Cyclist charged in road death

Tue, 04 Jan 2005 05:49:41 GMT,
<[email hidden]>, "Robert J. Matter"

Quoted message said:

The Bicycle Campaign intends to meet with Gwinnett police to clarify the
department's interpretation of the law, Hoffarth said.

They should bring a rope.
--
zk

Zoot Katz said:

Quoted message said:

The Bicycle Campaign intends to meet with Gwinnett police to clarify the
department's interpretation of the law, Hoffarth said.

They should bring a rope.

For who Mr. Judge and Jury? Unless you're privy to more facts then were
in the original post, you can hardly make any kind of judgement on this.

Bicyclists will lose in all car-bike incidents, no matter whose at
fault. So just because it was the bicyclist that lost, it doesn't mean
he wasn't at fault.

Although it does seem a little harsh to give a citation after his buddy
is killed....

Rich

Robert J. Matter said:

http://www.ajc.com/metro/content/metro/gwinnett/0105/04cyclist.html

Cyclist charged in road death
Police allege misdemeanor violations by victim Serrano's companion

By JOHN GHIRARDINI
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
Published on: 01/04/05

Gwinnett police filed charges on Monday against a bicyclist whose
riding companion was struck and killed by a car on Peachtree
Industrial Boulevard in August.

Cyclist Brian Mock was cited on misdemeanor charges of riding too far
into a through lane and not having a red reflector on his bike, said
Gwinnett police spokesman Cpl. Dan Huggins.

Anthony Serrano, 35, who was riding with Mock, was struck and killed
about 5 a.m. Aug. 26 by a 1987 Honda Prelude driven by Luke Joseph
Nicolosi, 19, of Alpharetta. Mock received minor injuries; Nicolosi
was unhurt.

This the accident discussed in some detail at the time with a strong
suggestion that the second cyclist not the car driver was at fault.

http://groups.google.co.uk/groups?hl=en&lr=&safe=off&frame=right&rnum=1&thl=0,895094045,895089351,895078129,895047645,895044832,895042860,895038744,895013258,894981444,894948100,894946926&seekm=TYGXc.69943%24Fg5.36535%40attbi_s53#link1

or

http://makeashorterlink.com/?V5FC1582A

pk

Tue, 4 Jan 2005 19:21:45 +0000 (UTC),
<[email hidden]>, "pk"

Quoted message said:

This the accident discussed in some detail at the time with a strong
suggestion that the second cyclist not the car driver was at fault.

You and a few other apologist scud slaves may have concluded that but,
by-and-large, it seems cyclists were questioning the "investigator's"
finding that would blame a cyclist who was riding in the right place.
--
zk

Tue, 04 Jan 2005 09:23:55 -0700, <[email hidden]>,

Rich said:

Quoted message said:

They should bring a rope.

For who Mr. Judge and Jury? Unless you're privy to more facts then were
in the original post, you can hardly make any kind of judgement on this.

For the scum stuffed so-called "investigators" or any other apologist
scud slaves who would exonerate a killer because they figure the dead
cyclist got his comeuppance for being five feet out in the lane.
--
zk

"Zoot Katz" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Tue, 04 Jan 2005 09:23:55 -0700, <[email hidden]>,

Rich said:

Quoted message said:

They should bring a rope.

For who Mr. Judge and Jury? Unless you're privy to more facts then were
in the original post, you can hardly make any kind of judgement on this.

For the scum stuffed so-called "investigators" or any other apologist
scud slaves who would exonerate a killer because they figure the dead
cyclist got his comeuppance for being five feet out in the lane.
--
zk

That clearly articulated well considered view leaves one hoping that the
author is not a "cyclist". Certainly wouldn't want to be guilty by
association.
Bill

Wed, 05 Jan 2005 00:21:01 GMT,
<[email hidden]>,

Bill said:

That clearly articulated well considered view leaves one hoping that the
author is not a "cyclist". Certainly wouldn't want to be guilty by
association.

