OT -- Decline of a noble language: raise your hand if you're innocent

Andre Jute said:

Andre Jute
 "Whenever I watch TV and see those poor starving kids all over the
world, I can't help but cry. I mean I'd love to be skinny like that
but not with all those flies and death and stuff."
 --- Mariah Carey- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

As long as we're being pedantic, you do realise the quotation in your
signature is fictitious, don't you? (See http://www.snopes.com/quotes/carey.asp)

Andre Jute said:

Andre Jute
"Whenever I watch TV and see those poor starving kids all over the
world, I can't help but cry. I mean I'd love to be skinny like that
but not with all those flies and death and stuff."
--- Mariah Carey- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

As long as we're being pedantic, you do realise the quotation in your
signature is fictitious, don't you? (See
http://www.snopes.com/quotes/carey.asp)

No, of course he doesn't. He spread all kinds of filth. It's par for the
course for Jute.

Pat said:

Andre Jute said:

Andre Jute
"Whenever I watch TV and see those poor starving kids all over the
world, I can't help but cry. I mean I'd love to be skinny like that
but not with all those flies and death and stuff."
--- Mariah Carey- Hide quoted text -

Quoted message said:

- Show quoted text -

As long as we're being pedantic, you do realise the quotation in your
signature is fictitious, don't you? (Seehttp://www.snopes.com/quotes/carey..asp)

No, of course he doesn't. He spread all kinds of filth. It's par for the
course for Jute.

"Misquoting" an important cultural figure like Mariah Carey!!! The
HORROR!!!!

Quoted message said:

Andre Jute said:

Andre Jute
"Whenever I watch TV and see those poor starving kids all over the
world, I can't help but cry. I mean I'd love to be skinny like that
but not with all those flies and death and stuff."
--- Mariah Carey- Hide quoted text -

Quoted message said:

- Show quoted text -

As long as we're being pedantic, you do realise the quotation in your
signature is fictitious, don't you? (Seehttp://www.snopes.com/quotes/carey.asp)

Oh dear. You can't trust the newspapers these days. I've jerked that
quote out of my list of sig files. Sorry, Mariah! Thanks for taking
the time to let me know, Rob.

******

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

http://www.conti-tyres.co.uk/conticycle/ti%20contact%20security.shtml
>>> Continental, Germany tells us :Animal paws were the model for
>> designing the tread pattern and it's surface!"

Tom Sherman asks:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>> How many animals have wheels and travel primarily on pavement?

Colin Campbell said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> And how many animals misuse "it's" twice in two sentences? I
> thought the UK had something to do with the English language.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

That language is no longer taught in schools as is apparent from
(lie/lay), (effect/impact), (affect/impact) and other speech
embellishments "overwhelming majority" aka "most" that we see all the
time.
Its the overwhelming majority of these kinds of things that give
wreck.bike a lack of clarity.
aka
Most of these things make wreck.bike unclear.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Actually, its/it's perfectly clear when read aloud.

The apostrophe is helpful and even elegant punctuation on the printed
page, but its/it's utterly inaudible when you read aloud.

The same is true of they're/there/their and too/to/two.

Or John's/Johns bicycle--the apostrophe that signals possession rather
than plurality to the eye cannot be heard.

Similarly, the contraction function of the apostrophe is literally
inaudible. You cannot hear a missin' letter, even though it eventually
signals the pronunciation of can't vs. cannot

(Try to pronounce the period for abbreviation in "vs." above.)

Somehow we manage to hear things without quite so much quibbling. The
errors of grammar and punctuation on RBT scarcely ever cause even the
slightest confusion.

Andre Jute replies to Fogel:
The first victim of the enemies of society is always the meaning of
the language -- Paul Johnson, The Enemies of Society

Andrew Muzi says:

Quoted message said:

Some old fogies (me) are driven to distraction on hearing things like
'orientated'. I, for one, have learned to smile and walk away, no one
being interested in my opinions of language. Languages degrade; get over it.

