Hit by a car door (Melb).

Sasha wrote -

<a balanced account of a motorist and passanger's stupidity snipped>

Quoted message said:

I would also be interested in hearing from anyone who has been in a
similar situtation, particularly in regards to the outcome in terms of the
Police prosecution

Its a while since I looked at it but my recollection is that there is a very
specific traffic regulation (in NSW) about fairly strict liability for
failing to take care when opening a vehicle door on a public road - I
suspect Vic will have much the same regulation.

If that's right then what about issuing a local court civil summons for the
replacement cost of your bike (and jersey/nicks?) as soon as you have the
correct names and addresses of those involved - it may be some satisfaction
to have them have to personally deal with that cost or the excess if they
are insured.

I did that when a taxi rear ended me (on the scoot, not the bike) and found
the local court office people really helpful about the process and ended up
with all damage paid for plus the costs of issuing the summons - it did take
a fair while because the driver did nothing with the summons so I had to
spend time finding out how the process really worked (if they just try and
ignore it there are things you can do which force them to pay).

That's a civil action that you control separate from the prosecution the
police may instigate and control for their failing to give accurate
particulars after injury or damage.

And commisserations from all of us - accidents are one thing, dishonesty is
quite another.

best, Andrew

Firstly, glad to hear you are (vaguely) OK.

Are you a BV member? if so, contact me fdutch at gmail.com and I can direct you as to what's available and what to do thru them and their lawyers.

If not, basically it will take persistance and thoroughness on your part.
DONT let the police let it slide, cos it's all too hard.
If nothing else they are guilty of giving false ID and leaving scene of accident without supplying ID. This is indisputable by Police or them.

As Tim says you can get identity of driver (It's his/her liability basically unless a taxi/Bus for some idiotic reason!) thru FOI request.
It may also be worth telling police involved that you need those details to make claim for bike damages.
On that, take your 'precious' off for assessment/quote.
PS make sure you are happy with the shop you geet it quoted from as many insurance Co's will make cheque straight out to them, not you!!

Lastly, DONT GIVE UP and keep us in the loop.
good luck
FD

Sasha said:

Anyway, if anyone can help that would be greatly appreciated.

Hi Sasha, I'll forward these details onto my cycling contacts in the local area. The Westgarth area has changed a *lot* during the last decade with cafes and increased traffic et al. It's not exactly one of my favourite spots, even after to wash off speed when coming off Ruckers Hill.

Have you considered printing this information and distributing to businesses in the area, or indeed, putting up notices in the area? Best of luck with you recovery and please keep us posted on developments. If you need assistance with what I suggested, please contact me on cfsmtbATgmailDOTcom, as I'm a local who lives just up the hill. 🙂

In aus.bicycle on Wed, 29 Mar 2006 09:31:58 +1100

flyingdutch said:

As Tim says you can get identity of driver (It's his/her liability
basically unless a taxi/Bus for some idiotic reason!) thru FOI
request.

I recall an incident in SA a while ago where the court held that the
liability was with whoever opened the door, and wasn't claimable on
the car's 3rd party unless the driver opened the door - the passenger
was on their own!

Not applicable in Vic, but worth considering elsewhere...

My home contents insurance covers me for liability, so if passenger
has same, you can suggest they claim on it and they might be more
willing to pay.

Zebee

Hi cyclists,

I will keep this short for the time being and save the full story for
another day. Basically, I was hit by a passenger of a car who swung his door
open in front of me whilst he was waiting in traffic. I hit the door at full
speed, suffered injuries (the full extent of which are still unknown at this
stage) and my racing bike is a write off (bike is a mid range Orbea). The
driver and passenger of the car then supplied false details to me in the
hope that I did not note their registration. I did, the matter has been
reported to the Police and parties involved will apparently be charged with
various offences in due course- or so the Police tell me.

This incident occured at approx 9.30am last Friday (24th) on High Street
Northcote going towards the CBD, approx 100metres before the Westgarth St
intersection.

