Gas chain cleaning?

Scott C said:

Many here have mentioned Kerosene to clean chains - as a kid I recall using car gas. Does this
work as well as Kerosene? I recall someone mentioning Kerosene is not as flammable? - maybe safer
to store. I am aware of Gunk for cleaning,but don't have this.. wanted to see if what I had would
be Ok - and I have gas for a lawn mower.

I *don't* recommend gasoline for cleaning chains. I use diesel, which isn't combustible. I haven't
tried kerosene.

Scott C at [email hidden] wrote on 7/24/03 8:48 AM:

Quoted message said:

Many here have mentioned Kerosene to clean chains - as a kid I recall using car gas. Does this
work as well as Kerosene? I recall someone mentioning Kerosene is not as flammable? - maybe safer
to store. I am aware of Gunk for cleaning,but don't have this.. wanted to see if what I had would
be Ok - and I have gas for a lawn mower.

DON'T do it.

The combustability of gasoline is frightening.

Diesel, Kerosene... maybe.

But there are plenty of decent degreasers available that won't ignite. The $5 you might save by
siphoning off some gas will look pretty cheap from the burn ward.

-- Jim

Gasoline will work well, but it is pretty dangerous, I'd avoid it if I were you. I use Zep citrus
degreaser, about $6 - $7 per gallon, non-flammable, smells nice. At full strength it works great on
chains, cassettes, and just about anything else that needs cleaning. I let chains sit in it over
night then rinse with warm water for a few minutes, let dry then lube.

Scott C said:

Many here have mentioned Kerosene to clean chains - as a kid I recall using car gas. Does this
work as well as Kerosene? I recall someone mentioning Kerosene is not as flammable? - maybe safer
to store. I am aware of Gunk for cleaning,but don't have this.. wanted to see if what I had would
be Ok - and I have gas for a lawn mower.

Thanks

sc

Mark said:

Gasoline will work well, but it is pretty dangerous, I'd avoid it if I were you. I use Zep citrus
degreaser, about $6 - $7 per gallon, non-flammable, smells nice. At full strength it works great
on chains, cassettes, and just about anything else that needs cleaning. I let chains sit in it
over night then rinse with warm water for a few minutes, let dry then lube.

Diesel is flammable, but only at fairly high temperatures. Its flashpoint is over 140F, while
gasoline's is below freezing. It's certainly not as volatile as gasoline. Drop a match in some
diesel at room or ambient temperature outdoors and the flame will die out as soon as it hits the
fuel. Can't do that with gasoline; you'll cause a minor explosion.

I've offered several benefits of diesel as a cleaner before:

It's cheap -- $1.40 a gallon here compared to your $7 citrus degreaser. It's reusable, so it's even
more cost-efficient -- let it sit and then strain off the cleaner top part for re-use; ecologically
discard the bottom dregs. It's oily -- so it won't completely strip all oil (but does a great job of
loosening dirt and gunk). It's fast -- put it in a safe plastic jar with your parts (chain, etc),
shake, change fuel, repeat.

The only drawback, if you can call it that, is that it works best followed up with
petroleum-based lubes.

cyclist101 may have said:

Scott C said:

Many here have mentioned Kerosene to clean chains - as a kid I recall using car gas. Does this
work as well as Kerosene? I recall someone mentioning Kerosene is not as flammable? - maybe safer
to store. I am aware of Gunk for cleaning,but don't have this.. wanted to see if what I had would
be Ok - and I have gas for a lawn mower.

I *don't* recommend gasoline for cleaning chains. I use diesel, which isn't combustible. I haven't
tried kerosene.

Diesel has a flash point that's higher than gasoline, and a vapor pressure that's lower, but if it's
hit by a spark, it will most certainly ignite. Kerosene and mineral spirits are both far safer to
use. Gasoline is so readily ignited, and so volatile, that it's *really* hazardous, since it can be
ignited by someone dropping a lit cigarette as much as ten to twenty feet away. The current
formulations of gasoline also contain fractions that are mildly carcinogenic, although at least in
49 states in the US, there's no tetraethyl lead anymore.

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Werehatrack said:

Quoted message said:

I *don't* recommend gasoline for cleaning chains. I use diesel, which isn't combustible. I haven't
tried kerosene.

