general buying advice please

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David said:

Hi,

I'm thinking of buying a new bike, and would like some
general buying advice. I currently have an ancient
moutain bike with 21 gears - basic. My riding is probably
50 miles a week at most, with a mixture of 50% off road
and 50% on road.

I've been looking at off roaders with suspension. I'm
looking to spend a minimum for something decent - maximum
budget is probably £150ish.

OK, the assistant in Halfords (who was about 10) basically
suggested all the bikes with a big price tag. I accept
that the really cheap ones are probably best avoided, but
would something around the £120 mark be suitable for the
miles/terrain I plan on doing?

probably being sensible. 50 miles a week is a reasonable
amount. If looking to spend only 150 go for at maxim front
suspension only.

If you can stretch you buget your will enjoy your
cycling more.

discountbicycles.co.ukdiscountbicycles.co.ukOpen ↗
bonthronebikes.comproduct details.aspOpen ↗

Peter

Peter

David said:

Hi,

I'm thinking of buying a new bike, and would like some
general buying advice. I currently have an ancient
moutain bike with 21 gears - basic. My riding is probably
50 miles a week at most, with a mixture of 50% off road
and 50% on road.

I've been looking at off roaders with suspension. I'm
looking to spend a minimum for something decent - maximum
budget is probably £150ish.

OK, the assistant in Halfords (who was about 10) basically
suggested all the bikes with a big price tag. I accept
that the really cheap ones are probably best avoided, but
would something around the £120 mark be suitable for the
miles/terrain I plan on doing?

You really won't get anything decent at that price
level. Suspension will be poor quality and performance
at that price. What's wrong with your "ancient mountain
bike" that it needs changing. Either look to spend
double you max budget or put the money into giving your
current bike a service

Tony

Thanks for the replies.

Quoted message said:

You really won't get anything decent at that price level.
Suspension will

be

Quoted message said:

poor quality and performance at that price. What's wrong
with your

"ancient

Quoted message said:

mountain bike" that it needs changing. Either look to
spend double you

max

Quoted message said:

budget or put the money into giving your current bike
a service

My current ancient bike was bought for £30 from the freeads
to enable me to chase after the kids and round 'em up when
they go in opposite directions on their bikes/scooters. I
found myself (unexpectedly) really enjoying riding. My bike
is actually too big a frame for me. As I have some
redundancy money I can afford to buy a new bike, but
obviously can't spend an absolute fortune.

Seems to me that the front only suspension bikes are
cheaper. Never having ridden a bike with suspension, what
are the pro's and con's of front/rear suspension both on
and off road?

David said:

My current ancient bike was bought for £30 from the
freeads to enable me to chase after the kids and round 'em
up when they go in opposite directions on their
bikes/scooters. I found myself (unexpectedly) really
enjoying riding. My bike is actually too big a frame for
me. As I have some redundancy money I can afford to buy a
new bike, but obviously can't spend an absolute fortune.

If the frame is too big I would go for buying another second
hand one of the right size. You'll get more for your money
that way than buying new. For some good advice read Myra's
articles on buying a bike - myra-simon.commtbOpen ↗
advice1.html

Quoted message said:

Seems to me that the front only suspension bikes are
cheaper. Never having ridden a bike with suspension, what
are the pro's and con's of front/rear suspension both on
and off road?

The cons are maintenance (both suspension units and the
pivots) and added weight. For cheap suspension the
performance is pretty poor and it needs a lot of maintenance
to keep it going because it doesn't have the quality of
seals on the sliding parts. The performance problems tend to
be that it has lots of stiction (i.e. it doesn't slide
smoothly but sticks and then gives when the load is high
enough) and they are underdamped so that they tend to bounce
rather than suspend which makes control on rough ground
difficult. The front fork legs tend to be flexy which makes
the steering imprecise on rough ground. If choosing I would
definitely not go for full suspension at that price point
and front suspension only if you have to. You'll get a much
better rigid forked bike for your money than you will a
suspension bike.

Tony

David said:

My bike is actually too big a frame for me. As I have some
redundancy m=

oney

Quoted message said:

I can afford to buy a new bike, but obviously can't spend
an absolute fortune.

Second hand is the place to look IMHO. Fortunately mountain
bikes are=20 about the most common things to get upgraded
and sold on.

