Wilier Escape Competition

flh said:

I have this guy in my bloc that has this wilier bike. I would like to buy it and I would like you guys to give me an estimate of how much this bike should go for...

- Wilier Triestina Escape Competition

Unless he give it to me for free... How much is this bike worth??

I'm thinking the original owner paid € 1000 +/- ... [convert to the currency of your choice!]

Is that right?

Do you know if it originally cost more?

Whatever he paid, it's only worth about half the original amount + whatever good will you want to extend.

OK,

$1000 Euros would make around 1500$ CDN. The guy said that he paid 5 years ago near 3500$CDN before taxes. That would make 2333 Euros.

My bet was not more than 300 Euros for it. Remember that somewhere this is a bike that was never used.

F

alfeng said:

I'm thinking the original owner paid € 1000 +/- ... [convert to the currency of your choice!]

Is that right?

Do you know if it originally cost more?

Whatever he paid, it's only worth about half the original amount + whatever good will you want to extend.

flh said:

$1000 Euros would make around 1500$ CDN. The guy said that he paid 5 years ago near 3500$CDN before taxes. That would make 2333 Euros.

My bet was not more than 300 Euros for it. Remember that somewhere this is a bike that was never used.

Okay, my initial thought was actually that the bike could have cost about € 2000 +/- because Wiliers tended to have been priced on the high side (at least, IMO ...) in the past relative to other Italian bikes (... but, my momentary high side projection was still lower than what the guy actually paid ==> $1200US for the frame & fork, $500US for the wheels, $1000US for the other components ... all +/-); but, even having thought that, I would have liked to have seen nicer components than a Veloce group (nothing wrong with Veloce, BTW) if that is truly a $2000 CDN frame-and-fork; so, about € 1000 seemed more reasonable to me for any alloy framed bike with Veloce components without actually knowing how much of a premium the Wilier frameset commanded OR how much additional may have been paid for the some of the fancy-schmancy components like the CF handlebars (since you didn't say what hubs the rims were laced on, etc.).

Regardless, I reckon that you may still have to figure HALF (or, about 1700 CDN +/-) is what YOU might have to expect that he would want ...

The problem for the seller is that in the past 5 years there have been some "improvements" in frame design (some "improvements" may be considered to be of a dubious nature & more to satisfy the market place) + the older style Campagnolo shifters/etc. might not warrant a premium (meaning YOU could discount them slightly on the one hand; but, since they are pre-2007 shifters, they could-or-would warrant a premium on the other hand!!).

The frame is not unimportant; but, since 'I' don't value the frame-itself as much as most people do (that is, IMO, the head tube angle + fork rake + quality of the fork & headset AND the headset adjustment mean more than the caboose that the rider sits on as far as the handling is concerned), I would hope to get the bike for closer to $1100 CDN because I know that I could cobble together a pretty nice riding bike with some reasonably nice components for between $1100 & $1500 CDN.

The fact that the bike was not used actually means that its depreciation would have been akin to a bike sitting in a shop ... so, 45% of retail is about a low as I would hope for the walk-out-the-door price of such a bike; or, in other words, $1575 CDN +/- based on a supposition of $3500 CDN as having been the retail price that was paid for the bike ...

THAT doesn't mean you might not get it for less ... much less!?!

Regardless, $300 CDN just isn't a realistic price ... he could get much more for that by parting out the bike.

I think that you should consider $1100 to be a great price; but, I think that if you really like the bike AND you want it then $1500 CDN wouldn't be too much because you would probably have to pay more than $1500+ CDN for a comparable bike from a shop ...

Have you been a really good friend & neighbor to the seller?!?

Thank you very much for your input. This is very interesting.

Well, here is my perspective.

I have been biking a lot for the last 3 years. In fact I went back to biking for fun and exercising. However, I started to ride with friends and it is now common to ride 80 to 130 Km a week-end. ON MY SPECIALIZED SIRRUS HYBRID.... (Specialized call it a flat-bar road bike).
My friends ride Trek or Marinoni road bikes. And I feel that I used my bike to the extent I could. I usually finish the ride worned out trying to keep up with them.