Andre Jute:
I agree with you, Andrew, people should write better English than
"languages degrade". Languages degrade what? What does languages
degrade? No, I think you mean that someone degrades the language. So
let's rewrite in simple and direct English without the solecisms:

****

Quoted message said:

Some old fogies (me) are driven to distraction on hearing things like

Some old fogies like me are driven to distraction by hearing words
such as

Quoted message said:

'orientated'. I, for one, have learned to smile and walk away, no one

'orientated' [oriented]. I have learned to smile and walk away because
no one

Quoted message said:

being interested in my opinions of language. Languages degrade; get over it.

is interested in my opinion of the language. People degrade languages.
Get over it.
*****

Besides "languages" incestuously degrading themselves, the parenthetic
"(me)" is a lazy affectation, "oriented" is a sample from a larger
whole rather than a metaphor and should take "such as", we can take
your opinion but if you imply more sharing your opinion as in "for
one" you should tell us who they are or Creepy Carl will call you a
liar for the deceit of claiming support you don't specify, "being
interested" is in a limp passive case that should be rewritten and
then allows the much more manly connective "because" before it in the
place of the limp comma, there is no reason for your opinion of the
language to be in the plural, you do not tell us what "languages
degrade" nor do you in fact mean to say that languages degrade
something but the someone degrades language to an extent where
resistance is futile, and it makes the two ideas stronger to split
them into separate short sentences.

*****

There will be no further charge for professional services, Andrew; I
like reading your advice on the newsgroup.

By the way, I have no objection to the way Andrew writes; he seems
pretty literate and comprehensible to me. I'm merely demonstrating
that even some of the best of us are not immune from criticism of the
way we use the language, so we should point out solecisms politely.
Not everyone has English as a mother tongue.

Andre Jute
members.lycos.co.ukTHE%20WRITER'S%20HOUSE.htmlOpen ↗

Andre Jute said:

I agree with you, Andrew, people should write better English than
"languages degrade". Languages degrade what? What does languages
degrade? No, I think you mean that someone degrades the language. So
let's rewrite in simple and direct English without the solecisms:

Degrade is in standard use as an intransitive verb.

Andrew's "Languages degrade" was clear; it's not like anyone would
be left wondering whether cats or Martians were responsible instead
of people. And it wasn't weaselly; it didn't have anything like
the evasive tone of, say, Ronald Reagan's "mistakes were made."

I like Andrew's phrasing; it's economical and pleasant to read.
"People degrade languages" doesn't add anything that wasn't
already obvious.

Tom Ace

Tom Ace said:

Andre Jute <[email hidden]> wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I agree with you, Andrew, people should write better English than
"languages degrade". Languages degrade what? What does languages
degrade? No, I think you mean that someone degrades the language. So
let's rewrite in simple and direct English without the solecisms:

Quoted message said:

Degrade is in standard use as an intransitive verb.

Not as "standard" as the correct word: "deteriorate".

In normal everyday English usage in England, "degrade" is a transitive
verb. As a purported intransitive verb, it sounds American-military and
decidedly non-standard.

JNugent said:

Tom Ace said:

Andre Jute said:

I agree with you, Andrew, people should write better English than
"languages degrade". Languages degrade what? What does languages
degrade? No, I think you mean that someone degrades the language. So
let's rewrite in simple and direct English without the solecisms:

Degrade is in standard use as an intransitive verb.

Not as "standard" as the correct word: "deteriorate".

In normal everyday English usage in England, "degrade" is a transitive
verb. As a purported intransitive verb, it sounds American-military and
decidedly non-standard.

You jumped in while I was still wondering whether it is politically
correct these days to describe a usage as "undesirable American
military jargon replacing perfectly good words offering greater
clarity of meaning".

Andre Jute
Is it only the non-anglophones who now respect the English language?

Andre Jute said:

JNugent said:

Tom Ace said:

Andre Jute <[email hidden]> wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> I agree with you, Andrew, people should write better English than
> "languages degrade". Languages degrade what? What does languages
> degrade? No, I think you mean that someone degrades the language. So
> let's rewrite in simple and direct English without the solecisms:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Degrade is in standard use as an intransitive verb.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Not as "standard" as the correct word: "deteriorate".

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

In normal everyday English usage in England, "degrade" is a transitive
verb. As a purported intransitive verb, it sounds American-military and
decidedly non-standard.

