pannier(s) versus backpack

Martin Törnsten said:

Captain's log. On StarDate Thu, 18 Dec 2003 20:55:11 GMT received comm from "kencogl <usenet-
[email hidden]> on channel rec.bicycles.tech ":

: As a new cyclist (using a hybrid, so far for up to 1/2 day recreational rides), I am interested
: in the relative advantages and disadvantages of panniers and backpacks for carrying similarly
: sized loads.
:
: Can someone please advise on what is to be learned from science &/or experience?😕

I addition to all other well explained posts in this thread I would like to offer you a third
option: a classic English type of saddle bad (can take much more load than small traditional
saddle bags, but still not require expensive and heavy bike racks).

I have one from Carradice called SQR Tour, but they have several more models (including wide
traditional ones) and also other manufactures which makes that type of bags (even if I'm only
familiar with Carradice myself).

I'll second this. I've got several saddlebags, the smallest being just big enough for levers and a
patch kit (SciCon brand, and I'm quite happy with that). Those are fine for hard training rides with
my club, etc.

If I'm riding all day, I will use a Baggins Banana Bag

rivendellbicycles.com20082.htmlOpen ↗

which has ample room for my repair kit, some food, etc. If I'm riding all day and want to carry some
stuff, I'll use my Carradice Nelson Longflap (see the Carradice links provided by Martin. I've done
minimalist tours with the Carradice including two weeks in France in which it and my bike were my
only luggage. My newest saddlebag acquisition is easily twice as capacious as the Nelson, and hasn't
yet been put through its paces unfortunately.

rivendellbicycles.com20078.htmlOpen ↗

It's very well made and ridiculously huge. I could carry days worth of groceries for two
people in it!

I find that a saddlebag is really convenient because I don't like to mount racks on my bikes.
They're quick to put on, quick to take off, and tend to be not very noticeable when riding.

Rivendell is a great source of saddlebags, but there are other such as Sheldon Brown's Web site
(www.sheldonbrown.com), Wallingford (www.wallbike.com) and St. John's Street Cycles in the UK.

Bill said:

Another option is to bungee a pack to a seatpost rack. I have one that attaches to the
seatpost and extends back over the back wheel. I've found it ideal for long trips when not
carrying TOO much.

Bungee cords are spoke-grabbers if the load shifts and a cord comes loose. Don't be surprised if
your rear wheel stops suddenly one day. This is most spectacular on a fast downhill.
--
Ron Hardin [email hidden]

On the internet, nobody knows you're a jerk.

kencogl said:

As a new cyclist (using a hybrid, so far for up to 1/2 day recreational rides), I am interested
in the relative advantages and disadvantages of panniers and backpacks for carrying similarly
sized loads.

Can someone please advise on what is to be learned from science &/or experience?😕

I'd say this all depends on where you're going to ride. 1/2 day rides are not very long and you
don't need to bring a whole lot to survive 😉 Offroad I wear a small camelbak with a hydrationsystem
and enough room for some spares and sandwiches. Don't need a big one for daytrips. Commuting I wear
a bigger packpack with enough room for towels and clothes and other necessities. For a longer
roadride I wouldn't wan't anything on my back and I'd try to put it on my bike any way I could.
Usually I can get all I need into the back pockets of my jersey plus a very small saddlebag for
extra tubes and some tools.

--
Perre

You have to be smarter than a robot to reply.

Pete Grey said:

Try throwing 60lb of gear in your backpack and taking a ride around the block:-]

Backpacks work great for commute clothes and other small stuff. For larger loads, do yourself a
favor and get panniers or a trailer (not to start a war here, I use both).

Do you really need 60 lbs of gear for 1/2 day recreational rides as the OP was asking advice about?

--
Perre

You have to be smarter than a robot to reply.

Per Elmsäter said:

Pete Grey said:

Try throwing 60lb of gear in your backpack and taking a ride around the block:-]

Backpacks work great for commute clothes and other small stuff. For larger loads, do yourself a
favor and get panniers or a trailer (not to start a war here, I use both).

Do you really need 60 lbs of gear for 1/2 day recreational rides as the OP was asking
advice about?

I carry groceries home every day; when something's on sale, it's sometimes really a lot of
groceries. The minimum load is a gallon of water and food for tomorrow.

If your bike can't carry that, you won't ever use it for that, let alone use it every day,
recreational or not.

For emergencies I have the Tanjor cargo/pet trailer lodrag.comlodrag.comOpen ↗ like for bringing home
160# of salt for the softener, which I have to remember to do again pretty soon now.