I am now seeking witnesses to the incident. There were plenty of people who
witnessed it, but in my writhing pain and preoccupation with my injuries I
was unable to collect their details. I am hoping someone out there witnessed
the accident or knows someone who did. It would help mine and the Police's
case greatly.

I know it is a long shot, but if anyone here saw the accident or knows of
someone who did please email me at sashan(nospam)@alphalink.com.au. Please
remove (nospam) before emailing.

I would also be interested in hearing from anyone who has been in a similar
situtation, particularly in regards to the outcome in terms of the Police
prosecution and retrieving compensation for bike damage from the car owners
insurance. Unfortunately privacy laws do not allow the Police to tell me who
the car owner is at this stage (they can once the investigation is
complete), so it looks like I may be without a bike for a while.

Finally, I cannot believe the stupidity of these people in giving false
details where a person has been injured. The car in question was quite
extensively damaged (it was an almost new Ford ute), so they would have had
to make a claim on insurance anyway. What the hell goes through the minds of
these people?

Anyway, if anyone can help that would be greatly appreciated.

Since a car was involved you can (and should) put in a TAC claim. This
may cover your medical bills, their may also be an option to sue under
common law for damages, loss of income, possibly your bike.

Since the TAC is a no fault situation, it does not require the
cooperation of the car owner. In fact the TAC has paid out on hit run
claims with no chance of even knowing any details of the car. It
ususally requires a witness for this

Currently I know of a person who was riding illegally on the foot path
who got hit by a car. The TAC is paying the medical bills. Remember
it is a no fault situation. They will probably send out a couple of
case mangers to interview you.

AFAIK, and IMO, IME (to use some great usenet acronyms) the car is covered
by CTP (- has to be by law with valid rego.). Any harm caused to you by the
car and any resultant physio, psycho stuff (where applicable) is covered by
this policy.

The car was in the control of the driver, the passenger was an invited party
and the insco would have trouble stepping away from the fact their insured
car caused the injury.

The car owner's insurance (comprehensive) will cover the damage to your bike
and clothing to the point of replacement. Get the receipts, a valuation
from your LBS (pre accident state obviously) and tender the details to the
insco after the Police have done the charging / whatever. Even the Vicroads
people should give the 3rd party insco details to you I would think. If
there is any problem ID'ing the company for comp ins., the Police will get
that information for you. Otherwise, call the various inscos and ask them
if you can lodge a claim, give them the rego & see who owns the policy that
way. In any case, the claim may need a police case number.
Any descriptions of the driver / passenger you would already have given will
help to nail them.

***
Any communications with the Police / inscos, anyone, write a diarised log of
events. Times calls are made, who you speak to and what was discussed.
This is a must do. Better to keep confusion out of the equation where
possible because often this stuff happens fast and calls get confused in
your memory.

My wife is going through the latter stages still of her accident along these
lines of a year ago. Operation next week on her wrist to try & get it
right.

Cycling accidents and [censored] motorists are a PITA (just for one final
acronym!)

Good Luck with your situation.
Jock

"Sasha" <sashan(nospam)@alphalink.com.au> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
| Hi cyclists,
|
| I will keep this short for the time being and save the full story for
| another day. Basically, I was hit by a passenger of a car who swung his
door
| open in front of me whilst he was waiting in traffic. I hit the door at
full
| speed, suffered injuries (the full extent of which are still unknown at
this
| stage) and my racing bike is a write off (bike is a mid range Orbea). The
| driver and passenger of the car then supplied false details to me in the
| hope that I did not note their registration. I did, the matter has been
| reported to the Police and parties involved will apparently be charged
with
| various offences in due course- or so the Police tell me.
|
| This incident occured at approx 9.30am last Friday (24th) on High Street
| Northcote going towards the CBD, approx 100metres before the Westgarth St
| intersection.
|
| I am now seeking witnesses to the incident. There were plenty of people
who
| witnessed it, but in my writhing pain and preoccupation with my injuries I
| was unable to collect their details. I am hoping someone out there
witnessed
| the accident or knows someone who did. It would help mine and the Police's
| case greatly.
|
| I know it is a long shot, but if anyone here saw the accident or knows of
| someone who did please email me at sashan(nospam)@alphalink.com.au. Please
| remove (nospam) before emailing.
|
| I would also be interested in hearing from anyone who has been in a
similar
| situtation, particularly in regards to the outcome in terms of the Police
| prosecution and retrieving compensation for bike damage from the car
owners
| insurance. Unfortunately privacy laws do not allow the Police to tell me
who
| the car owner is at this stage (they can once the investigation is
| complete), so it looks like I may be without a bike for a while.
|
| Finally, I cannot believe the stupidity of these people in giving false
| details where a person has been injured. The car in question was quite
| extensively damaged (it was an almost new Ford ute), so they would have
had
| to make a claim on insurance anyway. What the hell goes through the minds
of
| these people?
|
| Anyway, if anyone can help that would be greatly appreciated.
|
|