Diesel has a flash point that's higher than gasoline, and a vapor pressure that's lower, but if
it's hit by a spark, it will most certainly ignite.

Most certainly not. Take some diesel at room temperature and throw a match in it. The match will be
extinguished.

Quoted message said:

Kerosene and mineral spirits are both far safer to use.

Mineral spirits is far more combustible than diesel.

Quoted message said:

Gasoline is so readily ignited, and so volatile, that it's *really* hazardous, since it can be
ignited by someone dropping a lit cigarette as much as ten to twenty feet away.

Another good reason not to smoke.

Quoted message said:

The current formulations of gasoline also contain fractions that are mildly carcinogenic, although
at least in 49 states in the US, there's no tetraethyl lead anymore.

Even so, I'd be more immediately concerned with flash fires in or near my garage (which is attached
to my house, in which my family reside) than future cancer risks.

Scott C said:

Many here have mentioned Kerosene to clean chains - as a kid I recall using car gas. Does this
work as well as Kerosene? I recall someone mentioning Kerosene is not as flammable? - maybe safer
to store. I am aware of Gunk for cleaning,but don't have this.. wanted to see if what I had would
be Ok - and I have gas for a lawn mower.

Gas is a bad idea as a cleaning solvent. It is too volatile to be safe, and the fumes can pool
dangerously if not used outdoors. Also, it is easily absorbed through the skin, so your hands will
smell of it -- and it is certainly not going to improve your health. It also is not that great as a
solvent. Kerosene is about the same price, much less volatile, and less readily absorbed. Simple
green or some sort of citrus based cleaner is better still.

--

David L. Johnson

__o | And what if you track down these men and kill them, what if you _`\(,_ | killed all of us?
From every corner of Europe, hundreds, (_)/ (_) | thousands would rise up to take our places.
Even Nazis can't kill that fast. -- Paul Henreid (Casablanca).

Works fine if your fire insurance is paid up (and you'r mother in law is sleeping upstairs)

J/K :-3)

May you have the wind at your back. And a really low gear for the hills! Chris

Chris'Z Corner "The Website for the Common Bicyclist": geocities.comczcornerOpen ↗

On a more serious side, I would recommend either an automotive parts degreaser like "GUNK", or one
of the citrus cleaners.

I've heard that "Dawn" dishwashing lotion works on the lighter greases, but not having tried it,
this is only hearsay.

May you have the wind at your back. And a really low gear for the hills! Chris

Chris'Z Corner "The Website for the Common Bicyclist": geocities.comczcornerOpen ↗

cyclist101 may have said:

Werehatrack said:

Quoted message said:

I *don't* recommend gasoline for cleaning chains. I use diesel, which isn't combustible. I
haven't tried kerosene.

Diesel has a flash point that's higher than gasoline, and a vapor pressure that's lower, but if
it's hit by a spark, it will most certainly ignite.

Most certainly not. Take some diesel at room temperature and throw a match in it. The match will be
extinguished.

This varies with conditions; on a hot summer day, you most certainly can light diesel by dropping
a match into an open shallow pan containing it. The probability increases dramatically if there's
a rag or brush present to increase the surface area, which speeds evaporation and contributes to
the formation of a vapor pool. If this sounds like the typical scenario involved in cleaning
parts, it should.

I had the unpleaseant duty of having to extinguish such a fire once, and of transporting the
neighbor who had been badly burned while cleaning motorcycle parts in diesel. A conversation with a
fire marshal a few months later was, shall we say, illuminating. Mineral spirits *is* safer; to see
the difference, try soaking equal quantities of charcoal briquets with equal amounts of diesel and
spirits, and then lighting them; unless it's a cold day, you'll find that the diesel lights easier
and burns far more enthusiastically than the mineral spirits.

I am aware that farmers have used diesel for parts washing solvent for a long time. They also are
famous for charging their AC systems with propane. It works, but that neither makes it safe nor a
good idea.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Kerosene and mineral spirits are both far safer to use.

Mineral spirits is far more combustible than diesel.

The paint-thinner grade of mineral spirits that I've been picking up won't readily flash at common
temperatures unless wicked. The diesel that I've worked with for years will flash at common *summer*
temps with just a source of ignition, if there is enough of it present to form a vapor pool of the
needed size...which is much smaller than you might think. There are lots of heavy equipment
mechanics who can tell you this first hand. Mineral spirits vapor, on the other hand, tends to
disperse more readily, thus reducing the buildup of flashable vapor. (Even with mineral spirits,
though, if the ambient temp is high enough and the venitlation poor enough, the vapor pressure can
rise to the point where it's ignitable.)