Quoted message said:

You jumped in while I was still wondering whether it is politically
correct these days to describe a usage as "undesirable American
military jargon replacing perfectly good words offering greater
clarity of meaning".

Quoted message said:

Andre Jute
Is it only the non-anglophones who now respect the English language?

You'll find a lot of Anglophones respecting and debating the English
language over on alt.usage.english

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Andre Jute
"Whenever I watch TV and see those poor starving kids all over the
world, I can't help but cry. I mean I'd love to be skinny like that
but not with all those flies and death and stuff."
--- Mariah Carey- Hide quoted text -

Quoted message said:

- Show quoted text -

As long as we're being pedantic, you do realise the quotation in your
signature is fictitious, don't you?
(Seehttp://www.snopes.com/quotes/carey.asp)

No, of course he doesn't. He spread all kinds of filth. It's par for the
course for Jute.

"Misquoting" an important cultural figure like Mariah Carey!!! The
HORROR!!!!

It wasn't a "misquote." It was something worse. It was going out of his way
to denigrate and slur somebody without first checking to see if the thing he
was passing on was factual, true, or otherwise worthwhile. Obviously, he
couldn't take his precious time to think about these things---slurring and
running down an innocent person is more fun than fact-checking! And you?
What's your excuse?

Pat in TX

On Tue, 26 Feb 2008 10:46:40 -0800 (PST), Tom Ace <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Andre Jute said:

I agree with you, Andrew, people should write better English than
"languages degrade". Languages degrade what? What does languages
degrade? No, I think you mean that someone degrades the language. So
let's rewrite in simple and direct English without the solecisms:

Degrade is in standard use as an intransitive verb.

Andrew's "Languages degrade" was clear; it's not like anyone would
be left wondering whether cats or Martians were responsible instead
of people. And it wasn't weaselly; it didn't have anything like
the evasive tone of, say, Ronald Reagan's "mistakes were made."

I like Andrew's phrasing; it's economical and pleasant to read.
"People degrade languages" doesn't add anything that wasn't
already obvious.

Tom Ace

Not the Tom Ace from some single tree town outside of LA?

On Feb 26, 5:23 pm, "Pat" <[email hidden]> whined:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Andre Jute
"Whenever I watch TV and see those poor starving kids all over the
world, I can't help but cry. I mean I'd love to be skinny like that
but not with all those flies and death and stuff."
--- Mariah Carey- Hide quoted text -

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

- Show quoted text -

Quoted message said:

As long as we're being pedantic, you do realise the quotation in your
signature is fictitious, don't you?
(Seehttp://www.snopes.com/quotes/carey.asp)

Quoted message said:

No, of course he doesn't. He spread all kinds of filth. It's par for the
course for Jute.

"Misquoting" an important cultural figure like Mariah Carey!!! The
HORROR!!!!

It wasn't a "misquote."  It was something worse. It was going out of hisway
to denigrate and slur somebody without first checking to see if the thing he
was passing on was factual, true, or otherwise worthwhile. Obviously, he
couldn't take his precious time to think about these things---slurring and
running down an innocent person is more fun than fact-checking!  And you?
What's your excuse?

Sod off, you sanctimonious putz.

PS - enjoy your Mariah Carey CDs

PPS - try a laxative

dgk said:

Not the Tom Ace from some single tree town outside of LA?

Ouch. LA is one of several cities I'm 3+ hours away from,
and I don't characterize my location in terms of any of them.

Tom Ace

Andre Jute said:

Andre Jute replies to Fogel:
The first victim of the enemies of society is always the meaning of
the language -- Paul Johnson, The Enemies of Society

Paul Johnson, the conservative nut-case that he was, wasn't talking
about grammar.

Contextual rubbish:

"When we are dealing with concepts like freedom and equality, it is
essential to use words accurately and in good faith. So the eighth
commandment is: beware of those who seek to win an argument at the
expense of the language. For the fact that they do is proof positive
that their argument is false, and proof presumptive that they know it
is. A man who deliberately inflicts violence on the language will almost
certainly inflict violence on human beings if he acquires the power.
Those who treasure the meaning of words will treasure truth, and those
who bend words to their purposes are very likely in pursuit of
anti-social ones. The correct and honourable use of words is the first
and natural credential of civilized status."

