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In article <[email hidden]>, pvs1
@wildwales.fsnet.co.uk says...

Quoted message said:

Gordon wrote:

Quoted message said:

Do you know that OziExplorer has a trackpoint reducing feature? If you
load a track (or draw one of your own) you can then reduce the number of
points, either to a specific number or in other ways. Fewer points with
a wider spacing may work better, while still providing quite a detailed
route. It's the straighter sections that tend to lose points, rather

So does Tracklogs. always assumed it was for those people with limited
track memory on the gps. but maybe it is to help get around this
problem.

I've also had some strange navigation advice when following garmin
waypoint routes. Should really spend some time trying to work out its
logic, but it's easier not to bother and just use the mapping features!

--
Darren

* The air of uk.rec.walking was filled with the delicate perfume
* of violets, as Paul Saunders <[email hidden]> descended on a shaft
* of golden sunlight, and announced:

Quoted message said:

True, but when we do get a hurricane remnant it usually brings a lot of
rain with it. There was a memorable one around August 25th in 1986,
hurricane Charlie. 3 solid days of rain, force 10 winds measured at
Lundy, fallen trees, floods. I remember the drains were overflowing and
bursting in the streets so that many roads had rivers running down them.
Great fun driving around in that!

I remember it well! I was camping with the family in a large frame tent at
Oxwich. I had to brace the tent by holding the frame from the inside whilst
the force of the rain blew a fine mist through the fabric. After a while the
storm abated as the eye passed over us and there was silence. Then there was
a sound like an approaching express train as the storm started up again, with
the wind coming from the opposite direction over the hill. We (and the tent)
survived!

Regards: Jim Ford

On 6 Sep 2004 22:10:42 GMT, Jim Ford <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

I had to brace the tent by holding the frame from the inside whilst
the force of the rain blew a fine mist through the fabric.

Hee hee! My earliest memories of camping - my Dad holding the frame
of the tent with one hand and his pyjama trousers up with the other
(in the dark, in a storm in the middle of the night).

I don't ever remember being scared[1]. I must have had total trust in
my Dad's ability to prevent the tent acting like a box kite!

Judith
[1] Slight fib. I was often pertified by the ginormous creatures
which munched loudly inches from my head. On the rare occasion I was
brave enough to investigate it always turned out to be a sheep 20
yards away. But it *could* have been a monster.

"Paul Saunders" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I agree with you here. If I book a holiday in Scotland I will always
try to go in May/June as opposed to July/August for that reason.
Unfortunatly that didn't work this year as June had rainfall 75%
above average in the Oban region.

That's the thing with weather, it's so variable. Averages are just
that, averages, that doesn't mean the weather will be like the average.
August may be very wet one year and have blistering heatwaves the next,
so that averages out into a "typical" August that may not be very
typical at all.

I totally agree with you here. What I am saying is that holidaying in
Scotland in May/June you are more likely to get decent weather than in
July/August. I never said it was guarenteed.

Quoted message said:

One thing that used to surprise me in the past was how often weather
records are broken, like the "driest summer on record in England and
Wales" or the "most rainfall in one day in the south-west" or the
"hottest February day ever in Wales" and so on. The fact is that
weather is so variable and records have been kept for such a relatively
short length of time that new records are still quite common, especially
when qualified by a specific place and time. Records like "hottest day
ever in the UK" aren't broken very often.

Reminds me of something my boss said. He stated that it is more unusual if a
weather record isn't being broken somewhere. Something for the media to
think about when they try to blame every little thing on global warming.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I was referring to most peoples perceptions here. It's not been too
bad in the SE either.

Perceptions are a funny thing. Not only do people have different points
of view but much depends on how much time one spends out in the weather.
For example if you're indoors working while it's sunny all week then it
rains every weekend, you might get the perception that it was a mostly
wet month.

Which is why I check the Met Offices monthly assessments to see how "normal"
a month was. This August was actually close to average for sunshine as most
of the rain fell in showers rather than prolonged warm sector stratiform
rain.

