Donating Blood

runmum <[email hidden]> wrote in news:404729AD.8090705
@outrunningyahoo.ca:

Quoted message said:

I know some of you donate blood and others don't so I thought I would pass along this tip.

I didn't give blood for years because I was either pregnant or had small kids. I have just started
to give regularly again. The first time it went okay but yesterday I was really slow.

The nurse told me that with my pulse rate (48) it would be better if I drank a lot of liquids in
the two hours leading up to the donation. I had only had one glass of water. I felt fine but would
have preferred to be out of there in less than the 25 minutes it took :-)

I've found that a lot of nurses think there is something wrong with you if you have a low pulse
rate. Did you tell the nurse that you are a runner?

Phil
--

"You probably wouldn't worry about what people think of you if you knew how
seldom they do. -Olin Miller

The last time I went in with a pulse of 48, they told me I couldn't donate. After a bit of
discussion, they told me I could, if I could give them a sufficient excuse for having such a low
rate. I told them I had been running for years and training for a marathon for several months. That
was good enough for them.

By the way, I really think that loading up on water before donating does speed things up. I may be
imagining it, but I don't think so.

Brian Jones

"Phil M." <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

runmum <[email hidden]> wrote in news:404729AD.8090705 @outrunningyahoo.ca:

Quoted message said:

I know some of you donate blood and others don't so I thought I would pass along this tip.

I didn't give blood for years because I was either pregnant or had small kids. I have just
started to give regularly again. The first time it went okay but yesterday I was really slow.

The nurse told me that with my pulse rate (48) it would be better if I drank a lot of liquids in
the two hours leading up to the donation. I had only had one glass of water. I felt fine but
would have preferred to be out of there in less than the 25 minutes it took :-)

I've found that a lot of nurses think there is something wrong with you if you have a low pulse
rate. Did you tell the nurse that you are a runner?

Phil
--

"You probably wouldn't worry about what people think of you if you knew

how

Quoted message said:

seldom they do. -Olin Miller

my pulse is often below 50... so when i get ready to donate, i do drink a lot anyway, but i also
let them know in advance that as a runner my pulse is often below their 50 limit-- and i have never
been refused.

they love us O negatives...

runmum <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

I know some of you donate blood and others don't so I thought I would pass along this tip.

I didn't give blood for years because I was either pregnant or had small kids. I have just started
to give regularly again. The first time it went okay but yesterday I was really slow.

The nurse told me that with my pulse rate (48) it would be better if I drank a lot of liquids in
the two hours leading up to the donation. I had only had one glass of water. I felt fine but would
have preferred to be out of there in less than the 25 minutes it took :-)

Donna

I'm a nurse and the reason your nurse was probably surprised is because we see very few fit people
these days and thus must resting HRs are around 80-100. I've see people laying supine with HRs of
150 and they don't know the difference.

jOe

"Phil M." <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

runmum <[email hidden]> wrote in news:404729AD.8090705 @outrunningyahoo.ca:

Quoted message said:

I know some of you donate blood and others don't so I thought I would pass along this tip.

I didn't give blood for years because I was either pregnant or had small kids. I have just
started to give regularly again. The first time it went okay but yesterday I was really slow.

The nurse told me that with my pulse rate (48) it would be better if I drank a lot of liquids in
the two hours leading up to the donation. I had only had one glass of water. I felt fine but
would have preferred to be out of there in less than the 25 minutes it took :-)

I've found that a lot of nurses think there is something wrong with you if you have a low pulse
rate. Did you tell the nurse that you are a runner?

Phil
--

"You probably wouldn't worry about what people think of you if you knew

how

Quoted message said:

seldom they do. -Olin Miller

"Joe" <[email hidden]> wrote in
:"]news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

I'm a nurse and the reason your nurse was probably surprised is because we see very few fit people
these days and thus must resting HRs are around 80-100. I've see people laying supine with HRs of
150 and they don't know the difference.

I work in a hospital and I see some of this. I don't deal directly with patients, but I've noticed
the monitors in the nurses stations in the CCU and ICU. I've seen several HRs at a constant rate of
over 100. It makes me feel badly for them, while at the same time I feel gratefull that I am healthy
and able to enjoy life.

Phil

--
"There may be said to be two classes of people in the world: those who
constantly divide the people of the world into two classes, and those who
do not." ­ -Benchley

On Thu, 04 Mar 2004 12:05:53 GMT, runmum <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

I know some of you donate blood and others don't so I thought I would pass along this tip.

I didn't give blood for years because I was either pregnant or had small kids. I have just started
to give regularly again. The first time it went okay but yesterday I was really slow.

