9 days of herb treatment used for lipid-lowering.

Would you be kind enough to list all of you medications?

Please include all herbs, botanicals, supplements, minerals, and prescription medication.

Thanks, and Happy new year!

--
Patrick Blanchard, M.D. Board Certified in Family Medicine

SonoScore Winning against heart attack and stroke sonoscore.comsonoscore.comOpen ↗

francispoon said:

The following is a piece of empirical evidence about using herbs to lower lipid levels. The doctor
applied such a treatment to me 10 days ago and I went for a check=up today.

The results are as follows: (Dec 31) (reported on Nov 3 at HK Adventist Hospital) ALT 17.4 from 69
TCH 5.27 from 6.58

That's 203.9 mg/dl

Quoted message said:

HDL-C 2.10 from 1.68

That's 81.3 mg/dl

Quoted message said:

LDL-C 2.94 from 4.07

That's 113.8 mg/dl

Quoted message said:

TG 1.13 from 2.36

That's 100.2 mg/dl

Quoted message said:

These levels are quite acceptable by the standards of the medical community in China but the TCH
and LDL are still ranked as being too high by the yardsticks of HK Adventist(TCH:top-5.18;LDL:top-
2.59).

Optimal would be TC less than 200 mg/dl and LDL less than 100 mg/dl

Quoted message said:

During this time period (Nov 3 to Dec 31), I lost about 5 pds and ate carefully by avoiding highly
cholestrated food.

Good for you.

Quoted message said:

Question:

(1)Should I use a low doze of synthetic medication like shatin or lipitor to help further lower
the TCH and LDL?

Depends on how quickly you want to reach an "optimal" lipid profile.

Quoted message said:

(2)Can people on synthetic medication eat anything they please on the assumption that the medicine
will help regulate the lipid levels of the body?

No.

Quoted message said:

Thanks,

FP

You are welcome :-)

Humbly,

Andrew

--
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
Board-certified Cardiologist
http:/www.heartmdphd.com/

"Patrick Blanchard M.D." <pbmd@<nospamwamego>.net> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Would you be kind enough to list all of you medications?

Please include all herbs, botanicals, supplements, minerals, and prescription medication.

Thanks, and Happy new year!

I don't have the names in English. But if you give me any mailing address, I could send you one but
you need a herbalist who understands Chinese to read that. Actually there is nothing strange about
using herbs to clean up junks in the blood vessels. Some herbalist in the US could do that. Quite a
few US multinational drug companies are doing joint ventures in China to manufacture herb pills.

You could resort to diet control on the one hand and herb pills on the other. However, you could not
expect results as fast in herbs as in synthetic medication. On the other hand, there is hardly any
side-effect in herbs.

Rdg.,

FP

"Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

francispoon said:

The following is a piece of empirical evidence about using herbs to lower lipid levels. The
doctor applied such a treatment to me 10 days ago and I went for a check=up today.

The results are as follows: (Dec 31) (reported on Nov 3 at HK Adventist Hospital) ALT 17.4 from
69 TCH 5.27 from 6.58

That's 203.9 mg/dl

Quoted message said:

HDL-C 2.10 from 1.68

That's 81.3 mg/dl

Quoted message said:

LDL-C 2.94 from 4.07

That's 113.8 mg/dl

Quoted message said:

TG 1.13 from 2.36

That's 100.2 mg/dl

Quoted message said:

These levels are quite acceptable by the standards of the medical community in China but the TCH
and LDL are still ranked as being too high by the yardsticks of HK Adventist(TCH:top-5.18;LDL:top-
2.59).

Optimal would be TC less than 200 mg/dl and LDL less than 100 mg/dl

Quoted message said:

During this time period (Nov 3 to Dec 31), I lost about 5 pds and ate carefully by avoiding
highly cholestrated food.

Good for you.

Quoted message said:

Question:

(1)Should I use a low doze of synthetic medication like shatin or lipitor to help further lower
the TCH and LDL?

Depends on how quickly you want to reach an "optimal" lipid profile.

No hurry at all, according to the herbalist, since I will be using this herb tea to do 'weekend in-
house cleaning' any way from time to time. He does not like the idea that people have to take pills
daily for the rest of their life.

FP
================================

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

(2)Can people on synthetic medication eat anything they please on the assumption that the
medicine will help regulate the lipid levels of the body?

No.