All scud punks are scum until proven otherwise. When they kill people
other than themselves with their POS scuds they've utterly proven
themselves contemptible scum.

Any questions?

In the original news story, before any investigation, police officer
Thaxton concluded the cyclist was at fault. "Bicyclists are supposed
to be on the right edge of the roadway, and they were not,"

It's highly unlikely the other cops would want to discover any reason
to contradict him after their so-called "investigation".
--
zk

Zoot Katz said:

All scud punks are scum until proven otherwise. When they kill people
other than themselves with their POS scuds they've utterly proven
themselves contemptible scum.

Any questions?

Just one. Were you born with a below average IQ, or did the educational
system simply fail on you?

Tue, 04 Jan 2005 18:45:32 -0700, <[email hidden]>,

scud jockey Rich said:

Were you born with a below average IQ, or did the educational
system simply fail on you?

I know enough to have figured out that scud jockeys are deadly stupid.
--
zk

"pk" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

This the accident discussed in some detail at the time

with a strong

Quoted message said:

suggestion that the second cyclist not the car driver was

at fault.

Quoted message said:

http://groups.google.co.uk/groups?hl=en&lr=&safe=off&frame=right&rnum=1&thl=0,895094045,895089351,895078129,895047645,895044832,895042860,895038744,895013258,894981444,894948100,894946926&seekm=TYGXc.69943%24Fg5.36535%40attbi_s53#link1

Quoted message said:

Frankly, having now read or skimmed 66 posts in that thread,
I'd be hard pressed to agree with your conclusion. To me, it
looks like the same long-winded speculation based on vague
news reports and coming to no meaningful conclusion that we
seem headed for here.

Here's some actual information ... not just BS speculation:

From: "Atlanta Bike" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

To: "ABC Members" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Subject: Gwinnett Cyclist Charged

Quoted message said:

Date: Wed, 5 Jan 2005 15:53:47 -0500

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Dear ABC Members,

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

If you haven't already heard, Gwinnett County police have decided

to charge cyclist Brian Mock as being at fault in the crash and death
of his riding partner Tony Serrano in August. For details, see the
articles from the AJC and Gwinnett Daily Post below.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

In a press release Monday, police said the cyclist was in the wrong

for riding "at least 5 feet out into the right through lane of
traffic, putting him in violation of [code section] 40-6-294." This
is the code section of Georgia traffic law which states: "Every
person operating a bicycle upon a roadway shall ride as near to the
right side of the roadway as practicable, except when turning left or
avoiding hazards to safe cycling, when the lane is too narrow to
share safely with a motor vehicle, when traveling at the same speed
as traffic, or while exercising care when passing a standing vehicle
or one proceeding on the same direction..."

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Basically, the police are saying that Mock did not have the legal

right to "take the lane". As you can see in the articles, we have
raised the point that indeed, cyclists are allowed to take the lane,
and we actually advise them to do so in many situations,
including "when the lane is too narrow to share safely with a motor
vehicle", as stated in the law. Yesterday, we measured the lane width
at the point of the crash - it is 11 feet 8 inches between lane
stripes. We intend to bring this to the attention of the Gwinnett
police, and ask them to address whether they have considered that
aspect of the code. It appears that "taking the lane" in this
situation was not only within the law, but the advisable thing to do
to avoid being clipped by cars, trucks and buses trying to squeeze
past in the narrow lane.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Regarding the charge that Mock's bike did not have a rear

reflector, we do not have any additional information. State law
requires that bicycles operated at nighttime be equiped with a "red
reflector on the rear". The law further states that "A light emmiting
a red light visible from .... the rear may be used in addition to the
red reflector."