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Gasoline is so readily ignited, and so volatile, that it's *really* hazardous, since it can be
ignited by someone dropping a lit cigarette as much as ten to twenty feet away.

Another good reason not to smoke.

Agreed!

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

The current formulations of gasoline also contain fractions that are mildly carcinogenic,
although at least in 49 states in the US, there's no tetraethyl lead anymore.

Even so, I'd be more immediately concerned with flash fires in or near my garage (which is attached
to my house, in which my family reside) than future cancer risks.

Also agreed. This is enough of a concern that most US building codes now mandate that a gas-fired
water heater must be installed with a support structure that lifts the unit well above floor
level if it's located in a garage or exterior storage room. This is entirely because of the fact
that too many people will keep a lawn mower or improperly sealed gas can in the same room, and
gasoline vapors from that receptacle may disperse poorly, forming a gradually deepening layer of
flammable fumes at floor level. When the layer reaches the pilot light of the water heater,
things get loud and hot.

By the way, there's a not-really-safety reason to avoid using diesel as a cleaning agent; it has a
very pungent smell that will signal to all and sundry that it's present, and the aroma can cause
neighborhood busybodies to call fire department and other inspectors to have a look-see...and in
many areas, using non-approved solvents for parts cleaner will net you a citation of some sort.
Mineral spirits evaporates with less smell, doesn't linger long, and generally won't get you into
trouble with the regulatory gestapo.

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On Thu, 24 Jul 2003 18:31:50 -0400 (EDT), [email hidden] (Chris Zacho "The Wheelman"😉 may

have said:

Works fine if your fire insurance is paid up (and you'r mother in law is sleeping upstairs)

And somebody you don't like very much is doing the cleaning.

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Scott C said:

Many here have mentioned Kerosene to clean chains - as a kid I recall car gas. Does this work as
well as Kerosene? I recall someone mentioning Kerosene is not as flammable? - maybe safer to
store. I am aware of Gunk cleaning,but don't have this.. wanted to see if what I had would be Ok -
I have gas for a lawn mower.

Political correctness warning: It is politically incorrect to use gasoline for anything other than
fueling a proper gas-powered vehicle. Kerosene is an acceptable cleaner in that regard.

I don't know about the consequences of using gasoline to clean a chain, but I can tell you
about Kerosene.

It is safer to store, because it doesn't vaporise as well (or maybe even at all). For the same
reason, it's messy as all hell. You'll never get the smell out of your clothes, chain, driveway,
skin, etc.

Never ever.

In a reply, somebody mentioned Diesel. Diesel and Kerosene are slightly different grades of the same
fuel, and are interchangable except for emissions when burned, where Diesel burns cleaner.

Diesel and Kerosene are gentler on sensitive materials such as rubber, though I don't know that
there's anything other than steel or plain alloys in chains. Gasoline, OTOH, is self-cleaning -- you
use it, then let the item sit for a few minutes, and all the gasoline vaporizes off of it and it's
clean as a whistle.

I clean roof nailing guns with Kerosene, or if I have a few minutes to really disassemble them and
remove rubber O-rings/gaskets, I use gasoline for better and overall easier results.

Consider also WD-40, or maybe even paint thinner. I don't know about paint thinner. WD-40 is great
for cleaning, just don't use it as your lubricant (WD probably stands for Wrecks Derailleurs).

Quoted message said:

Thanks

sc

--
Rick Onanian

Jim Edgar said:

DON'T do it.

The combustability of gasoline is frightening.

The $5 you might save by siphoning off some gas will look pretty cheap from the burn ward.

<sarcasm> C'mon! I smoke and weld while cleaning running equipment with gasoline! </sarcasm>

Quoted message said:

-- Jim

--
Rick Onanian

David L. Johnson said:

easily absorbed through the skin, so your hands will smell of it -- and is certainly not going to
improve your health. It also is not that great as a solvent. Kerosene is about the same price,
much less volatile, and less readily absorbed. Simple green or some sort of citrus based cleaner

What? I agree about absorbing easier, but the end result is: I smell like gas for a few hours. I
smell like kerosene/diesel for DAYS. Further, because I smell like it, everything around my absorbs
the smell, and I end up dealing with it for weeks. Ugh.

