How much do tires affect speed?

The rolling resistance between a given tub, clincher or tubeless is so small as to be only significant in a laboratory. Buy a fast tub, a fast clincher or a fast tubeless and ride whatever makes you think you're a brainiac.

BTW, Tom Dumoulin, the 2017 TT World Champion won on the slow old Vittoria Corsa tubs! LOL!
https://www.bikeradar.com/us/road/gear/article/tom-dumoulin-giant-trinity-advanced-pro-tt-bike-gallery-51045/

CAMPYBOB said:

The rolling resistance between a given tub, clincher or tubeless is so small as to be only significant in a laboratory. Buy a fast tub, a fast clincher or a fast tubeless and ride whatever makes you think you're a brainiac.

BTW, Tom Dumoulin, the 2017 TT World Champion won on the slow old Vittoria Corsa tubs! LOL!
https://www.bikeradar.com/us/road/gear/article/tom-dumoulin-giant-trinity-advanced-pro-tt-bike-gallery-51045/

There you go arguing again when there's no need to. For those AWARE of science, they would know that the slower a rider is the more important low rolling resistance is. The air friction on Dumolin was 40 times higher than the rolling resistance. For even a fast sports rider it is only something like 16 times the rolling resistance so rolling resistance is far more important for the slower riders.

For someone who rides at around 12 mph average the air friction is about three times the rolling resistance. This makes the rolling resistance more and more important to especially new riders with lower average speeds.

The difference between a tubular and a tubeless is around 16%. You can ignore that if you like.

Looks like it about a Watt and a half! Ignore it? You'll never repeatably measure that in a 250-300 Watt equation. Go clean and oil your chain. You'll be better off. Or wear a tighter jersey that's zipped. Or shave your arms. And for God's sake don't dare raise your head up 5 Cm.

Jezus H. Tapdancing K-rist on rollerblades! A geriatric punter telling us all about those marginal gains. Say, you must have replaced your Salbutamol inhaler with the good stuff. Party On!

CAMPYBOB said:

Looks like it about a Watt and a half! Ignore it? You'll never repeatably measure that in a 250-300 Watt equation. Go clean and oil your chain. You'll be better off. Or wear a tighter jersey that's zipped. Or shave your arms. And for God's sake don't dare raise your head up 5 Cm.

Jezus H. Tapdancing K-rist on rollerblades! A geriatric punter telling us all about those marginal gains. Say, you must have replaced your Salbutamol inhaler with the good stuff. Party On!

And we're supposed to believe that you're so great. Tell us what teams you've raced for and what positions you've obtained. Here's a clue - MOST people do not ride much over 2 mph averages as experienced sports riders. If you want to pretend you're faster because you do 10 miles rides go right ahead. I did 58 miles yesterday in ninety degree heat and then crossing back over the hill the temperature was 72 with a high wind blowing the whole way. I had the same average speed as a friend who did a metric down in Ventura the day before on a flat course. Pretense after pretense from you as if not getting flats, having lower rolling resistance and being able to use lighter racing tires rather than armored heavier sport tires isn't important.

This is me. Not so happy with having to smell a moron like you. WTF? You want a medal for riding when it's [censored] 90? WTF is wrong with your brain? [ATTACH=full]3148[/ATTACH]

This is me. Telling you to go [censored] yourself. [ATTACH=full]3149[/ATTACH]

This is me. Off the front on the bricks while you perform mental masturbation.
[ATTACH=full]3151[/ATTACH]

Please. Tell me again. Are your tires really, really, really fast? LMFAO!

CAMPYBOB said:

This is me. Not so happy with having to smell a moron like you. WTF? You want a medal for riding when it's [censored] 90? WTF is wrong with your brain? [ATTACH=full]3148[/ATTACH]

Looks like you got an award for eating the most BBQ ribs.

cyclintom said:

Looks like you got an award for eating the most BBQ ribs.

Oh, wait, you finished behind the guy that ate the most BBQ ribs. Well, that's certainly an accomplishment to be proud of.

Well. Now we know you're the reincarnation of Alf. Just another [censored] moron.

CAMPYBOB said:

Well. Now we know you're the reincarnation of Alf. Just another [censored] moron.

You know Bob, you just have to get a sense of humor and stop your obsession with the idea that being faster in some manner makes you better. My comments were funny and were meant to be. Your postings were supposed to show that you're some sort of expert when you aren't. You're and average good rec rider and we'd all like to ride with you. That is unless you wanted to show how great you are by trying to ride off on some sort of breakaway.

You're [censored] looney tunes.

Stop running your mouth and let's see your bona fides. I'll post more of mine.

So your "bona fides" is getting beat in an old farts race? Yeah, I raced for a short period. As a Cat 5 I could catch and hang onto the back of the Cat 3's.