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

We requested a meeting with the Gwinnett police shortly after the

crash. They agreed to meet with us, but not until they had further
examined the pertinent points of law. At that time, they had publicly
stated that the two cyclists were in the wrong for not riding on the
far right side of the "right turn only" lane. After receiving strong
advice from ABC and the Gwinnett Bicycle Users group, they backed off
of this position, but still found Mock to be at fault as stated
above.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

We hope that an actual meeting with the police will help clarify

this matter further, and that if the cyclist is being wrongfully
charged, they will correct that sooner than later.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

____ _o Dennis Hoffarth

Quoted message said:

___ _ \<, Executive Director

Quoted message said:

( )/ ( ) Atlanta Bicycle Campaign

Quoted message said:

404-881-1112

Quoted message said:

[email hidden]

Quoted message said:

www.atlantabike.org

Quoted message said:

--------------------------------------------------------------------

-----------------------------------

Quoted message said:

Cyclist charged in road death

Quoted message said:

Police allege misdemeanor violations by victim Serrano's companion

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

By JOHN GHIRARDINI

Quoted message said:

The Atlanta Journal-Constitution

Quoted message said:

Published on: 01/04/05

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Gwinnett police filed charges on Monday against a bicyclist whose

riding companion was struck and killed by a car on Peachtree
Industrial Boulevard in August.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Cyclist Brian Mock was cited on misdemeanor charges of riding too

far into a through lane and not having a red reflector on his bike,
said Gwinnett police spokesman Cpl. Dan Huggins.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Anthony Serrano, 35, who was riding with Mock, was struck and

killed about 5 a.m. Aug. 26 by a 1987 Honda Prelude driven by Luke
Joseph Nicolosi, 19, of Alpharetta. Mock received minor injuries;
Nicolosi was unhurt.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

According to police investigators, the collision occurred at a part

of Peachtree Industrial where two through lanes adjoin a right-turn-
only lane.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Serrano was in compliance with road rules, police said.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Mock was at least 5 feet out into the right through lane, police

said. When Nicolosi tried to evade Mock, he struck Serrano.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Investigators deemed the collision unavoidable, Huggins said, and

did not charge Nicolosi, who was driving within the speed limit. "It
was just a tragic accident," Huggins said.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

A local bicycle advocate questioned the charges against Mock.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

"My concern is a cyclist being wrongfully charged," said Dennis

Hoffarth, executive director of the Atlanta Bicycle Campaign.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

State law allows cyclists to occupy a lane further to the left than

normal if there are unusual circumstances, Hoffarth said. Those
include width of the lane and possible hazards on the road.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

The Bicycle Campaign intends to meet with Gwinnett police to

clarify the department's interpretation of the law, Hoffarth said.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

*******************************************

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Police fault bicyclist in fatal accident

Quoted message said:

by Andria Simmons

Quoted message said:

Gwinnett Daily Post

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

LAWRENCEVILLE - A confusing aspect of state law governing bicycles

on roadways may have contributed to the death of a bicyclist struck
by a car while pedaling down Peachtree Industrial Boulevard,
officials said.

Quoted message said:

Controversy over the interpretation of bicycle laws in Georgia has

swirled during the four-month Gwinnett police investigation into the
death of 35-year-old Antonio Serrano. The probe was one of the most
in-depth that the Accident Investigation Unit has ever conducted,
according to its supervisor, Sgt. Wayne Thaxton.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Authorities Monday announced charges were filed against Serrano's

friend and cycling partner, Brian Mock, for minor traffic and
equipment violations. Police allege Mock was riding too far inside
the right through-lane of travel on Peachtree Industrial Boulevard.
That section of the roadway has a right turn lane about 1,000 feet
long - 10 times longer than most turn lanes, according to Thaxton.

Quoted message said:

The driver of a 1987 Honda Prelude came up behind Mock, who was

about 5 feet inside the lane, swerved to miss him and then struck
Serrano. Serrano was riding a few feet ahead and to the right of Mock
on the edge of the right through-lane.

