food for thought

sf said:

I haven't heard of this happening, but maybe someone else has.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2006/06/14/BUG3KJDKLC1.DTL
or
http://tinyurl.com/j76dk

Honest folks needn't be concerned.

"ChargeBack Bureau could be engaging in an unfair business practice
under state law. "The purpose of this looks to be to prevent people
from using [abusing] their legal rights," she said. "

Hmm, don't they mean *abusing*?

No legitimate company is going to blacklist any customer who
*occasionally* makes returns (for whatever reason), otherwise they'd
all be out of business.

But people who make purchases knowing full well in advance that they
are only going to use the merchandise once or twice and then return it
are a big problem, especially for those of us honest consumers, they
raise costs same as shoplifters. Retailers have rights too, they need
to protect themselves and their honest customers from the thieves.
Individual businesses have always kept a list of the deadbeats and scam
artists (they'd be imbeciles if they didn't), maintaining a national
chargeback list is a great idea. And remember, credit is a privilege,
not a right... credit cards can be revoked at any time, so can credit
purchases be denied... no business is required to extend anyone credit.

This is especially good news for the restaurant business. Restaurants
accept credit cards as a convenience, but they are not required to.
Restaurants get stiffed often by the douchebags who order expensive
meals, pay with plastic, and then send off a dispute note to the credit
card company (in large cities the meal scammers can eat out often for
many years and never pay) . But don't think the credit card companies
don't keep tabs an those who regularly dispute payment, at some point
they'll revoke the card, and they already have been notifiying other
card companies of these scum.... a list of credit disputes comes up on
credit check reports.

Sheldon

sf said:

I haven't heard of this happening, but maybe someone else has.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2006/06/14/BUG3KJDKLC1.DTL
or
http://tinyurl.com/j76dk

I don't see the problem. They didn't say they want to take away the
ability to chargeback as the article implies but establish a rating
system to spot offenders. I don't even see why the typical chargeback
items they cite would even require a chargeback. Such as you order a red
one and get a blue one. Wouldn't you just notify the merchant?

I know a few people who are proud of themselves for scamming merchants.
Such people would get on the list and be treated accordingly. We all pay
if they don't.

"Sheldon" <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

sf said:

I haven't heard of this happening, but maybe someone else has.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?

f=/c/a/2006/06/14/BUG3KJDKLC

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

1.DTL or
http://tinyurl.com/j76dk

Honest folks needn't be concerned.

"ChargeBack Bureau could be engaging in an unfair business practice
under state law. "The purpose of this looks to be to prevent people
from using [abusing] their legal rights," she said. "

Hmm, don't they mean *abusing*?

No legitimate company is going to blacklist any customer who
*occasionally* makes returns (for whatever reason), otherwise they'd
all be out of business.

But people who make purchases knowing full well in advance that they
are only going to use the merchandise once or twice and then return it
are a big problem, especially for those of us honest consumers, they
raise costs same as shoplifters. Retailers have rights too, they need
to protect themselves and their honest customers from the thieves.
Individual businesses have always kept a list of the deadbeats and
scam artists (they'd be imbeciles if they didn't), maintaining a
national chargeback list is a great idea. And remember, credit is a
privilege, not a right... credit cards can be revoked at any time, so
can credit purchases be denied... no business is required to extend
anyone credit.

This is especially good news for the restaurant business. Restaurants
accept credit cards as a convenience, but they are not required to.
Restaurants get stiffed often by the douchebags who order expensive
meals, pay with plastic, and then send off a dispute note to the
credit card company (in large cities the meal scammers can eat out
often for many years and never pay) . But don't think the credit
card companies don't keep tabs an those who regularly dispute payment,
at some point they'll revoke the card, and they already have been
notifiying other card companies of these scum.... a list of credit
disputes comes up on credit check reports.

Sheldon

You missed a few minor details!

The fact that the company is based in Panama, protected from U.S.
regulations doesn't bother you? A bogus contact phone number? P.O. Box
only address? Owner name disputes? Not replying to U.S. investigative e-
mail enquiries?

It's the first "offshore" junk credit rating system for subscribing
companies to abuse that I've ever heard of.

You're OK with that, I'm not.

Andy

Andy q said:

The fact that the company is based in Panama, protected from U.S.
regulations doesn't bother you? A bogus contact phone number? P.O. Box
only address? Owner name disputes? Not replying to U.S. investigative e-
mail enquiries?

Do I smell email addy harvesting?

Quoted message said:

It's the first "offshore" junk credit rating system for subscribing
companies to abuse that I've ever heard of.

.....today!!

nb

notbob <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Andy q said:

The fact that the company is based in Panama, protected from U.S.
regulations doesn't bother you? A bogus contact phone number? P.O.