Quoted message said:

January 1988 has a special place in my heart. I was out taking photos
on no less than 14 days that month, one of the sunniest and most
productive Januaries ever as I recall it, yet when I mentioned the
January sunshine to someone a month later they replied "what sunshine?
It rained non-stop all month!"

This was confirmed by the met office who recorded it as the wettest
January for 45 years. Yet to me it was a very sunny month, and I have
the photos to prove it! Obviously there was a lot of sunshine in
between all that rain, and since I was out in that sunshine taking
photos my perception is of a sunny month, whereas other people remember
it as a very wet month.

Not that I didn't notice the rain too, I was out walking and camping in
it a few times, but I was selective and managed to miss most of it,
picking out the fine days.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> more typical of autumn,

How dare you accuse this naff summer of being like my favourite
season! :-)

Quoted message said:

I was referring to the fact that the weather has been far more
unsettled than normal, rather than the temperature.

Fair enough.

Quoted message said:

30 degrees isn't that common. 20-25 is a more typical August high.

In the longer term yes, but I've experienced 30 degrees here during
summer quite frequently during recent years. This has been the coolest
summer for quite a few years I'm glad to say. At least that's been my
perception of it.

Which shows how wrong perceptions can be. August (and indeed the whole
summer) had above average temperatures.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

25-30C is NOT typical for September.

Of course not. But the weather is no respecter of dates. Throughout
the year there are typical weather patterns which tend to recur, often
associated with specific dates, for example the March and October gales,
April showers and so on, but the timing of these patterns varies from
one year to the next, so sometimes a weather pattern occurs earlier or
later than normal, such as the late heat we're experiencing now. In
1994 we had an unexpected heavy snowfall in April, more typical of
March.

Interestingly enough, statistically, a white easter is more likely than a
white christmas.

Adam

Quoted message said:

Paul
--
http://www.wilderness-wales.co.uk
http://www.wildwales.fsnet.co.uk

"Paul Saunders" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I agree with you here. If I book a holiday in Scotland I will always
try to go in May/June as opposed to July/August for that reason.
Unfortunatly that didn't work this year as June had rainfall 75%
above average in the Oban region.

That's the thing with weather, it's so variable. Averages are just
that, averages, that doesn't mean the weather will be like the average.
August may be very wet one year and have blistering heatwaves the next,
so that averages out into a "typical" August that may not be very
typical at all.

I totally agree with you here. What I am saying is that holidaying in
Scotland in May/June you are more likely to get decent weather than in
July/August. I never said it was guarenteed.

Quoted message said:

One thing that used to surprise me in the past was how often weather
records are broken, like the "driest summer on record in England and
Wales" or the "most rainfall in one day in the south-west" or the
"hottest February day ever in Wales" and so on. The fact is that
weather is so variable and records have been kept for such a relatively
short length of time that new records are still quite common, especially
when qualified by a specific place and time. Records like "hottest day
ever in the UK" aren't broken very often.

Reminds me of something my boss said. He stated that it is more unusual if a
weather record isn't being broken somewhere. Something for the media to
think about when they try to blame every little thing on global warming.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I was referring to most peoples perceptions here. It's not been too
bad in the SE either.

Perceptions are a funny thing. Not only do people have different points
of view but much depends on how much time one spends out in the weather.
For example if you're indoors working while it's sunny all week then it
rains every weekend, you might get the perception that it was a mostly
wet month.

Which is why I check the Met Offices monthly assessments to see how "normal"
a month was. This August was actually close to average for sunshine as most
of the rain fell in showers rather than prolonged warm sector stratiform
rain.

Quoted message said:

January 1988 has a special place in my heart. I was out taking photos
on no less than 14 days that month, one of the sunniest and most
productive Januaries ever as I recall it, yet when I mentioned the
January sunshine to someone a month later they replied "what sunshine?
It rained non-stop all month!"