The nurse told me that with my pulse rate (48) it would be better if I drank a lot of liquids in
the two hours leading up to the donation. I had only had one glass of water. I felt fine but would
have preferred to be out of there in less than the 25 minutes it took :-)

Donna

I've donated blood twice. I would have been happy with a 25 minute time. It took me 40 minutes.
Donating blook set back my perceived fitness level for two mnths.

Joe said:

I'm a nurse and the reason your nurse was probably surprised is because we see very few fit people
these days and thus must resting HRs are around 80-100. I've see people laying supine with HRs of
150 and they don't know the difference.

jOe

"Phil M." <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

runmum <[email hidden]> wrote in news:404729AD.8090705 @outrunningyahoo.ca:

Quoted message said:

I know some of you donate blood and others don't so I thought I would pass along this tip.

I didn't give blood for years because I was either pregnant or had small kids. I have just
started to give regularly again. The first time it went okay but yesterday I was really slow.

The nurse told me that with my pulse rate (48) it would be better if I drank a lot of liquids
in the two hours leading up to the donation. I had only had one glass of water. I felt fine but
would have preferred to be out of there in less than the 25 minutes it took :-)

I've found that a lot of nurses think there is something wrong with you if you have a low pulse
rate. Did you tell the nurse that you are a runner?

Phil
--

"You probably wouldn't worry about what people think of you if you knew

how

Quoted message said:

seldom they do. -Olin Miller

About 12 years ago I had some day surgery. During recovery they had to reset the monitor because my
resting pulse was under 40.

runmum said:

I know some of you donate blood and others don't so I thought I would pass along this tip.

I didn't give blood for years because I was either pregnant or had small kids. I have just started
to give regularly again. The first time it went okay but yesterday I was really slow.

The nurse told me that with my pulse rate (48) it would be better if I drank a lot of liquids in
the two hours leading up to the donation. I had only had one glass of water. I felt fine but would
have preferred to be out of there in less than the 25 minutes it took :-)

Donna

Funny, I just donated on Tuesday, na the nurse gave the same comment about fluids. But she implied
that it would make it easier for her to find the vein!

FWIW, I've donated on and off for many years (I'm up to 5.5gallons). It's affects on my running seem
to go away in just a couple days (though today's run was tough, but not 100% sure its the donation).

I guess the point is to make sure you increase fluids before as well as after a donation.

And on the theoretical side, I've wondered if regular donations could work a little like training at
altitude. Not the same of course since you can only do it every 56 days.

--
Ed Prochak running faqs.orgrunning faqOpen ↗ netiquette psg.comemily.htmlOpen ↗
--
"Two roads diverged in a wood and I
I took the one less travelled by
and that has made all the difference."
robert frost

xenman <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

On Thu, 04 Mar 2004 12:05:53 GMT, runmum <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

The nurse told me that with my pulse rate (48) it would be better if I drank a lot of liquids in
the two hours leading up to the donation.

The advice is good whatever your pulse rate is, but I´m amazed that your pulse gets checked; is it
intended as a check to rule out undesirable donors (not that it is immediately obvious how effective
it would be as such) or a precaution against possible lawsuits from donors who faint?

(Here we merely fill in a questionnaire, which the nurse then has a look at.)

Quoted message said:

I've donated blood twice. I would have been happy with a 25 minute time. It took me 40 minutes.
Donating blook set back my perceived fitness level for two mnths.

Are you referring to the time from stepping in to stepping out after drinking a cup of coffee?:-)

I have the impression it takes more like four minutes
- which depends on the volume your heart pumps per minute at rest, not on your pulse rate - to fill
a bag of whole blood, and there aren´t any effects felt after three weeks, providing you eat
properly and aren´t already (borderline) anemic.

OTOH if you donated plasma - which takes 40 minutes - there shouldn´t have been any effect lasting
longer than a few days, IMHO.

Anders

Anders Lustig said:

The advice is good whatever your pulse rate is, but I´m amazed that your pulse gets checked; is it
intended as a check to rule out undesirable donors (not that it is immediately obvious how
effective it would be as such) or a precaution against possible lawsuits from donors who faint?

This is with Canadian Blood Services. The nurses have one of those portable blood
pressure/temperature/heart rate machines and everyone gets checked. I assume if you are off the
range on either side they might exclude you.

and drug use :-)

When the nurse saw my heart rate she asked me if I "worked out". The next nurse looked closely at me
and asked if I was a runner.

Quoted message said:

Are you referring to the time from stepping in to stepping out after drinking a cup of coffee?:-)

I have the impression it takes more like four minutes
- which depends on the volume your heart pumps per minute at rest, not on your pulse rate - to
fill a bag of whole blood, and there aren´t any effects felt after three weeks, providing you
eat properly and aren´t already (borderline) anemic.

The woman donating next to me took about 15 minutes. I think that is about normal.