Quoted message said:

Thanks,

FP

You are welcome :-)

Humbly,

Andrew

"Patrick Blanchard M.D." <pbmd@<nospamwamego>.net> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Would you be kind enough to list all of you medications?

Please include all herbs, botanicals, supplements, minerals, and prescription medication.

There are some excellent herb pills that are manufactured by multinational companies in China and I
believe you could buy them in the US.

A herb treatment in lowering lipid level is not meant to be a life time commitment. Once your lipid
level is lowered, it is your responsibility to keep eating carefully, as less than 1% of the
population is pre-disposed to high lipid levels, according to this doctor of mine. Then you go back
and re-check your levels in say 3 months time. If the levels are higher than being 'safe', you then
apply some herb pills. Otherwise you just leave them alone.

FP
====================

Quoted message said:

Thanks, and Happy new year!

The latest scientific information and evidence on natural remedies and their uses for
atherosclerosis is very impressive.

Aspirin originally came from willow bark.

I often tell my patients to take willow bark to prevent heart attack and stroke. When I get a really
strange look, I tell them the story of aspirin. We laugh.

Red rice yeast, used in China for many hundreds of years was banned from US by pharmaceutical
industry because it had a "patented" formula in it. Once the patent expired, red rice yeast was
available to US consumers. Red Rice Yeast is derived from a strain of yeast (M purpureus Went) that
is prepared by a traditional rice fermentation process. The yeast has been shown to contain
compounds that posses the same activity as found in the statin drugs, which is responsible for
inhibiting cholesterol synthesis in the liver.

What is the "patented" formula?

Mevacor (lovastatin)

The pharmaceutical industry often discredits the very source of its own success, nature. hmmmm, I
wonder why?

"Modern" medicine may not be so modern after all!

(francispoon) said:

I don't have the names in English. But if you give me any mailing address, I could send you one
but you need a herbalist who understands Chinese to read that. Actually there is nothing strange
about using herbs to clean up junks in the blood vessels. Some herbalist in the US could do
that. Quite a few US multinational drug companies are doing joint ventures in China to
manufacture herb pills.

You could resort to diet control on the one hand and herb pills on the other. However, you could
not expect results as fast in herbs as in synthetic medication. On the other hand, there is hardly
any side-effect in herbs.

--
Patrick Blanchard, M.D. Board Certified in Family Medicine

SonoScore Winning against heart attack and stroke sonoscore.comsonoscore.comOpen ↗

And what about the usual and customary side effects encountered with use of the Statins? Matt

Patrick Blanchard M.D.

Quoted message said:

The latest scientific information and evidence on natural remedies and their uses for
atherosclerosis is very impressive.

Aspirin originally came from willow bark.

I often tell my patients to take willow bark to prevent heart attack and stroke. When I get a
really strange look, I tell them the story of aspirin. We laugh.

Red rice yeast, used in China for many hundreds of years was banned from US by pharmaceutical
industry because it had a "patented" formula in it. Once the patent expired, red rice yeast was
available to US consumers. Red Rice Yeast is derived from a strain of yeast (M purpureus Went)
that is prepared by a traditional rice fermentation process. The yeast has been shown to contain
compounds that posses the same activity as found in the statin drugs, which is responsible for
inhibiting cholesterol synthesis in the liver.

What is the "patented" formula?

Mevacor (lovastatin)

The pharmaceutical industry often discredits the very source of its own success, nature. hmmmm, I
wonder why?

"Modern" medicine may not be so modern after all!

(francispoon) said:

I don't have the names in English. But if you give me any mailing address, I could send you one
but you need a herbalist who understands Chinese to read that. Actually there is nothing strange
about using herbs to clean up junks in the blood vessels. Some herbalist in the US could do
that. Quite a few US multinational drug companies are doing joint ventures in China to
manufacture herb pills.

You could resort to diet control on the one hand and herb pills on the other. However, you could
not expect results as fast in herbs as in synthetic medication. On the other hand, there is hardly
any side-effect in herbs.

Quoted message said:

And what about the usual and customary side effects encountered with use of the Statins? Matt

Red yeast rice side effect profile is generally the same as statins. Some experts believe that RYR
may offer similar benefits as prescription statins, with fewer adverse effects. However, long-term
studies are lacking.

