funny thing I saw

Quoted message said:

Ok, it was a cold and frosty winter morning, so here he was, *steaming* at the bus stop. It looked
like he was completely enveloped in his self-generated mist. I never saw anything so funny in my
life. If you didn't know better, you'd think he was on fire or something. I couldn't stop laughing!

i have steam coming off my head in some weather. it is rather amusing.

[email hidden] (Claire Petersky) spake thusly on or about Fri, 14 Feb 2003 19:14:29 UTC

-> Ok, it was a cold and frosty winter morning, so here he -> was, *steaming* at the bus stop. It
looked like he was completely -> enveloped in his self-generated mist. I never saw anything so funny
in -> my life. If you didn't know better, you'd think he was on fire or -> something. I couldn't
stop laughing! ->

ok Claire never go anywhere without some kind of camera.

--
I hurt before the ride so fibro gives me a head start on the rest of the pack. silver lining?
[email hidden]

Claire Petersky said:

The other day I was riding with my husband to work. He needed to be in by a particular time for a
meeting he had, and we were already late, so the plan was to hammer like hell, and make a certain
bus at a freeway flyer stop so he could get in on time.

So we ride as hard as could, and we made to the stop with some time to spare. Now, my husband is a
total sweatbox, just drips even after a short light ride, so you can imagine what he was like when
we got to the bus stop. He stripped to the waist, so all he had on top was the straps of his bib
shorts (he still had on his tights etc. on the bottom half). Ok, it was a cold and frosty winter
morning, so here he was, *steaming* at the bus stop. It looked like he was completely enveloped in
his self-generated mist. I never saw anything so funny in my life. If you didn't know better,
you'd think he was on fire or something. I couldn't stop laughing!

Sort of like this:
<http://www.masters-of-photography.com/images/full/stieglitz/stieglitz_terminal.jpg> which you may
remember as one of the most famous photographic images of all time...

Claire Petersky said:

The other day I was riding with my husband to work. He needed to be in by a particular time for a
meeting he had, and we were already late, so the plan was to hammer like hell, and make a certain
bus at a freeway flyer stop so he could get in on time.

So we ride as hard as could, and we made to the stop with some time to spare. Now, my husband is a
total sweatbox, just drips even after a short light ride, so you can imagine what he was like when
we got to the bus stop. He stripped to the waist, so all he had on top was the straps of his bib
shorts (he still had on his tights etc. on the bottom half). Ok, it was a cold and frosty winter
morning, so here he was, *steaming* at the bus stop. It looked like he was completely enveloped in
his self-generated mist. I never saw anything so funny in my life. If you didn't know better,
you'd think he was on fire or something. I couldn't stop laughing!

Some years ago, I took my boots off while hiking. The first was steaming just like you described, so
I got the camera out before taking off the second. We were heating up that trail!

Pat
--
Apologies to those easily confused. Address is spam-resistant. Correct email address like pdlamb
'round-about comcast point net.

Steve Palincsar said:

Sort of like this:
<http://www.masters-of-photography.com/images/full/stieglitz/stieglitz_terminal.jpg> which you may
remember as one of the most famous photographic images of all time...

Claire's husband pulls a NYC trolley? Impressive.

Seriousl, though, thanks for that link.

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] (Luigi de

Guzman) said:

Quoted message said:

Ok, it was a cold and frosty winter morning, so here he was, *steaming* at the bus stop. It
looked like he was completely enveloped in his self-generated mist. I never saw anything so funny
in my life. If you didn't know better, you'd think he was on fire or something. I couldn't stop
laughing!

i have steam coming off my head in some weather. it is rather amusing.

I have had the experience of having my vision momentarily cloud over, and then realizing it was
steam coming from my face and head.

Sweaty in Vancouver,

--
Ryan Cousineau, [email hidden] sfu.ca~rcousineOpen ↗ President, Fabrizio Mazzoleni Fan Club

So my wife and I just got back yesterday from a weekend in Portland, Oregon; now that is a bike
riding town! I have read that they may actually be the best, well it has our vote.

It poured down rain for the entire 3 days that we were there, and we saw more bike riders in those 3
days than 6 months of sunny days in Southern California. I don't know the statistics, but I would
say that 20-30% of the people downtown ride to work; bravo Portland.

Michael

Tue, 18 Feb 2003 16:35:51 -0800, <[email hidden]>,

Michael James Anderson said:

So my wife and I just got back yesterday from a weekend in Portland, Oregon; now that is a bike
riding town! I have read that they may actually be the best, well it has our vote.

