Headset play

Doki said:

Right. My sister's decided she'd like to start riding a
bike, but she doesn't want to buy a new one, or even a
decent second hand one. She wants to ride my old Halfords
POS. Anyway, having had a look at it, I can tell you that
it's not only a piece of [censored], but there's masses of play
in the headset. I've followed the instructions in my book
for getting rid of play on a threaded headset to no avail.
Any ideas? Chuck it in the bin and buy something better
for a fiver would be my favourite..

Just loosened everything and wanged it with a hammer to see
if owt was seized. Seemed to make no difference.

Doki said:

Right. My sister's decided she'd like to start riding a
bike, but she doesn't want to buy a new one, or even a
decent second hand one. She wants to ride my old Halfords
POS. Anyway, having had a look at it, I can tell you that
it's not only a piece of [censored], but there's masses of play
in the headset. I've followed the instructions in my book
for getting rid of play on a threaded headset to no avail.
Any ideas? Chuck it in the bin and buy something better
for a fiver would be my favourite..

Threadless? Threaded?

"Doki" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Doki said:

Right. My sister's decided she'd like to start riding a
bike, but she doesn't want to buy a new one, or even a
decent second hand one. She wants to ride my old
Halfords POS. Anyway, having had a look at it, I can
tell you that it's not only a piece of [censored], but
there's masses of play in the headset. I've followed the
instructions in my book for getting rid of play on a
threaded headset to no avail. Any ideas? Chuck it in the
bin and buy something better for a fiver would be my
favourite..

Just loosened everything and wanged it with a hammer to
see if owt was seized. Seemed to make no difference.

Why not heat it with an oxy-acetylene burning torch and
squeeze it in a vice while it's still white hot?

Paul.

Doki said:

Doki said:

Right. My sister's decided she'd like to start riding a
bike, but she doesn't want to buy a new one, or even a
decent second hand one. She wants to ride my old Halfords
POS. Anyway, having had a look at it, I can tell you that
it's not only a piece of [censored], but there's masses of play
in the headset. I've followed the instructions in my book
for getting rid of play on a threaded headset to no avail.
Any ideas? Chuck it in the bin and buy something better
for a fiver would be my favourite..

Just loosened everything and wanged it with a hammer to
see if owt was seized. Seemed to make no difference.

Badly faced head tube, probably. Take it to a bike shop and
have them check it out. BTW, a loose headset has very little
impact on shimmy etc
- this is a bit of an urban myth. I rode a bike with a loose
headset for years. In fact, riding no-hands was easier if
I slackened it right off!

Simonb said:

Doki said:

Right. My sister's decided she'd like to start riding a
bike, but she doesn't want to buy a new one, or even a
decent second hand one. She wants to ride my old Halfords
POS. Anyway, having had a look at it, I can tell you that
it's not only a piece of [censored], but there's masses of
play in the headset. I've followed the instructions in my
book for getting rid of play on a threaded headset to no
avail. Any ideas? Chuck it in the bin and buy something
better for a fiver would be my favourite..

Threadless? Threaded?

Threaded. Hence me following the instructions for a threaded
headset 🙂.

Paulmouk said:

"Doki" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:2gi0inF35nvqU1@uni-
berlin.de...

Quoted message said:

Doki said:

Right. My sister's decided she'd like to start riding a
bike, but she doesn't want to buy a new one, or even a
decent second hand one. She wants to ride my old
Halfords POS. Anyway, having had a look at it, I can
tell you that it's not only a piece of [censored], but
there's masses of play in the headset. I've followed the
instructions in my book for getting rid of play on a
threaded headset to no avail. Any ideas? Chuck it in the
bin and buy something better for a fiver would be my
favourite..

Just loosened everything and wanged it with a hammer to
see if owt was seized. Seemed to make no difference.

Why not heat it with an oxy-acetylene burning torch and
squeeze it in a vice while it's still white hot?

Did I mention that I hate the bike? The fact of the matter
is that I didn't have an oxy-acetylene torch or a vice handy
in the garden. I'll take it to someone I know with a welding
works in the morning 😉.

Zog The Undeniable said:

Doki said:

Doki said:

Right. My sister's decided she'd like to start riding a
bike, but she doesn't want to buy a new one, or even a
decent second hand one. She wants to ride my old
Halfords POS. Anyway, having had a look at it, I can
tell you that it's not only a piece of [censored], but
there's masses of play in the headset. I've followed the
instructions in my book for getting rid of play on a
threaded headset to no avail. Any ideas? Chuck it in the
bin and buy something better for a fiver would be my
favourite..

Just loosened everything and wanged it with a hammer to
see if owt was seized. Seemed to make no difference.

Badly faced head tube, probably. Take it to a bike shop
and have them check it out.

I doubt that's worth it. It's a complete shed of a thing.
Full suspension, weighs 40 tonnes and the fork's seized.

Quoted message said:

BTW, a loose headset has very little impact on shimmy etc
- this is a bit of an urban myth. I rode a bike with a
loose headset for years. In fact, riding no-hands was
easier if I slackened it right off!

What's the problem with play in the headset then? I just
assumed it was A Bad Thing.

In "]news:[email hidden],
Doki <[email hidden]> typed:

Quoted message said:

Zog wrote

Quoted message said:

BTW, a loose headset has very little impact on shimmy
etc - this is a bit of an urban myth. I rode a bike with
a loose headset for years. In fact, riding no-hands was
easier if I slackened it right off!

What's the problem with play in the headset then? I just
assumed it was A Bad Thing.