This was confirmed by the met office who recorded it as the wettest
January for 45 years. Yet to me it was a very sunny month, and I have
the photos to prove it! Obviously there was a lot of sunshine in
between all that rain, and since I was out in that sunshine taking
photos my perception is of a sunny month, whereas other people remember
it as a very wet month.

Not that I didn't notice the rain too, I was out walking and camping in
it a few times, but I was selective and managed to miss most of it,
picking out the fine days.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> more typical of autumn,

How dare you accuse this naff summer of being like my favourite
season! :-)

Quoted message said:

I was referring to the fact that the weather has been far more
unsettled than normal, rather than the temperature.

Fair enough.

Quoted message said:

30 degrees isn't that common. 20-25 is a more typical August high.

In the longer term yes, but I've experienced 30 degrees here during
summer quite frequently during recent years. This has been the coolest
summer for quite a few years I'm glad to say. At least that's been my
perception of it.

Which shows how wrong perceptions can be. August (and indeed the whole
summer) had above average temperatures.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

25-30C is NOT typical for September.

Of course not. But the weather is no respecter of dates. Throughout
the year there are typical weather patterns which tend to recur, often
associated with specific dates, for example the March and October gales,
April showers and so on, but the timing of these patterns varies from
one year to the next, so sometimes a weather pattern occurs earlier or
later than normal, such as the late heat we're experiencing now. In
1994 we had an unexpected heavy snowfall in April, more typical of
March.

Interestingly enough, statistically, a white easter is more likely than a
white christmas.

Adam

Quoted message said:

Paul
--
http://www.wilderness-wales.co.uk
http://www.wildwales.fsnet.co.uk

"Paul Saunders" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

Was that September 1st by any chance? I remember that morning, first
time I've felt a chill in the air for months. Wonderful!

I can remember September 1st being a bit chill yes because that was the
first day I went back to work but a few other mornings have been chilly
recently as well for those that get up early regularly. The one I
particularly remember was when I was back in the Forest of Dean which was
actually a bit longer ago than I thought working it out from the calendar.
August 21st probably.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

30 degrees and hazy here yesterday.

Quoted message said:

Really? Well I'm glad I'm not where you are, it wasn't so hot here. I
think my indoor thermometer said 24 or thereabouts. Where are you?

Bristol. 30 degrees was what the thermometer said (in the shade) on my
balcony and indoors. Looking at the webpages of a couple of localish
amateur weather recording stations they got 28.6 and 31.1 degrees max. I
think it was the hottest day of the year here from a quick look at stats on
one of them which is the same thing as the 44 degrees in the sun from my max
min thermometer told me.

"Geoff Berrow" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

Try wrapping different coloured materials around your thermometer bulb
and see the difference. Also try wrapping some wet material around it.

They were supposed to be doing heat transfer experiments at school today but
ironically both teachers decided to cancel them because it was too hot.

In message <[email hidden]>, Adam Lea
<[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

Which is why I check the Met Offices monthly assessments to see how "normal"
a month was. This August was actually close to average for sunshine as most
of the rain fell in showers rather than prolonged warm sector stratiform
rain.

According to Dr Steve Darling, senior lecturer at the UEA and research
director of WeatherQuest, in September 6's Guardian, August's daytime
temperatures were 1.2 C above average, sunshine was 100% of average and
rainfall was 185% of average.

Bitstring <[email hidden]>, from the wonderful
person Gordon <[email hidden]> said
<big snip>

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I suspect that having too many waypoints too close together may be
what's causing the problem. I haven't tried this track following
business yet, but I'll probably try it out sometime.

I must say that using Tracklogs and uploading a track allowing the
software to produce waypoints gave me 114 waypoints for a (planned) walk
of 6.2 miles - total overkill compared with the 20 or so I plotted
manually! I think I will have to experiment with settings to see if I
can reduce that, or else forget about following tracks and go back to
manually plotted waypoints.

Quoted message said:

Do you know that OziExplorer has a trackpoint reducing feature?