"A NEW DEUTERONOMY" Ten Pillars of our Civilization
by Paul Johnson
from Enemies of Society
1977

Peter Cole said:

Andre Jute said:

Andre Jute replies to Fogel:
The first victim of the enemies of society is always the meaning of
the language -- Paul Johnson, The Enemies of Society

Paul Johnson, the conservative nut-case that he was, wasn't talking
about grammar.

He was talking about weasel words, IIRC. You're the one with a copy of
Mr Johnson's book. You could look it up and let us know.

But Johnson isn't a rightwinger. For a start, he's a Catholic, for
another he was Bertrand Russell's gofer and Russell was one of the
limpest of the lefties. Johnson gradually came to his senses, and it
is the fact that he isn't a dogmatic born conservative that makes him
worth reading. That and his excellent prose, of course.

Quoted message said:

Contextual rubbish:

"When we are dealing with concepts like freedom and equality, it is
essential to use words accurately and in good faith. So the eighth
commandment is: beware of those who seek to win an argument at the
expense of the language. For the fact that they do is proof positive
that their argument is false, and proof presumptive that they know it
is. A man who deliberately inflicts violence on the language will almost
certainly inflict violence on human beings if he acquires the power.
Those who treasure the meaning of words will treasure truth, and those
who bend words to their purposes are very likely in pursuit of
anti-social ones. The correct and honourable use of words is the first
and natural credential of civilized status."

"A NEW DEUTERONOMY" Ten Pillars of our Civilization
by Paul Johnson
from Enemies of Society
1977

Makes perfect sense to me. For those my age who remember the damage
done to an entire country by language-garbling
commiepinkofellowtravelling wreckers in the British unions, and the
French and Italian unions, it is difficult not to agree with Mr
Johnson.

It is significant to understandng his outlook that Mr Johnson is also
a distinguished and insightful historian.

*****

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

http://www.conti-tyres.co.uk/conticycle/ti%20contact%20security.shtml
>>> Continental, Germany tells us :Animal paws were the model for
>> designing the tread pattern and it's surface!"

Tom Sherman asks:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>> How many animals have wheels and travel primarily on pavement?

Colin Campbell said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> And how many animals misuse "it's" twice in two sentences? I
> thought the UK had something to do with the English language.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

That language is no longer taught in schools as is apparent from
(lie/lay), (effect/impact), (affect/impact) and other speech
embellishments "overwhelming majority" aka "most" that we see all the
time.
Its the overwhelming majority of these kinds of things that give
wreck.bike a lack of clarity.
aka
Most of these things make wreck.bike unclear.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Actually, its/it's perfectly clear when read aloud.

The apostrophe is helpful and even elegant punctuation on the printed
page, but its/it's utterly inaudible when you read aloud.

The same is true of they're/there/their and too/to/two.

Or John's/Johns bicycle--the apostrophe that signals possession rather
than plurality to the eye cannot be heard.

Similarly, the contraction function of the apostrophe is literally
inaudible. You cannot hear a missin' letter, even though it eventually
signals the pronunciation of can't vs. cannot

(Try to pronounce the period for abbreviation in "vs." above.)

Somehow we manage to hear things without quite so much quibbling. The
errors of grammar and punctuation on RBT scarcely ever cause even the
slightest confusion.

Andre Jute replies to Fogel:
The first victim of the enemies of society is always the meaning of
the language -- Paul Johnson, The Enemies of Society

Andrew Muzi says:

Quoted message said:

Some old fogies (me) are driven to distraction on hearing things like
'orientated'. I, for one, have learned to smile and walk away, no one
being interested in my opinions of language. Languages degrade; get over it.

