Being strong and not being huge

TrekDedicated said:

If I want to increase my strength, but not my overall size, what exercises do you all suggest?

I'm probably one of the few guys out that there that does NOT want to be jacked. I want to have a lot of strength and be learn and cut, not look like a gorilla.

Suggestions/tips?

Lower weights and more (10 - 12) reps with sets of 3 should do it. Stay away from heavy weights / low reps as this will add bulk.

TrekDedicated said:

If I want to increase my strength, but not my overall size, what exercises do you all suggest?... Suggestions/tips?

Just to clarify, do you mean strength as in the ability to lift or press large weights or do you mean cycling strength as in the ability to ride a particular climb fast?

Just checking because the word "strength" gets used to mean a lot of things but the answers will be different depending on what you're after.

-Dave

daveryanwyoming said:

Just to clarify, do you mean strength as in the ability to lift or press large weights or do you mean cycling strength as in the ability to ride a particular climb fast?

Just checking because the word "strength" gets used to mean a lot of things but the answers will be different depending on what you're after.

-Dave

Dave,

Kind of both. But, I guess to focus it down, overall strength whether it is on the bike or not. I'm very strong on the bike in terms of sprinting.

Find a decent hill climb, about 3-5 mins. Big gear, 60-70 RPM's and a heart rate about 85%. Maybe once a week, do it to often and you will probably find your cadence will go down on the rest of your rides. I like to do these followed with some real spinning on the down side. If there are no hilss then into a head wind standing, or if you are like me with very short hills do them more often.🙂

greyg8r said:

Lower weights and more (10 - 12) reps with sets of 3 should do it. Stay away from heavy weights / low reps as this will add bulk.

Are you sure you don't have this backwards?

TrekDedicated said:

If I want to increase my strength, but not my overall size, what exercises do you all suggest?

I'm probably one of the few guys out that there that does NOT want to be jacked. I want to have a lot of strength and be learn and cut, not look like a gorilla.

Suggestions/tips?

Unfortunately, strength and bulk go hand in hand. Being cut and well defined is just icing on the cake and does not depend on either. You can get that without strength or bulk. Body builders care about both, weight lifters care only about strength.

Strength training involves doing small number of reps with relatively heavy weights, close to your one rep max. This coupled with proper bulking nutrition (i.e. lots of high quality protein, and plenty of carbs) will increase strength.

Now, if you mean strength on the bike, then strength in the classical sense (force) is not really relevant. Metabolic adaptations and metabolic fitness is what enables one to endure higher power output for a long period of time. And that means increasing your FTP.
You don't have to be strong in the sense that you can lift or push huge weight for a short burst of time. You do however have to be able to endure to push relatively small weight for a long period of time. So, this means 2x20s I'm afraid 🙂.

Here we go again.

Trek - just lift heavy.

You're not going to put on mass if you keep your caloric intake equal to what you burn.

Lifting light weights ain't going to jack for your strength. Lift heavy, and don't worry about getting HUGE. It's not going to happen if you bike a lot.

And read the "gyming to improve power" sticky threads.

velomanct said:

Here we go again.

Trek - just lift heavy.

You're not going to put on mass if you keep your caloric intake equal to what you burn.

Lifting light weights ain't going to jack for your strength. Lift heavy, and don't worry about getting HUGE. It's not going to happen if you bike a lot.

And read the "gyming to improve power" sticky threads.

If you dont eat an excess of calories you are not going to get stronger. If you lift big you will either get bigger or you wont get much of anything. If you are not eating much and doing a lot of cardio such as bicycling your probably not going to get much.

No offense but you dont seem to understand strength training. I train for bicycling and grappling. Both are sports that you want to keep your weight downa nd your strength up. When dealing with weight classes there is not a while lot you can do other than optomize your weight for mustcle, aka lose fat gain muscle but maintain weight.

What you can do to not gain weight is to build muscular endurance which is what you really want to do for bicycling anyway. Lower weights (not low) and higher reps. I often do a 12 rep max weight. It helps build up how long you can sustain power. If you look at power lifters they might be able to squat over 1000 lbs but they would be terrible sprinters on a bike because they can only perform near their peak strength for a short time. From training for grappling i learned that the biggest guy is not really the strongest. I often am able to physically overpower someone after only 60 seconds becuase they simply cant maintain their strength.

