Rear wheel noise

nbfman said:

A sqeaking sound has developed on my rear wheel. It goes away for periods of time and is not related to pedaling. Also, it only occurs under load. I thought it might be a noisy spoke. The wheels are Dura Ace 7800 (2007 model, aluminum rims). I read some past threads on spoke noise, and, for some, it was a precursor to spoke breakage.

Is spoke noise the most likely cause? Can it be related to the hub and bearings? How easy is it to lose control when a spoke breaks during a ride? Do most of you check spoke tension fairly regularly, and, if you do, can you recommend tools?

Thanks in advance for any input.

See you are in Japan but I'd first look to see that none of the spokes are pulling thru the rim. If not and the wheel is true, I'd OVH the hub, may be a seal somewhere that is dry.

nbfman said:

A sqeaking sound has developed on my rear wheel. It goes away for periods of time and is not related to pedaling. Also, it only occurs under load. I thought it might be a noisy spoke. The wheels are Dura Ace 7800 (2007 model, aluminum rims). I read some past threads on spoke noise, and, for some, it was a precursor to spoke breakage.

Is spoke noise the most likely cause? Can it be related to the hub and bearings? How easy is it to lose control when a spoke breaks during a ride? Do most of you check spoke tension fairly regularly, and, if you do, can you recommend tools?

In addition to being concerned about a problem with your spokes, you may simply want to check to ensure that your brake caliper is still centered & that the pads are not rubbing against the rim's braking surface.

In that vein, as Peter has suggested, you want to ensure that your (rear) wheel is true and not rubbing.

As far as a broken spoke when riding, the obvious problem is that the wheel will go out-of-true & whether "opening" the calipers will give you enough clearance to continue to ride depends on the wheel ...

On a ROLF Satellite -- 28 (?) paired spokes -- that I changed the spoke on (several years ago), the rim barely deflected when I removed/changed the spoke.

I don't know what will happend if a spoke breaks on your DA wheel ... I doubt you will lose control if you are going in a straight line if-and-when it happens, but I can't anticipate how fast you will be going & I don't know what your bike handling skills are ... however, if you are carving through a turn, then it will probably/(hopefully!?!) only feel the same as rolling off the pavement and onto a soft shoulder, so (again) your bike handling skills (i.e., not panicking) will come into play.

TRY THIS: If you have a hallway, get on your bike and slowly guide your bike along the hallway and see if you hear the noise which has become a concern when you are riding at speed.

BTW. I do NOT check my spoke tension very often, but maybe I should!

I use a PARK TOOL tensiometer because it is the fastest/easiest to use & built like a hockey puck ... and, it has the advantage of being the least expensive one that you can buy.

I also had a WHEELSMITH tensiometer (twice as expensive & some say more accurate), but each one is individually "calibrated" (due to the incalculable imprecision in the application of the "paper" gauge on the edge of each half) & I found it tedious to use by comparison.

Thanks for the tips so far. The noise is not related to brake pads, which was the first thing I checked. It is something more subtle. I think it is time to over haul the hub anyway, so I will give that a try. I'll look for a Park Tools tension gauge, too.

nbfman said:

Thanks for the tips so far. The noise is not related to brake pads, which was the first thing I checked. It is something more subtle. I think it is time to over haul the hub anyway, so I will give that a try. I'll look for a Park Tools tension gauge, too.

Try adding a DROP OF OIL (e.g., 3-in-1/"household" oil OR the lighter sewing machine oil) to each pulley's bearings.

alfeng said:

Try adding a DROP OF OIL (e.g., 3-in-1/"household" oil OR the lighter sewing machine oil) to each pulley's bearings.

By "pulley", do you mean the small wheel with cogs that guides the chain through the rear derailleur? As in the OP, the noise only happens under load (i.e. when I am sitting on the bike) and is not related to pedaling (i.e. not due to cleats/pedal or any parts along the drive train). So, I think it is related to either spokes or hub.

nbfman said:

By "pulley", do you mean the small wheel with cogs that guides the chain through the rear derailleur? As in the OP, the noise only happens under load (i.e. when I am sitting on the bike) and is not related to pedaling (i.e. not due to cleats/pedal or any parts along the drive train). So, I think it is related to either spokes or hub.

Yes, by "pulley" wheels I am referring to the "jockey" (?!?) wheels which guide the chain through the rear derailleur's cage ...

While you are doing THAT, as an alternative to taking them apart, run a piece of notebook paper (or, equivalent weight paper) between the cage & pulley wheels (this is probably more 'important' on a MTB rear derailleur).

BTW. Also, consider checking your seatpost's cradle. Even go so far as to try a different saddle for a short ride to ensure that it isn't the rails on your current saddle ... OR, even a different seatpost if you have one that will fit in your frame.

AND, if you have another rear wheel, try it for a short ride OR put the current rear wheel in a different frame to see if you can replicate the sound.

alfeng said:

While you are doing THAT, as an alternative to taking them apart, run a piece of notebook paper (or, equivalent weight paper) between the cage & pulley wheels (this is probably more 'important' on a MTB rear derailleur).

BTW. Also, consider checking your seatpost's cradle. Even go so far as to try a different saddle for a short ride to ensure that it isn't the rails on your current saddle ... OR, even a different seatpost if you have one that will fit in your frame.

I guess what I was trying to say was that it can not be related to pulleys (or the seat) because it persists when I am not pedaling i.e. I am just coasting with no movement in my legs, no rotation of the cranks or pedals, no movement of the chain, etc. Also, I am familiar with the sounds of creaking in the seat and squeaky pulleys. This noise is different. It has the same period as the rotation cycle of the wheel.

Anyway, I appreciate the suggestions and will tinker around to see what I find.

Lube/overhaul hub, and check the spokes. You don't need a tensiometer to check the spokes. You can manually check for spoke tension by plucking each spoke. The spokes on a given side should have the same tone when plucked. Note that the tone will be different between the DS and the NDS.

alienator said:

You don't need a tensiometer to check the spokes. You can manually check for spoke tension by plucking each spoke. The spokes on a given side should have the same tone when plucked.

Good tip. Thanks.

BTW, I have the Shimano spoke wrenches that came with the wheel. The spokes are bladed, and there is one tool to hold the blade at the right angle and another tool to turn the nipple. I tried it once and felt like I was damaging the bladed part of the spoke. Any tips to doing this "correctly"? I assume it is best to hold the blade as close to the nipple as possible.

nbfman said:

Good tip. Thanks.

BTW, I have the Shimano spoke wrenches that came with the wheel. The spokes are bladed, and there is one tool to hold the blade at the right angle and another tool to turn the nipple. I tried it once and felt like I was damaging the bladed part of the spoke. Any tips to doing this "correctly"? I assume it is best to hold the blade as close to the nipple as possible.

Yup: hold the blade near as possible to the nipple. I dunno what kind of spoke holder Shimano gave you. Some of the ones provided by manufacturers are [censored]. I usually use pliers, needle nose actually, and wrap each side of the jaw with a few wraps of electrical tape or duct tape.

You are turning the nipple the right way, aren't you? Righty tighty lefty loosey.......maybe Shimano put a weak thread lock on.

alienator said:

Some of the ones provided by manufacturers are [censored].

You are turning the nipple the right way, aren't you? Righty tighty lefty loosey

Turning direction is OK. But, the quality of tools included with the wheels is not good. They are machined out of aluminum, and the nipple wrench slipped; so, I have the commercial Shimano nipple wrench, which is made of steel. The blade holder also did not seem very effective, as the slot was too wide. Perhaps it is to leave room for some padding, but I'll try pliers+tape.