Ghost Bikes

Dan wrote

Quoted message said:

If you'd have asked me yesterday what percentages of drivers
I think got it, I'd have said 60-75 depending on
my mood at the time. Now I'm thinking it's more
like 15%.

Honestly Dan, I'm embarrassed to say I'd never heard of a "ghostbike"
until reading this post.

Thanks for sharing.

Best Regards - Mike Baldwin

"Michael Baldwin" wrote: Honestly Dan, I'm embarrassed to say I'd never
heard of a "ghostbike"

Quoted message said:

until reading this post.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Nor I. I have seen a number of damaged bikes locked up. but I always
assumed that they were left there by their owners because they were not
rideable.

Leo Lichtman said:

"Michael Baldwin" wrote: Honestly Dan, I'm embarrassed to say I'd never
heard of a "ghostbike"

Quoted message said:

until reading this post.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Nor I. I have seen a number of damaged bikes locked up. but I always
assumed that they were left there by their owners because they were not
rideable.

Ghost bikes aren't necessarily the bike the deceased was riding at
the time of their demise. They're almost always inoperable and most
frequently painted all white, including the tires.

It's a legacy of the sixties Provo movement in Amsterdam and their
"White Plans"

"White Corpse Plan" is a spin-off of the "White Bike Plan"

"Whenever the big green monster strikes anywhere in Amsterdam and
someone is flattened against the merciless asphalt, the police (blue
chickens) must trace the victim's outline on the ground with a piece
of chalk. As soon as an ambulance has removed the sad remains, the
murderer himself or herself, using a chisel and hammer, must hack out
the silhouette of his victim one inch deep in the asphalt, under
supervision of the police. Next he or she will fill the hollow with
white mortar. Then perhaps, all the prospective murderers approaching
the scene of the disaster will let up on the gas for just a moment".

The "White Bike Plan" is still alive in some cities and campuses but
the bikes are now usually painted yellow or other unappealing bold
colour. The Paris' Velib program is also part of the legacy those
crazy anarchists left in hopes of raising public consciousness.
--
zk

Quoted message said:

So I was just speaking with someone about the ghost bike that was
stolen and then returned in Portland ....

If you'd have asked me yesterday what percentages of drivers I think
got it, I'd have said 60-75 depending on my mood at the time. Now I'm
thinking it's more like 15%.

I think you are still high.

In article <[email hidden]>,

Zoot Katz said:

Leo Lichtman said:

"Michael Baldwin" wrote: Honestly Dan, I'm embarrassed to say I'd never
heard of a "ghostbike"

Quoted message said:

until reading this post.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Nor I. I have seen a number of damaged bikes locked up. but I always
assumed that they were left there by their owners because they were not
rideable.

Ghost bikes aren't necessarily the bike the deceased was riding at
the time of their demise. They're almost always inoperable and most
frequently painted all white, including the tires.

I think ghostbikes too greatly portray cycling
as a dangerous activity. They shift the focus
onto cycling and away from the motorized traffic
which poses the /real/ danger in the first place.

Perhaps the message would be better conveyed
by hanging effigies of killer drivers from
the streetlamps nearest the scenes of their
misdeeds & crimes.

Some folks might say we could do better than
effigies, but I consider capital punishment
barbaric. Come to think of it, even hanging
effigies is quite distasteful & morbid.
unless it's artificial fuchsias or petunias
in baskets, and then it's just gauche.

I wonder what would happen if the media were to
regularly summarize the week's local traffic carnage?
Especially w/ details as to who did what to whom.

Anyways, as I see it, ghostbikes are supposed to
tell drivers: "Hey, you guyz! Please stop
clobberin' and killin' us!"

But maybe that's being inferred as: "We're taking
stoopid chances by being adjacent or proximitous
to motorized vehicles, and maybe we shouldn't."
Which is, of course, the wrong message to convey.