Quoted message said:

Seems to me that the front only suspension bikes are
cheaper. Never hav=

ing

Quoted message said:

ridden a bike with suspension, what are the pro's and
con's of front/re=

ar

Quoted message said:

suspension both on and off road?

First up, suspension designs for on and off road are usually
different=20 beasts, even though the gains in each case are
through improved=20 efficiency, handling and comfort (*if*
it's good suspension). On the=20 road you're looking at
absorbing a lot of very small, fairly constant=20 shocks,
where off road you need an ability to soak up very big bumps
as=20 a routine thing. Unfortunately the extra travel for
the big stuff=20 weighs more and encourages the bike to pogo
with pedalling if you're=20 climbing, so off-road suspension
is often effectively a liability on the =

road. On road suspension is of some use off, but it'll
generally lack=20 enough travel to soak up the routine bumps
encountered so it won't do a=20 proper job. But the above
assumes the suspension has been well designed. On a cheap =

bike it generally won't have been, as the design requirement
is=20 /looking/ like an expensive bike, and never mind what
actually happens.=20 The springing system will be grot,
damping possibly non-existent, and=20 though it will soak up
big hits better than nothing it's unlikely to be=20 good at
soaking up a continuous stream of rough stuff in a way
that=20 makes the bike truly more efficient, which is where
/good/ suspension=20 scores over rigid.

Dual suspension, where done well, does the above Good Things
mentioned=20 better, though is heavier and there's more
maintenance. Done badly it=20 takes even more money away
from frame and transmission for primarily=20 cosmetic
reasons. Same goes for disc brakes: done properly they're=20
superb, done cheaply they're there to look cool but will
cost more than=20 V brakes, wear out pads quicker and not
work any better.

For dual suspension you're looking at well towards 4 figure
price tags=20 for a good job where money has been sensibly
spread around the whole=20 bike to make a well rounded
whole. It's hard to buy an MTB with rigid=20 forks these
days, but I wouldn't want to spend any less than =A3250 on
on= e=20 with suspension forks, and preferably not less than
about =A3350. And it=
=20
wouldn't have disc brakes at that price.

I'd start looking hard at second hand.

Pete. --=20 Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer Tel 44
1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK net
[email hidden] dundee.ac.uk~pjclinchOpen ↗

in message <[email hidden]>, David

(') said:

Hi,

I'm thinking of buying a new bike, and would like some
general buying advice. I currently have an ancient
moutain bike with 21 gears - basic. My riding is probably
50 miles a week at most, with a mixture of 50% off road
and 50% on road.

I've been looking at off roaders with suspension. I'm
looking to spend a minimum for something decent - maximum
budget is probably £150ish.

Add another nought.

You are not going to get a new full suspension bike worth
having at much under a thousand. There are second hand
bargains to be had if you're careful but even they will cost
a lot more than £150. You can get a usable hardtail (front
suspension only) for about £400 upwards new, half that
second hand.

It might make more sense to give your ancient one an
overhaul.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke)
jasmine.org.uk~simonOpen ↗ -----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version: 3.1 GP/CS s++: a+ C+++ ULBVCS*++++$ L+++ P--- E+>++
W+++ N++ K w--(---) M- !d- PS++ PE-- Y+ PGP !t 5? X+ !R b++
!DI D G- e++ h*(-) r++ y+++ ------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------

in message <[email hidden]>, David

(') said:

Thanks for the replies.

Quoted message said:

You really won't get anything decent at that price level.
Suspension will

be

Quoted message said:

poor quality and performance at that price. What's wrong
with your

"ancient

Quoted message said:

mountain bike" that it needs changing. Either look to
spend double you

max

Quoted message said:

budget or put the money into giving your current bike a
service

My current ancient bike was bought for £30 from the
freeads to enable me to chase after the kids and round 'em
up when they go in opposite directions on their
bikes/scooters. I found myself (unexpectedly) really
enjoying riding. My bike is actually too big a frame for
me. As I have some redundancy money I can afford to buy a
new bike, but obviously can't spend an absolute fortune.

Seems to me that the front only suspension bikes are
cheaper. Never having ridden a bike with suspension, what
are the pro's and con's of front/rear suspension both on
and off road?