All the market value of my bicycle is in the trailer and the two GPS's on the handlebars for
entertainment.
--
Ron Hardin [email hidden]

On the internet, nobody knows you're a jerk.

"Tim McNamara" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

For many years, chainstays got proportionally longer as frames got bigger, precisely to address
this issue. With the increasing triumph of marketing fantasy over riding reality on the bike
industry, and with cost cutting being all the rage, the well-known geometric relationships of the
bicycle being ignored more and more. This affects the largest and smallest frame sizes the most.
If you look at geometry charts, many manufacturers use the same length chain stays on frames from
54 to 62 cm. A 39 cm chain stay might be fine on a 54 cm frame, but a 62 cm frame should have a 42
cm stay or so (for a "racing" bike).

Many of us tall riders have determined from experience that longer chainstays are very desirable. I
ride nothing but touring frames fro that reason. Leonard Zinn, in his line of frames for tall people
("up to 6'6" -- big whup, I'm 6'10"😉, continues to use fashionably short chainstays, which makes me
conclude he's totally clueless.

kencogl said:

As a new cyclist (using a hybrid, so far for up to 1/2 day recreational rides), I am interested
in the relative advantages and disadvantages of panniers and backpacks for carrying similarly
sized loads.

Can someone please advise on what is to be learned from science &/or experience?😕

If you're going any real distance or carrying any significant load, get panniers. Riding distances
with a loaded backpack is a pain in the ass -- quite literally, if you catch my drift.

--

-John ([email hidden])

Per Elmsäter said:

Do you really need 60 lbs of gear for 1/2 day recreational rides as the OP was asking
advice about?

It depends. Do you have kids?

--

-John ([email hidden])

John Thompson said:

Per Elmsäter said:

Do you really need 60 lbs of gear for 1/2 day recreational rides as the OP was asking
advice about?

It depends. Do you have kids?

OK, you got me 😉

--
Perre

You have to be smarter than a robot to reply.

John Thompson said:

kencogl said:

As a new cyclist (using a hybrid, so far for up to 1/2 day recreational rides), I am interested
in the relative advantages and disadvantages of panniers and backpacks for carrying similarly
sized loads.

Can someone please advise on what is to be learned from science &/or experience?😕

If you're going any real distance or carrying any significant load, get panniers. Riding distances
with a loaded backpack is a pain in the ass -- quite literally, if you catch my drift.

Yes and no. I use a backpack for grocery shopping, etc. However, I rarely have to go very far with a
load, or do it very often. The backpack is comfortable, but sweaty, and makes it harder to spring
out of the saddle to climb hills or accelerate in traffic. If I were carrying large loads regularly,
I'd definately invest in racks and panniers (not to mention a bike on which they can be mounted).
However, in cooler weather I could definately ride with my backpack all day, comfortably, if I had
to. Racks and panniers would definately be a better riding experience, though.

One advantage of a backpack is that it comes with you, so your stuff isn't left on the bike, prone
to theft and vandalism. I can pop my lights off, and throw them in the backpack. I can either stuff
my helmet in there too, or clip it to the outside, so everything's toegther in one neat package. I
know many panniers dismount easily, but they aren't always easy to carry (which IIRC was the
original question). And then you have the racks to worry about -- if you have nice ones, they could
disappear too. An unencumbered MTB that looks like any other is less of a target.

Saddlebags are great, but they can get in the way of your thighs, and they don't mount/dismount as
conveniently.

Matt O.

Quoted message said:

I am interested in the relative advantages and disadvantages of panniers and backpacks for
carrying similarly sized loads.

Rucksacks are best avoided for cycling. When you are hiking the load gets on your shoulders and on
the hips and you can carry quite heavy loads. Cycling it is completely different. As you have a
different body position, leaning more or less forward, the load lands right at your spine. It is OK
with a camelbak, water is soft and follows the body´s contours but any heavier load soon becomes
really painful. The treshhold varies with how the rucksack is constructed, if there is an
intervening layer of water or not etc., but don´t count on being able to carry much more than 4-5 kg
for longer distances.

Panniers or a saddle post mounted rack are preferable. Does not cut into´your spine and you get the
weight lower so it impedes balance less.

Per lowdin.nuMTB.htmlOpen ↗

Quoted message said:

I think this reasoning is faulty. Bicycles are dynamically stable: most work just fine on their
own, as anyone who has "ghost-ridden" a bike can tell you.

Well, yes, and no, the exception is when you have a bar mounted bag. It makes the steering
inherently unstable, twitchy, let go off it for a second, and it will flip around its axle. This
does not apply to "low-riders" that are mounted on the fork legs.

Per lowdin.nuMTB.htmlOpen ↗