That being said and obviously going from an Hybrid to a road bike I do not really care about the latest improvement. The only thing I care is :
1) A bike that fits my body.
2) A bike at a good price.
3) Keeping up with my friends without feeling dead at the end of the day.

For example, going from a Shimano Sora to a Campy Veloce , I am sure I will be happy. Going from a cage style to a clipless pedals, I am sure I will have a few weeks to get the habit but be happy. To me if the bike fits my body and the price is right that would be an excellent introductory bike to road biking...

And within 2 years there might be improvment to the bike that I would like or change the bike... I will see then .

However, if the guy asks 1500$, I would probably think adding an extra 500$ and go for a SCOTT CR1 or a Marinoni Sportivo.

Last year, I already made him offers on his bike but he usually denied. I think that it confronts him with the fact that he put so much money into something that he never used. And the bike is still in his locker gathering dust.

BTW, this neighbourgh is a friend of everybody in the building but he is never home. He travel for work.

My final thoughts would be the following:
Between 0$ and 1000$CDN, this is a real fine bike to start with. (Past the 1000$ mark I will go to my LBS.

flh said:

Well, here is my perspective.

I have been biking a lot for the last 3 years. In fact I went back to biking for fun and exercising. However, I started to ride with friends and it is now common to ride 80 to 130 Km a week-end. ON MY SPECIALIZED SIRRUS HYBRID.... (Specialized call it a flat-bar road bike).

My friends ride Trek or Marinoni road bikes. And I feel that I used my bike to the extent I could. I usually finish the ride worned out trying to keep up with them.

That being said and obviously going from an Hybrid to a road bike I do not really care about the latest improvement. The only thing I care is :
1) A bike that fits my body.
2) A bike at a good price.
3) Keeping up with my friends without feeling dead at the end of the day.

For example, going from a Shimano Sora to a Campy Veloce , I am sure I will be happy. Going from a cage style to a clipless pedals, I am sure I will have a few weeks to get the habit but be happy. To me if the bike fits my body and the price is right that would be an excellent introductory bike to road biking...

And within 2 years there might be improvment to the bike that I would like or change the bike... I will see then .

However, if the guy asks 1500$, I would probably think adding an extra 500$ and go for a SCOTT CR1 or a Marinoni Sportivo.

Last year, I already made him offers on his bike but he usually denied. I think that it confronts him with the fact that he put so much money into something that he never used. And the bike is still in his locker gathering dust.

BTW, this neighbourgh is a friend of everybody in the building but he is never home. He travel for work.

My final thoughts would be the following:
Between 0$ and 1000$CDN, this is a real fine bike to start with. (Past the 1000$ mark I will go to my LBS.

One thing about Flat Bar bikes is that your inherently upright riding position is non-aerodynamic & that results in an inefficiency ...

Several years ago, when I tested the difference in speed between the tops-and-drops of a Road bar when coasting on a l-o-n-g false flat I found the difference in speed to be something under 2 mph (I forget what the actual difference was, now ... the altitude was ~6000' in the primary test). I did the same coasting test at a higher altitude on another False Flat, and the result was about the same.

The difference in drag at closer to Sea level may be more ... much more.

So, if you extrapolate, THAT is probably one reason that you feel worn out compared to your friends ...

Because, if you are keeping up with their pace, then you are undoubtedly expending more energy to overcome the aerodynamic drag of the relatively upright riding positon.

Now, some people just aren't comfortable with a drop bar bike ...
[INDENT]Several years ago, I sold one of my bikes to a guy who said that he is at least an inch taller than I am (maybe, he is 2" taller) ... but, I set it up with a stem that was only 8cm long because he said that he felt too stretched out on the bike of another friend who is also about 2" taller than I am. Even with the shorter stem and shorter overall reach, the first time he got on it he asked if he was in a full aerodynamic tuck (he wasn't -- he was almost sitting up straight & I think his hands were on the hoods!).
[/INDENT]For a few hundred dollars (less than $200US if you are a wise shopper on eBay), you can buy a ROAD handlebar + a pair of non-QS, Campagnolo 10-speed shifters + cables/housing & handlebar tape AND you will know if you want to pony up even more for a whole bike. Whatever you buy to upgrade your Hybrid can be moved to another bike in the future.

