I need chili making advice

"Nikita" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

What's a Russian guy doing trying to make chili, huh?... Well, you
have to try something different.

My past efforts at chili making did not turn out too badly; the
results were certainly edible. I actually got a Texan girl to try
some, and she did finish her bowl; whether she actually enjoyed it or
was merely polite, the world may never know. Anyway, most of my chilis
suffer from two failings, and I come to this group for advice on how to
remedy them.

Problem 1: the chili comes out too acidic.

What do you mean by "too acidic"? I'm wondering if this might be just a
flavor bias on your part. Ask others to taste it and give their opinions.
Don't poison the well by suggesting in advance that you find it "too
acidic."

Quoted message said:

That, no doubt, is the direct result of putting tomatoes and/or tomato
paste into the chili. Putting less tomato paste and more water might
solve the problem, but I'm afraid the result will be too watery and
will lack flavour. What do I do?

Although there are still some chile con carne diehards who stubbornly insist
that tomatoes have no place in "real" chili, every winner of the World
Champion Chili Cookoff since Wick Fowler took home the prize in 1967 has
used some form of tomatoes in his recipe. Some use quite a lot of tomato;
others actually add vinegar or lime juice. A bit of acidity is just one of
the natural flavors in chili.

Quoted message said:

Problem 2: the chili lacks texture.
They say putting beans into your chili is a big no-no; so I don't do
it. However, just about anything else you put into the chili
disintegrates into pretty much a paste after having been cooked for 2-3
hours, so you end up with meat (which is also quite soft) surrounded by
this flavourful slurry, with nothing substantial to chew on. Do I
ignore all this conventional wisdom and throw in some beans anyway, or
are there other options?

Neither. That's what chili is, a thick soup. Although cooking beans in chili
is a big no-no for chili purists, only the real snobs object to serving
beans along side for those who care to add them. I usually serve beans,
diced raw onions, shredded cheddar, and oyster crackers along side my chili.
I eat mine straight. People here in Hawaii usually eat their chili mixed
about half and half with plain white rice, but I don't condone that.

--Rich

Nikita wrote:<snip>

Quoted message said:

Problem 1: the chili comes out too acidic.
That, no doubt, is the direct result of putting tomatoes and/or tomato
paste into the chili. Putting less tomato paste and more water might
solve the problem, but I'm afraid the result will be too watery and
will lack flavour. What do I do?

I pre-cook canned diced tomatoes and tomato sauce for a long time,
uncovered, before adding anything else. If it is really acidic, I add
some sugar and a tiny bit of baking soda.

Quoted message said:

Problem 2: the chili lacks texture.
They say putting beans into your chili is a big no-no;

Screw that.

Quoted message said:

so I don't do
it. However, just about anything else you put into the chili
disintegrates into pretty much a paste after having been cooked for 2-3
hours, so you end up with meat (which is also quite soft) surrounded by
this flavourful slurry, with nothing substantial to chew on. Do I
ignore all this conventional wisdom and throw in some beans anyway, or
are there other options?

It's YOUR chili - make it however you want. I brown my meat well
(leave it kinda chunky) and set it aside. I then sautee garlic,
onions, a bit of celery, and green, jalapeno and chili peppers. I
semi-caramelize the onions first, and then throw in the other stuff for
a little while. I add that to the tomato mixture, and then add my
spices. I simmer that for a good half hour, and then throw in my meat,
and two kids of beans - kidney and red, usually. I then let the
flavors blend on low until I am ready to eat it - usually at least an
hour. It's better the second day.

I don't like that red meat slop a lot of people call chili. They call
mine Mexican vegetable soup, but so be it. It tastes awesome.

-L.

Rich said:

"Nikita" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

What's a Russian guy doing trying to make chili, huh?... Well, you
have to try something different.

My past efforts at chili making did not turn out too badly; the
results were certainly edible. I actually got a Texan girl to try
some, and she did finish her bowl; whether she actually enjoyed it or
was merely polite, the world may never know. Anyway, most of my chilis
suffer from two failings, and I come to this group for advice on how to
remedy them.

Problem 1: the chili comes out too acidic.

What do you mean by "too acidic"? I'm wondering if this might be just a
flavor bias on your part. Ask others to taste it and give their opinions.
Don't poison the well by suggesting in advance that you find it "too
acidic."

Quoted message said:

That, no doubt, is the direct result of putting tomatoes and/or tomato
paste into the chili. Putting less tomato paste and more water might
solve the problem, but I'm afraid the result will be too watery and
will lack flavour. What do I do?