Presumably it adds lag and imprecision to the steering, as
well as being a pain when you brake as the bike geometry
changes a bit but noticeably.

And everything wears out quickly when loose. Like Zog, I
had a bike whose headset I couldn't get tight for a
while, and it was niggly to ride. Never shimmied, though.
Not surprising given my minimal weight and the solidity
of the frame.

A

Doki said:

Quoted message said:

Threadless? Threaded?

Threaded. Hence me following the instructions for a
threaded headset
🙂.

What instructions tell you to use a hammer? ;-) And WTF have
you been doing with it exactly?

I think you must be doing something wrong because it's
always possible to get rid of headset play. It's just that
steering may then be stiff if you go too far or there's
something wrong with frame/forks/headset.

Are you sure there really is play in the headset? How are
you testing it? The rocking-bike-with-front-brake-on test
doesn't work properly on bikes with suspension forks. Any
knocking could be from play or something in the suspension.

Instead, bounce the front of the bike up and down, with tyre
well inflated on a hard surface and listen to the sound it
makes! It should alter when there's no headset play. Also
test steering freeness by lifting bike by frame and tilting
it without touching the handlebars. So start off with
headset definitely loose, then tighten by small increments
until you think it's right.

~PB

Pete Biggs said:

Doki said:

Quoted message said:

Threadless? Threaded?

Threaded. Hence me following the instructions for a
threaded headset
🙂.

What instructions tell you to use a hammer? ;-) And WTF
have you been doing with it exactly?

None of them 😄. I've not been doing anything with it, the
thing's been in a shed for the best part of 10 years.

Quoted message said:

I think you must be doing something wrong because it's
always possible to get rid of headset play. It's just that
steering may then be stiff if you go too far or there's
something wrong with frame/forks/headset.

I suspect a new headset is worth more than the rest of the
bike, bar perhaps the back tyre which is a half decent
Michelin. Quite tempted to rob the Michelin for my MTB and
tell my sister to buy something that's not hopelessly
knackered.

Quoted message said:

Are you sure there really is play in the headset? How are
you testing it? The rocking-bike-with-front-brake-on test
doesn't work properly on bikes with suspension forks. Any
knocking could be from play or something in the
suspension.

It has suspension forks, but they're siezed. I can't shift
em by bouncing my 16 stone up and down on them, so I doubt
they're affecting things much... There's definate headset
play front to back

Quoted message said:

Instead, bounce the front of the bike up and down, with
tyre well inflated on a hard surface and listen to the
sound it makes! It should alter when there's no headset
play. Also test steering freeness by lifting bike by frame
and tilting it without touching the handlebars. So start
off with headset definitely loose, then tighten by small
increments until you think it's right.

Righto.

in message <[email hidden]>, Doki

(') said:

Pete Biggs said:

Doki said:

> Threadless? Threaded?

Threaded. Hence me following the instructions for a
threaded headset
🙂.

What instructions tell you to use a hammer? ;-) And WTF
have you been doing with it exactly?

None of them 😄. I've not been doing anything with it, the
thing's been in a shed for the best part of 10 years.

Take the thing apart, throw away all the ball bearings on
principle, examine the cups for corrosion. If the cup
surfaces are pitted you really need to throw them away too,
which on a frame of that value really does mean Beyond
Economic Repair. Otherwise, get new balls of the appropriate
size from your LBS and plenty of grease and reassemble.
Remember when putting balls in a race that you need to leave
a gap of about one ball diameter - do not try to cram in
'just one more ball' because if they don't have space to
turn independently the bearing will fail.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke)
jasmine.org.uk~simonOpen ↗

Morning had broken, and I found when I looked that
we had run out of copper roove nails.

Doki said:

It has suspension forks, but they're siezed. I can't shift
em by bouncing my 16 stone up and down on them, so I doubt
they're affecting things much...

Could there still be some front-to-back play in it even if
the suspension doesn't work vertically? Otherwise something
ultra-weird is going on or you are not adjusting the
headset properly.

Quoted message said:

There's definate headset play front to back

How can you tell? What are the symptoms exactly?

Play will disappear when the upper race is tightened
sufficiently (not just the locknut), unless the threads are
stripped. There may be a problem with stack height, or
locknut or washer incompatibility, if the locknut can't be
tightened properly but that's extremely unlikely if the
headset is the original one (and it should still be possible
to remove play temporarily).

Instructions:
www.parktool.com/repair_help/howfix_headset.shtml

~PB

I said:

Quoted message said:

There's definate headset play front to back

How can you tell? What are the symptoms exactly?

Sorry, don't worry about answering that question, I know
what you mean.

~PB

"Doki" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

None of them 😄. I've not been doing anything with it, the
thing's been in a shed for the best part of 10 years.

<snip>

Quoted message said:

I suspect a new headset is worth more than the rest of the
bike, bar perhaps the back tyre which is a half decent
Michelin. Quite tempted to rob the Michelin for my MTB and
tell my sister to buy something that's not hopelessly
knackered.

This does rather beg the question of why you have bothered
to store it all these years. :-)

--
Dave...

Agreed.
"Dave Kahn" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Doki" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

None of them 😄. I've not been doing anything with it,
the thing's been

in a

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

shed for the best part of 10 years.

<snip>

Quoted message said:

I suspect a new headset is worth more than the rest of
the bike, bar

perhaps

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

the back tyre which is a half decent Michelin. Quite
tempted to rob the Michelin for my MTB and tell my
sister to buy something that's not hopelessly knackered.

This does rather beg the question of why you have bothered
to store it all these years. :-)

--
Dave...