Old steel vs. new aluminum

Beans Baxter said:

Thanks to everybody that helped me out with my question about upgrading a
Panasonic DX-4000. I have another question related to that bike. I have
the opportunity to purchase a used Trek 1000 and I was wondering what
people's opinion of the two frames are.

For those of you unfamilar with the Panasonic, it's a lugged frame made
with Tange 2 double-butted tubing. The Trek 1000 is a year 2000 model
aluminum frame. Thanks for your help.

Beans Baxter

apples and oranges, I don't think either frame is better if you take away
the variable of the nicer modern components.

The Trek will probably be a little stiffer and a better hillclimber if
you're the out of the saddle type. I bet it weights a pound less as well.
The handling will be slightly more responsive or twitchier depending on
how you want to perceive it. It's an all around darn good frame--I think
it even has braze ons for fenders and a rack if you wanted to go the sport
tour route. List for a complete bike is around 600 bucks, so if you can
pick a used one up for half or a little more, then by all means do it.
It's a solid ride.

The Panasonic's going to be slightly more shock absorbent than the
Trek--not tons, the Trek's ride is pretty nice--but if you ride on bumpy
pavement you'll probably like it better. I believe the wheelbase and
fork rake are larger--don't have the specs in front of me, I'm going by
what the norm for the vintages are--so the Panasonic would be more of a
"steady rider".

Which one feels better? That's the important question. If the Trek fits
well, then why not get something modern and fresher? I'd still hang on the
panasonic and perhaps slap some sturdier rubber on it and make it a foul
weather bike--can't have enough ponies! 🙂

"Beans Baxter" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Thanks to everybody that helped me out with my question about upgrading a
Panasonic DX-4000. I have another question related to that bike. I have
the opportunity to purchase a used Trek 1000 and I was wondering what
people's opinion of the two frames are.

For those of you unfamilar with the Panasonic, it's a lugged frame made
with Tange 2 double-butted tubing. The Trek 1000 is a year 2000 model
aluminum frame. Thanks for your help.

Beans Baxter

My opinion is to go with the steel frame. I would worry about the life span
of the Aluminium frame frame. Also narrower tubes are generally more aero
than fat tubes. The Aluminium frame is probably a bit lighter but I know
that overall the weight difference is not significant. (For example I would
be better off not eating chips and drinking beer.)

Marty

If the trek is cheap and it fits buy it. However you will be more comfy riding
the panasonic. I have a DX3000 and loved riding it. It is now my errand bike
meaning if it gets stolen I wont be committed to an asylum. For long fast rides
I use my Lemond also steel as it is lighter and just as comfortable.

Quoted message said:

me out with my question about upgrading a
Panasonic DX-4000. I have another question related to that bike. I have
the opportunity to purchase a used Trek 1000 and I was wondering what
people's opinion

Beans Baxter said:

Thanks to everybody that helped me out with my question about upgrading a
Panasonic DX-4000. I have another question related to that bike. I have
the opportunity to purchase a used Trek 1000 and I was wondering what
people's opinion of the two frames are.

For those of you unfamilar with the Panasonic, it's a lugged frame made
with Tange 2 double-butted tubing. The Trek 1000 is a year 2000 model
aluminum frame. Thanks for your help.

Beans Baxter

As others have said, hard to compare them. Both are nice bikes.

Geometry and fitting will be the big differences. I have one bike with
tight angles- probably similar to the Trek. And one with more relaxed
angles- probably similar to the Panasonic. They ride differently. The
tight one is zippy and twitchy and fun. The relaxed one is steady and
smooth and fun.

Depending on my mood and where I am riding, I'll use either bike. When
I have had either one off the road, I am happy with the one that
works, and yet I miss riding the other one. If the Trek feels good and
you have money and room for two bikes, get it? You can always sell one
or the other later if need be.

Beans Baxter said:

For those of you unfamilar with the Panasonic, it's a lugged frame made
with Tange 2 double-butted tubing. The Trek 1000 is a year 2000 model
aluminum frame. Thanks for your help.

I have a a ~1990 Trek 1100 and the one thing I hate about it is the
bottem end (where the bottom bracket goes). I'm not a big guy (5'8",
180lbs) but I can twist the bottom bracket so the chaing scrapes the
derailleur when I stand or pedal real hard. I now have a low end Ti
bike and I love it (Mongoose RX100). I can't twist that bike.

Oh, I rode the 1100 for about 35K miles, I still have it but I put
most of my miles on the RX100.

--
Linux Home Automation Neil Cherry [email hidden]
http://home.comcast.net/~ncherry/ (Text only)
http://linuxha.sourceforge.net/ (SourceForge)
http://hcs.sourceforge.net/ (HCS II)

Quoted message said:

My opinion is to go with the steel frame. I would worry about the life

span

Quoted message said:

of the Aluminium frame frame. Also narrower tubes are generally more aero
than fat tubes. The Aluminium frame is probably a bit lighter but I know
that overall the weight difference is not significant. (For example I

would

Quoted message said:

be better off not eating chips and drinking beer.)

Marty

Fear of life span is unwarrented. Both frames are designed to similar risk
standards, regardless of material. I'd expect either to last more than
50,000 km unless you do lots of pogo jumping (which isn't a common use for a
road frame).

Bruce

"Bruce Frech" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

My opinion is to go with the steel frame. I would worry about the life

span

Quoted message said:

of the Aluminium frame frame. Also narrower tubes are generally more

aero

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

than fat tubes. The Aluminium frame is probably a bit lighter but I know
that overall the weight difference is not significant. (For example I

would

Quoted message said:

be better off not eating chips and drinking beer.)

