Cycling vs Running

I ran daily for about 20 years and gave it up about 8 years ago in favor of
cycling (long distances in both sports). I'm a much better cyclist than I
was a runner, and it's much less punishing to my body. Too bad it took so
long for me to figure this out.
"Number 9" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
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Quoted message said:

Can poor runners become excellent cyclists? What is the relationship
between the two sports?

Thanks ahead of time!

Number 9

How did the exchange of excercises go with you? Did you compete at
running? Do you compete now in cycling?

"Bill" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
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Quoted message said:

I ran daily for about 20 years and gave it up about 8 years ago in favor

of

Quoted message said:

cycling (long distances in both sports). I'm a much better cyclist than I
was a runner, and it's much less punishing to my body. Too bad it took so
long for me to figure this out.
"Number 9" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Can poor runners become excellent cyclists? What is the relationship
between the two sports?

Thanks ahead of time!

Number 9

Number 9 said:

Can poor runners become excellent cyclists? What is the relationship
between the two sports?

I'm a poor runner -- I look like a freak while running, which isn't
a problem because I can't do it for long, nor is there any purpose,
as I can walk faster. I couldn't run away from a giant carnivorous
snail.

I'm a mediocre, at best, bicyclist. I can bike 40 or 50 miles at
14mph pretty easily nowadays, and even without putting in lots of
miles, I do seem to be improving. I can bike away from the snail,
unless I'm going uphill.

I can't say if they're related.
--
Rick Onanian

"Number 9" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Can poor runners become excellent cyclists? What is the relationship
between the two sports?

Thanks ahead of time!

Number 9

I have done both for many years.

I find that cross-training is much better than specializing for physical
fitness. The muscles are used differently for each exercise, so I am able
to do more. I include for stretching and resistance exercises at my local
Goodlife fitness gym.

Cordially,

Churchill

It depends on why one is a poor runner. I know some excellent cyclists
who are poor runners because of their weight or their tendancy to get
injured.

I do both and find similarity in the aerobic conditioning. The main
difference is muscles used. Cycling is mostly quads, running is
hamstring and calfs. So, to transition from one sport to another will
require some adaptation.

"Number 9" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Can poor runners become excellent cyclists? What is the relationship
between the two sports?

Thanks ahead of time!

Number 9

Thank you for your response. Do you race your bike? My running never
achieved race quality, and I am hoping I can develop my cycling to do it!

"Rick Onanian" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Number 9 said:

Can poor runners become excellent cyclists? What is the relationship
between the two sports?

I'm a poor runner -- I look like a freak while running, which isn't
a problem because I can't do it for long, nor is there any purpose,
as I can walk faster. I couldn't run away from a giant carnivorous
snail.

I'm a mediocre, at best, bicyclist. I can bike 40 or 50 miles at
14mph pretty easily nowadays, and even without putting in lots of
miles, I do seem to be improving. I can bike away from the snail,
unless I'm going uphill.

I can't say if they're related.
--
Rick Onanian

I am w/o question a poor runner and a farily good cyclist, and yes,
you can do well at cycling even if you were a lousy runner. I do
triathlons every once in a while (only because of friends that
pressure me). I usually end up reasonably high after the cycling part.
During the run, everyone passes me.

Even though I hate racing, I can do bike races and finish ok. In a 10k
I'll finish among the last runners.

I think that leg length is very important in running while it is
slightly less important in cycling. If you have proportianately short
legs in relation to torso you'll be a lousy runner. When you are
running, sometimes you are next to a friend that is barely jogging and
s/he is dropping you. You move your legs really fast to keep up but
your friend keeps dropping you. That is because s/he has a naturally
longer stride.

Andres

"Number 9" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Can poor runners become excellent cyclists? What is the relationship
between the two sports?

Thanks ahead of time!

Number 9

"Number 9" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Can poor runners become excellent cyclists?

I think it is possible. It depends on why someone is a poor runner. If
you have poor running mechanics but good cardiovascular capacity,
probably so, if you are determined. I think there might be some
interplay with how much cycling you have done over your lifetime,
including as a child. Despite doing a lot of running myself I never
felt like I was able to run at the same level that I can ride. I think
there are tools like a fixed gear (for which there is no equivalent in
running) that can force a cyclist to develop their biomechanical
skills.

