BB longevity

jim said:

Hello all,

I need to purchase a new splined BB(Octalink) for my road bike. Anyone
out there have experience as to whether the Ultegra or Dura-Ace BB's
last longer than the much less expensive 105-level BB's? I don't care
about the weight difference.

Get 105, black spindle rather than silver, less $, otherwise no diff.
Stay away from DA loose ball ones and I'd buy a few as Octalink like
ISIS is agoin' away.

D'ohBoy said:

Bill Sornson said:

jim said:

Hello all,

I need to purchase a new splined BB(Octalink) for my road bike. Anyone
out there have experience as to whether the Ultegra or Dura-Ace BB's
last longer than the much less expensive 105-level BB's? I don't care
about the weight difference.

Ultegra is pretty damned bomb-proof, IME. (I used on one my mtb until my
XTR rings gave out.) Nothing wrong with 105 (or DA for that matter),
either. Get whatever's on special?

Many posters have noted the difficulties with the DA tubular spindle
BB. Apparently poorly sealed and difficult to adjust. More than one
wrench here has suggested the Ultegra BB is the best choice. Weight
aside, the plastic cup on the 105 BB can be damaged if not approached
with some caution.

Metal cup on Octalink 105 BB, like ultegra..just a black spindle is
all.

Quoted message said:

If you are having a pro wrench care for your bike, the 105 is not an
issue (don't know your skills with a wrench).

D'ohBoy

John Forrest Tomlinson said:

Derk said:

Ozark Bicycle said:

You can see the 'Dead End' sign at the end of the Octalink Hwy, too?

Well, I know how it went with the pre-OCtalink standard: first you couldn't
get D-A BB any more, then Ultegra etc.

Other than the DA BB, which was particularly narrow, I think you can
still get perfectly fine BBs for other square taper Shimano cranks.
Maybe not labeled "Ultegra" but ones that will work fine.

I think the difference is that there are zillions of sqaure taper
cranks out there, made for decades but Octalink cranks were made for
about 9 years.

Quoted message said:

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Hey ladies and germs, thanks for all the replies. I think I will 'stock
up' on some 105 or Ultegra level Octalink BB's as the standard seems to
be moving toward external cartridge cups, and I'm not ready ($$) to
adopt. I gather that the 105's also have metal cups instead of plastic?
I was also trying to locate the technical documents for Octalink BB's -
anyone know where those are found? Shimano's website seems to have
shoved any trace of splined BB's down the memory hole.

I'm still unclear on one thing - the Dura-Ace splined BB's (7700?) have
both cartridge and ball bearings, right? That's how they save the
weight, I assume.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

D'ohBoy wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

If you are having a pro wrench care for your bike, the 105 is not an
issue (don't know your skills with a wrench).

D'ohBoy

Quoted message said:

Qui si parla Campagnolo wrote:

Quoted message said:

Metal cup on Octalink 105 BB, like ultegra..just a black spindle is
all.

Thinking of the old square-taper 105 bb (I think?).

D'ohBoy

jim said:

Hey ladies and germs, thanks for all the replies. I think I will 'stock
up' on some 105 or Ultegra level Octalink BB's as the standard seems to
be moving toward external cartridge cups, and I'm not ready ($$) to
adopt. I gather that the 105's also have metal cups instead of plastic?

that's what mine has.

Quoted message said:

I was also trying to locate the technical documents for Octalink BB's -
anyone know where those are found? Shimano's website seems to have
shoved any trace of splined BB's down the memory hole.

I'm still unclear on one thing - the Dura-Ace splined BB's (7700?) have
both cartridge and ball bearings, right?

no, both roller and ball bearings. the "cartridge" is the large metal
cylinder that encases the whole assembly on the 105/ultegra. dura-ace
has no cartridge, only separate cups, like the old loose ball bb's, only
they're set up for the shimano ball/roller combo.

Quoted message said:

That's how they save the
weight, I assume.

that and the milling inside the spindle, yes.

Gary Young said:

jim beam said:

Quoted message said:

Hello jimski,

> I need to purchase a new splined BB(Octalink) for my road bike.
> Anyone out there have experience as to whether the Ultegra or
> Dura-Ace BB's last longer than the much less expensive 105-level
> BB's? I don't care about the weight difference.
What mode of failure have you experienced and wish to avoid with this
purchase? The do-race version is probably no different except in the
style and weight of the cranks.

jeepers, do you wish to look ignorant in /every/ field - can't you just
keep it to materials? the breakdown is like this:

*105*
- lower end steel spindle
- steel cartridge housing
- lower end bearings

*ultegra*
- high end pipe spindle
- steel cartridge housing
- high end bearings

*dura-ace*
- high end spindle that in addition to being hollow, is further
internally machined for additional weight reduction.
- separate bearing cups with roller and ball bearings in plastic
retainers. cups are sealed with plastic tube, but rely on the bb for
alignment as opposed to the others which remain aligned relative to the
cartridge.

of course, your ignorance on this matter begs another question - wtf
qualifies you to criticize the octalink system when you've evidently
never even handled it??? that's got to be up there with your
statements about elasto-hydrodynamic separation!

I have a 105 octalink bottom bracket. But until reading your post, I
had no knowledge about its guts or how it might differ from the ultegra
and dura ace bottom brackets.

that tells its own story...