Jock wrote:
<snip>

Quoted message said:

The car was in the control of the driver, <snip>

Woo, that's a bit wierd!! Couldn't the driver then argue the car made me
do it?

In aus.bicycle on Wed, 29 Mar 2006 13:00:53 GMT

Jock said:

AFAIK, and IMO, IME (to use some great usenet acronyms) the car is covered
by CTP (- has to be by law with valid rego.). Any harm caused to you by the
car and any resultant physio, psycho stuff (where applicable) is covered by
this policy.

State-dependent.

gpoc.tas.gov.auR MAIB FirstSubmision2003 Append%20C.pdfOpen ↗

has an overview of state policies.

Vic specifically mentions dooring as covered.

NSW restricts it to "caused by owner or driver" so passengers dooring
you aren't covered.

Qld is "injury by, through or in connection with a motor vehicle" so
that should cover passenger dooring

WA doesn't specify, but seems to only count "driving", so I don't
think a dooring will count.

SA specifically mentions actions of passengers as covered.

ACT only insures the driver so if the passenger doors you the CTP
won't cover it.

Zebee

If it was as you suggest, I would have left out 'the' before control.
Basic stuff really.
Jock
"Brendo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
| Jock wrote:
| <snip>
| > The car was in the control of the driver, <snip>
|
| Woo, that's a bit wierd!! Couldn't the driver then argue the car made me
| do it?

Sasha said:

Thanks to everyone that has responded to date. It is all good advice. I will
be speaking to the Police today, and will keep the group updated. Hopefully
common sense will prevail anjd the car owner will cooperate once he realises
the seriousness of the charges he faces. Anyway, will post an update soon.

Thanks to all,

Sasha

Hope all goes well with this Sasha. Remember, you are dealing with a ute driver who gave false details - ie he has very limited conscience. I hope you bent the feck outta the ute door at a minimum.

I think the key, apart from accurate record keeping, is determination, persistance and stamina to see this through to the end, so that at least the pain of kit and bike replacement is eased, and you get your medicals covered.

Jock said:

If it was as you suggest, I would have left out 'the' before control.
Basic stuff really.
Jock
"Brendo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
| Jock wrote:
| <snip>
| > The car was in the control of the driver, <snip>
|
| Woo, that's a bit wierd!! Couldn't the driver then argue the car made me
| do it?

Sorry, good point. It was late!
Brendo

Jock said:

Any communications with the Police / inscos, anyone, write a diarised log of
events. Times calls are made, who you speak to and what was discussed.
This is a must do. Better to keep confusion out of the equation where
possible because often this stuff happens fast and calls get confused in
your memory.

Seconded. This really is useful. Particularly when it becomes evident
that the insurance company is procrastinating in the hope that you
will go away.

Sasha said:

Thanks to everyone that has responded to date. It is all good
advice. I will be speaking to the Police today, and will keep the
group updated. Hopefully common sense will prevail anjd the car
owner will cooperate once he realises the seriousness of the charges
he faces. Anyway, will post an update soon.

Good luck in your fight -- I may not have much to offer, but you have my
moral support. Here's hoping that it's not too difficult to get the
compensation you deserve.

--
My Usenet From: address now expires after two weeks. If you email me, and
the mail bounces, try changing the bit before the "@ to usenet".