Three weeks is too long to feel the effects, in my opinion. I'm only a runner, though, I'm not
competing or training twice a day, just a 30 mile a week usual.

Donna

OK, donating blood is bad.........got it. Thanks.

runmum said:

Anders Lustig said:

I have the impression it takes more like four minutes
- which depends on the volume your heart pumps per minute at rest, not on your pulse rate - to
fill a bag of whole blood, and there aren´t any effects felt after three weeks, providing you
eat properly and aren´t already (borderline) anemic.

The woman donating next to me took about 15 minutes. I think that is about normal.

I haven't donated often since I used to be anemic, but the successful times were about 5-10 min,
iirc. One time it clotted since it wasn't getting enough flow. That time, I thought they said they
start looking carefully if it's not done in about 15 min or so, since clotting's likely to be an
issue by then. Their time slots are also 15 min. I think they had me in the couch for 30-45 min that
time since there were delays starting, tried a 2nd, smaller needle (defective) in other arm, and a
few other things.

A hint they gave me that time - after everything - was to be sure to relax hand completely between
squeezes to allow things to refill. I don't think I had relaxed my hand enough that time since I was
tense (*not* my first time donating) - tight schedule, they were running late, and there was an
obnoxious violent cartoon on the video. I paid more attention to relaxing between squeezes this time
and filled in about 5 min, about half the time it's taken in the past. I was also sure to drink a
lot before hand, but was doing that after Sat race anyway.

As far as how long in the office - usually 45 min to 1.5 hr = wait, paperwork, wait, pre-check (hr,
bp, temperature, hematocrit, paperwork), wait, donate, recovery (=cookies and juice). I'm not sure
if this is typical of other places or not.

Dot

--
"Success is different things to different people" -Bernd Heinrich in Racing the Antelope

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I've donated blood twice. I would have been happy with a 25 minute time. It took me 40 minutes.
Donating blook set back my perceived fitness level for two mnths.

Are you referring to the time from stepping in to stepping out after drinking a cup of coffee?:-)

I have the impression it takes more like four minutes
- which depends on the volume your heart pumps per minute at rest, not on your pulse rate - to
fill a bag of whole blood, and there aren´t any effects felt after three weeks, providing you
eat properly and aren´t already (borderline) anemic.

OTOH if you donated plasma - which takes 40 minutes - there shouldn´t have been any effect lasting
longer than a few days, IMHO.

It took 40 minutes with the needle in my arm to donate whole blood. The technician was constantly
coming back to check up on me and to use a device to move the blood from the plastic tub to the
recepticle.

runmum said:

The nurse told me that with my pulse rate (48) it would be
better if I drank a lot of liquids in the two hours
leading up to the donation.

Ok, folks, time to explain things.

The Red Cross has 2 cutoffs on heart rate. Under 50 they
will refuse you unless you have the good reason of being
athletically trained. Under 45 they don't care what your
excuse is and they will not take your blood. I know. I was
refused with a pulse of 41. Didn't matter that I run 30+
miles a week. Also didn't matter that I'm an attending
physician and I'm the doctor who might be ordering the blood
for use in a transfusion. Didn't matter that I'm the doctor
for some of the people who work there. They are trained to
be VERY careful about whom they accept blood from.

Their logic makes sense. The absolute safety of the blood
supply is in their hands. Testing blood is a good way to try
to keep bad stuff out of it, but you can't test for
everything that needs testing. Therefore, they rely on the
questionnaires much more strongly than scientific blood
testing to keep the blood supply clean.

Reasons why they might not want the blood of someone with a
pulse of 41:
- donor couldbe in 3rd degree heart block, serious disease,
needs to keep his blood!
- donor could be on medicines which slow the heart which
recipient shouldn't get
- donor on heart-slowing medicines may have diseases
requiring those medicines which also requires a full
circulating blood volume, needs to keep his blood

Get the picture?

What to do in order to raise your pulse? I do the following:
1) drink a cup of coffee, caffeine raises heart rate
2) run from Red Cross parking lot to donation building to
get pulse up before going in the door

What could be easier? -- Josh Steinberg MD, Syracuse

Josh Steinberg said:

Ok, folks, time to explain things.

<snip>

Very interesting, Josh. I am in Canada but I am sure our
Blood Services has similar cut-offs for pulse. They ask a
whole load of questions too, which makes me feel more secure
about the supply.

Running from the parking lot wouldn't help much here since
you end up sitting for quite a while until your pulse is
taken. I get the idea, though. I'll try some coffee next
time. I would hate for a very healthy person like me to be
refused :-)

Donna

Josh Steinberg <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Reasons why they might not want the blood of someone with
a pulse of 41:
- donor couldbe in 3rd degree heart block, serious
disease, needs to keep his blood!