But does he know that Tracklogs also has a trackpoints (or waypoints)
reducing feature? Open the track (or route or whatever) select
'properties' and then 'point filter'. You can reduce any route to 2
points (with some loss of accuracy. 8>.)

--
GSV Three Minds in a Can
Outgoing Msgs are Turing Tested,and indistinguishable from human typing.

Chris Townsend said:

According to Dr Steve Darling, senior lecturer at the UEA and research
director of WeatherQuest, in September 6's Guardian, August's daytime
temperatures were 1.2 C above average, sunshine was 100% of average
and rainfall was 185% of average.

And of course the average is only half way between the extremes, so how
many percent different are the extremes?

Paul
--
http://www.wilderness-wales.co.uk
http://www.wildwales.fsnet.co.uk

In message <[email hidden]>, Paul Saunders
<[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

Chris Townsend said:

According to Dr Steve Darling, senior lecturer at the UEA and research
director of WeatherQuest, in September 6's Guardian, August's daytime
temperatures were 1.2 C above average, sunshine was 100% of average
and rainfall was 185% of average.

And of course the average is only half way between the extremes, so how
many percent different are the extremes?

Mean monthly extremes:

warmest Ross-on-Wye 22.8C
coldest Lerwick 15.5C
sunniest Bournemouth 225 hours
least sun Leuchars 126 hours
wettest Eskdalemuir 317mm
driest Guernsey 69mm

Dr Darling also notes that there was a ground frost at Tulloch Bridge in
the Highlands on August 22 and the second half of August was 3C degrees
cooler on average than the first. Although the coldest place Lerwick had
50% higher than average sunshine. Averaged across the whole of the UK
August 31 was the sunniest day.

GSV Three Minds in a Can <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Do you know that OziExplorer has a trackpoint reducing feature?

But does he know that Tracklogs also has a trackpoints (or waypoints)
reducing feature?

Yes he does, and he takes sugar, one level spoonful please. :-)

Quoted message said:

Open the track (or route or whatever) select
'properties' and then 'point filter'. You can reduce any route to 2
points (with some loss of accuracy. 8>.)

That's fine for tracks plotted in Tracklogs, but I have been downloading
tracks walked over the years and saved in Ozi, and have to filter them
before transferring to Tracklogs because of the 750 trackpoint limit.

I suppose it reduces the storage size of the Ozi tracks.....

I find it interesting to look at the spider's web we have created in
Yorkshire and Derbyshire at the 1:1M mini-scale. It also reveals areas
we have neglected.
--
Gordon

Bitstring <[email hidden]>, from the wonderful
person Gordon <[email hidden]> said

Quoted message said:

GSV Three Minds in a Can <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>Do you know that OziExplorer has a trackpoint reducing feature?

But does he know that Tracklogs also has a trackpoints (or waypoints)
reducing feature?

Yes he does, and he takes sugar, one level spoonful please. :-)

There's not many of us would get that joke, Gordon. 8>.

--
GSV Three Minds in a Can
Outgoing Msgs are Turing Tested,and indistinguishable from human typing.

Gordon <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

That's fine for tracks plotted in Tracklogs, but I have been downloading
tracks walked over the years and saved in Ozi, and have to filter them
before transferring to Tracklogs because of the 750 trackpoint limit.

Are you sure about that? My walks usually result in tracks of around 1000
points and I upload those directly from the Geko 201 to Tracklogs. I then
use the point reducer to get the number down to 100-200 which usually
results in reported errors less than 5m.

Quoted message said:

I find it interesting to look at the spider's web we have created in
Yorkshire and Derbyshire at the 1:1M mini-scale. It also reveals areas
we have neglected.

Yes, I do that also. It is a bit annoying that if you print the map it does
not have an option to print all the tracks in the current folder. I find
the 1:1M scale is a bit too large (or is it too small?), 1:250k would be
much more useful. I have requested this, and had some indication that it
may be coming in the future. They do seem quite responsive to user
requests.