Andre Jute:
I agree with you, Andrew, people should write better English than
"languages degrade". Languages degrade what? What does languages
degrade? No, I think you mean that someone degrades the language. So
let's rewrite in simple and direct English without the solecisms:

****

Quoted message said:

Some old fogies (me) are driven to distraction on hearing things like

Some old fogies like me are driven to distraction by hearing words
such as

Quoted message said:

'orientated'. I, for one, have learned to smile and walk away, no one

'orientated' [oriented]. I have learned to smile and walk away because
no one

Quoted message said:

being interested in my opinions of language. Languages degrade; get over it.

is interested in my opinion of the language. People degrade languages.
Get over it.
*****

Besides "languages" incestuously degrading themselves, the parenthetic
"(me)" is a lazy affectation, "oriented" is a sample from a larger
whole rather than a metaphor and should take "such as", we can take
your opinion but if you imply more sharing your opinion as in "for
one" you should tell us who they are or Creepy Carl will call you a
liar for the deceit of claiming support you don't specify, "being
interested" is in a limp passive case that should be rewritten and
then allows the much more manly connective "because" before it in the
place of the limp comma, there is no reason for your opinion of the
language to be in the plural, you do not tell us what "languages
degrade" nor do you in fact mean to say that languages degrade
something but the someone degrades language to an extent where
resistance is futile, and it makes the two ideas stronger to split
them into separate short sentences.

*****

There will be no further charge for professional services, Andrew; I
like reading your advice on the newsgroup.

By the way, I have no objection to the way Andrew writes; he seems
pretty literate and comprehensible to me. I'm merely demonstrating
that even some of the best of us are not immune from criticism of the
way we use the language, so we should point out solecisms politely.
Not everyone has English as a mother tongue.

Andre Jute
Forgive me if I sin, for English is not my first language, not by five
or six

Andre Jute said:

Peter Cole said:

Andre Jute said:

Andre Jute replies to Fogel:
The first victim of the enemies of society is always the meaning of
the language -- Paul Johnson, The Enemies of Society

Paul Johnson, the conservative nut-case that he was, wasn't talking
about grammar.

He was talking about weasel words, IIRC. You're the one with a copy of
Mr Johnson's book. You could look it up and let us know.

I quoted it.

Quoted message said:

But Johnson isn't a rightwinger. For a start, he's a Catholic, for
another he was Bertrand Russell's gofer and Russell was one of the
limpest of the lefties. Johnson gradually came to his senses, and it
is the fact that he isn't a dogmatic born conservative that makes him
worth reading. That and his excellent prose, of course.

"Admired by conservatives in the United States and elsewhere, he is
strongly anti-communist[14]. Johnson has defended Richard Nixon[15] in
the Watergate scandal, finding his cover-up considerably less heinous
than Bill Clinton's perjury, and Oliver North in the Iran-Contra Affair.
In his Spectator column he has defended his friend Jonathan Aitken* and
has expressed admiration for General Franco."

*"Aitken was charged with perjury and perverting the course of justice,
and in 1999 was jailed for 18 months, of which he served seven."

Quite a guy.

Quoted message said:

language-garbling commiepinkofellowtravelling

I'll let that speak for itself.

Quoted message said:

"Misquoting" an important cultural figure like Mariah Carey!!! The
HORROR!!!!

It wasn't a "misquote." It was something worse. It was going out of his
way
to denigrate and slur somebody without first checking to see if the thing
he
was passing on was factual, true, or otherwise worthwhile. Obviously, he
couldn't take his precious time to think about these things---slurring and
running down an innocent person is more fun than fact-checking! And you?
What's your excuse?

Sod off, you sanctimonious putz.

PS - enjoy your Mariah Carey CDs

PPS - try a laxative

Grow up, juvenile.

PS- I don't have Mariah Carey CDs

PPS- once again, grow up.

Pat said:

Quoted message said:

"Misquoting" an important cultural figure like Mariah Carey!!! The
HORROR!!!!

It wasn't a "misquote." It was something worse. It was going out of
his way
to denigrate and slur somebody without first checking to see if the
thing he
was passing on was factual, true, or otherwise worthwhile.
Obviously, he couldn't take his precious time to think about these
things---slurring and running down an innocent person is more fun
than fact-checking! And you? What's your excuse?

Sod off, you sanctimonious putz.

PS - enjoy your Mariah Carey CDs

PPS - try a laxative

Grow up, juvenile.

PS- I don't have Mariah Carey CDs

PPS- once again, grow up.

