Clubs and rider development

Discussion in 'Road Cycling' started by James, Feb 17, 2003.

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  1. James

    James Guest

    For those of you who aren't pro's and are members of club "teams", what do you do for
    helping/developing your Citizens/Cat 5's?

    I'm trying to get some input and ideas for my club regarding what others are doing to help develop
    their newer members into better racers.

    Thanks,

    James
     
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  2. Mike S.

    Mike S. Guest

    Take them out on epic hammer fests and work their asses into the ground! Those that are too weak to
    hang on don't deserve to ride!! Don't they know that riding with the big dogs is a privilege??

    Bow down before the altar of pain and suffering worthless pigs!

    Seriously, I know that SDBC has "development rides" every Sat that leaves right after their main
    ride. Entry level riders, juniors, etc. that aren't ready to ride in the 100+ rider pack go learn
    the basics first. Check out www.sdbc.org for contact info for club officers. They can help out with
    more detail.

    Next?

    "James" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > For those of you who aren't pro's and are members of club "teams", what do you do for
    > helping/developing your Citizens/Cat 5's?
    >
    > I'm trying to get some input and ideas for my club regarding what others
    are
    > doing to help develop their newer members into better racers.
    >
    > Thanks,
    >
    > James
     
  3. "James" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > For those of you who aren't pro's and are members of club "teams", what do you do for
    > helping/developing your Citizens/Cat 5's?
    >
    > I'm trying to get some input and ideas for my club regarding what others
    are
    > doing to help develop their newer members into better racers.
    >
    > Thanks,
    >
    > James

    There's a lot you can do, but we've had good luck doing early-season training crits, with everyone
    from local pros to citizens in the same bunch. We use a wide, safe, easy course and tell everyone to
    keep it low key, there being nothing on the line but minor swag from sponsors. We tell riders that
    if they get lapped, they should stay out on the wide line and try to get back on until the
    five-to-go sign comes out and then pull out. The experienced guys have been good about letting the
    newer riders play a role in things until the speed goes too high for them, setting up mock teams,
    letting them get in breaks and showing them how to work together in the bunch. The newbies
    appreciate the experience of getting to work with the fast guys for a while and don't mind getting
    shelled when the hammer goes down. They enjoy peeling off to watch the finishes and have seemed to
    pick up pretty quickly on tactics. The difference in their calmness, confidence and pack skills over
    a few races is definitely noticeable. Far from being the crash-fest you might imagine, they've been
    pretty safe, with the only crashes happening in the last few laps when some strong, but
    less-experienced riders let their enthusiasm get the best of them. But seeing someone get road rash
    for no good reason is a useful learning tool for everyone, too. Good for guys to know they're not
    indestructible and that pavement is a lot harder than dirt.

    We also use Topica for a club email listserver and encourage less-experienced members to ask
    questions and the rest to share anything they can that'll be of use to their mates. Works pretty
    well for that, as long as everyone avoids politics and religion... ;-)

    SB
     
  4. Dion Dock

    Dion Dock Guest

    My team, Team Oregon, has been pretty successful with developing cat 5s. Here are my suggestions:

    a) Have a regular ride that leaves at the same place and time year around.
    b) Get new people to introduce themselves at the beginning of said ride.
    c) Take some time to talk to new people during ride and supply advice ("you did bring some
    food, right?").
    d) Do a quick check of their bike fit after the ride. I'm not talking Fit Kit but just "your saddle
    needs to go up some". This seems to be a chronic problem with new riders.

    -Dion

    "James" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > For those of you who aren't pro's and are members of club "teams", what do you do for
    > helping/developing your Citizens/Cat 5's?
    >
    > I'm trying to get some input and ideas for my club regarding what others
    are
    > doing to help develop their newer members into better racers.
    >
    > Thanks,
    >
    > James
     
  5. Tom Kunich

    Tom Kunich Guest

    "James" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > For those of you who aren't pro's and are members of club "teams",
    what do
    > you do for helping/developing your Citizens/Cat 5's?
    >
    > I'm trying to get some input and ideas for my club regarding what
    others are
    > doing to help develop their newer members into better racers.

    Developing racers is difficult for club riders because they tend to race each other and drop
    newcomers rather than train effectively.
     
  6. Mike S.

    Mike S. Guest

    "Tom Kunich" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > "James" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > > For those of you who aren't pro's and are members of club "teams",
    > what do
    > > you do for helping/developing your Citizens/Cat 5's?
    > >
    > > I'm trying to get some input and ideas for my club regarding what
    > others are
    > > doing to help develop their newer members into better racers.
    >
    > Developing racers is difficult for club riders because they tend to race each other and drop
    > newcomers rather than train effectively.
    >
    >
    See my post above...

    Mike
     
  7. Tritonrider

    Tritonrider Guest

    >From: "Tom Kunich" [email protected]

    >Developing racers is difficult for club riders because they tend to race each other and drop
    >newcomers rather than train effectively.

    Our club's masters/cat3 types have been fantastic in general training with my son Robert, they used
    to come back for me until I convinced them it was a waste of their ride. Our serious weekly training
    ride goes 2.5 hours at very close to race pace. Robert is a hard head and insists on taking his
    pulls, attacking on climbs, and last year he fell into covering attacks when he was on form. This
    leads to his blowing up on a fairly regular basis and someone ALWAYS drops with him. There are
    always people willing to work with and help new riders, once in a while I even manage to be helpful.
    One person who has made a huge effort to help new racers is Kathryn Roszko. She leads a weekly
    rolling clinic/ride and is always willing to help anyone who asks. Bill C.
     