Actually, you can get very strong and not add bulk. There are a lot of powerlifters out there that weight under 200 that are stronger then most NFL lineman. George Halbert just benched 560 pounds at a bodyweight of 198. Strength training should focus on training the CNS to effeciently move heavy weights. This can be done without adding muscle. You need to train basic compound movements with the rep range being between 1-3 reps per set. No one is going to build large muscles training with less then 3 reps. That's why bodybuilders train between 8-12 reps per set. This rep range is optimal for building muscle. In fact, when powerlifters are trying to move up in weight class, they do more reps per set (6-10) to build mass. If they're maintaining weight or dropping a weight class they perform fewer reps like doubles and singles.

If you really want to get into strength training search Westside Barbell training or check out Elite Fitness Systems website. You'll find all kinds of useful articles. I am a powerlifter and I have also developed a passion for cycling. They can both work as long as you plan and prioritize your training.

Packeteer said:

If you dont eat an excess of calories you are not going to get stronger.

Tell that to the lightweight power lifters who weigh no more than the average person, yet squat over 600lbs or bench over 350lbs.

So basically you're saying that my increase in strength (represented by my 1RM deadlift from 200lbs to 330lbs) is impossible because I didn't gain muscle?

Strength is largerly dependent on CNS function, in addition to cross sectional area.

Where's Ric when you need him? lol

Don't lift weights. I'll get flamed for that. Okay, let me rephrase. I don't lift weights. I used to, but now I do mostly climbing and yoga (ashtanga and vinyasa), with the occasional body-weight workout on rings and lot's of core stuff. For me that combination builds a lot of functional muscle without bulk.

masonpaul said:

Actually, you can get very strong and not add bulk. There are a lot of powerlifters out there that weight under 200 that are stronger then most NFL lineman. George Halbert just benched 560 pounds at a bodyweight of 198. Strength training should focus on training the CNS to effeciently move heavy weights. This can be done without adding muscle. You need to train basic compound movements with the rep range being between 1-3 reps per set. No one is going to build large muscles training with less then 3 reps. That's why bodybuilders train between 8-12 reps per set. This rep range is optimal for building muscle. In fact, when powerlifters are trying to move up in weight class, they do more reps per set (6-10) to build mass. If they're maintaining weight or dropping a weight class they perform fewer reps like doubles and singles.

If you really want to get into strength training search Westside Barbell training or check out Elite Fitness Systems website. You'll find all kinds of useful articles. I am a powerlifter and I have also developed a passion for cycling. They can both work as long as you plan and prioritize your training.

Powerlifters are trying to build up their 1RM strength. Cyclists are trying to build muscular endurance. What i am trying to say is that doing exercises to build muscle but then not eating is making a nearly net zero change. Of course your CNS develops but not in the way that is optimal for cycling. You are better off either accepting bulk and eating right or not trying for bulk and lifting for endurance than if you sabatoge yourself.

You say "No one is going to build large muscles training with less then 3 reps." but that is only partly true. You will build larger muscles its just not as efficient at doing so as higher reps. Bodybuilders of course are doing whats best for muscle size so they do more reps most of the time. I'm sure though you have heard of bodybuilders doing low reps for a while to build strength so they can be strong enough to do high reps with high weight. Sometimes they go back and forth.

What i would give for advice is to just not waste your time lifting super heavy and not eating enough. As i have said i train for cycling and grappling, 2 sports that need low body weight. I accept a certain level of body composition change and i eat accordingly. I dont eat high calories but im not starving myself while i try and train, that is going to get nobody anywhere.

TrekDedicated said:

If I want to increase my strength, but not my overall size, what exercises do you all suggest?

I'm probably one of the few guys out that there that does NOT want to be jacked. I want to have a lot of strength and be learn and cut, not look like a gorilla.

Suggestions/tips?

I used to powerlift in another life and we all had to get strong and make weight at the same time. What you are seeking an increase in neuromuscular power with little or no hypertrophy. The way to do this would be very few sets of heavy compound movements such as squat, bench and deadlift and or by doing plyometrics.(jumping, one leg hops etc..) Then you have to eat very clean and limit endurance work. Here is the problem. If you have no background in weight training, you are likely to gain some weight from the initial adaptation. 2nd you need to spend lots of time learning to do the lifts or plyos correctly. 3rd they dont help cycling much unless you are a match sprinter or kilo specialist.