cwebs said:If the BMC doesn't work out for me, I'll sell it. I'll just have to eat the loss. I'm sure I could work out an arrangement with an LBS and get credit on the frame. One of the shops has a nice Cervelo Soloist which I might be able to put credit toward but I thought that might be too much bike for a newb. No dramas. Perhaps I could get one of these! drool
Why Campagnolo over Shimano? Which Campagnolo group would be equivalent to 105?
You do know that the shop will give you ONLY a fraction of the purchase price in credit for your frame once you/they start putting parts onto it, don't you?
I mean, if they give you ~30% of what you pay for the frame (if you are paying full-freight retail), then consider yourself lucky ... but, don't be surprised if they sell it to a Mate of yours for ~70% of the retail ... it's the way of the world BECAUSE they do have some overhead expenses ... so, I won't fault them ... but, you may be really unhappy about the situation.
If you are having a local shop put the components on the frame for you, then go for a couple of test rides on THEIR demo bikes in the three frame sizes ... 54, 56, 58 ... even 52. MEASURE THE TOP TUBE(S) ... buy based on the top tube length.
Now, the Campophiles will tell you that:
[center]Shimano breaks down while Campagnolo breaks in.[/center]
This is probably a mantra from a dozen years ago when the 8-speed Shimano shifters were RANDOMLY prone to seizing.
And, they will say that you can rebuild a Campy shifter whereas a Shimano shifter becomes a paperweight after its useful life is reached due to thousands of miles of use or sudden seizure.
The 9-speed 105 Shimano "stuff" is better than the 8-speed 105 Shimano "stuff" ... and, the 10-speed 105 "stuff" is better than the 9-speed 105 "stuff."
Having done so, I will tell you that you need the Patience-of-Job the first time to try to rebuild a Campagnolo shifter because the large, main spring is a b*tch to re-install ... I presume there is a special tool to expedite this. The parts are expensive & the wait can seem lengthy; so, it may be cheaper to cannibalize another shifter for the parts!
Now, I just read a thread where some people indicated that they were disappointed by the feel of the Veloce over their Record shifters. Well, that is akin to saying the brand new, washed once & still stiff blue jeans are not as comfortable as the old pair which the new pair is replacing!
The signficant internals of ALL the Campagnolo shifters used to be the same. The Record & Chorus had a ball bearing cartridge which supported the central shaft whereas all the others had a bushing and a slightly smaller shaft & the shift lever's cradle has an appropriately sized hole; but, otherwise all the significant parts are interchangeable. The Record (and, recent Chorus) and Mirage/Xenon share the same PLASTIC (Uh, "composite"😉 shifter blade ... but, the high end shifters have a faux-carbon-fiber decal. The brake levers are interchangeable. The indexing gears are interchangeable. The body & hoods are interchangeable.
I reckon the break-in time for the OLD Record shifters was about 400 miles (less than a week for the really competitive riders) whereas it was probably about 1000 miles for the lesser "stuff" because the bushing also needed to seat. I presume the recent "Ultra" variant had a break in time of close-to-zero since the interactive bits were teflon coated AND presumably blue-printed to a tigher spec. This may just be in my mind; but, I know that a set of shifters that I have which have thousands of miles have a decidely lighter touch/feel to them than when new.
When I get a new set of shifters, I mount them on a set of spare bars, and break them in while I am doing other stuff (do this when you are alone) which does not otherwise require use of my hands -- reading, watching a TV program in-the-background ... whatever. You know, an hour or two of constant "dry" shifting is like weeks of shifting on the road.
BAD cables/housing make any shifter seem less than optimum. Campagnolo makes some of the best cables & housing ... but, you can get close to the same level of low-friction cabling with the proper lubing of your cables ... EVEN with the plastic lined stuff.
Anyway, from your wallet's point of view, you get more bang for the buck with Campagnolo shifters. While the derailleurs may cost more, for $200US you can certainly get a new set of Veloce shifters + rear derailleur & use almost any front derailleur. The Campagnolo Cogniscenti say that Shimano front derailleurs shift better with their ERGO shifters than the Campagnolo front derailleur. So, you can save a few pennies by getting an Ultegra front derailleur. You can't even buy a new pair of Shimano shifters for $200.
Several years ago, when I was belatedly making the transition from friction to indexed shifting, I just couldn't embrace the Shimano shifting. There was an intangible that I couldn't quantify UNTIL I tried a pair of Campagnolo ERGO shifters ...
And, it was the ability of the Campagnolo shifters to make the chain traverse multiple cogs with a single shift that was the missing element FOR ME. Certainly, other people will give you another reason why they prefer Campagnolo shifters.
AND, some people will tell you that you can shift the entire range in a single shift ... well, I can only manage THREE cogs per shift, up or down. AND, when I recently took the occasion to install a set of 105 shifters for some "tests" I found that I could downshift three cogs at a time, but only upshift one cog at a time.
A nice PLUS with the Campagnolo shifters is that the chain moves in the direction you are pressing the related lever -- I presume that this is what some people have referred to as the "intuitive" aspect of Campagnolo's shifters:[indent]That is, you push the RIGHT shift blade inward, and the chain moves toward the centerline of the bike and onto a larger cog.
You press the RIGHT thumb lever DOWN, and the chain moves down to a smaller cog.
You push the LEFT shift blade inward, and the chain moves toward a larger chainring.
You press the LEFT thumb lever DOWN, and the chain moves down toward the smaller chainring.
[/indent]How great is that?!?
I've had a set of RECORD shifters with the carbon fiber blades & everything else except for the XENON. I sold the Record shifters after a few of thousand miles of use and continue to use Mirage on my "Winter" bike ... and, Centaur on another, Veloce on another, and Chorus (alloy levers) on another, et cetera. Cosmetically, I like the look of the Centaur shift blade ("open"😉, but the solid shift blade feels better (to me -- embarrassingly, this is probably best described as a princess-and-the-pea situation).
So, let your wallet AND your aesthetic sensibilities be your guide in selecting which Campagnolo group you buy your components from if you purchase your components a la carte.
FWIW. My work-bench observation is that the Shimano 10-speed rear derailleurs can be interchanged for a Campagnolo ... your results may vary.
NB. Besides the weight difference between the better & lesser components of the two brands, you need to know that the pulley wheels on the 105 rear derailleur are decidely cheaper -- you need to lube INITIALLY (as soon as you get the bike from the shop since they probably won't lube them) + more often -- than the pulley wheels on the Ultegra rear derailleur. Unless you were going to replace the pulley wheels with some alloy pulley wheels from the git-go OR have the discipline to lube your bike's components on a regular basis, it is cheaper to buy an Ultegra rear derailleur.
More than you wanted to know?
There's certainly more ...