Many of my patients complain of the muscle aches while taking RYR, as do those who take prescription
statins. RYR also depletes Co-Q10 from the liver, as do statins. Co-Q10 supplementation while taking
RYR or prescription statins can help decrease muscle aches and promotes better exercise tolerance.
Here is a good discussion: tinyurl.com2cp36Open ↗

I have heard that more than one pharmaceutical company in the US is trying to patent a combination
pill with statin/co-q10. Although the companies recognize statins deplete Co-q10, there is not a
push for supplementation with it.

As to anectdotal evidence and some impressive scientific studies on the side effects and dangers of
statins, I defer to those in smc better qualified than I to discuss them.

I can say that I tend to encourage lovastatin in prescription form for individuals identified with
worrisome levels of atherosclerosis until regression of atherosclerosis is seen. There are well
known immediate vascular benefits from statins that occur within a few weeks of therapy that, for
some patients, can be lifesaving (such as in acute coronary syndrome - usually caused by vulnerable
plaques that are misbehaving).

If an individual has shown regression of atherolsclerosis after 6 months to a year, then I work with
them to make a transition to natural remedies such as RYR, policosanols and plant sterols if they
are wanting to do so.

Of course, don't forget to take your willow bark, or synthetic derivitive of it. 😉

--
Patrick Blanchard, M.D. Board Certified in Family Medicine

SonoScore Winning against heart attack and stroke sonoscore.comsonoscore.comOpen ↗

Why would you use non-standardized herbs etc., when the use of the common statin is so very
available and you know what you are getting. Matt

Patrick Blanchard M.D.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

And what about the usual and customary side effects encountered with use of the Statins? Matt

Red yeast rice side effect profile is generally the same as statins. Some experts believe that RYR
may offer similar benefits as prescription statins, with fewer adverse effects. However, long-term
studies are lacking.

Many of my patients complain of the muscle aches while taking RYR, as do those who take
prescription statins. RYR also depletes Co-Q10 from the liver, as do statins. Co-Q10
supplementation while taking RYR or prescription statins can help decrease muscle aches and
promotes better exercise tolerance. Here is a good discussion: tinyurl.com2cp36Open ↗

I have heard that more than one pharmaceutical company in the US is trying to patent a combination
pill with statin/co-q10. Although the companies recognize statins deplete Co-q10, there is not a
push for supplementation with it.

As to anectdotal evidence and some impressive scientific studies on the side effects and dangers
of statins, I defer to those in smc better qualified than I to discuss them.

I can say that I tend to encourage lovastatin in prescription form for individuals identified with
worrisome levels of atherosclerosis until regression of atherosclerosis is seen. There are well
known immediate vascular benefits from statins that occur within a few weeks of therapy that, for
some patients, can be lifesaving (such as in acute coronary syndrome - usually caused by
vulnerable plaques that are misbehaving).

If an individual has shown regression of atherolsclerosis after 6 months to a year, then I work
with them to make a transition to natural remedies such as RYR, policosanols and plant sterols if
they are wanting to do so.

Of course, don't forget to take your willow bark, or synthetic derivitive of it. 😉

I suppose it depends on what "standardization" level someone is comfortable with.

Lipitor has had some problems with fakery...

(AP) Federal investigators discovered more than 30,000 additional bottles of fake Lipitor, a top-
selling anti-cholesterol pill, as they worked Tuesday to crack a huge case of medical
counterfeiting.

cbsnews.commain556851.shtmlOpen ↗

Is this one isolated case, or is medical counterfeiting more common than we think?

ama-assn.org1944 6269.htmlOpen ↗

FDA points to unprecedented success during the past three years in collecting record-breaking
penalties from medical product manufacturers, including

* TAP Pharmaceuticals ($879 million settlement for violations of PDMA)

* Schering Plough ($500 million for failure to comply with good manufacturing practices)

* AstraZeneca ($355 million for healthcare fraud)

* Guidant ($92.4 million for failure to report medical-device malfunctions)

* Aventis ($33 million for submitting false information to FDA)

* Wyeth Ayerst ($30 million for good manufacturing practices noncompliance).

tinyurl.com393s5Open ↗

Is regulation the answer?

As to cost, I have some patients who simply must choose between medication or groceries. Supplements
are affordable.

I believe that as long as someone who is taking supplements is evaluated properly, that the safety
margin is quite good.