Quoted message said:

Serrano, a father of two who competed in triathlons, died at the

scene. Mock suffered minor injuries. The driver of the Prelude, Luke
Nicolosi, was not injured.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Bicyclists were assuming that the edge of the roadway was the fog

line dividing the right through-lane from the right turn lane,
according to Cpl. Dan Huggins. Police initially said the bicyclists
should have been riding next to the curb in the right turn lane.
However, they now acknowledge that the law could be interpreted both
ways. "The current bicycle laws can be confusing to the riders,"
Thaxton said. "The issue needs to be resolved." Thaxton said he will
notify the Georgia Department of Motor Vehicle Safety's legislative
liaison and the deputy legal counsel for Georgia State Patrol about
the problem. Both agencies would be able to lobby for a change in the
law at the state legislature.

Quoted message said:

Still, Thaxton said the cause of the fatal collision was Mock's

failure to ride along the edge of the right through- lane. Mock's
presence in the lane prompted Nicolosi to take evasive action and
then collide with Serrano, Huggins said. Mock also was cited for not
having a red reflector on the rear of his bicycle. No charges have
been filed against Nicolosi.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Mock could not be reached for comment on Monday. Serrano's brother,

Victor Serrano, said his family is ready to move on. He doesn't hold
any ill will toward Mock for the collision. On the contrary, Victor
Serrano believes Nicolosi should shoulder some of the blame for the
accident.

Quoted message said:

"I still think he's partially at fault because I think he was

distracted," Victor Serrano said. "I think if he would have been
paying attention, he could have avoided it."

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Bicycling enthusiasts hope Serrano's death will cause motorists to

pay more respect to bicyclists and promote a clearer understanding of
the law. Dennis Hoffarth, executive director of the Atlanta Bicycle
Campaign said he still has some questions about why police faulted
Mock instead of Nicolosi. In some circumstances, Hoffarth said his
organization advises bicyclists to "take the lane" and ride in the
center to clearly signal to approaching vehicles that there isn't
enough room to pass. "We need to be very careful that they are
accurately interpreting the law at this point," Hoffarth said. "We
have asked them for a meeting, and we hope to meet with them soon
about that."

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

A clarification in Georgia law about where bicycles should ride

with respect to turn lanes would benefit both cyclists and motorists,
Hoffarth said. One Georgia law (O.C.G.A. 40-6-291) states that the
rules of the road apply to bicycles. Another law (O.C.G.A. 40-6-294)
states that bicyclists should ride as close to the right side of the
roadway as practical.

Thu, 6 Jan 2005 16:54:40 -0500, <[email hidden]>,
"psycholist" <[email hidden]> copied and pasted the SOS:
\snip

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Bicyclists were assuming that the edge of the roadway was the fog
line dividing the right through-lane from the right turn lane,
according to Cpl. Dan Huggins. Police initially said the bicyclists
should have been riding next to the curb in the right turn lane.
However, they now acknowledge that the law could be interpreted both
ways. "The current bicycle laws can be confusing to the riders,"
Thaxton said. "The issue needs to be resolved." Thaxton said he will
notify the Georgia Department of Motor Vehicle Safety's legislative
liaison and the deputy legal counsel for Georgia State Patrol about
the problem. Both agencies would be able to lobby for a change in the
law at the state legislature.

So Thaxton is still confused about the law and figures the cyclists
were cofused too. WHAT A CROCK!

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Still, Thaxton said the cause of the fatal collision was Mock's
failure to ride along the edge of the right through- lane. Mock's
presence in the lane prompted Nicolosi to take evasive action and
then collide with Serrano, Huggins said. Mock also was cited for not
having a red reflector on the rear of his bicycle. No charges have
been filed against Nicolosi.

Quoted message said:

Mock could not be reached for comment on Monday. Serrano's brother,
Victor Serrano, said his family is ready to move on. He doesn't hold
any ill will toward Mock for the collision. On the contrary, Victor
Serrano believes Nicolosi should shoulder some of the blame for the
accident.

