Ever Ride in City Traffic?

Many moons ago, I commuted into NYC on an upright (over the GWB into
midtown). At the risk of getting flamed, I would not ride a recumbent
in NYC. The reasons are many: acceleration, jumping curbs and potholes,
visibility, etc. Maybe someone here will disagree with me and set me
straight, but that is my 2 cents worth.

"rBOB" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Many moons ago, I commuted into NYC on an upright (over the GWB into
midtown). At the risk of getting flamed, I would not ride a recumbent
in NYC. The reasons are many: acceleration, jumping curbs and potholes,
visibility, etc. Maybe someone here will disagree with me and set me
straight, but that is my 2 cents worth.

rBOB is right. Recumbents really don't work all that well in heavy city
traffic, especially for something as wild as bike messaging. You want to be
on an upright where you can be like a deer. On a recumbent, you will be like
a hedgehog and nothing but an accident waiting to happen.

I have deleted the other newsgroups as posting a message to more than one
newsgroup is an abomination. There ought to be a law against it.

Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota

"NYC XYZ" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

NYC, that is! On a weekday in mid-town Manhattan? I did bike
messenging for almost two months one summer -- only job where I wish I
had more time in the day for (second hardest after Army infantry, no
joke!) -- and now that I'm curious about recumbents, I'm trying to
picture myself in all kinds of situations.

How do you lock up a 'bent, anyway?

Is it good for weaving in and out of traffic?

Does it brake just like an upright?

Is it harder to go real slow?

Ever run red lights with them?

How would they fare on the sidewalk? How well do they go over curbs
and speed bumps?

Ever get mugged on one? (Serious! Twice I had to jet away from some
miscreants in broad daylight in the parks.)

And apparently they make lots of squeaky noises??

And they're actually worse for certain kinds of back problems???

Why post this message to multiple newsgroups when what you want to know will
only be found on ARBR.

I once spent several years in NYC and never saw a single recumbent bicycle.
Forget nyc.general.

Rec.bicycles.misc is too miscellaneous for any information of a worthwhile
nature.

If you want to know something about recumbents, then post to ARBR and only
to ARBR. After all, we are the experts on the subject of recumbents. All you
will get from other newsgroups is a lot of bum information.

Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota

Edward Dolan said:

Why post this message to multiple newsgroups when what you want to know will
only be found on ARBR.

I doubt that. I didn't even know ARBR existed until half-way through
my research into recumbents!

Quoted message said:

I once spent several years in NYC and never saw a single recumbent bicycle.
Forget nyc.general.

You tend to see them mostly during the annual 5 Boro Bike Tour, but you
know, it was this past Thursday, when I saw the stereotypical fat
bearded middle-aged white guy on a 'bent that I remembered my long-ago
interest in those bikes.

Quoted message said:

Rec.bicycles.misc is too miscellaneous for any information of a worthwhile
nature.

I dunno...was hoping there'd be folks like myself, upright riders who
also believe in the virtues of a 'bent.

I guess I'll stick to my Trek 7500FX for NYC, then, and use a 'bent for
other travels.

Quoted message said:

If you want to know something about recumbents, then post to ARBR and only
to ARBR. After all, we are the experts on the subject of recumbents. All you
will get from other newsgroups is a lot of bum information.

Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota

Yes, Your Cycleness!

Hmm...is it not possible to have a rather more upright position -- but
still relatively reclined compared to real uprights -- and maybe front
wheel drive? Someone ought to design a bike that's half-way between an
upright and a 'bent...it'd be more upright than 'bent, but still
recognizably non-upright...the legs are elevated just enough to allow
for a real seat, but an upright otherwise so as to be manuverable....

Like http://www.easyracers.com/ ?

NYC XYZ said:

NYC, that is! On a weekday in mid-town Manhattan? I did bike
messenging for almost two months one summer -- only job where I wish I
had more time in the day for (second hardest after Army infantry, no
joke!) -- and now that I'm curious about recumbents, I'm trying to
picture myself in all kinds of situations.

<snip>

I've never ridden in NYC. As far as major cities go, I've only ridden
in Atlanta, GA, Birmingham, AL, and Paris, France.