If this condition can be asymptomatic, then I can see a
certain point. (But apparently here it´s considered a very
low-probability risk and the question "Have you had any of
the following (symptoms)?" suffices.

Quoted message said:

- donor could be on medicines which slow the heart which
recipient shouldn't get
- donor on heart-slowing medicines may have diseases
requiring those medicines which also requires a full
circulating blood volume, needs to keep his blood

Here it seems it´s trusted that people will answer the
question "Are you on any medification?" truthfully (and not
likely to have a serious memory blackout).

Quoted message said:

Get the picture?

Yes - but is it true that people with congenitally large
hearts/low HRs run a higher risk of fainting after a (whole)
blood donation?

Quoted message said:

What to do in order to raise your pulse? I do the
following:
1) drink a cup of coffee, caffeine raises heart rate
2) run from Red Cross parking lot to donation building to
get pulse up before going in the door

Now you´ve gone and ruined an important feature of the
screening system! Just think if a potential donor of the
kind you described reads this newsgroup and is hell bent on
getting his blood accepted:-)

Anders

Anders Lustig said:

Here it seems it´s trusted that people will answer the
question "Are you on any medification?" truthfully (and
not likely to have a serious memory blackout).

This may not be relevant in this case, but I was behind an
elderly (70+?) auto-donor (one donating for his own surgery)
the other day. The attendants apparently have more paperwork
to do and more medications to check. But it was obvious he
(the donor / recipient) was having trouble answering the
questions ("serious memory blackout" or insufficient
knowledge of drugs he was taking). Of the assortment of
medications he was taking, did any have aspirin, etc. I
presume it was a relative there with him assisting, but I
could easily see an incorrect answer coming from him
unintentionally.

Since he would be receiving the blood in this case, it may
not have made a difference. But had he been a regular donor,
there may have been a possibility of incorrect answer. But
maybe there's some checks in the system since I'm sure it
was obvious to the attendants.

Dot

--
"Success is different things to different people" -Bernd
Heinrich in Racing the Antelope

Anders Lustig said:

Here it seems it´s trusted that people will answer the
question "Are you on any medification?" truthfully (and
not likely to have a serious memory blackout).

Do not underestimate the ability for patients to omit stuff
from their health history. Everyone who works in a doctors
office or ER knows that if 6 people take a health history
(intern, fellow, triage nurse, attending ER doc, admitting
doc, etc.), you get 6 subtly or not so subtly different sets
of info. People are not dumb, just remember different info
depending on how the questions are asked and how many times
you ask 'em.

"No, I don't take any medicines." "What about birth
control?" "Oh, yeah, of course, birth control pill every
day. But no medicines."

"What do you take Atenolol for?" "High blood pressure." "Oh,
really? You didn't mention high blood pressure a moment
ago." "Oh, yeah, I've had that for years."

"So you have asthma?" "Yes." "But you said you take no
medicines." "Oh, well, I mean I only use my puffer when I
have a flare up of my asthma." "Ah, I see."

"Do you take any medicines?" "No." "How 'bout over-the-
counter stuff like aspirin, tylenol, vitamins, supplements,
and so forth?" "I get a lot of headaches, so I take five or
ten or fifteen Ibuprofens a day." "Really! I bet that might
have something to do with you being weak, dizzy, and passing
bloody stools, but let's keep going through your health
history and then I'll examine you."

Would you like a few dozen more permutations?!? -- Josh
Steinberg MD, Syracuse

Josh Steinberg <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Here it seems it´s trusted that people will answer the
question "Are you on any medification?" truthfully (and
not likely to have a serious memory blackout).

"Yes, I took two Asperifins.":-)

Quoted message said:

Do not underestimate the ability for patients to omit
stuff from their health history. Everyone who works in a
doctors office or ER knows that if 6 people take a health
history (intern, fellow, triage nurse, attending ER doc,
admitting doc, etc.), you get 6 subtly or not so subtly
different sets of info. People are not dumb, just remember
different info depending on how the questions are asked
and how many times you ask 'em.

Patients, even when they aren´t in an acute distress, are
often too preoccupied about whatever they went to see the
doc for or about whatever they think will be done to them.
Potential blood donors are usually less distracted by such
concerns and thus less prone to similar lapses of memory.

(Patients can also wish to be a bit elliptic, but donors
have the option of not turning up in the first place.)

Quoted message said:

Would you like a few dozen more permutations?!?

While not all of them were relevant to donating blood (and
the relevant ones would be met by one of the itemized
questions about general health, syndromes or medicines
listed in the questionnaire and/or by a follow-up query by
the nurse), I appreciate the view into the everyday life of
a practising mediciner:-)

Anders