John

Paul Saunders said:

And of course the average is only half way between the extremes

That's the median. I imagine the Met Office use the arithmetic mean (sum of
all values divided by number of values). Otherwise a completely dry month
will forever distort the figures.

--
Money can't buy happiness, but allows a choice of misery.

Mail john rather than nospam...

Bitstring <[email hidden]>, from the
wonderful person John Yale <[email hidden]> said

Quoted message said:

Gordon <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

That's fine for tracks plotted in Tracklogs, but I have been downloading
tracks walked over the years and saved in Ozi, and have to filter them
before transferring to Tracklogs because of the 750 trackpoint limit.

Are you sure about that? My walks usually result in tracks of around 1000
points and I upload those directly from the Geko 201 to Tracklogs. I then
use the point reducer to get the number down to 100-200 which usually
results in reported errors less than 5m.

Quoted message said:

I find it interesting to look at the spider's web we have created in
Yorkshire and Derbyshire at the 1:1M mini-scale. It also reveals areas
we have neglected.

Yes, I do that also. It is a bit annoying that if you print the map it does
not have an option to print all the tracks in the current folder.

Do it from the screen - you can copy the screen to the clipboard using
'printsc' key, then paste it into the graphics editor of your choice (MS
Paint is free) and print it from there.

--
GSV Three Minds in a Can
Outgoing Msgs are Turing Tested,and indistinguishable from human typing.

John Yale <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

Gordon <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

That's fine for tracks plotted in Tracklogs, but I have been downloading
tracks walked over the years and saved in Ozi, and have to filter them
before transferring to Tracklogs because of the 750 trackpoint limit.

Are you sure about that?

Errm - no! I just downloaded one of 1042 points, but I definitely had
one session where I loaded several tracks from Ozi to the Vista, then
downloaded into Tracklogs, and each track stopped short at 750
trackpoints, even the little diagram showed that. maybe it was a
limitation on the evaluation version of the program?
Duh!

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I find it interesting to look at the spider's web we have created in
Yorkshire and Derbyshire at the 1:1M mini-scale. It also reveals areas
we have neglected.

Yes, I do that also. It is a bit annoying that if you print the map it does
not have an option to print all the tracks in the current folder.

Indeed, but at least you can see them on the PC screen....

Quoted message said:

I find
the 1:1M scale is a bit too large (or is it too small?), 1:250k would be
much more useful. I have requested this, and had some indication that it
may be coming in the future. They do seem quite responsive to user
requests.

Again I agree, the level of detail is insufficient on the 1:1M map.
Perhaps I'll add my wish-list to yours.

I have plotted the extent of several 1:25,000 Explorer maps on the
1:50,000 as though they were long rectangular routes, and am toying with
the idea of getting one or two of the most interesting, as I don't enjoy
looking and plotting on 1:50,000.
--
Gordon

In article <[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

I find it interesting to look at the spider's web we have created in
Yorkshire and Derbyshire at the 1:1M mini-scale. It also reveals areas
we have neglected.

Never thought of doing that to find new areas!! obvious really. it's
always the simple ideas ...

--
Darren

Darren G <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

I find it interesting to look at the spider's web we have created in
Yorkshire and Derbyshire at the 1:1M mini-scale. It also reveals areas
we have neglected.

Never thought of doing that to find new areas!! obvious really. it's
always the simple ideas ...

Unfortunately those areas have usually been left alone for a good
reason, like they are dull and uninteresting tracts of featureless
moorland.

Never mind - they will suit the hairy monsters on this group. :-)
--
Gordon

[email hidden] said...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Yes he does, and he takes sugar, one level spoonful please. :-)

There's not many of us would get that joke, Gordon. 8>.

Oh, I don't know - it used to be one of my favourite programmes
back in the days when I had the time and the peace and quiet to
listen to the radio. And apart from Radio Cymru it's the only
station my radio knows anything about.
--
I try to be a good example to my children, but they just see me
as a dire warning.