"I still think he's partially at fault because I think he was
distracted," Victor Serrano said. "I think if he would have been
paying attention, he could have avoided it."

Serrano was to Mock's right. Nicolosi's "evasive action" sounds like
an attempt to overtake Mock on his right.

The scud punk deserves crucifixion.
Maybe his mother is a former Miss America or something.
--
zk

psycholist said:

Here's some actual information ... not just BS speculation:

From: "Atlanta Bike" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

To: "ABC Members" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Subject: Gwinnett Cyclist Charged

Quoted message said:

Date: Wed, 5 Jan 2005 15:53:47 -0500

Quoted message said:

Dear ABC Members,

Quoted message said:

If you haven't already heard, Gwinnett County police have decided

to charge cyclist Brian Mock as being at fault in the crash and death
of his riding partner Tony Serrano in August. For details, see the
articles from the AJC and Gwinnett Daily Post below.

Quoted message said:

In a press release Monday, police said the cyclist was in the wrong

for riding "at least 5 feet out into the right through lane of
traffic, putting him in violation of [code section] 40-6-294." This
is the code section of Georgia traffic law which states: "Every
person operating a bicycle upon a roadway shall ride as near to the
right side of the roadway as practicable, except when turning left or
avoiding hazards to safe cycling, when the lane is too narrow to
share safely with a motor vehicle, when traveling at the same speed
as traffic, or while exercising care when passing a standing vehicle
or one proceeding on the same direction..."

Quoted message said:

Basically, the police are saying that Mock did not have the legal

right to "take the lane". As you can see in the articles, we have
raised the point that indeed, cyclists are allowed to take the lane,
and we actually advise them to do so in many situations,
including "when the lane is too narrow to share safely with a motor
vehicle", as stated in the law. Yesterday, we measured the lane width
at the point of the crash - it is 11 feet 8 inches between lane
stripes. We intend to bring this to the attention of the Gwinnett
police, and ask them to address whether they have considered that
aspect of the code. It appears that "taking the lane" in this
situation was not only within the law, but the advisable thing to do
to avoid being clipped by cars, trucks and buses trying to squeeze
past in the narrow lane.

Quoted message said:

Regarding the charge that Mock's bike did not have a rear

reflector, we do not have any additional information. State law
requires that bicycles operated at nighttime be equiped with a "red
reflector on the rear". The law further states that "A light emmiting
a red light visible from .... the rear may be used in addition to the
red reflector."

Quoted message said:

We requested a meeting with the Gwinnett police shortly after the

crash. They agreed to meet with us, but not until they had further
examined the pertinent points of law. At that time, they had publicly
stated that the two cyclists were in the wrong for not riding on the
far right side of the "right turn only" lane. After receiving strong
advice from ABC and the Gwinnett Bicycle Users group, they backed off
of this position, but still found Mock to be at fault as stated
above.

Quoted message said:

We hope that an actual meeting with the police will help clarify

this matter further, and that if the cyclist is being wrongfully
charged, they will correct that sooner than later.

Quoted message said:

____ _o Dennis Hoffarth

Quoted message said:

___ _ \<, Executive Director

Quoted message said:

( )/ ( ) Atlanta Bicycle Campaign

Quoted message said:

404-881-1112

Quoted message said:

[email hidden]

Quoted message said:

www.atlantabike.org

Quoted message said:

--------------------------------------------------------------------

-----------------------------------

Quoted message said:

Cyclist charged in road death

Quoted message said:

Police allege misdemeanor violations by victim Serrano's companion

Quoted message said:

By JOHN GHIRARDINI

Quoted message said:

The Atlanta Journal-Constitution

Quoted message said:

Published on: 01/04/05

Quoted message said:

Gwinnett police filed charges on Monday against a bicyclist whose

riding companion was struck and killed by a car on Peachtree
Industrial Boulevard in August.