Paris was easily the scariest. Also, it was my first time riding on the
streets of a major city ever, so let's throw that one out.

Atlanta and B'ham: There's no way these towns even compare to the
ruggedness required for NYC. And I can't even imagine riding a
recumbent in those places. So NYC just seems out of the question to me.

--
Paul M. Hobson
Georgia Institute of Technology
http://www.underthecouch.org
..:you may want to fix my email
address before you send anything:.

NYC XYZ asked:

Quoted message said:

How do you lock up a 'bent, anyway?

I use a motorcycle cable and Master padlock.

Quoted message said:

Is it good for weaving in and out of traffic?

No.

Quoted message said:

Does it brake just like an upright?

Better, because there's no danger of a header.

Quoted message said:

Is it harder to go real slow?

At first, yes -- but with practice, not much.

Quoted message said:

Ever run red lights with them?

No. Running a red light in city traffic can be the last stupid mistake
you ever get to make.

Quoted message said:

How would they fare on the sidewalk?

Not as maneouverable as an upright.

Quoted message said:

How well do they go over curbs and speed bumps?

Not well.

Quoted message said:

Ever get mugged on one?

No. I was mugged on my upright by two attackers, though. After I
flat-backed the first one, the second one shagged ass. I'm not a good
choice of target by a mugger: I don't carry money or valuables, but I do
carry over 200 pounds of bad attitude.

Quoted message said:

And apparently they make lots of squeaky noises??

No.

Quoted message said:

And they're actually worse for certain kinds of back problems???

I can't imagine the kind of back problem for which a recumbent is worse
than an upright.

--
"Bicycling is a healthy and manly pursuit with much
to recommend it, and, unlike other foolish crazes,
it has not died out." -- The Daily Telegraph (1877)

"Paul Hobson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Paris was easily the scariest. Also, it was my first time riding on the
streets of a major city ever, so let's throw that one out.

Yet I loved cycling in Paris - the Parisian rush hour was so easy! Yes, it
was busy, but the motorists had such an excellent attitude to cyclists,
giving me loads of room. As well as me cycling, my husband and our then 14
year-old son cycled said Parisian rush hour, and we all thought the same. At
the hotel where we were staying was an American (Texan, but no, not that
one) who was also cycling and he too thought cycling in Paris was fun. Are
we talking the same Paris? ;-)

Cheers, helen s

I ride in NYC traffic and I see recumbents from time to time,
especially with the critical mass groups. Even with the 8 foot flags,
the fear I have is cars can't see that low.

I was off the bike for five years and then popped into a shop and test
rode a carbon fiber bianchi through Times Square in rush hour, I was
hooked.

People ask me, but I explain you never forget how to ride, it's just
like riding a bicycle, you never forget!

How is that for clever?

NYC XYZ said:

NYC, that is! On a weekday in mid-town Manhattan? I did bike
messenging for almost two months one summer -- only job where I wish I
had more time in the day for (second hardest after Army infantry, no
joke!) -- and now that I'm curious about recumbents, I'm trying to
picture myself in all kinds of situations.

Most of the questions you ask don't have specific answers, because
'bents are not a single functional class of cycle, just a general
description of the seating layout. What goes for a BikeE will not
necessarily go for an Anthrotech touring trike, and what goes for that
probably has little to do with what will go for an M5 Lowracer.

Quoted message said:

How do you lock up a 'bent, anyway?

Most have some sort of frame/wheel interface where you do it same as you
would a DF. But not all of them.

Quoted message said:

Is it good for weaving in and out of traffic?

As above, /very/ much implementation dependent. A compact city 'bent
like the HPVel Spirit, pretty good, a lowracer or a long wheelbase
tourer will suck at it Bigtime.

Quoted message said:

Does it brake just like an upright?

Most of them brake considerably better. With a lower centre of mass
there's far less tendency to disappear over the bars, so usually a skid
is the worst you can manage. Being usually pricier, 'bents are
typically aimed at a market who appreciate more expensive things, like
hydraulic disc brakes, and that can be a factor too.

Quoted message said:

Is it harder to go real slow?

On a bike, as a rule of thumb the lower the seat is the harder really
slow travel is. On a trike, you can do an indefinite track stand if
you want to.