Again, gas, while it has many advantages (and I use it), is very dangerous, and should only be used
outside, in a safe area, with no possible ignition sources anywhere near it. I use it on a large
flat rock in the middle of my lawn.

--
Rick Onanian

Gasoline is absorbed into your skin and can be absorbed into the bloodstream via this route. Seems
like a bad thing. It's also volatile and readily absorbed through the repiratory system. For these
reasons alone, I'd recommend against using it as a cleaning solvent, there are (relatively) safe
alternatives. Burning seems to be also a deterrent.

WOW, so many opinions and good advise on all. As I have gas for a lawn mower, I suppose I'll use
this to clean with once in a while, but do like the idea of a degreaser - which I will also buy in a
gallon container.

thanks

sc

"Scott C" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:JdTTa.135219$N7.19328@sccrnsc03...

Quoted message said:

Many here have mentioned Kerosene to clean chains - as a kid I recall

using

Quoted message said:

car gas. Does this work as well as Kerosene? I recall someone mentioning Kerosene is not as
flammable? - maybe safer to store. I am aware of Gunk

for

Quoted message said:

cleaning,but don't have this.. wanted to see if what I had would be Ok -

and

Quoted message said:

I have gas for a lawn mower.

Thanks

sc

Rick Onanian may have said:

David L. Johnson said:

easily absorbed through the skin, so your hands will smell of it -- and is certainly not going to
improve your health. It also is not that great as a solvent. Kerosene is about the same price,
much less volatile, and less readily absorbed. Simple green or some sort of citrus based cleaner

What? I agree about absorbing easier, but the end result is: I smell like gas for a few hours. I
smell like kerosene/diesel for DAYS. Further, because I smell like it, everything around my absorbs
the smell, and I end up dealing with it for weeks. Ugh.

Again, gas, while it has many advantages (and I use it), is very dangerous, and should only be used
outside, in a safe area, with no possible ignition sources anywhere near it. I use it on a large
flat rock in the middle of my lawn.

In the middle of a spot in your lawn where no grass or other vegetation is to be found, as well, I
should think...

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"Tim McNamara" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Gasoline is absorbed into your skin and can be absorbed into the bloodstream via this route. Seems
like a bad thing. It's also volatile and readily absorbed through the repiratory system. For these
reasons alone, I'd recommend against using it as a cleaning solvent, there are (relatively) safe
alternatives. Burning seems to be also a deterrent.

Yeah. After using gasoline a couple of times, it gets annoying when the smell doesn't leave you for
days, and it's carcinogenic. I'm going to stay away from that one.

--
Phil, Squid-in-Training

Rick Onanian may have said:

Consider also WD-40, or maybe even paint thinner. I don't know about paint thinner.

Most of what's sold as "paint thinner" is mineral spirits; it evaporates about as cleanly as
gasoline but not as fast, it's much safer to work with, and it leaves far less lingering aroma than
diesel or kerosene (none at all on nonporous surfaces). If you shop around, it can frequently be had
for about $2 per gallon, sometimes less. Oddly enough, at places like Home Depot, it's often cheaper
in the one-gallon cans than in the 5-gallon drum. (This vexes me no end, since I'd much rather buy
the 5 gallon size, but I'm too cheap to pay the difference...and I go through about a gallon a month
in my screen printing activities.)

Quoted message said:

WD-40 is great for cleaning, just don't use it as your lubricant (WD probably stands for Wrecks
Derailleurs).

"WD" stands for "water displacement", believe it or not, but Wrecks Ders is appropriate in my
opinion. From what I've seen, it's a *terrible* lube for most purposes. If you want to destroy the
threads on a puller, for instance, just put WD40 on them and then use the puller for a stubborn
task. The threads will strip right out. The owner of a nearby sewing machine shop once told me that
he had a week where seven people all brought him repair work that was needed due to the use of WD40
on the linkages and shafts of older machines. If you soak a moving part with that stuff, make sure
to go back and coat it with the *appropriate* lubricant before using it under stress or at speed.
The same goes for any kind of penetrating oil, such as LPS, Rustbuster, or Liquid Wrench.

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