Quoted message said:

Cyclist Brian Mock was cited on misdemeanor charges of riding too

far into a through lane and not having a red reflector on his bike,
said Gwinnett police spokesman Cpl. Dan Huggins.

Quoted message said:

Anthony Serrano, 35, who was riding with Mock, was struck and

killed about 5 a.m. Aug. 26 by a 1987 Honda Prelude driven by Luke
Joseph Nicolosi, 19, of Alpharetta. Mock received minor injuries;
Nicolosi was unhurt.

Quoted message said:

According to police investigators, the collision occurred at a part

of Peachtree Industrial where two through lanes adjoin a right-turn-
only lane.

Quoted message said:

Serrano was in compliance with road rules, police said.

Quoted message said:

Mock was at least 5 feet out into the right through lane, police

said. When Nicolosi tried to evade Mock, he struck Serrano.

Quoted message said:

Investigators deemed the collision unavoidable, Huggins said, and

did not charge Nicolosi, who was driving within the speed limit. "It
was just a tragic accident," Huggins said.

Quoted message said:

A local bicycle advocate questioned the charges against Mock.

Quoted message said:

"My concern is a cyclist being wrongfully charged," said Dennis

Hoffarth, executive director of the Atlanta Bicycle Campaign.

Quoted message said:

State law allows cyclists to occupy a lane further to the left than

normal if there are unusual circumstances, Hoffarth said. Those
include width of the lane and possible hazards on the road.

Quoted message said:

The Bicycle Campaign intends to meet with Gwinnett police to

clarify the department's interpretation of the law, Hoffarth said.

Quoted message said:

*******************************************

Quoted message said:

Police fault bicyclist in fatal accident

Quoted message said:

by Andria Simmons

Quoted message said:

Gwinnett Daily Post

Quoted message said:

LAWRENCEVILLE - A confusing aspect of state law governing bicycles

on roadways may have contributed to the death of a bicyclist struck
by a car while pedaling down Peachtree Industrial Boulevard,
officials said.

Quoted message said:

Controversy over the interpretation of bicycle laws in Georgia has

swirled during the four-month Gwinnett police investigation into the
death of 35-year-old Antonio Serrano. The probe was one of the most
in-depth that the Accident Investigation Unit has ever conducted,
according to its supervisor, Sgt. Wayne Thaxton.

Quoted message said:

Authorities Monday announced charges were filed against Serrano's

friend and cycling partner, Brian Mock, for minor traffic and
equipment violations. Police allege Mock was riding too far inside
the right through-lane of travel on Peachtree Industrial Boulevard.
That section of the roadway has a right turn lane about 1,000 feet
long - 10 times longer than most turn lanes, according to Thaxton.

Quoted message said:

The driver of a 1987 Honda Prelude came up behind Mock, who was

about 5 feet inside the lane, swerved to miss him and then struck
Serrano. Serrano was riding a few feet ahead and to the right of Mock
on the edge of the right through-lane.

Quoted message said:

Serrano, a father of two who competed in triathlons, died at the

scene. Mock suffered minor injuries. The driver of the Prelude, Luke
Nicolosi, was not injured.

Quoted message said:

Bicyclists were assuming that the edge of the roadway was the fog

line dividing the right through-lane from the right turn lane,
according to Cpl. Dan Huggins. Police initially said the bicyclists
should have been riding next to the curb in the right turn lane.
However, they now acknowledge that the law could be interpreted both
ways. "The current bicycle laws can be confusing to the riders,"
Thaxton said. "The issue needs to be resolved." Thaxton said he will
notify the Georgia Department of Motor Vehicle Safety's legislative
liaison and the deputy legal counsel for Georgia State Patrol about
the problem. Both agencies would be able to lobby for a change in the
law at the state legislature.