Quoted message said:

Ever run red lights with them?

Same as on an upwrong, something that is possible, but I don't do,
'cause it's Very Dumb.

Quoted message said:

How would they fare on the sidewalk?

Same as on an upwrong, depends on the other population and not something
I go in for.

Quoted message said:

How well do they go over curbs and speed bumps?

You typically can't hop the front wheel, so going up kerbs is a question
of wheel size and suspension. Going down them isn't really a problem
IME. Speed bumps will also vary with wheel size and suspension, but you
won't go over the bars if you hit a nasty one unexpectedly.

Quoted message said:

Ever get mugged on one? (Serious! Twice I had to jet away from some
miscreants in broad daylight in the parks.)

I haven't been...

Quoted message said:

And apparently they make lots of squeaky noises??

Oh. Mine doesn't. No particular reason they should be squeakier than
any other bike AFAICT.

Quoted message said:

And they're actually worse for certain kinds of back problems???

For /some/, yes. But probably a typical upwrong crouch will be worse
for rather more. If your back problem is made worse by a recumbent
position then something /really/ upright (maybe a Pedersen) would be a
possibility in the other direction worth considering.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

"wafflycat" <waffles*A*T*v21net*D*O*T*co*D*O*T*uk> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Paul Hobson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Paris was easily the scariest. Also, it was my first time riding on the
streets of a major city ever, so let's throw that one out.

Yet I loved cycling in Paris - the Parisian rush hour was so easy! Yes, it
was busy, but the motorists had such an excellent attitude to cyclists,
giving me loads of room. As well as me cycling, my husband and our then 14
year-old son cycled said Parisian rush hour, and we all thought the same.
At the hotel where we were staying was an American (Texan, but no, not
that one) who was also cycling and he too thought cycling in Paris was
fun. Are we talking the same Paris? ;-)

Cheers, helen s

helen s most likely has Paris, France confused with Paris, Texas. Paris,
Texas is doubtless a fun town in which to ride a bicycle. Paris, France is a
haven for traitors and cowards to the West and a real American would not be
caught dead there on a bicycle - or on anything else either for that matter.
Let us leave the despicable French to themselves. The less said about them
the better.

Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota

"NYC XYZ" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Edward Dolan said:

Why post this message to multiple newsgroups when what you want to know
will
only be found on ARBR.

I doubt that. I didn't even know ARBR existed until half-way through
my research into recumbents!

We are an elite group of cyclists and we do not often deign to honor others
with our august presence.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I once spent several years in NYC and never saw a single recumbent
bicycle.
Forget nyc.general.

You tend to see them mostly during the annual 5 Boro Bike Tour, but you
know, it was this past Thursday, when I saw the stereotypical fat
bearded middle-aged white guy on a 'bent that I remembered my long-ago
interest in those bikes.

That must have been Larry Varney of this group that you saw. He is old, he
is ugly and he has a white beard down to his knees. He is from Kentucky but
he likes to get around and do tours in various parts of the country.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Rec.bicycles.misc is too miscellaneous for any information of a
worthwhile
nature.

I dunno...was hoping there'd be folks like myself, upright riders who
also believe in the virtues of a 'bent.

Nope, ARBR is your best bet. Most upright cyclists do not know squat about
recumbents, and what they think they do know is mostly wrong.

Quoted message said:

I guess I'll stick to my Trek 7500FX for NYC, then, and use a 'bent for
other travels.

You have got that right, NYC XYZ!

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

If you want to know something about recumbents, then post to ARBR and
only
to ARBR. After all, we are the experts on the subject of recumbents. All
you
will get from other newsgroups is a lot of bum information.

Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota

Yes, Your Cycleness!

Jeez! NYC XYZ has got me figured out to perfection after just one post.
These NYC guys are just plan smarter than us Midwestern yokels. I keep
telling my local newsgroup (ARBR) that if they can't accept me as their God,
then they can at the least accept me as their King.

Quoted message said:

Hmm...is it not possible to have a rather more upright position -- but
still relatively reclined compared to real uprights -- and maybe front
wheel drive? Someone ought to design a bike that's half-way between an
upright and a 'bent...it'd be more upright than 'bent, but still
recognizably non-upright...the legs are elevated just enough to allow
for a real seat, but an upright otherwise so as to be manuverable....