OTOH, if someone is a poor runner because they are basically out of
shape and have not put the effort yet into getting into proper
condition, they are not going to become a good cyclist either until
they commit to the work.

Quoted message said:

What is the relationship between the two sports?

There's been a lot of stuff over the years about the incompatibility
between the two sports. I'm not completely convinced of it. My feeling
about running is that it is good for strengthening your cardiovascular
system, like the "base miles" that cyclists go for before harder
training. The thing you don't get is the leg strength and the power
that you need to be a good cyclist. That comes with hard work, but if
you have been doing a lot of running you are probably in a good place
to start and may be surprised at how fast you improve if you push
yourself. Contrary to what some people say, I think that an important
part of "getting up to speed" is to challenge yourself frequently with
relatively big gears.

There is something about cycling that for me is less aversive than
running. For the same heart rate, I find cycling less painful. I'm not
sure why this is, but my theory is that the pounding your body endures
while running adds to the overall discomfort in a subtle way. However,
this is based on my personal observation and ability- despite the fact
that I used to run 30-40 miles a week at 10 miles a pop, I always
noticed with a certain amount of jealousy people who looked a lot more
comfortable running than I felt.

JP

andres muro said:

I think that leg length is very important in running while it is
slightly less important in cycling. If you have proportianately short
legs in relation to torso you'll be a lousy runner. When you are
running, sometimes you are next to a friend that is barely jogging and
s/he is dropping you. You move your legs really fast to keep up but
your friend keeps dropping you. That is because s/he has a naturally
longer stride.

Many top runners are quite short, so they have short legs. For instance,
Kenenisa Bekele, recent world record setter in the 5000 and 10000, and
zillion time world cross country running champion, is only 5'3" (160 cm).
His leg to torso proportion looks average to me (maybe a bit torso long?).
Why should it matter how long the torso is? Wouldn't weight be more
important? Anyway, I'm a runner, follow the sport, see lots of pictures and
don't see any trend towards high leg length to torso length ratios. Sure
there are runners who are "all legs", but I can also recall many top
marathoners with relatively short legs. Some elite runners are impossibly
thin, others are very strong looking, though of course none are fat.

As for myself, my proportions are around average, maybe slightly torso long:
5'10", 32.2-32.4" cycling inseam. I'm a decent runner and a better runner
than cyclist. As a cyclist, I'm very strong in climbs. My running stride
rate (full left and right cycle) is pretty much the same as my cycling
cadence. It's about 92-95 for most of my regular training pace from say 10
minutes per mile to 6 minutes per mile. At slower speeds, people sometimes
say that I have a short stride or an unusually high stride rate, but that's
my natural stride rate and it's not any different from a cyclist pedaling at
those cadences at low speeds. At 4:45 to 5:30 per mile, my stride rate is
around 100-110. When doing strides at 14 sec/100m, my stride rate is
120-125. I think my running stride rates are pretty much the same as my cyc
ling cadence at the same intensity (except for hills in cycling, but I still
run a 42/24 low).

Good observation, I used to run 12-20 miles a week, 7 years ago. I noticed
that I didn't necessarily get faster at that sport, but my cardio did not
cut me off, and was in quite good shape. Cycling seems to be more directly
Quadracep or whatever intensive than running.

Thanks
"JP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Number 9" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Can poor runners become excellent cyclists?

I think it is possible. It depends on why someone is a poor runner. If
you have poor running mechanics but good cardiovascular capacity,
probably so, if you are determined. I think there might be some
interplay with how much cycling you have done over your lifetime,
including as a child. Despite doing a lot of running myself I never
felt like I was able to run at the same level that I can ride. I think
there are tools like a fixed gear (for which there is no equivalent in
running) that can force a cyclist to develop their biomechanical
skills.

OTOH, if someone is a poor runner because they are basically out of
shape and have not put the effort yet into getting into proper
condition, they are not going to become a good cyclist either until
they commit to the work.

Quoted message said:

What is the relationship between the two sports?