Quoted message said:

Still, Thaxton said the cause of the fatal collision was Mock's

failure to ride along the edge of the right through- lane. Mock's
presence in the lane prompted Nicolosi to take evasive action and
then collide with Serrano, Huggins said. Mock also was cited for not
having a red reflector on the rear of his bicycle. No charges have
been filed against Nicolosi.

Quoted message said:

Mock could not be reached for comment on Monday. Serrano's brother,

Victor Serrano, said his family is ready to move on. He doesn't hold
any ill will toward Mock for the collision. On the contrary, Victor
Serrano believes Nicolosi should shoulder some of the blame for the
accident.

Quoted message said:

"I still think he's partially at fault because I think he was

distracted," Victor Serrano said. "I think if he would have been
paying attention, he could have avoided it."

Quoted message said:

Bicycling enthusiasts hope Serrano's death will cause motorists to

pay more respect to bicyclists and promote a clearer understanding of
the law. Dennis Hoffarth, executive director of the Atlanta Bicycle
Campaign said he still has some questions about why police faulted
Mock instead of Nicolosi. In some circumstances, Hoffarth said his
organization advises bicyclists to "take the lane" and ride in the
center to clearly signal to approaching vehicles that there isn't
enough room to pass. "We need to be very careful that they are
accurately interpreting the law at this point," Hoffarth said. "We
have asked them for a meeting, and we hope to meet with them soon
about that."

Quoted message said:

A clarification in Georgia law about where bicycles should ride

with respect to turn lanes would benefit both cyclists and motorists,
Hoffarth said. One Georgia law (O.C.G.A. 40-6-291) states that the
rules of the road apply to bicycles. Another law (O.C.G.A. 40-6-294)
states that bicyclists should ride as close to the right side of the
roadway as practical.

And you people wonder why there are some places where I ride on the
wrong side. Taking the lane as if you were a car is totally stupid
because in a car you might get rear ended not killed. In this case if
the group is offended, too bad, I am alive and a cyclist is now "Dead
right." with the emphasis on DEAD. Almost all of the cyclist deaths
caused by interaction with a car I hear of are from a cyclist exercising
his/her 'right' to be treated like a car. Without 4,000 pounds of metal
surrounding you, you are of no consequence to the car.
The law is not necessarily in the interest of the survival of a cyclist.
As a rule the laws are written by fat, rich slobs who never ride.
Bill Baka

Thu, 06 Jan 2005 15:47:17 -0800, <[email hidden]>,

Bill Baka said:

And you people wonder why there are some places where I ride on the
wrong side.

I doubt you'd have done that in this situation.

(USGS image of the location of the collision)
http://tinyurl.com/4fhn9
--
zk

It's a shame that the victim was killed and from what I recall reading here in
this NG I would definitely assign a portion of the blame to the driver of the
car.
Having said that however, I would also assign a portion of the blame to the
other cyclist present, not because he took the lane but because he endangered
his friend in doing so.
Is it okay to take the lane if the situation warrants it? Absolutely. Is it
okay to do so at 5:00 am? Yes. Is it okay to do so without any rear reflector
or lighting to the rear? No. That appears to be what happened in this case.
*Two* people- Mock and Nicolosi- apparently screwed up and Serrano paid a
terrible price for their screwups. That Mock is a cyclist and that Serrano was
his friend doesn't change that. Based solely on what I've read in this NG about
the crash *both* deserve some type of penalty.

Regards,
Bob Hunt

Bill Baka said:

And you people wonder why there are some places where I ride on the
wrong side.

We _know_ why you ride on the wrong side, Bill. But some of us are a
little too polite to say it bluntly.

--
--------------------+
Frank Krygowski [To reply, remove rodent and vegetable dot com,
replace with cc.ysu dot edu]

Zoot Katz said:

Thu, 06 Jan 2005 15:47:17 -0800, <[email hidden]>,

Bill Baka said:

And you people wonder why there are some places where I ride on the
wrong side.