You do not want any kind of a reclined position for the kind of riding you
have to do in the big city. New York is not Podunk, or even Minneapolis. If
and when you want to ride a recumbent, you will have to get out of the city
and find a sensible sized town.

I think the only way I would ever ride a recumbent in NYC is on a bike path
and/or if they closed the streets to automotive traffic. Do they not do this
in Central Park on weekends? I think it would be one hell of a lot of fun to
ride a recumbent bike in Central Park. You would be the center of attention.

Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota

"NYC XYZ" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

NYC, that is! On a weekday in mid-town Manhattan?

I've lived in and around NYC all my life. When I was riding into Manhattan
on a regular basis it was always on an upright. I would be willing to do the
occasional ride or even commute but I wouldn't want to spend my days zipping
through midtown traffic on a 'bent. For bent riding I'd limit myself to the
extreme west side, extreme east side, and Central Park.

I manage to [censored] enough drivers in the 'burbs by taking up a lane of
traffic on my trike. I could only imaging how the Manhattanites would find
it.

Quoted message said:

How do you lock up a 'bent, anyway?

I use a lock that is shaped like a large pair of handcuffs and I use a
supplimental cable to go through the wheels. Still I wouldn't lock up my
bike or trike in NYC where it wouldn't be in my constant view.

Quoted message said:

Is it good for weaving in and out of traffic?
Does it brake just like an upright?
Is it harder to go real slow?
Ever run red lights with them?
How would they fare on the sidewalk? How well do they go over curbs
and speed bumps?

I think that for this type of riding an upright is going to be better.

Quoted message said:

And they're actually worse for certain kinds of back problems???

That is what I've heard although I don't have back problems. I ride them for
comfort. If I were working on my bike in NYC I doubt it would be a 'bent.

There have recently been a lot of Pedicabs in NYC and they are almost all
upright. I think you want the kind of power and control afforded by an
upright when you are trying to get through traffic. Bikes are not well
respected by either pedestrians or drivers in NYC.

NYC XYZ said:

How do you lock up a 'bent, anyway?

U-lock around the frame or steering riser

Quoted message said:

Is it good for weaving in and out of traffic?

Depends on the bike. The Speedmachine I use as my #1 commuting bike (in
central London) is not very good at this; the Kingcycle I ran for many years
was almost as handy as an upright.

Quoted message said:

Does it brake just like an upright?

Better.

Quoted message said:

Is it harder to go real slow?

Not with practice, though track-stands are out.

Quoted message said:

Ever run red lights with them?

No. Nor on an upright bike or in a motorcar.

Quoted message said:

How would they fare on the sidewalk? How well do they go over curbs
and speed bumps?

I neither know nor care, coz I ride on the road.

Quoted message said:

Ever get mugged on one? (Serious! Twice I had to jet away from some
miscreants in broad daylight in the parks.)

No.

Quoted message said:

And apparently they make lots of squeaky noises??

No.

Quoted message said:

And they're actually worse for certain kinds of back problems???

Can't say I've noticed...

--
Dave Larrington - <http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk/>
Apparently Guy has now got a Brompton. I'd never have guessed.

On 17 Jul 2005 17:33:54 -0700, "NYC XYZ" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

How do you lock up a 'bent, anyway?

I use a Master Street Cuff round the main tube behind the steerer.

Quoted message said:

Is it good for weaving in and out of traffic?

Not particularly, a higher bike, maybe with USS, is probably better
for that than a sports bike like mine.

Quoted message said:

Does it brake just like an upright?

Much better :-)

Quoted message said:

Is it harder to go real slow?

Not really.

Quoted message said:

Ever run red lights with them?

I imagine it's not different than running them on a wedgie, but no I
don't (on either)

Quoted message said:

How would they fare on the sidewalk? How well do they go over curbs
and speed bumps?

I have no idea, I have never felt the slightest urge to find out!

Quoted message said:

Ever get mugged on one? (Serious! Twice I had to jet away from some
miscreants in broad daylight in the parks.)

No. I've never met anyone who could keep up for long :-)

Quoted message said:

And apparently they make lots of squeaky noises??