It poured down rain for the entire 3 days that we were there, and we saw more bike riders in those
3 days than 6 months of sunny days in Southern California. I don't know the statistics, but I would
say that 20-30% of the people downtown ride to work; bravo Portland.

Michael

Best estimates show bicycling to make up about 3.3 percent of all trips in the inner, urbanized
parts of Portland. In the city as a whole, bicycle use is estimated at two percent of trips.

There's higher mode split for bicycling (3.3 percent) in areas with: good street continuity,
sidewalks, easy street crossings, and gentle topography. Much of inner Portland (i.e., west of I-205
to the west hills) is characterized by such conditions.
--
zk

"Zoot Katz" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Tue, 18 Feb 2003 16:35:51 -0800, <[email hidden]>,

Michael James Anderson said:

So my wife and I just got back yesterday from a weekend in Portland, Oregon; now that is a bike
riding town! I have read that they may actually be the best, well it has our vote.

It poured down rain for the entire 3 days that we were there, and we saw more bike riders in
those 3 days than 6 months of sunny days in Southern California. I don't know the statistics, but
I would say that 20-30% of the people downtown ride to work; bravo Portland.

Michael

Best estimates show bicycling to make up about 3.3 percent of all trips in the inner, urbanized
parts of Portland. In the city as a whole, bicycle use is estimated at two percent of trips.

There's higher mode split for bicycling (3.3 percent) in areas with: good street continuity,
sidewalks, easy street crossings, and gentle topography. Much of inner Portland (i.e., west of
I-205 to the west hills) is characterized by such conditions.

That and alot of smelly homeless types.

Robin Hubert

"Zoot Katz" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Tue, 18 Feb 2003 16:35:51 -0800,

<[email hidden]> , Michael

Quoted message said:

James Anderson said:

So my wife and I just got back yesterday from a weekend

in Portland,

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Oregon; now that is a bike riding town! I have read that

they may

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

actually be the best, well it has our vote.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

It poured down rain for the entire 3 days that we were

there, and we saw

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

more bike riders in those 3 days than 6 months of sunny

days in Southern

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

California. I don't know the statistics, but I would say

that 20-30% of

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

the people downtown ride to work; bravo Portland.

Quoted message said:

Best estimates show bicycling to make up about 3.3 percent

of all trips

Quoted message said:

in the inner, urbanized parts of Portland. In the city as

a whole,

Quoted message said:

bicycle use is estimated at two percent of trips.

Quoted message said:

There's higher mode split for bicycling (3.3 percent) in

areas with:

Quoted message said:

good street continuity, sidewalks, easy street crossings,

and gentle

Quoted message said:

topography. Much of inner Portland (i.e., west of I-205 to

the west

Quoted message said:

hills) is characterized by such conditions.

You're a Vancouverite, no? I'm curious about the bike stats in Vancouver, and Victoria too.
Certainly more Vancouverites ride than in most American cities, though I'm sure it's still a really
small percentage. There seems to be a higher percentage of cyclists in Victoria, but maybe a lot of
them are just tourists. Where did you get those stats, anyway?

A great thing about the PNW is that while the weather often sucks, it bothers people less. I think
they're generally more outdoorsy up there than anywhere else in the US. Southern CA takes the prize
for the best weather, *and* the biggest wussies.

Matt O.

"Steve McDonald" wrote

Quoted message said:

Portland is very pro-active in developing bikepaths and routes and the folks there do a lot
of riding. <snip>

With regard to bikepaths, here is one of my favorite web pages:

bicyclinglife.comTheRoadsWeHave.htmOpen ↗

Tue, 18 Feb 2003 18:39:45 -0800 (PST), <[email hidden]>,

(Steve McDonald) said:

Portland is very pro-active in developing bikepaths and routes and the folks there do a lot of
riding. But Eugene, which has only 20% of Portland's population in its metropolitan area, has
more miles of off-road bikepaths and close to as many riders. With the recent completion of
two important stretches of path that linked other sections together, I'd match our bikepath
network against any in the world. Portland essentially got its impetus for bikepath building,
from the example Eugene set, beginning in 1972. Almost every progressive movement in Oregon
begins in Eugene, then Portland appropriates it and eventually manages to claim most of the
credit. But, they're welcome to it and show that they know where to look for guidance.