"Brendo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
| Jock wrote:
| > If it was as you suggest, I would have left out 'the' before control.
| > Basic stuff really.
| > Jock
| > "Brendo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
| > news:[email hidden]...
| > | Jock wrote:
| > | <snip>
| > | > The car was in the control of the driver, <snip>
| > |
| > | Woo, that's a bit wierd!! Couldn't the driver then argue the car made
me
| > | do it?
| >
| >
| Sorry, good point. It was late!
| Brendo

You get that.
Jock

Good luck, Sasha. I'm a local too, I would have been riding along on Westgarth half an hour or so before then. I do avoid High St, as I do most roads that have trams and shops.

A couple of years ago I almost witnessed an accident where a cyclist was coming down the hill, passing on the left some stopped cars. A car turning right from High St into Union St through a gap in the stopped cars collected the cyclist. I was riding up Union St and just heard it but didn't get a good look. Checked to see how the cyclist was and I called for the ambulance and police. Cyclist was OK, even though he did not have a helmet.

When the police arrived, they spoke to the driver who was an older man - "never had an accident in his life" - so it looked like they were going to charge him.

On 2006-03-30, slaw (aka Bruce)
was almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea:

Quoted message said:

When the police arrived, they spoke to the driver who was an older man
- "never had an accident in his life" - so it looked like they were
going to charge him.

"him" as in older man, or "him" as in cyclist?

If cyclist, I hope the police remembered it is illegal to cross lane
boundaries without
1) giving sufficient indication.
2) giving way to someone already in the lane.

I know Melbourne drivers are incapable of doing either, but they are
both still required.

I was about to inform a certain red car driver today of their lack of
driving skill, but alas, they got away.

--
TimC
Er, RFC 882 put the dot in .com.

TimC said:

I was about to inform a certain red car driver today of their lack of
driving skill, but alas, they got away.

Given your crit form Tim, surely you could have chased him down 😉 Guess
any chance of me keeping up with you on the Warrandyte climb are well
and truly gone.

DaveB

Thanks to everyone that has responded to date. It is all good advice. I will
be speaking to the Police today, and will keep the group updated. Hopefully
common sense will prevail anjd the car owner will cooperate once he realises
the seriousness of the charges he faces. Anyway, will post an update soon.

Thanks to all,

Sasha

"Sasha" <sashan(nospam)@alphalink.com.au> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Hi cyclists,

I will keep this short for the time being and save the full story for
another day. Basically, I was hit by a passenger of a car who swung his
door open in front of me whilst he was waiting in traffic. I hit the door
at full speed, suffered injuries (the full extent of which are still
unknown at this stage) and my racing bike is a write off (bike is a mid
range Orbea). The driver and passenger of the car then supplied false
details to me in the hope that I did not note their registration. I did,
the matter has been reported to the Police and parties involved will
apparently be charged with various offences in due course- or so the
Police tell me.

This incident occured at approx 9.30am last Friday (24th) on High Street
Northcote going towards the CBD, approx 100metres before the Westgarth St
intersection.

I am now seeking witnesses to the incident. There were plenty of people
who witnessed it, but in my writhing pain and preoccupation with my
injuries I was unable to collect their details. I am hoping someone out
there witnessed the accident or knows someone who did. It would help mine
and the Police's case greatly.

I know it is a long shot, but if anyone here saw the accident or knows of
someone who did please email me at sashan(nospam)@alphalink.com.au. Please
remove (nospam) before emailing.

I would also be interested in hearing from anyone who has been in a
similar situtation, particularly in regards to the outcome in terms of the
Police prosecution and retrieving compensation for bike damage from the
car owners insurance. Unfortunately privacy laws do not allow the Police
to tell me who the car owner is at this stage (they can once the
investigation is complete), so it looks like I may be without a bike for a
while.

Finally, I cannot believe the stupidity of these people in giving false
details where a person has been injured. The car in question was quite
extensively damaged (it was an almost new Ford ute), so they would have
had to make a claim on insurance anyway. What the hell goes through the
minds of these people?

Anyway, if anyone can help that would be greatly appreciated.