LOL! So do any bikes if you neglect them! Mine runs pretty much
silently

Quoted message said:

And they're actually worse for certain kinds of back problems???

Allegedly.

Guy
--
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

"Let’s have a moment of silence for all those Americans who are stuck
in traffic on their way to the gym to ride the stationary bicycle."
- Earl Blumenauer

Quoted message said:

Like http://www.easyracers.com/ ?

Hey, cool!

But why is the $5K titanium modeal almost 27 lbs.???

Would also like a 26/26 version....

I'll go out on a limb here and volunteer the name of a very nice gentleman
who runs a messenger service in downtown Manhattan that you could talk to
and possible test ride one of his several recumbents.
Shelly Mossy [email hidden]
I borrowed his EZ1 last August for the day
Any *head first* style vehicle is out of the question for this person no
matter what the reason.
LWB oss works well in the tight confines of NYC, SF, Seattle, L.A., Indy
and Portland
the only big cities I have had the chance to ride.
Speedy

NYC XYZ said:

NYC, that is! On a weekday in mid-town Manhattan? I did bike
messenging for almost two months one summer -- only job where I wish I
had more time in the day for (second hardest after Army infantry, no
joke!) -- and now that I'm curious about recumbents, I'm trying to
picture myself in all kinds of situations.

How do you lock up a 'bent, anyway?

Is it good for weaving in and out of traffic?

Does it brake just like an upright?

Is it harder to go real slow?

Ever run red lights with them?

How would they fare on the sidewalk? How well do they go over curbs
and speed bumps?

Ever get mugged on one? (Serious! Twice I had to jet away from some
miscreants in broad daylight in the parks.)

And apparently they make lots of squeaky noises??

And they're actually worse for certain kinds of back problems???

----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==----
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NYC XYZ said:

How do you lock up a 'bent, anyway?

Standard issue bicycle chain. Almost nobody rides one, so it's much less
in demand than ATB's and racebikes.

Quoted message said:

Is it good for weaving in and out of traffic?

Depends on traffic. Very dense city traffic : nope. Any other kind of
city traffic : yes.

Quoted message said:

Does it brake just like an upright?

Roughly the same to better. Used to ride an ATB with v-brakes, now on a
Optima Baron with discbrakes. The only difference is that you tend to
drive the recumbent much faster.

Quoted message said:

Is it harder to go real slow?

Nope and remember practise makes perfect ;-)

Quoted message said:

Ever run red lights with them?

Almost every light I encounter on my daily commute.

Quoted message said:

How would they fare on the sidewalk? How well do they go over curbs
and speed bumps?

Hmmm. My bike has no springs whatsoever, so in my case real steep bumps
cause me to slow down. Normal speedbumps are no problem.

Quoted message said:

Ever get mugged on one? (Serious! Twice I had to jet away from some
miscreants in broad daylight in the parks.)

Nope.

Quoted message said:

And apparently they make lots of squeaky noises??

Nope.

Quoted message said:

And they're actually worse for certain kinds of back problems???

So are uprights. I have a bad back, by the way nothing to do with me
starting to ride a recumbent. Even bought and tested my bike while being
under serious pain. Once I'm on the bike the pain is gone.

My city travels are made in Amsterdam and The Hague (The Netherlands).
Amsterdam is pretty relaxed compared to the italian like scenes one
sometimes encounters in the Hague. Been to NYC as well and would drive
my bike anyday.

Arnold.

In article <[email hidden]>, NYC

XYZ said:

NYC, that is! On a weekday in mid-town Manhattan? I did bike
messenging for almost two months one summer -- only job where I wish I
had more time in the day for (second hardest after Army infantry, no
joke!) -- and now that I'm curious about recumbents, I'm trying to
picture myself in all kinds of situations.

There is a documentary called "Pedal" about the messengers in NYC. An
odd group of people to be sure. (crackheads, one legged riders, jesus
preachers) I recommend it to anyone that rides a bike. One fellow in
the movie rides a BikeE for his messenger work.
Some ride track bikes. Which to me seems completely crazy because these
track bikes typically don't have brakes. So if you think riding a bent
in NYC is crazy, there are far crazier bikers on the road than a bent
rider.