HCA - another story ?

"euristics" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Surfing the web for the Columbia HCA heath care story I have find some data about a new T2
diabetes cure with a HCA (hydroxycitric acid) ingredient in a dietary supplement. Even the daily
intake of chromium and vanadium contained in the dietary supplement are suficiently to induce
insulin sensitivity effects,the seller say that the "cure" is realised by the HCA from an extract
from a cambodgian plant. I am asking (100% NO SPAM) if anyone have an experience with HCA alone in
the management of T2 diabetes. Thank you

Oh, please! Are you seriously going to believe something a seller would say about their product? I
highly doubt that anyone here is going to have experience with this stuff. We know better than to
try snake oil.

--
Type 2 users.bestweb.net~jboveOpen ↗

Its a SCAM

It's one of those weight loss things. Here is a little more info:

Med Hypotheses. 1998 Nov;51(5):399-403. Utility of metformin as an adjunct to
hydroxycitrate/carnitine for reducing body fat in diabetics.

McCarty MF.

Nutrition 21, San Diego, CA 92109, USA.

Excessive exposure of tissues to fatty acids is likely to be the chief cause of the various
dysfunctions that lead to sustained hyperglycemia in type II diabetes. These dysfunctions are likely
to be substantially reversible if body fat and dietary fat can be greatly reduced. Disinhibition of
hepatic fatty acid oxidation with hydroxycitrate (HCA) and carnitine has considerable potential as a
new weight-loss strategy, but in diabetics runs the risk of further enhancing excessive hepatic
gluconeogenesis. Since the clinical utility of metformin in diabetes is probably traceable to
inhibition of gluconeogenesis, its use as an adjunct to HCA/carnitine treatment of obesity in
diabetics deserves evaluation, particularly as metformin therapy itself tends to reduce body weight.
A consideration of relevant evidence suggests that metformin therapy will not impede the activation
of fatty acid oxidation by HCA/carnitine, and is likely to potentiate the appetite-suppressant and
thermogenic benefits of this strategy. Indeed, since metformin has been reported to lower body
weight and improve cardiovascular risk factors in obese non-diabetics, a broader application of a
metformin/HCA/carnitine therapy for obesity can be contemplated.

PMID: 9848468

BL

"As the waves pass the rock, their shape is changed. There is a hologram of the rock within the wave
that comes forward and crashes on the beach, then there's a reflected wave back." Ralph Abraham

"I'd like to learn to windsurf." BL

Julie Bove said:

"euristics" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Surfing the web for the Columbia HCA heath care story I have find some data about a new T2
diabetes cure with a HCA (hydroxycitric acid) ingredient in a dietary supplement. Even the daily
intake of chromium and vanadium contained in the dietary supplement are suficiently to induce
insulin sensitivity effects,the seller say that the "cure" is realised by the HCA from an extract
from a cambodgian plant. I am asking (100% NO SPAM) if anyone have an experience with HCA alone in
the management of T2 diabetes. Thank you

Oh, please! Are you seriously going to believe something a seller would say about their product? I
highly doubt that anyone here is going to have experience with this stuff. We know better than to
try snake oil.

Show the data. We've seen way, way, way too many claims about "chromium supplements", "vanadium
supplements" andn "miracle ages-old herbal remedies" to take such a claim at face value. Given
the pyramid scheme sales structure of these vitamin and herbal supplement businesses, I
serously doubt it.

Thank you friends,

Julie,I was sure like you that anyone have not experienced this product but I have try a question.

Nico,I understand your fury but i am not the author of the requested data.I can show you only a web
site link diabetes-help.comindex.htmOpen ↗ and I can confirm that in my case Chromium FTG have
not effect.

Thank you BL.I have see the paper.And a US Patent Application
(20030233992/A1/july 17,2003, uspto.govuspto.govOpen ↗ ) claims another findings regarding the effects
of chromium - HCA combination in preventing insulin resistance,but the hypothesis of
hyperglycemia induced by fatty acids will be demonstrated ?

Best regards, euristics

[email hidden] (BL 1204) wrote in message news:<20031015101951.21542.00000757@mb-
m02.aol.com>...

Quoted message said:

It's one of those weight loss things. Here is a little more info:

Med Hypotheses. 1998 Nov;51(5):399-403. Utility of metformin as an adjunct to
hydroxycitrate/carnitine for reducing body fat in diabetics.

McCarty MF.

Nutrition 21, San Diego, CA 92109, USA.

Excessive exposure of tissues to fatty acids is likely to be the chief cause of the various
dysfunctions that lead to sustained hyperglycemia in type II diabetes. These dysfunctions are
likely to be substantially reversible if body fat and dietary fat can be greatly reduced.
Disinhibition of hepatic fatty acid oxidation with hydroxycitrate (HCA) and carnitine has
considerable potential as a new weight-loss strategy, but in diabetics runs the risk of further
enhancing excessive hepatic gluconeogenesis. Since the clinical utility of metformin in diabetes
is probably traceable to inhibition of gluconeogenesis, its use as an adjunct to HCA/carnitine
treatment of obesity in diabetics deserves evaluation, particularly as metformin therapy itself
tends to reduce body weight. A consideration of relevant evidence suggests that metformin therapy
will not impede the activation of fatty acid oxidation by HCA/carnitine, and is likely to
potentiate the appetite-suppressant and thermogenic benefits of this strategy. Indeed, since
metformin has been reported to lower body weight and improve cardiovascular risk factors in obese
non-diabetics, a broader application of a metformin/HCA/carnitine therapy for obesity can be
contemplated.