If ghostbikes were appropriate, ghostpedestrians
would be even more so. Reminds me of that song
(Weighty Ghost) by WinterSleep.

cheers,
Tom

--
Nothing is safe from me.
I'm really at:
tkeats curlicue vcn dot bc dot ca

ZBicyclist said:

Quoted message said:

So I was just speaking with someone about the ghost bike that was
stolen and then returned in Portland ....

Quoted message said:

If you'd have asked me yesterday what percentages of drivers I think
got it, I'd have said 60-75 depending on my mood at the time. Now I'm
thinking it's more like 15%.

I think you are still high.

I may be. It's just always seemed obvious to me, at least the general
principle, even before I had read anything about it on the net.
There's a sad looking bike spraybombed white tip-to-tip, chain and
all, usually surrounded with flowers, pictures, etc. There's nothing
there that says "Happy Birthday".

Also, when I said "get it" I simply meant understand the bike is a
memorial to someone who likely died there on a bike. I don't mean to
suggest any spiritual movements. My initial post was simply about the
number of drivers who made the connection between the bikes and the
death of a rider. Now realizing many cyclists on the cycling
newsgroups also have no idea, my estimate probably is still high at
15%. Maybe 15% of city drivers would understand when seeing one? I'm
sure most people who live in small towns and rarely travel to the city
may never see these things, or have any reason to know what they
represent. I don't think I saw one until I had my license and was
able to drive into the city on a whim.

The good or bad debate on ghost bikes is an interesting one. I'm
somewhere in the middle. I can see problems with the concept, but I
can also understand wanting to do *something* when you lose a friend
so senselessly. If nothing else it probably makes the people involved
in it's creation and decoration feel a little bit better, and relive
some memories with the deceased.

Quoted post said:

The good or bad debate on ghost bikes is an interesting one. I'm
somewhere in the middle. I can see problems with the concept, but I
can also understand wanting to do *something* when you lose a friend
so senselessly. If nothing else it probably makes the people involved
in it's creation and decoration feel a little bit better, and relive
some memories with the deceased.

I'm with Tom Keats on this (or perhaps he's with me; I may have said
it first in a previous thread). I think ghost bikes go almost
entirely unnoticed except by dedicated cyclists. And I think if a non-
cyclist does notice, he doesn't understand the meaning, that a cyclist
was injured or killed there. And if he does get that meaning, he
probably thinks "So it's obviously dumb to ride a bike. I'm sticking
with my car."

If I did lose a friend that way, I probably would want to do
something. But I'd want to do something more productive.

BTW, as an avid adult cyclist since 1973 or so, I've never had a
friend who died from a bike crash. But I've had about four friends
who died in car accidents.

- Frank Krygowski

ZBicyclist said:

[email hidden] wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

thinking it's more like 15%.

I think you are still high.

He may be high, high as a motorist in a CO induced stupor... but let's
not go into that now.

I'll bet that less than 15% of the motoring public would notice one if
you wire-tied it to their front grill.

I know they wouldn't stop if they ran over one of 'em.

I love the idea. On the roads here in the South there are markers and
memorials along the roads marking where people have died whilst
traveling the highways. Usually these are simple plastic flowered
crosses and plaques. But this is perfect.

If I should meet my end on the road (my preferred means of passing) This
is what I want.

- -
Compliments of:
"Your Friendly Neighborhood Wheelman"

If you want to E-mail me use:
ChrisZCorner "at" webtv "dot" net

My website:
http://geocities.com/czcorner

It's Chris said:

I love the idea. On the roads here in the South there are markers and
memorials along the roads marking where people have died whilst
traveling the highways. Usually these are simple plastic flowered
crosses and plaques. But this is perfect.

If I should meet my end on the road (my preferred means of passing)
This is what I want.

Here's how to get it done:
Bob Fuller's Roadside Memorials

--
Mike Kruger
Say not always what you know, but always know what you say.
Claudius; 10 BC-AD 54, Roman Emperor