Box

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

only address? Owner name disputes? Not replying to U.S. investigative

e-

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

mail enquiries?

Do I smell email addy harvesting?

Quoted message said:

It's the first "offshore" junk credit rating system for subscribing
companies to abuse that I've ever heard of.

....today!!

nb

nb,

http://chargebackbureau.org/

"because the customer is not always right"

UNBELIEVABLE.

Andy

Andy said:

http://chargebackbureau.org/

"because the customer is not always right"

UNBELIEVABLE.

Andy

Unfortunately things like this are necessary because of the certain
percentage of people who scam merchants that we all pay for.

George <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Andy said:

http://chargebackbureau.org/

"because the customer is not always right"

UNBELIEVABLE.

Andy

Unfortunately things like this are necessary because of the certain
percentage of people who scam merchants that we all pay for.

But that's the credit card issuer's problem now isn't it?!!! After a few
too many cancelled charges pile up they will simply cancel your card and
be rid of you. They grow tired of being the imbetween party real fast!

You trust a company in Panama to do a better job???

GIMMEABREAK!

Andy

Andy said:

Quoted message said:

Unfortunately things like this are necessary because of the certain
percentage of people who scam merchants that we all pay for.

But that's the credit card issuer's problem now isn't it?!!! After a few
too many cancelled charges pile up they will simply cancel your card and
be rid of you. They grow tired of being the imbetween party real fast!

You trust a company in Panama to do a better job???

GIMMEABREAK!

Andy

I can see where you are going about Panama and not saying its a good thing
but outfits in India and the Phillipines for example have access to all
of our
information now.

It can't work without a central database though. Say you scam a bunch of
merchants and have a Citicard and they dump you. You could sinply go to
the next bank, get a new CC and keep on scamming.

You may not realize it but scamming merchants is a big problem and I can
understand why they would try to limit it.

George <[email hidden]> wrote in news:F--
[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Say you scam a bunch of
merchants and have a Citicard and they dump you. You could sinply go

to

Quoted message said:

the next bank, get a new CC and keep on scamming.

George,

Yeah but it's a matter of diminishing returns. Your record will be
passed across banks via the trusted credit agencies and your credit card
request will be denied in short order.

You sound like a fraud yourself with your adamant foreign relations
support.

Andy

Andy said:

George <[email hidden]> wrote in news:F--
[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Say you scam a bunch of
merchants and have a Citicard and they dump you. You could sinply go

to

Quoted message said:

the next bank, get a new CC and keep on scamming.

George,

Yeah but it's a matter of diminishing returns. Your record will be
passed across banks via the trusted credit agencies and your credit card
request will be denied in short order.

You sound like a fraud yourself with your adamant foreign relations
support.

Andy

Any reason for the personal attack? I supplied polite and reasonable
responses to you. Just because you have a problem reading for content is
not a reason to attack someone.

George said:

Andy said:

Quoted message said:

Unfortunately things like this are necessary because of the certain
percentage of people who scam merchants that we all pay for.

But that's the credit card issuer's problem now isn't it?!!! After a
few too many cancelled charges pile up they will simply cancel your
card and be rid of you. They grow tired of being the imbetween party
real fast!

You trust a company in Panama to do a better job???

GIMMEABREAK!

Andy

I can see where you are going about Panama and not saying its a good
thing but outfits in India and the Phillipines for example have
access to all of our
information now.

The problem is, the phone number listed by the company is bogus. You can't
contact this alleged Panamanian company if you want to talk to someone.
That, in itself, makes the whole thing suspect. I'd expect to start getting
emails from some poor widow in Panama who will share her husband's million
dollar estate if you will only give her your bank account information...
then she'll move to Nigeria!

Jill

Sheldon said:

sf said:

I haven't heard of this happening, but maybe someone else has.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2006/06/14/BUG3KJDKLC1.DTL
or
http://tinyurl.com/j76dk

Quoted message said:

Honest folks needn't be concerned.

Quoted message said:

chargeback list is a great idea. And remember, credit is a privilege,
not a right... credit cards can be revoked at any time, so can credit
purchases be denied... no business is required to extend anyone credit.

While credit card companies can, and will, revoke credit cards if
somebody makes too big a habit of demanding chargebacks, the merchant
agreements say the merchant must accept all credit cards of the
particular type (e.g.Visa, Mastercard) if they accept any. The merchant
is not allowed to refuse one person's Visa card while accepting others'
unless the transaction gets refused by the credit card company. Though
I suppose it is unlikely a scammer would complain to the credit card
company.

A merchant could get around it by refusing the customer entirely. Not even
accepting cash from that person.

Bill Ranck
Blacksburg, Va.