There's been a lot of stuff over the years about the incompatibility
between the two sports. I'm not completely convinced of it. My feeling
about running is that it is good for strengthening your cardiovascular
system, like the "base miles" that cyclists go for before harder
training. The thing you don't get is the leg strength and the power
that you need to be a good cyclist. That comes with hard work, but if
you have been doing a lot of running you are probably in a good place
to start and may be surprised at how fast you improve if you push
yourself. Contrary to what some people say, I think that an important
part of "getting up to speed" is to challenge yourself frequently with
relatively big gears.

There is something about cycling that for me is less aversive than
running. For the same heart rate, I find cycling less painful. I'm not
sure why this is, but my theory is that the pounding your body endures
while running adds to the overall discomfort in a subtle way. However,
this is based on my personal observation and ability- despite the fact
that I used to run 30-40 miles a week at 10 miles a pop, I always
noticed with a certain amount of jealousy people who looked a lot more
comfortable running than I felt.

JP

Number 9 said:

Thank you for your response. Do you race your bike? My running never
achieved race quality, and I am hoping I can develop my cycling to do it!

No, although I never tried, so I don't know how well I'd do.
--
Rick Onanian

"Number 9" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Can poor runners become excellent cyclists? What is the relationship
between the two sports?

I was never much of a runner. I ran track & field in high school. I
usually did 100 yd dash, quarter mile, mile relay, and occasionally half
mile. I was even worse at longer events never even managing a 7 minute
mile. Luckily I was a much better discus thrower than runner as I never
placed in any running event but I managed to score a few points for my
team in discus.

The bike racers I met when I was in high school in the 1970's seemed
impossibly fit and talked casually about 100 mile rides. Based on my
lack of success running I assumed that I'd never be able to successfully
race bicycles. Even when I ran a lot I always carried an extra 10-15
lbs. and the bike racers I met looked like they lived in a concentration
camp.

In college I continued to run on and off but just for exercise not sport.
I rode bicycles for transportation as well. I worked at a bike shop and
nobody there ever expected me to ever get fast. I was getting dropped
from medium (~16 MPH) training rides. When Winter arrived and you had to
leave early to have enough light to ride I stayed behind to close the bike
shop since everyone else who worked there either already raced or planned
to. After locking the doors I rode the turbo trainer for an hour. I hit
the trainer pretty hard and managed to get fit even without many road
miles.

I did ride with everyone on Sundays and every week I was stronger and
after one ride where I went off the front with a strong Cat II racer they
talked me into sending off for my license.

I was always a rank amateur but I got fast enough to have a lot of fun.
I raced 2.5 years before the pressure of paying bills and finishing
college made me quit. At my fittest I was pinching below 5% body fat
and looking at myself in the mirror I realized that I was as lean as the
bike racers that seemed impossibly fit to me when I was in high school.
I don't know that I'd ever call myself an "excellent" cyclist but I
certainly saw a lot more success and fun on the bike than I ever did
running.
--
Bruce Jackson - Sr. Systems Programmer - DMSP, a M/A/R/C Group Company

Thanks, I am a rank beginner, and your story does help, I never really rode.
Just started about 2 weeks ago, I can maintain 14mph right now, but hope to
get alot better. Is 14mph good for a rank beginner?

"Bruce Jackson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Number 9" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Can poor runners become excellent cyclists? What is the relationship
between the two sports?

I was never much of a runner. I ran track & field in high school. I
usually did 100 yd dash, quarter mile, mile relay, and occasionally half
mile. I was even worse at longer events never even managing a 7 minute
mile. Luckily I was a much better discus thrower than runner as I never
placed in any running event but I managed to score a few points for my
team in discus.

The bike racers I met when I was in high school in the 1970's seemed
impossibly fit and talked casually about 100 mile rides. Based on my
lack of success running I assumed that I'd never be able to successfully
race bicycles. Even when I ran a lot I always carried an extra 10-15
lbs. and the bike racers I met looked like they lived in a concentration
camp.

In college I continued to run on and off but just for exercise not sport.
I rode bicycles for transportation as well. I worked at a bike shop and
nobody there ever expected me to ever get fast. I was getting dropped
from medium (~16 MPH) training rides. When Winter arrived and you had to
leave early to have enough light to ride I stayed behind to close the bike
shop since everyone else who worked there either already raced or planned
to. After locking the doors I rode the turbo trainer for an hour. I hit
the trainer pretty hard and managed to get fit even without many road
miles.