I doubt you'd have done that in this situation.

(USGS image of the location of the collision)
http://tinyurl.com/4fhn9

You are right, since I would not have ridden there in the daylight. What
appeared at first glance to be bike lanes are turn lanes for the cars.
Not a good layout for bicycling, and I would not have even ridden on the
wrong side in that case. Sidewalk time for me, and if that is deemed
illegal it would be time to make a hell of a lot of noise for bike
lanes, which if done there would require tearing up a lot of pavement
and starting over. This just reaffirms my belief that there are some
places where it is better not to ride, much less at 5:00 A.M. I also
didn't notice much in the way of street lighting so double bad by the
local planning commission. If that was a commute for them, I have to say
that they should have been lit up as much as possible since the cost of
a life is hardly offset by the expense of having lights on the bike.
Bill Baka

Frank Krygowski said:

Bill Baka said:

And you people wonder why there are some places where I ride on the
wrong side.

We _know_ why you ride on the wrong side, Bill. But some of us are a
little too polite to say it bluntly.

Yeah, I don't like getting whiffed by semis. The sudden rush of tailwind
is nice but not worth the danger.

Quoted message said:

I looked at the link showing the accident scene and I don't think there
was a good place to ride. What look like bike lanes are car turn lanes
and taking the lane at 5 in the morning is not the best thing to do from
a survival standpoint. The dead rider may have been technically
correct and politically correct for this group, but he is still dead.
There is a term for this, "DEAD right", which is used here in California
during one of the police driving adds on television once in a while.
Just because you are in the right don't assume the other driver is going
to respect that. Always assume the person behind the wheel does not know
how to drive and have an exit strategy. I suspect the rider who was
killed must have at least seen headlights coming up behind him and
should have had a chance to get over. The police report should be
interesting.
It is too bad that a bicyclist got killed for no other reason than
'Proper cycling' but it does happen.
My condolences,
Bill Baka

"Hunrobe" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

It's a shame that the victim was killed and from what I recall reading
here in
this NG I would definitely assign a portion of the blame to the driver of
the
car.
Having said that however, I would also assign a portion of the blame to
the
other cyclist present, not because he took the lane but because he
endangered
his friend in doing so.
Is it okay to take the lane if the situation warrants it? Absolutely. Is
it
okay to do so at 5:00 am? Yes. Is it okay to do so without any rear
reflector
or lighting to the rear? No. That appears to be what happened in this
case.
*Two* people- Mock and Nicolosi- apparently screwed up and Serrano paid a
terrible price for their screwups. That Mock is a cyclist and that Serrano
was
his friend doesn't change that. Based solely on what I've read in this NG
about
the crash *both* deserve some type of penalty.

Maybe so, but the driver had to be attempting to pass on the right, using a
right-turn lane, in order to hit the rightmost cyclist who himself was
properly positioned. The business about the lack of a reflector may or may
not be a contributing factor, but the collision would not have happened if
the driver had acted properly and legally, passing on the left. This was,
after all, a four-lane (6 if you count the turn lanes) road.

If the driver didn't see the bike with no reflector, then he didn't see the
bike that did have a reflector -- the one he hit -- either.

If GA law lets riders ride two abreast (and it does), then it sounds to me
like both riders were legally positioned; one in the rightmost position of
the thru lane, the other abreast of him on his left.

If bikes are vehicles under GA law (and they are), then the "as far right as
practicable" condition for a rider legally riding abreast of another would
be pretty near the middle of the lane, since it's not "practicable" to ride
too close to another rider.

I really get stuck on the fact that the driver moved to the right when there
was an empty thru lane on his left.

And even granting everything you say and conceding that the leftmost cyclist
shares responsibility, that has no bearing -- no bearing, I repeat -- on the
likelihood that the authorities are trying to blame the cyclist instead of
the driver. That's indefensible, evil, and intolerable.

RichC