But I was doing a job for the military at the time - designing a poison gas detector to protect our troops from those WMD that the beanie babies claimed didn't exist. I couldn't get it to work properly at lower levels and finally in frustration did the calculus myself to discover the physicists had improperly made the calculations. This meant that I had to change the software to the correct calculation. My device was the only way of measuring lower levels of poison gas so we had to use timing to make sure that all of the poison gas was pumped out of the test chamber before entering. Seems as how the jackasses got that wrong as well. I entered the chamber a couple of minutes early because with things like this you ALWAYS have a minimum of 100% safety margin. Well, in fact they had no safety margin and the poison gas burned my lungs and that was the end of racing. The scarring is still on the X-rays and pulmonary specialists can see it.

My "bona fides" are that I will break 3,000 miles tomorrow and I am now at 102,000 ft of climbing. I don't put in the distance anymore but I had 10 years of over 10,000 miles in the year.

That's what I thought. All hat. No cattle.

CAMPYBOB said:

Looks like it about a Watt and a half! Ignore it? You'll never repeatably measure that in a 250-300 Watt equation. Go clean and oil your chain. You'll be better off. Or wear a tighter jersey that's zipped. Or shave your arms. And for God's sake don't dare raise your head up 5 Cm.

There are plenty of ways to save a few extra watts. It'd be interesting to compare savings from equipment vs simple cheap things the rider can do.

steve said:

There are plenty of ways to save a few extra watts. It'd be interesting to compare savings from equipment vs simple cheap things the rider can do.

Well, some of the simple things a rider can do is to ride on the drops. Costs nothing more than a sore back and crotch. Head down and knees in on downhills. But believe me, since you have to change tires fairly regularly, changing it over to a tubeless system (using Orange sealant) will give you a better boost in the long term.

My Time Elite VX was completely unrideable with 23 mm tires but with the 28's at 80 psi it is one of the better bikes I've ridden. Now you could NOT have convinced me of that just one year ago. I was completely off of carbon fiber for the stiff ride and the difficult handling at high speeds over rough roads. Now this isn't the perfect fix - the fatter tires with lower pressure has to be set just right or the bike will bounce pretty hard on the low spots at high speed. But when set correctly 40-45 mph on a hard descent doesn't bother me at all now. Matching the Basso Loto with 23 mm's, the Pinarello Stelvio with 25 tubeless and the Time with 28 tube tires has the Time beating the others all to hell.

Since we have a lot of pretty good climbing (though nothing like they have in a Appalachians) I have decided the best gears for me is a compact crank with a 11/28. I use Campy stuff and Shimano is probably better. The cheap Campy cassettes don't shift very well and the Record level costs a fortune. It appears to be the C-C spacing between the cogs.

Ultegra level Shimano shifts sure and it doesn't jump cogs. Though unfortunately I've used Campy for so long that I just can't get used to Shimano - the inside levers work opposite each other on the two. SR only shifts one gear at a time and I will often approach a rise and shift down three gears at a time. Or spanning the top of a hill go the other way multiple gears in one motion.

So what are the things that you need to go tubeless? The hook-bead on a tubeless rim and a tubeless tire are different from a normal old-fashion rim but most wheels today have the proper bead locks. The best wheels are a type of construction called UST (??) which doesn't have any spoke holes on the inside - only a hole for the filler valve. These days heavier riders have to change wheels fairly often - I've broken so many wheels I can't keep track of them - now I buy deep rim wheels because they are so much stronger. At first they feel dangerous in cross-winds but after awhile you learn to not worry too much but to keep an eye out. But if you do have spoke holes you can use a type of tubeless tape to seal the inner surface. The previous sealants such as "goo" or "slime" do not work well because they don't seal larger holes. Orange works well.

Anyway - you're not going to get aero benefits from older bikes and you will beat yourself up pretty good trying to keep up with a group on older bikes. I was dead set against CF because of failures I've had and friends have had but after enormous investigation I cannot truly say that my failures and my friend's sudden and medically serious failures could be assigned to the material but instead to the learning curve of how to properly use the material. I would not have anything to do with Colnago's C60 series because I don't trust the lug type construction on CF bikes. Too many areas in which errors could be made. However, barring these errors being present they are as safe as any other material. I have seen lugs fail on high end steel bikes.

So what's to say about increasing performance for the "normal" rider that doesn't want to buyer newer and all hell and gone more expensive bikes and groups? More riding. Proper training which I see very little of. Virtually all training should be at a moderate pace with only short bursts of very hard efforts. You can gain more from, "The Bicyclists Training Bible" or "Fast After 50" by Joe Friel than by ALL of the improvement made in bicycles in the last 20 years and spending $25 on a paperback is a hell of a lot cheaper than the Colnago CLX I'm building up.