PMID: 9848468

BL

"As the waves pass the rock, their shape is changed. There is a hologram of the rock within
the wave that comes forward and crashes on the beach, then there's a reflected wave back."
Ralph Abraham

"I'd like to learn to windsurf." BL

If you consider that there is a SCAM,you must to know
that the authors of this "SCAM" are :

1.A Master of Education at Montana State University
2.A Doctor in Medicine at University of Washington,Seatle
3.A member of American Academy of Family Physicians
4.Cliff Street Books and Amazon.com

diabetes-help.comultimatehca book.htmlOpen ↗

5.Shepard,Mullin.Richter & Hampton LLP,Los Angeles,CA
6.United State Patent Office

uspto.govuspto.govOpen ↗, US Patent Application 20030133992 / july 17,2003

Are you american ?

euristics

"BJ in Texas" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Its a SCAM

euristics said:

Thank you friends,

Julie,I was sure like you that anyone have not experienced this product but I have try a question.

Nico,I understand your fury but i am not the author of the requested data.I can show you only a
web site link diabetes-help.comindex.htmOpen ↗ and I can confirm that in my case Chromium
FTG have not effect.

Fury? What fury? I *quoted* someone who was furious, and urged that Julie show data.

Quoted message said:

Thank you BL.I have see the paper.And a US Patent Application
(20030233992/A1/july 17,2003, uspto.govuspto.govOpen ↗ ) claims another findings regarding the effects
of chromium - HCA combination in preventing insulin resistance,but the hypothesis
of hyperglycemia induced by fatty acids will be demonstrated ?

Do you have any *concept* of how many patent applications are made and never granted, or are granted
for pure nonsense? Patenting something does not mean that it actually works!

"Patent Pending" costs maybe $50 bucks to get if you do it on the cheap: A good patent attorney
will charge you maybe a $1000 for something simple and unlikely to be contested, a lot more if it
actually affects big industries and needs to be crafted to prevent trivial modification and
patent filing to interfere with your production rights. But for a chemical treatment cocktail?
Piece of cake....

On 15 Oct 2003 17:34:25 -0700, [email hidden] (euristics) wrote:

It's good to know who the author of the SCAM is. Doesn't make it ANY LESS A SCAM

Quoted message said:

If you consider that there is a SCAM,you must to know that the authors of this "SCAM" are :

1.A Master of Education at Montana State University
2.A Doctor in Medicine at University of Washington,Seatle
3.A member of American Academy of Family Physicians
4.Cliff Street Books and Amazon.com

diabetes-help.comultimatehca book.htmlOpen ↗

5.Shepard,Mullin.Richter & Hampton LLP,Los Angeles,CA
6.United State Patent Office

uspto.govuspto.govOpen ↗, US Patent Application 20030133992 / july 17,2003

Are you american ?

euristics

"BJ in Texas" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Its a SCAM

========
COWBOY UP! Magic Number=5
========

cc'd by email Well the scammer of a fad diet doctor claims to be a certified family practitioner BUT
is not registered as such according to the ABMS

AND, in any case, has NO crudentials which would back up their scamming [censored]

euristics said:

If you consider that there is a SCAM,you must to know that the authors of this "SCAM" are :

1.A Master of Education at Montana State University
2.A Doctor in Medicine at University of Washington,Seatle
3.A member of American Academy of Family Physicians
4.Cliff Street Books and Amazon.com

diabetes-help.comultimatehca book.htmlOpen ↗

5.Shepard,Mullin.Richter & Hampton LLP,Los Angeles,CA
6.United State Patent Office

uspto.govuspto.govOpen ↗, US Patent Application 20030133992 / july 17,2003

Are you american ?

euristics

"BJ in Texas" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Its a SCAM

Nico Kadel-Garcia said:

Do you have any *concept* of how many patent applications are made and never granted, or are
granted for pure nonsense? Patenting something does not mean that it actually works!

For example:

patent.freeserve.co.ukpedrick.htmlOpen ↗ lightlink.comwfinger.htmlOpen ↗
lightlink.comwcircle.htmlOpen ↗ United States Patent 6,341,372
delphion.comdetailsOpen ↗ totallyabsurd.comphonegas.htmOpen ↗
totallyabsurd.combulletproofbuttocks.htmOpen ↗

--
Wes Groleau Alive and Well freepages.religions.rootsweb.com~wgroleauOpen ↗

diabetes-help.comultimatehca book.htmlOpen ↗

I see the page is titled "Ultimate HCA book" Does this indicate the book was written to sell
the product?

Let's look at the page and see. The title of the book is "The Diabetes Cure" and it is written by
Dr. Vern S. Cherewatenko founder and chairman of HealthMax (a supplement company) and Paul Perry,
the author of "Saved by the Light: The True Story of a Man Who Died Twice and the Profound
Revelations He Received"

Hmmmmm.

The book provides a handly list of companies offering HCA supplements. Number 2 on the list is
HealthMax (Cherewatenko's company) but number 1 is Ultimate HCA. What was the name of that URL
again? Oh yeah ultimatehca_book.

Ultimate HCA (now called Diabetetron) is sold by the Advanced Health Group, formerly Idea Concepts,
a self-pronounced MLM scheme, (see ideaconcepts.hypermart.netideaconcepts.hypermart.netOpen ↗) which sells a line of
lotions, breast enhancement pills, and weight loss products.

Was the book written to sell the product? You decide. Seems pretty obvious to me.