On my newsreader, you're flaming yourself. (I must have plonked whoever
you're quoting; why not leave an attribution?)

Andre Jute said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>http://www.conti-tyres.co.uk/conticycle/ti%20contact%20security.shtml
>>>> Continental, Germany tells us :Animal paws were the model for
>>> designing the tread pattern and it's surface!"

Tom Sherman asks:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>>> How many animals have wheels and travel primarily on pavement?

Colin Campbell said:

Quoted message said:

>> And how many animals misuse "it's" twice in two sentences?  I
>> thought the UK had something to do with the English language.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> That language is no longer taught in schools as is apparent from
> (lie/lay), (effect/impact), (affect/impact) and other speech
> embellishments "overwhelming majority" aka "most" that we see all the
> time.
> Its the overwhelming majority of these kinds of things that give
> wreck.bike a lack of clarity.
> aka
> Most of these things make wreck.bike unclear.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Actually, its/it's perfectly clear when read aloud.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

The apostrophe is helpful and even elegant punctuation on the printed
page, but its/it's utterly inaudible when you read aloud.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

The same is true of they're/there/their and too/to/two.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Or John's/Johns bicycle--the apostrophe that signals possession rather
than plurality to the eye cannot be heard.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Similarly, the contraction function of the apostrophe is literally
inaudible. You cannot hear a missin' letter, even though it eventually
signals the pronunciation of can't vs. cannot

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

(Try to pronounce the period for abbreviation in "vs." above.)

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Somehow we manage to hear things without quite so much quibbling. The
errors of grammar and punctuation on RBT scarcely ever cause even the
slightest confusion.

Andre Jute replies to Fogel:
The first victim of the enemies of society is always the meaning of
the language -- Paul Johnson, The Enemies of Society

Andrew Muzi says:

Quoted message said:

Some old fogies (me) are driven to distraction on hearing things like
'orientated'. I, for one, have learned to smile and walk away, no one
being interested in my opinions of language. Languages degrade; get overit.

Andre Jute:
I agree with you, Andrew, people should write better English than
"languages degrade". Languages degrade what? What does languages
degrade? No, I think you mean that someone degrades the language. So
let's rewrite in simple and direct English without the solecisms:

****> Some old fogies (me) are driven to distraction on hearing things like

Some old fogies like me are driven to distraction by hearing words
such as

Quoted message said:

'orientated'. I, for one, have learned to smile and walk away, no one

'orientated' [oriented]. I have learned to smile and walk away because
no one

Quoted message said:

being interested in my opinions of language. Languages degrade; get overit.

is interested in my opinion of the language. People degrade languages.
Get over it.
*****

Besides "languages" incestuously degrading themselves, the parenthetic
"(me)" is a lazy affectation, "oriented" is a sample  from a larger
whole rather than a metaphor and should take "such as", we can take
your opinion but if you imply more sharing your opinion as in "for
one" you should tell us who they are or Creepy Carl will call you a
liar for the deceit of claiming support you don't specify, "being
interested" is in a limp passive case that should be rewritten and
then allows the much more manly connective "because" before it in the
place of the limp comma, there is no reason for your opinion of the
language to be in the plural, you do not tell us what "languages
degrade" nor do you in fact mean to say that languages degrade
something but the someone degrades language to an extent where
resistance is futile, and it makes the two ideas stronger to split
them into separate short sentences.

*****

There will be no further charge for professional services, Andrew; I
like reading your advice on the newsgroup.

By the way, I have no objection to the way Andrew writes; he seems
pretty literate and comprehensible to me. I'm merely demonstrating
that even some of the best of us are not immune from criticism of the
way we use the language, so we should point out solecisms politely.
Not everyone has English as a mother tongue.

Andre Jute
 "Whenever I watch TV and see those poor starving kids all over the
world, I can't help but cry. I mean I'd love to be skinny like that
but not with all those flies and death and stuff."
 --- Mariah Carey- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I can haz ur bikzzzz?

Scott Gordo said:

...
I can haz ur bikzzzz?

Methinks Scott has been reading too many posts by "Libby" [1].

[1] alt.mountain-bike centric reference.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
The weather is here, wish you were beautiful