  8. Tom Kunich

    Tom Kunich Guest

    In my experience this is a rare group and you ought to be glad to have that group around. There
    seems to be too much ego around racers and ex-racers (note AA and RC) for them to conduct
    themselves in anything short of a self-centered blind need to be better than anyone else on every
    ride all the time.

    Actually the most selfless riders I've seen have been pretty accomplished upper catagory racers who
    will often spend all sorts of time with young up and comers.

    "TritonRider" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > >From: "Tom Kunich" [email protected]
    >
    > >Developing racers is difficult for club riders because they tend to race each other and drop
    > >newcomers rather than train effectively.
    >
    > Our club's masters/cat3 types have been fantastic in general
    training with my
    > son Robert, they used to come back for me until I convinced them it
    was a waste
    > of their ride. Our serious weekly training ride goes 2.5 hours at
    very close to
    > race pace. Robert is a hard head and insists on taking his pulls,
    attacking on
    > climbs, and last year he fell into covering attacks when he was on
    form. This
    > leads to his blowing up on a fairly regular basis and someone ALWAYS
    drops with
    > him. There are always people willing to work with and help new
    riders, once in
    > a while I even manage to be helpful. One person who has made a huge
    effort to
    > help new racers is Kathryn Roszko. She leads a weekly rolling
    clinic/ride and
    > is always willing to help anyone who asks. Bill C.
     
  9. Mike S.

    Mike S. Guest

    "Tom Kunich" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > In my experience this is a rare group and you ought to be glad to have that group around. There
    > seems to be too much ego around racers and ex-racers (note AA and RC) for them to conduct
    > themselves in anything short of a self-centered blind need to be better than anyone else on every
    > ride all the time.
    >
    > Actually the most selfless riders I've seen have been pretty accomplished upper catagory racers
    > who will often spend all sorts of time with young up and comers.
    >
    Over the years of riding, I've noticed that the riders who are truly fast are some of the nicest
    people you'll meet. Its the ones that THINK they're fast that are the arseholes! Granted, there are
    exceptions to every rule, but...

    >
    > "TritonRider" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]...
    > > >From: "Tom Kunich" [email protected]
    > >
    > > >Developing racers is difficult for club riders because they tend to race each other and drop
    > > >newcomers rather than train effectively.
    > >
    > > Our club's masters/cat3 types have been fantastic in general
    > training with my
    > > son Robert, they used to come back for me until I convinced them it
    > was a waste
    > > of their ride. Our serious weekly training ride goes 2.5 hours at
    > very close to
    > > race pace. Robert is a hard head and insists on taking his pulls,
    > attacking on
    > > climbs, and last year he fell into covering attacks when he was on
    > form. This
    > > leads to his blowing up on a fairly regular basis and someone ALWAYS
    > drops with
    > > him. There are always people willing to work with and help new
    > riders, once in
    > > a while I even manage to be helpful. One person who has made a huge
    > effort to
    > > help new racers is Kathryn Roszko. She leads a weekly rolling
    > clinic/ride and
    > > is always willing to help anyone who asks. Bill C.
    >
     
  10. "Mike S." <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    >
    > "Tom Kunich" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]...
    > > In my experience this is a rare group and you ought to be glad to have that group around. There
    > > seems to be too much ego around racers and ex-racers (note AA and RC) for them to conduct
    > > themselves in anything short of a self-centered blind need to be better than anyone else on
    > > every ride all the time.
    > >
    > > Actually the most selfless riders I've seen have been pretty accomplished upper catagory racers
    > > who will often spend all sorts of time with young up and comers.
    > >
    > Over the years of riding, I've noticed that the riders who are truly fast are some of the nicest
    > people you'll meet. Its the ones that THINK
    they're
    > fast that are the arseholes! Granted, there are exceptions to every rule, but...

    The "fast" assholes tend to be assholes to each other. If you're not a threat to someone, they have
    little to gain by being an ass to you. It's when ego is threatened that aberrant behavior emerges.
     
  11. Mike S.

    Mike S. Guest

    "Kurgan Gringioni" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:j2%[email protected]...
    >
    > "Mike S." <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > >
    > > "Tom Kunich" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > news:[email protected]...
    > > > In my experience this is a rare group and you ought to be glad to have that group around.
    > > > There seems to be too much ego around racers and ex-racers (note AA and RC) for them to
    > > > conduct themselves in anything short of a self-centered blind need to be better than anyone
    > > > else on every ride all the time.
    > > >
    > > > Actually the most selfless riders I've seen have been pretty accomplished upper catagory
    > > > racers who will often spend all sorts of time with young up and comers.
    > > >
    > > Over the years of riding, I've noticed that the riders who are truly
    fast
    > > are some of the nicest people you'll meet. Its the ones that THINK
    > they're
    > > fast that are the arseholes! Granted, there are exceptions to every
    rule,
    > > but...
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > The "fast" assholes tend to be assholes to each other. If you're not a threat to someone, they
    > have little to gain by being an ass to you. It's when ego is threatened that aberrant behavior
    > emerges.
    >

    THAT must be it. Guess I'll have to ride faster to either prove or disprove that theory...
     
  12. "Mike S." <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    >
    >
    > THAT must be it. Guess I'll have to ride faster to either prove or
    disprove
    > that theory...

    I've seen it in action. Other people have told me stories that support that assertion, ie. someone
    was nice to them until they got good. Then that someone wasn't nice anymore.
     
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