Marty

Fear of life span is unwarrented. Both frames are designed to similar

risk

Quoted message said:

standards, regardless of material. I'd expect either to last more than
50,000 km unless you do lots of pogo jumping (which isn't a common use for

a

Quoted message said:

road frame).

Bruce

They may be designed to similar risk standards but from my own observations
I've seen more Aluminium frames fail than steel frames. I'm not knocking
Aluminium frames but just drawing conclusions from what I've seen.

Marty

Neil Cherry said:

I'm not a big guy (5'8",
180lbs) but I can twist the bottom bracket so the chaing scrapes the
derailleur when I stand or pedal real hard.

That's not a bad thing and it's quite normal 🙂 Some of us like to ride
"lively" frames and ride gears so we don't have to exert such torque upon
our machines. I've got a 70s straight gauge steelie as my main ride--she's
brutally strong, but I can easily cause the bike to "autoshift" or rub the
derailleur cage if I give it all I've got--I take that sound as a sign to
downshift and save the old knees :P

My former city bike was a breathtakingly stiff Marin San Anselmo (the
original, with a 7-speed hub), You could literally throw it down a cliff
or ride home with (no joke) a hundred pounds of groceries on the rear
rack--with no complaint. The jackhammer up the rectum quality of the ride
left much to be desired, though she was quite the hillclimber for an
urban assault vehicle. LOL

maxo said:

The Panasonic's going to be slightly more shock absorbent than the
Trek--not tons, the Trek's ride is pretty nice--but if you ride on bumpy
pavement you'll probably like it better.

If you ride on bumpy pavement a lot, the frame is not what you
should change. Instead, change to fatter tires and shock absorbing
seatpost and stem.
--
Rick Onanian

Beans Baxter said:

Thanks to everybody that helped me out with my question about upgrading a
Panasonic DX-4000. I have another question related to that bike. I have
the opportunity to purchase a used Trek 1000 and I was wondering what
people's opinion of the two frames are.

Noticeable differences will result from geometry and componentry.
Material is an immaterial concern (eh?).
--
Rick Onanian

Steel or Aluminum; Boxers or Briefs; Bikini or Thong. It's so personal, only
you can decide which you prefer... Personally, I don't like the way Aluminum
bikes ride; feel dead to me. Steel much better, plus steel w/lug
construction = old school. Old School good.

Beans Baxter said:

Thanks to everybody that helped me out with my question about upgrading a
Panasonic DX-4000. I have another question related to that bike. I have
the opportunity to purchase a used Trek 1000 and I was wondering what
people's opinion of the two frames are.

For those of you unfamilar with the Panasonic, it's a lugged frame made
with Tange 2 double-butted tubing. The Trek 1000 is a year 2000 model
aluminum frame. Thanks for your help.

Beans Baxter

--
Tp,

-------- __o
----- -\<. -------- __o
--- ( )/ ( ) ---- -\<.
-------------------- ( )/ ( )
-----------------------------------------

No Lawsuit Ever Fixed A Moron...

"TomP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]

Quoted message said:

Steel or Aluminum; Boxers or Briefs; Bikini or Thong. It's so
personal, only you can decide which you prefer... Personally, I
don't like the way Aluminum bikes ride; feel dead to me. Steel much
better, plus steel w/lug construction = old school. Old School good.

Top posting bad.

--

A: Top-posters.
Q: What is the most annoying thing on Usenet?

DRS said:

Top posting bad.

folks with nothing better to do than point that out:

worse.

😄

"maxo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]

Quoted message said:

DRS said:

Top posting bad.

folks with nothing better to do than point that out:

worse.

Rubbish. If nothing is said then how will the children learn?

--

A: Top-posters.
Q: What is the most annoying thing on Usenet?

Show me in the TOS where is says top posting is wrong...

"DRS" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"maxo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]

Quoted message said:

DRS said:

Top posting bad.

folks with nothing better to do than point that out:

worse.

Rubbish. If nothing is said then how will the children learn?

--

A: Top-posters.
Q: What is the most annoying thing on Usenet?

"F1" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]

Quoted message said:

Show me in the TOS where is says top posting is wrong...

Nobody mentioned the TOS, moron.

--

A: Top-posters.
Q: What is the most annoying thing on Usenet?

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F1 said:

Show me in the TOS where is says top posting is wrong...

Bottom vs. top posting and quotation style on Usenet
http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/usenet/brox.html

Why is Bottom-posting better than Top-posting
http://www.caliburn.nl/topposting.html

http://www.blakjak.demon.co.uk/gey_stv0.htm

http://www.fscked.co.uk/writing/top-posting-cuss.html

Wade your way through even one of those and then come back an try to
convince me that top-posting has any advantages to the reader.

Mark

- --
Remove both wrongs to make the email address right.

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Thu, 3 Jun 2004 13:38:41 +1000, <[email hidden]>,

DRS said:

"F1" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]

Quoted message said:

Show me in the TOS where is says top posting is wrong...

Nobody mentioned the TOS, moron.

Google Duel!

top posting bad (310)
top posting sucks (46)
top posting wrong (19)
top posting moron (17)
top posting idiot (8)
top posting [censored] (3)
top posting good (3)

http://www.googleduel.com/original.php
--
zk

This reminds me of the Jeopardy TV show where you have to come up with
the question to which the subject is the answer. There would be
nothing to that show if top posting were logical. That's why the
program has a challenging interest. It is a classic of top posting.

Jobst Brandt
[email hidden]