On smooth roads suspension is not necessary and actually
slows you down
- good suspension bikes have 'lockout' systems to lock the
suspension when it's not needed. On gentle off-road tracks
and paths a bit of suspension is quite nice but doesn't
really make all that much difference. Where it does make a
big difference is on rough and loose surfaced paths and
tracks, particularly if you're moving fast. What makes the
difference is

* You're more comfortable so you don't get so tired and can
go further;
* The bike will cope much better with bad lines and
obstacles so you don't have to concentrate so much so you
don't get so tired;
* You can go faster over rougher ground;
* You have more grip and more traction on rough sections.

However, only good suspension systems will cope with these
conditions and good suspension costs serious money. Cheap
suspension systems are heavy, fragile and don't work very
well. Suspension really needs to be tuned to the weight of
the rider, or it won't do much good. On a good bike you will
either have air suspension (where you can change the
pressure with a pump) or alternatively the bike shop
*should* ask you what you weigh and fit the right spring for
your weight.

Related topic, cheap cable operated disk brakes are much
heavier than V brakes and don't work as well.

Essentially if your budget is limited a light bike with no
suspension is better than a heavy bike with poor suspension.
Unless you can afford at least £300 don't buy suspension -
and don't buy disk brakes unless you can afford a good bit
more than that.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke)
jasmine.org.uk~simonOpen ↗

Quoted message said:

I'm thinking of buying a new bike, and would like some
general buying advice. I currently have an ancient
moutain bike with 21 gears - basic. My riding is probably
50 miles a week at most, with a mixture of 50% off road
and 50% on road.

I've been looking at off roaders with suspension. I'm
looking to spend a minimum for something decent - maximum
budget is probably £150ish.

What sort of off road? For canal towpaths, forestry tracks,
etc suspension isn't needed. Front suspension is worth
having for anything more serious. As suggested by other
posters £150 is not enough for a new bike. At that price
point the components just don't work as well, need more
frequent adjustment and wear out faster. For a front
suspension mountain bike spend at least about £300. For the
extra cash you'll get a far better bike that's nicer to use
and lasts longer. Try looking in a few local bike shops. If
you say what area you live in someone on this group should
be able to point you at a reasonable shop. Iain

Quoted message said:

What sort of off road? For canal towpaths, forestry
tracks, etc suspension isn't needed. Front suspension is
worth having for anything more serious.

Mostly I go along a disused railway (Castleman trailway)
that's got a rough gravel surface, and country park/woodland
trails, so I'm thinking that suspension would probably be
not essential.

Quoted message said:

As suggested by other posters £150 is not enough for a
new bike. At that price point the components just don't
work as well, need more frequent adjustment and wear
out faster.

Taking on board what people have said, I am thinking the
best solution is a mountain bike with no suspension. I thank
you all for your input, and it's certainly been very
helpful! Also, I think I can up the budget to £200. As there
isn't a tearing hurry to get it, I'll also investigate the
free ads too.

Quoted message said:

Try looking in a few local bike shops. If you say what
area you live in someone on this group should be able
to point you at a reasonable shop.

I live in the Bournemouth area. I did look in a couple today
actually. One (Bike Lab) didn't seem to stock anything below
£500, and one in the local mall had some, but the only non-
suspension mountain bike in stock was a basic Raleigh that I
didn't really like the look of. But the assistant did give
good advice and steered me away from suspension bikes having
told her my use for the bike. A stark difference from
Halfords advice that was basically "biggest price tag".

I'm on holiday from tomorrow, but I'll certainly be looking
deeper when I get back.

Thanks

David

David said:

I live in the Bournemouth area. I did look in a couple
today actually. One (Bike Lab) didn't seem to stock
anything below £500, and one in the local mall had some,
but the only non-suspension mountain bike in stock was a
basic Raleigh that I didn't really like the look of. But
the assistant did give good advice and steered me away
from suspension bikes having told her my use for the bike.
A stark difference from Halfords advice that was basically
"biggest price tag".

I'm on holiday from tomorrow, but I'll certainly be
looking deeper when I get back.

Have a look in Primera in Charminster - see if they will
cut you a deal on a Specialized Hardrock rigid which lists
at £249 and is a classic entry level bike. primera-primera-Open ↗
bournemouth.co.uk/details.asp?FKID=36&type=bikes&recType=b-
ike&ID=103

Tony