Quoted message said:

Are you saying that because I've only handled the 105 bottom bracket,
I can't draw any conclusions about the octalink interface? Does the
interface differ from one model to the other?

no, the interface is the same. the point is, if you don't know about
the system, as evidenced by showing that you have no experience on this
system in service, how are you going to know about how the interface
performs in practice?

Quoted message said:

This is unusually stupid even for you.

no gary, i have areas of ignorance. i can fix them by research. you
otoh have shown no ability to do that. there's the difference.

jim said:

Hey ladies and germs, thanks for all the replies. I think I will 'stock
up' on some 105 or Ultegra level Octalink BB's as the standard seems to
be moving toward external cartridge cups, and I'm not ready ($$) to
adopt. I gather that the 105's also have metal cups instead of plastic?
I was also trying to locate the technical documents for Octalink BB's -
anyone know where those are found? Shimano's website seems to have
shoved any trace of splined BB's down the memory hole.

Must be the same memory hole they've used in the past for things like
Dyna-drive pedals and cranks.

Quoted message said:

I'm still unclear on one thing - the Dura-Ace splined BB's (7700?) have
both cartridge and ball bearings, right? That's how they save the
weight, I assume.

jim beam said:

Gary Young said:

jim beam said:

[email hidden] wrote:
> Hello jimski,
>
>> I need to purchase a new splined BB(Octalink) for my road bike.
>> Anyone out there have experience as to whether the Ultegra or
>> Dura-Ace BB's last longer than the much less expensive 105-level
>> BB's? I don't care about the weight difference.
> What mode of failure have you experienced and wish to avoid with this
> purchase? The do-race version is probably no different except in the
> style and weight of the cranks.
>
jeepers, do you wish to look ignorant in /every/ field - can't you
just keep it to materials? the breakdown is like this:

*105*
- lower end steel spindle
- steel cartridge housing
- lower end bearings

*ultegra*
- high end pipe spindle
- steel cartridge housing
- high end bearings

*dura-ace*
- high end spindle that in addition to being hollow, is further
internally machined for additional weight reduction. - separate
bearing cups with roller and ball bearings in plastic retainers. cups
are sealed with plastic tube, but rely on the bb for alignment as
opposed to the others which remain aligned relative to the cartridge.

of course, your ignorance on this matter begs another question - wtf
qualifies you to criticize the octalink system when you've evidently
never even handled it??? that's got to be up there with your
statements about elasto-hydrodynamic separation!

I have a 105 octalink bottom bracket. But until reading your post, I
had no knowledge about its guts or how it might differ from the ultegra
and dura ace bottom brackets.

that tells its own story...

Quoted message said:

Are you saying that because I've only handled the 105 bottom bracket, I
can't draw any conclusions about the octalink interface? Does the
interface differ from one model to the other?

no, the interface is the same. the point is, if you don't know about
the system, as evidenced by showing that you have no experience on this
system in service, how are you going to know about how the interface
performs in practice?

Jeez, I don't know.

Wait -- how about relying on a body of theory that's derived from the
accumulated experience and thinking of a lot of smart people? You know --
Standing on the Shoulders of Giants and all that. Or maybe listening to
what other people have to say about their experience?

But no, holding the BB in your hand -- caressing it, sniffing it,
fantasizing about it, learning the characteristics of it that have nothing
to do with the interface -- is probably the only sure way to a mystical
communion with a higher truth.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

This is unusually stupid even for you.

no gary, i have areas of ignorance. i can fix them by research. you
otoh have shown no ability to do that. there's the difference.

Ozark Bicycle said:

jim said:

Hey ladies and germs, thanks for all the replies. I think I will 'stock
up' on some 105 or Ultegra level Octalink BB's as the standard seems to
be moving toward external cartridge cups, and I'm not ready ($$) to
adopt. I gather that the 105's also have metal cups instead of plastic?
I was also trying to locate the technical documents for Octalink BB's -
anyone know where those are found? Shimano's website seems to have
shoved any trace of splined BB's down the memory hole.

Must be the same memory hole they've used in the past for things like
Dyna-drive pedals and cranks.

yep, make something unique, use the 'gorilla in the room' size to make
it a 'standard', find out it ain't too great, cancel it!!
SPD-R is another good example.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I'm still unclear on one thing - the Dura-Ace splined BB's (7700?) have
both cartridge and ball bearings, right? That's how they save the
weight, I assume.

"jim beam" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
<snip>>

Quoted message said:

no, the interface is the same. the point is, if you don't know about
the system, as evidenced by showing that you have no experience on this
system in service, how are you going to know about how the interface
performs in practice?

Quoted message said:

This is unusually stupid even for you.

no gary, i have areas of ignorance. i can fix them by research. you
otoh have shown no ability to do that. there's the difference.

Jim, after having watched this for a while, you have drawn me out of lurknig
mode. I am reminded that every once in a while you need meet a real [censored]
to remind yourself that they are out there. Jobst may be a bit abrasive and
occasionally in error but he is not relentlessly vindictive. You may be
somewhat knowledgeable but you are always unpleasant. You, my friend are the
perfect [censored]. Thanks for refreshing the definition.
Bill