I did ride with everyone on Sundays and every week I was stronger and
after one ride where I went off the front with a strong Cat II racer they
talked me into sending off for my license.

I was always a rank amateur but I got fast enough to have a lot of fun.
I raced 2.5 years before the pressure of paying bills and finishing
college made me quit. At my fittest I was pinching below 5% body fat
and looking at myself in the mirror I realized that I was as lean as the
bike racers that seemed impossibly fit to me when I was in high school.
I don't know that I'd ever call myself an "excellent" cyclist but I
certainly saw a lot more success and fun on the bike than I ever did
running.
--
Bruce Jackson - Sr. Systems Programmer - DMSP, a M/A/R/C Group Company

"Number 9" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Thanks, I am a rank beginner, and your story does help, I never really rode.
Just started about 2 weeks ago, I can maintain 14mph right now, but hope to
get alot better. Is 14mph good for a rank beginner?

[snip]

14mph is fine for a beginner or anyone, for that matter, but ...

Unless you want to race, it doesn't really matter how fast you are.
Cycling is a good way to get around and see the world at whatever
speed you want to go.

If you do want to race, 14mph on a flat/rolling road course will leave
you way down the back of the lowest grade (probably).

The best thing to do as a beginner is to just relax, get out there and
ride!

Ritch

Yes, I am interested in racing. The 14mph was on a Hybrid bike, I ordered a
Cannondale R600 2-3 weeks ago, and am waiting for it. Hopefully it will
allow me to ride faster with the same effort.
Do you ride/race?

Thanks

"Ritch" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Number 9" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Thanks, I am a rank beginner, and your story does help, I never really

rode.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Just started about 2 weeks ago, I can maintain 14mph right now, but hope

to

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

get alot better. Is 14mph good for a rank beginner?

[snip]

14mph is fine for a beginner or anyone, for that matter, but ...

Unless you want to race, it doesn't really matter how fast you are.
Cycling is a good way to get around and see the world at whatever
speed you want to go.

If you do want to race, 14mph on a flat/rolling road course will leave
you way down the back of the lowest grade (probably).

The best thing to do as a beginner is to just relax, get out there and
ride!

Ritch

Number 9 said:

Thanks, I am a rank beginner, and your story does help, I never really rode.
Just started about 2 weeks ago, I can maintain 14mph right now, but hope to
get alot better. Is 14mph good for a rank beginner?

No.

Ok, what speed do people normally start out at?

"Bill Lloyd" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Number 9 said:

Thanks, I am a rank beginner, and your story does help, I never really

rode.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Just started about 2 weeks ago, I can maintain 14mph right now, but hope

to

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

get alot better. Is 14mph good for a rank beginner?

No.

I ran in high school and college -- 800 meters in 2'9", mile in 5'6",
typical 10K road race would be 36 to 38 minutes. I started cycling in
earnest while recovering from knee problems and discovered that, wow!
cycling doesn't hurt like running does.

Several friends encouraged me to get into USCF racing, but life got in
the way. Today, I'm a Fred who puts in about 50 commuting miles each
week plus a couple of 20-30 mile lunchtime rides. On the occasional
longer weekend recreational rides I average 16 mph over 40 miles,
putting me in the "mediocre" category around here. On club rides I get
dropped on the hills but catch the pack on the straights.

RFM

Number 9 said:

Ok, what speed do people normally start out at?

Here are the speeed ratings for a local bike club:

AVERAGE SPEEDS (MPH) FOR DIFFERENT RIDE CATEGORIES & HILLINESS
RATINGS
Approx. Hilliness
Ft./Mi. Rating
--------- ---------
0-25 1
25-50 2
50-75 3
75-100+ 4

AVERAGE SPEED (MPH) vs. HILLINESS and RIDE CATEGORY

1 2 3 4
--------------
A 10 8 6 NA
B 12 10 8 6
C 14 13 12 11
D 17 16 15 14
E 20 19 18 17
F 23 22 21 20

The bulk of the club riders are comfortable riding at a "C" pace,
and most new riders start out on "B" rides.

http://www.westernwheelers.org/main/schedules/ride_info.htm

--
terry morse Palo Alto, CA http://bike.terrymorse.com/