The 10-speed Campagnolo shifters can be mated to either an 8-speed or 9-speed Shimano drivetrain with zero to minimal effort, respectively ... a good thing!

Regardless, at 1500$CDN (which is probably less than the guy will want), the Wilier with its modest Veloce components is probably a better bike than you would get for 2000$CDN from your LBS ...

That is to say, about the ONLY way a 2000$CDN bike at an LBS would be better is if the bike had Campagnolo Centaur-or-better components on it.

BTW. I presume you have already changed your tyres/tubes to 700-28 from the presumably larger size that came on the bike ...

Pedal type on your Hybrid vs. on a Road bike ... you can change the pedals on your Hybrid at any time. Many bikes do not come with pedals ... of course, many do.

flh said:

OK,
I have this guy in my bloc that has this wilier bike. I would like to buy it and I would like you guys to give me an estimate of how much this bike should go for . . .
The mavic bike computer shows 1.2 KM total.

Unless he give it to me for free... How much is this bike worth??

Francois

Seeing you're Canadian, I'll assume that the group you aspire to keep up with is pretty hard, so I'll keep my comments relevant to the bike in question.

We've been selling a similarly equipped new 2008 Bianchi Via Nirone--Al frame (with carbon seat stays), entry-level carbon fork, Campy Veloce, etc., etc., for about $1400 US. I would expect to pay about $700-850 US for a well maintained used Via Nirone with Veloce.

Veloce is Campy's answer to 105, but it shifts like a knife through butter that's been sitting on the table an hour, and Wilier makes really sweet frames. Since this one is a bit of a rarity and it's in such pristine condition, I think your plan to shop elsewhere if he won't take $1000 CDN is a good one. Well, maybe I'd go just a little higher--it does have pedals and a carbon bar.

For all those who answered this thread many thanks about your own valuation of the bike.

The guy finally gave it to me. 😄😄😄😄😄😄😄😄😄😄😄😄😄
Plus, shoes, pump, bottles, kryptonite lock...

I went on the mountain (Mont-Royal, Montreal) to try it and it is a wonderfull bike.

It is exactly what I thought it would be. I sent it to my LBS to be checked and they say it is like a brand new bike.

Thanks again

F.

Ca c'est une belle velo francois! Love the willier paint job. Have fun climbing mont royal. I know it well. Lived in Montreal for a couple of years.

Feel like telling us what you got everything for? I'm curious.......

CdnRider said:

Ca c'est une belle velo francois! Love the willier paint job. Have fun climbing mont royal. I know it well. Lived in Montreal for a couple of years.

Feel like telling us what you got everything for? I'm curious.......

I am not sure about your question??? What do you mean what I got everything for?

Your last post said that he gave it to you. Does that mean free?? If not....I was just curious as to how mug you got it for.

CdnRider said:

Your last post said that he gave it to you. Does that mean free?? If not....I was just curious as to how mug you got it for.

Free like <freebee> like <given> like <gift> like <I do not have to pay>.

In the past, the guy has given away stuff to other tenent in the building. He bought the bike 4-5 years ago and as you probably read in the thread used it for a few km before he fell and hurt himself.

I tried two things: first encourage him to try to get back on his bike because even at 60 he is still in shape and I considered a shame that such a bike would gather dust. Second I told him that I would buy him back the bike. Probably not at the price he bought it but at a fair price. This was the goal of this tread.

I met him in the hallway of the building the other day and he told me that he would gave it to me.

What was I supposed to say?

Of course a bottle of scotch or a nice bottle of wine will be appreciated. Also, I thought of giving money to any charity that he would support.

F.

Nice work. A gift of some sort would be appropriate.