reasoning on B-Doubles is too accepting , but it does re-inforce what we know about these leviathons of the country roads, (don't get in their way as they will not stop for anything smaller than them).

But its a good outcome just the same... NEXT HAZARD PLEASE

In aus.bicycle on Mon, 1 Oct 2007 22:44:41 +1000

rooman said:

still on their thoughts on the LHS for the access pathway, I think
their reasoning on B-Doubles is too accepting , but it does re-inforce
what we know about these leviathons of the country roads, (don't get in
their way as they will not stop for anything smaller than them).

Neither will trains.....

It's a matter of being a leviathan. They take time to stop, if they
are doing 100 then it's quite a distance before they are down to cycle
speed.

Pull out in front of one expecting car-like stopping, well that's
silly.

Zebee

Zebee Johnstone said:

rooman said:

still on their thoughts on the LHS for the access pathway, I think
their reasoning on B-Doubles is too accepting , but it does re-inforce
what we know about these leviathons of the country roads, (don't get in
their way as they will not stop for anything smaller than them).

Neither will trains.....

It's a matter of being a leviathan. They take time to stop, if they
are doing 100 then it's quite a distance before they are down to cycle
speed.

Pull out in front of one expecting car-like stopping, well that's
silly.

Most of these rumble strips are being put in on secondary country roads, not
on major highways. In Victoria, B-Doubles are still, I think only used on
the main highways. Truck drivers are, in my experience on country roads,
very courteous and willing to give room. There's always the odd yahoo, but
it's generally the regular car driver who shaves too close, overtakes just
before a bridge, crosses double lines etc. The more we can do to slow them
down the better, and emphasising the place of cyclists in the traffic flow
is essential. A smooth strip down the middle of the raised strips, with a
very clear row of bike logos through it, would help to do this

A bit like the bike logos that are being used in some parts of the US and
UK - a bike logo, stencilled n the roads where bikes should ride, wide of
the door zone on urban streets.

--
Cheers
Peter

~~~ ~ _@
~~ ~ _- \,
~~ (*)/ (*)

In aus.bicycle on Tue, 02 Oct 2007 02:00:17 GMT

PeteSig said:

the main highways. Truck drivers are, in my experience on country roads,
very courteous and willing to give room. There's always the odd yahoo, but
it's generally the regular car driver who shaves too close, overtakes just
before a bridge, crosses double lines etc. The more we can do to slow them
down the better, and emphasising the place of cyclists in the traffic flow
is essential. A smooth strip down the middle of the raised strips, with a
very clear row of bike logos through it, would help to do this

Trouble is that a hazard never seen is a hazard ignored.

If you see no cyclists then the cycle logos and such are ignored.
When a cyclist is suddenly there, trouble.

Human nature, can't be changed. People have mental maps of what's
going on, and a task like driving encourages a mental map of "what is
about to happen will be the same as what has happened". A truck in
the way triggers the "oh [censored], a sabretooth!" part of the hindbrain, a
bicycle doesn't.

It isn't until bicycles are common on country roads so that people's
mental maps include them that will change. Chicken and egg.

On the whole, expecting people to do something wildly different to
what they have always done just because you put a bit of white paint
on the ground is silly.

Biggest complaint I hear about bicycles after red light running? "All
that money spent and those lanes, and you never see one". Especially
from motorcyclists wanting to use bicycle lanes in which they don't
see bicycles. Again, chicken and egg. But we better get a nice
visible chicken soon...

Zebee

Zebee Johnstone said:

Trouble is that a hazard never seen is a hazard ignored.

<snip>

Quoted message said:

On the whole, expecting people to do something wildly different to
what they have always done just because you put a bit of white paint
on the ground is silly.

No, but it doesn't matter if there is no cyclist there!

Many years ago, in a different age (the 70s), while touring down the Vic
west coast we encountered trucks. his was when the Portland Alcoa smelter
was being built. Three of us riding in line, keeping left - BIG trucks drove
straight past as if we weren't there. Grrrrr!!

We could hear the trucks coming. My mate Russ (a copper) suddenly twigged
that if one of us wobbled about, the trucks gave heaps of room. From then on
I have always used the strategic wobble to ward off motor vehicles from
doing the 'elbow shave'.

Believe me, if there is a cyclist on the road, and the logo has been used,
the truckies _will know_ what their obligations are. They are professional
drivers.

'I didn't see him' and 'She came out of nowhere' are cop-outs used by
motorists when something much more serious has happened. The charge here
should be manslaughter, or permanent loss of licence and vehicle at the
minimum. Just my 2c.

--
Cheers
Peter

~~~ ~ _@
~~ ~ _- \,
~~ (*)/ (*)

PeteSig said:

Zebee Johnstone said:

Trouble is that a hazard never seen is a hazard ignored.

<snip>

Quoted message said:

On the whole, expecting people to do something wildly different to
what they have always done just because you put a bit of white paint
on the ground is silly.

No, but it doesn't matter if there is no cyclist there!

Many years ago, in a different age (the 70s), while touring down the Vic
west coast we encountered trucks. his was when the Portland Alcoa smelter
was being built. Three of us riding in line, keeping left - BIG trucks drove
straight past as if we weren't there. Grrrrr!!

We could hear the trucks coming. My mate Russ (a copper) suddenly twigged
that if one of us wobbled about, the trucks gave heaps of room. From then on
I have always used the strategic wobble to ward off motor vehicles from
doing the 'elbow shave'.

Believe me, if there is a cyclist on the road, and the logo has been used,
the truckies _will know_ what their obligations are. They are professional
drivers.

'I didn't see him' and 'She came out of nowhere' are cop-outs used by
motorists when something much more serious has happened. The charge here
should be manslaughter, or permanent loss of licence and vehicle at the
minimum. Just my 2c.

They should use advertising similar to this.

http://www.frederiksamuel.com/blog/images/drunk.jpg

Dorfus

PeteSig wrote:
In Victoria, B-Doubles are still, I think only used on

Quoted message said:

the main highways.

Not sure that this is correct Peter. Whether they should or not, they do
use the secondary roads 'cause I see them. Plenty of times I have loaded
grain onto them and all off minor roads.
Halcyon

Halcyon said:

PeteSig wrote:
In Victoria, B-Doubles are still, I think only used on

Quoted message said:

the main highways.

Not sure that this is correct Peter. Whether they should or not, they do
use the secondary roads 'cause I see them. Plenty of times I have loaded
grain onto them and all off minor roads.

What area?
In NSW, a decade or so ago, there was a NWish area that they could
perate in unrestricted. Probably changed.

Might also be regulations covering grain/livestock operations.