--
Patrick Blanchard, M.D. Board Certified in Family Medicine

SonoScore Winning against heart attack and stroke sonoscore.comsonoscore.comOpen ↗

FYI, I asked a pharmacist about this subject and this is what was sent back to me..

This is from a newspaper in New Jersey. You might need to fill in a couple of blanks for access, but
it is a good article. It is about the recent Lipitor scam.

nj.comindex.ssfOpen ↗

This one is about Neupogen and some other expensive meds counterfited back in 2001.

essentialdrugs.orgmsg00035.phpOpen ↗

I think that there is a BIG incentive to counterfit brand name drugs because of the high dollar
amounts that are involved. Generic drugs are much less of a target because of the small wholesale
prices involved.

As far as manufacturing processes for generic drugs, they need to demonstrate that their version has
the same rate of absorbtion, rate of elimination, and same AUC as the original drug.

The FDA only requires manufacturers (Brand or Generic companies) to make their pills/liquids/etc.
contain within 10% of the labeled amount. ie -if Synthroid is labeled to have 100mcg per tablet, it
gets the FDA OK if the tests show that the pills contain anywhere from 90 to 110mcg!

They say that most drug companies run on tighter specs that that (we hope!)

I found also that brandname firms are linked to an estimated 50% of generic drug production, which
may help aleviate some people's concerns about generic drugs.

[email hidden] wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Why would you use non-standardized herbs etc., when the use of the common statin is so very
available and you know what you are getting.

The draw-back with herbs is this: you have to take them a few times a day, which is awefully
troublesome, while in the case of synthetic medication such as Lipitor you take it only once a day.
The good thing with herbs is you rarely get bad side effects but then again i am referring to herb
tea, not necessarily herbs pills. One never knows what is in herb pills, perhaps a lot of heavy
metals, but you could be rest for sure that you see nothing but herbs in the tea you drink.
Prescribing herb tea is a science and an art. The herbalist has to diagnose you first before
prescribing ...

FP
==============================

Quoted message said:

Matt

Patrick Blanchard M.D.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

And what about the usual and customary side effects encountered with use of the Statins? Matt

Red yeast rice side effect profile is generally the same as statins. Some experts believe that
RYR may offer similar benefits as prescription statins, with fewer adverse effects. However, long-
term studies are lacking.

Many of my patients complain of the muscle aches while taking RYR, as do those who take
prescription statins. RYR also depletes Co-Q10 from the liver, as do statins. Co-Q10
supplementation while taking RYR or prescription statins can help decrease muscle aches and
promotes better exercise tolerance. Here is a good discussion: tinyurl.com2cp36Open ↗

I have heard that more than one pharmaceutical company in the US is trying to patent a
combination pill with statin/co-q10. Although the companies recognize statins deplete Co-q10,
there is not a push for supplementation with it.

As to anectdotal evidence and some impressive scientific studies on the side effects and dangers
of statins, I defer to those in smc better qualified than I to discuss them.

I can say that I tend to encourage lovastatin in prescription form for individuals identified
with worrisome levels of atherosclerosis until regression of atherosclerosis is seen. There are
well known immediate vascular benefits from statins that occur within a few weeks of therapy
that, for some patients, can be lifesaving (such as in acute coronary syndrome - usually caused
by vulnerable plaques that are misbehaving).

If an individual has shown regression of atherolsclerosis after 6 months to a year, then I work
with them to make a transition to natural remedies such as RYR, policosanols and plant sterols
if they are wanting to do so.

Of course, don't forget to take your willow bark, or synthetic derivitive of it. 😉

francispoon said:

[email hidden] wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Why would you use non-standardized herbs etc., when the use of the common statin is so very
available and you know what you are getting.

The draw-back with herbs is this: you have to take them a few times a day, which is awefully
troublesome, while in the case of synthetic medication such as Lipitor you take it only once a
day. The good thing with herbs is you rarely get bad side effects but then again i am referring to
herb tea, not necessarily herbs pills. One never knows what is in herb pills, perhaps a lot of
heavy metals, but you could be rest for sure that you see nothing but herbs in the tea you drink.
Prescribing herb tea is a science and an art. The herbalist has to diagnose you first before
prescribing ...

FP

Does the herbalist examine you before the diagnosing and prescribing?

Humbly,

Andrew

--
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
Board-Certified Cardiologist
heartmdphd.comheartmdphd.comOpen ↗