Steve McDonald

The master plan for the University of Oregon at Eugene is a model of revolutionary planning thought.
Perhaps the City wisely appropriated its formula.
--
zk

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] (Steve

McDonald) said:

Portland is very pro-active in developing bikepaths and routes and the folks there do a lot
of riding. But Eugene, which has only 20% of Portland's population in its metropolitan area,
has more miles of off-road bikepaths and close to as many riders. With the recent completion
of two important stretches of path that linked other sections together, I'd match our
bikepath network against any in the world. Portland essentially got its impetus for bikepath
building, from the example Eugene set, beginning in 1972. Almost every progressive movement
in Oregon begins in Eugene, then Portland appropriates it and eventually manages to claim
most of the credit. But, they're welcome to it and show that they know where to look for
guidance.

Steve McDonald

Isn't Eugene where the state university is? University towns tend to be a bit more cycle friendly.

But really, you'd imagine southern CA would be pretty nice for bikes, with the great weather. But
from what I hear, nice climate is not necessarily a guarantee of great riding.

Wed, 19 Feb 2003 02:59:58 GMT, <[email hidden]>, "Matt O'Toole"

Quoted message said:

You're a Vancouverite, no? I'm curious about the bike stats in Vancouver, and Victoria too.
Certainly more Vancouverites ride than in most American cities, though I'm sure it's still a really
small percentage.

There were surveys done and actual counts along bike routes. It's estimated that bicycle modal split
has increased since adding bike routes. Still, on a good day it's only about 2.0% off traffic
entering the downtown core and falling to 1.1% on cold, wet, windy days.
city.vancouver.bc.ca12cReview.pdfOpen ↗

I saw another survey that counted bicycles on bridges entering downtown and, IIRC, optimistically
estimated 2.8% mode share. I think it was part of the Downtown Transportation Plan report.

UBC, the other major cycle commuting destination, sees between seven and eight percent mode share.
www.sustain.ubc.ca/pdfs/ubccarpoolreport.pdf

Quoted message said:

There seems to be a higher percentage of cyclists in Victoria, but maybe a lot of them are just
tourists.

5% of all trips to work in the Capital Region were made by bicycle in 1996, the highest of any
Census Metropolitan Area in Canada; 10% to 20% of journey-to-work trips were by bicycle in most
parts of Oak Bay and Victoria; and, 5% to 10% of journey-to work trips were by bicycle in several
parts of Esquimalt, Sidney, and southern Saanich.
crd.bc.cacycle98.htmOpen ↗

Quoted message said:

Where did you get those stats, anyway?

trans.ci.portland.or.uspolicies.htmOpen ↗

Quoted message said:

A great thing about the PNW is that while the weather often sucks, it bothers people less. I think
they're generally more outdoorsy up there than anywhere else in the US. Southern CA takes the prize
for the best weather, *and* the biggest wussies.

Matt O.

The point is that if you don't cycle in the wet, you don't cycle much at all. You figure out how to
stay comfortable under the conditions so you're not deterred by a little liquid sunshine.
--
zk

Wed, 19 Feb 2003 05:01:40 GMT, <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] (Marlene

Blanshay) said:

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden]

(Steve McDonald) said:

Portland is very pro-active in developing bikepaths and routes and the folks there do a lot
of riding. But Eugene, which has only 20% of Portland's population in its metropolitan area,
has more miles of off-road bikepaths and close to as many riders. With the recent completion
of two important stretches of path that linked other sections together, I'd match our
bikepath network against any in the world. Portland essentially got its impetus for bikepath
building, from the example Eugene set, beginning in 1972. Almost every progressive movement
in Oregon begins in Eugene, then Portland appropriates it and eventually manages to claim
most of the credit. But, they're welcome to it and show that they know where to look for
guidance.

Steve McDonald

Isn't Eugene where the state university is? University towns tend to be a bit more cycle friendly.

Yep, the University's master plan is the subject of a book and an ongoing experiment in the use of
pattern languages. google.comsearchOpen ↗

Quoted message said:

But really, you'd imagine southern CA would be pretty nice for bikes, with the great weather. But
from what I hear, nice climate is not necessarily a guarantee of great riding.

That's for sure. We can't do anything about it anyway so just dress right and ride.

