Cycling Equipment · Public discussion

Alternate Drivetrains

Started by Dave · · Last activity · 8 posts · 679 views

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Cycling Equipment
Published
20 October 2004
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26 October 2004
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Dave
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  1. I was just thinking about drivetrain ideas and was wondering why
    ratcheting cranks are not seen in use. Yes it would cost you some
    weight and reliability and you would give up the ability to easily
    jump the bike but I am almost sure it would improve power delivery. I
    can think of two schemes, one employing a simple independant ratchet
    on each crank, and the second having a further embellishment so that
    each pedal would be independently disengaged during the least
    effective portion of the rotation (perhaps eight O'Clock to twelve
    O'Clock ?) so that it could immediately and effortlessly be moved to
    the top of the powerstroke. This has all no doubt been prototyped,
    tried, and abandoned back in the 60's or 70's, but what were the
    results? Thanks...

    Dave

    ---
    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CheapMTB/

  2. Dave said:


    I was just thinking about drivetrain ideas and was wondering why
    ratcheting cranks are not seen in use. Yes it would cost you some
    weight and reliability and you would give up the ability to easily
    jump the bike but I am almost sure it would improve power delivery. I
    can think of two schemes, one employing a simple independant ratchet
    on each crank, and the second having a further embellishment so that
    each pedal would be independently disengaged during the least
    effective portion of the rotation (perhaps eight O'Clock to twelve
    O'Clock ?) so that it could immediately and effortlessly be moved to
    the top of the powerstroke. This has all no doubt been prototyped,
    tried, and abandoned back in the 60's or 70's, but what were the
    results? Thanks...

    6 months in the workshop and a short spin round the block is usually
    enough 😉
    ---
    Marten

  3. In article <[email hidden]>,

    Dave said:

    I was just thinking about drivetrain ideas and was wondering why
    ratcheting cranks are not seen in use.

    Bikes like this exist. I have seen some (in museums) that were
    built in the early 1900s. I assume they didn't catch on because
    they were less efficient over long rides.

  4. (Dave) said:

    I was just thinking about drivetrain ideas and was wondering why
    ratcheting cranks are not seen in use.

    There are multiple answers to this. First, however, you are laboring
    under a false impression. They've been tried.

    Quoted message said:

    Yes it would cost you some
    weight and reliability and you would give up the ability to easily
    jump the bike but I am almost sure it would improve power delivery.

    How?

    Bear in mind that this has been hashed out here before; claims of
    benefit by the proponents of the extant variations notwithstanding,
    there's never been any acceptably verifiable and validated evidence
    that conclusively supports the contention that they produce any
    significant benefit.

    Quoted message said:

    I
    can think of two schemes, one employing a simple independant ratchet
    on each crank, and the second having a further embellishment so that
    each pedal would be independently disengaged during the least
    effective portion of the rotation (perhaps eight O'Clock to twelve
    O'Clock ?) so that it could immediately and effortlessly be moved to
    the top of the powerstroke.

    Oh, bloody.

    First, a ratchet mechanism allows free movement in one direction and
    not in the other. Think about that for a moment. An independent
    ratchet on each crank would simply allow the rider to desynchronize
    the pedals, which isn't all that great of an idea. It's been tried.
    The bits to do it still languish in the bottoms of junk bins at some
    older packrat-owned bike shops scattered around the world. The
    principal problem with the concept is that the ider must *always* lift
    the crank through the non-power portion of the cycle; such an
    arrangement must be used with clips or cleats, as the foot must be
    able to propel the crank through the entire 360 degrees. This
    eliminates the option of standing on the pedals without them both
    being at the bottom of the stroke as well. Trackstanding becomes
    usless to attempt.

    A variation on the second idea is currently in production and under
    patent, and while there is some basis for contending that the idea is,
    in fact, not new (and that the patent would be indefensible if
    challenged), there is zero likelihood that it will, in fact, be the
    subject of any attempt to copy the device. If you *really* want one,
    you can get them from the Powercranks people; www.powercranks.com, but
    be prepared to pay $800 or more for the privilege of making your bike
    a lot less pleasant to ride.

    A third and less abusive concept which doesn't use ratcheting
    mechanisms but which does speed the pedal's return to the top of the
    stroke is the Rotor Crank (www.rotorcranks.com), which while not
    objectionable, doesn't really seem to be much more than a fancy
    gimmick in my estimation. At least is doesn't render the bike
    unpleasant or infuriating to ride, as the PowerCranks or the simple
    ratcheting concept does.

    Quoted message said:

    This has all no doubt been prototyped,
    tried, and abandoned back in the 60's or 70's, but what were the
    results? Thanks...

    The results should be obvious from the lack of them as a common
    feature on the bikes in your area. In point of fact, precisely the
    opposite idea, the fixed-gear bike which does not freewheel *at all*
    and maintains the regular synchronized motion of the pedals, is far
    more common and popular, though still far from universally adored.
    --
    Typoes are a feature, not a bug.
    Some gardening required to reply via email.
    Words processed in a facility that contains nuts.

  5. [email hidden] (do not spam) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

    Quoted message said:

    In article <[email hidden]>,

    Dave said:

    I was just thinking about drivetrain ideas and was wondering why
    ratcheting cranks are not seen in use.

    Bikes like this exist. I have seen some (in museums) that were
    built in the early 1900s. I assume they didn't catch on because
    they were less efficient over long rides.

    Google "Alenax". Been there, done that.

    Jeff

  6. [email hidden] (do not spam) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

    Quoted message said:

    In article <[email hidden]>,

    Dave said:

    I was just thinking about drivetrain ideas and was wondering why
    ratcheting cranks are not seen in use.

    Bikes like this exist. I have seen some (in museums) that were
    built in the early 1900s. I assume they didn't catch on because
    they were less efficient over long rides.

    Yes but the scheme I'm suggesting could be pedaled conventionally or
    in a ratcheting mode. Maybe I need to also say that I was thinking of
    this for mountainbiking where road pedaling techniques are often not
    so easy to apply and every added inch of pedal ground clearance would
    be a blessing.

  7. Dave said:

    I was just thinking about drivetrain ideas and was wondering why
    ratcheting cranks are not seen in use. Yes it would cost you some
    weight and reliability and you would give up the ability to easily
    jump the bike but I am almost sure it would improve power delivery. I
    can think of two schemes, one employing a simple independant ratchet
    on each crank, and the second having a further embellishment so that
    each pedal would be independently disengaged during the least
    effective portion of the rotation (perhaps eight O'Clock to twelve
    O'Clock ?) so that it could immediately and effortlessly be moved to
    the top of the powerstroke. This has all no doubt been prototyped,
    tried, and abandoned back in the 60's or 70's, but what were the
    results? Thanks...

    Dave
    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CheapMTB/

    something like this exists for some kinds of wheelchairs.

  8. Rotor cranks, Powercranks, Powerpedals...still trying to re-invent the bicycle.

    looked at one of the Wright Bros bicycles from the late 1890s...gee, it sure
    looked similar to today.

    Double triangle frameset, HS, hubs, BB, crank, nice hubs with the rear being a
    single speed with an interbal brake, from 1895 or so.

    Peter Chisholm
    Vecchio's Bicicletteria
    1833 Pearl St.
    Boulder, CO, 80302
    (303)440-3535
    http://www.vecchios.com
    "Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"

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