City – U.S. %Bicycle %Walk Atlanta .7% 2.4% Chicago
1.% 9.0% Denver
2.4% 5.6% Houston .4% 3.0% Los Angeles
3.% 9.0% New York .6% 15.4% Phoenix
4.1% 3.6% San Diego .6% 5.2% San Francisco
5.% 10.6% Washington, D.C. .6% 8.8%

City - Canada %Bicycle %Walk Montreal
6.1% 11.8% Ottawa
7.3% 12.1% Toronto
8.% 6.1% Vancouver
9.3% 14.3%

City - World London
10.4% 34.2% Copenhagen
11.5% 12.5% Shanghai
12.9% 32.9%

sactaqc.orgmode split.htmOpen ↗
--
zk

On Tue, 18 Feb 2003 18:39:45 -0800 (PST) in rec.bicycles.misc, [email hidden] (Steve

McDonald) said:

With the recent completion of two important stretches of path that linked other sections together,
I'd match our bikepath network against any in the world.

i'll take streets designed with proper calming measures to keep drivers at reasonable speeds over
bike paths that make cyclists second class citizens any day. paths are not bike paths, they're
multi-use paths, and if they are at all attractive to runners, roller bladers, wheelchairs, and
peds, are useless for anyone wanting to use bikes for serious transportation.

"Dennis P. Harris" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Tue, 18 Feb 2003 18:39:45 -0800 (PST) in

rec.bicycles.misc,

Quoted message said:

(Steve McDonald) said:

With the recent completion of two important stretches of path that

linked other sections

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

together, I'd match our bikepath network against any in

the world.

Quoted message said:

i'll take streets designed with proper calming measures to

keep

Quoted message said:

drivers at reasonable speeds over bike paths that make

cyclists

Quoted message said:

second class citizens any day. paths are not bike paths,

they're

Quoted message said:

multi-use paths, and if they are at all attractive to

runners,

Quoted message said:

roller bladers, wheelchairs, and peds, are useless for

anyone

Quoted message said:

wanting to use bikes for serious transportation.

I disagree. First, those other users' needs must be served too. Second, even if they don't allow you
to hammer along at 20 mph, these paths can still provide valuable shortcuts where roads don't go,
shaving miles and minutes off a commute. There are a couple of paths like this here in Blacksburg,
VA. Irvine, CA is full of them -- following culverts, powerline cuts, etc., bypassing major
intersections where one might have to wait at lights, etc. They're certainly not a singular
solution, but can still be valuable as part of the overall plan.

Matt O.

Tue, 18 Feb 2003 22:54:42 -0800 (PST), <[email hidden]>,

(Steve McDonald) said:

Regarding Z.K.'s blurb about the U. of Oregon being a masterpiece of revolutionary planning, I'm
amazed to hear this. I've been a part of this university community all my life and to my thinking,
it's a mess of sprawl and disorganization. Is Z.K. the Dean of the Dept. or Urban Planning there?

It looks good in theory.

The Oregon Experiment approach was based on the University's desire to develop a planning method
that met three goals as it guided growth and change: 1. that the solution be a process and not just
a map; 2. that the process honor and strengthen the University's tradition of meaningful
consultation with students, faculty, and staff; and 3. that the plan provide for continuous
adjustment of campus facilities in response to changing educational policies and programs.

uoregon.eduplanexp.htmlOpen ↗
--
zk

Steve McDonald <[email hidden]> wrote:
: D. Harris sez:
[...]
:> second-class citizens, any day. Paths are not bikepaths, they're multi-use paths, and if they are
:> at all attractive to runners, roller-bladers, wheelchairs, and peds, are useless for anyone
:> wanting to
:. use bikes for serious transportation.

: I say nutz to this view of off-street bikepaths. I hear this idea expressed occasionally, but
: can't understand its basis. I rip around on our separate bikepaths every day and only rarely
: am I impeded in having a hard and unbroken workout by other types of users.
[...]
: A mile on an on-street lane, seems as long and hard to me, as five miles on one of our
: beautiful, separate and quiet bikepaths, through the woods and along the river. Wildlife
: abounds and you become one with Nature.

Pravda.

I can't use them now as they are not winter maintained but the river trails in Guelph provide a
nice cross-city route - early morning, mist rising off the river, ducks and geese paddling along,
turtles trekking down to the shore, groundhogs, early rising squirrels chittering about rabbits
getting in a last nibble of grass before calling it a night....

That's what helps make cycling an enjoyable activity.

--
'People think I'm insane because I am frowning all the time All day long I think of things
but nothing seems to satisfy' 'Make a joke and I will sigh And you will laugh and I will
cry' -Black Sabbath