Although there are still some chile con carne diehards who stubbornly insist
that tomatoes have no place in "real" chili, every winner of the World
Champion Chili Cookoff since Wick Fowler took home the prize in 1967 has
used some form of tomatoes in his recipe. Some use quite a lot of tomato;
others actually add vinegar or lime juice. A bit of acidity is just one of
the natural flavors in chili.

Quoted message said:

Problem 2: the chili lacks texture.
They say putting beans into your chili is a big no-no; so I don't do
it. However, just about anything else you put into the chili
disintegrates into pretty much a paste after having been cooked for 2-3
hours, so you end up with meat (which is also quite soft) surrounded by
this flavourful slurry, with nothing substantial to chew on. Do I
ignore all this conventional wisdom and throw in some beans anyway, or
are there other options?

Neither. That's what chili is, a thick soup. Although cooking beans in chili
is a big no-no for chili purists, only the real snobs object to serving
beans along side for those who care to add them. I usually serve beans,
diced raw onions, shredded cheddar, and oyster crackers along side my chili.
I eat mine straight. People here in Hawaii usually eat their chili mixed
about half and half with plain white rice, but I don't condone that.

And then there's spam-chili!

jim

Rich said:

"Nikita" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

What's a Russian guy doing trying to make chili, huh?... Well, you
have to try something different.

My past efforts at chili making did not turn out too badly; the
results were certainly edible. I actually got a Texan girl to try
some, and she did finish her bowl; whether she actually enjoyed it or
was merely polite, the world may never know. Anyway, most of my
chilis suffer from two failings, and I come to this group for advice
on how to remedy them.

Problem 1: the chili comes out too acidic.

What do you mean by "too acidic"? (snip)

Tomatoes are often acidic. A pinch or two of sugar helps this.

Jill

Nikita said:

What's a Russian guy doing trying to make chili, huh?... Well, you
have to try something different.

My past efforts at chili making did not turn out too badly; the
results were certainly edible. I actually got a Texan girl to try
some, and she did finish her bowl; whether she actually enjoyed it or
was merely polite, the world may never know. Anyway, most of my
chilis suffer from two failings, and I come to this group for advice
on how to remedy them.

Problem 1: the chili comes out too acidic.
That, no doubt, is the direct result of putting tomatoes and/or tomato
paste into the chili. Putting less tomato paste and more water might
solve the problem, but I'm afraid the result will be too watery and
will lack flavour. What do I do?

Add a pinch or two of sugar to cut the acidity of the tomatoes.

Quoted message said:

Problem 2: the chili lacks texture.
They say putting beans into your chili is a big no-no; so I don't do
it.

That's a big debate among chili purists but I happen to love beans in chili
and I don't come from Texas so who cares what they think? In fact, a lot of
chili purists say don't add tomatoes; what they wind up with is basically a
brown beef stew with nothing added but ground chili peppers. Sorry, not my
cup of tea 🙂

However, just about anything else you put into the chili

Quoted message said:

disintegrates into pretty much a paste after having been cooked for
2-3 hours, so you end up with meat (which is also quite soft)
surrounded by this flavourful slurry, with nothing substantial to
chew on.

Do I ignore all this conventional wisdom and throw in some

Quoted message said:

beans anyway, or are there other options?

TIA.

Nikita.

Ignore it. Do what Lynn (-L) said. Cook the sauce first with spices first
and add some sauteed veggies such as onion, garlic, celery. Add beans, who
cares if someone says it shouldn't have beans?? I use red kidney beans and
sometimes pinto beans as the mood suits me. You might also try using
floured and then browned cubed beef (i.e. round steak) rather than ground
beef/mince to give it more "bite" from the meat. But add it in the last
hour of cooking. The meat will be cooked but won't disintegrate into mush
🙂

Jill

"Nikita" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

What's a Russian guy doing trying to make chili, huh?... Well, you
have to try something different.

My past efforts at chili making did not turn out too badly; the
results were certainly edible. I actually got a Texan girl to try
some, and she did finish her bowl; whether she actually enjoyed it or
was merely polite, the world may never know. Anyway, most of my chilis
suffer from two failings, and I come to this group for advice on how to
remedy them.

Problem 1: the chili comes out too acidic.
That, no doubt, is the direct result of putting tomatoes and/or tomato
paste into the chili. Putting less tomato paste and more water might
solve the problem, but I'm afraid the result will be too watery and
will lack flavour. What do I do?

Problem 2: the chili lacks texture.
They say putting beans into your chili is a big no-no; so I don't do
it. However, just about anything else you put into the chili
disintegrates into pretty much a paste after having been cooked for 2-3
hours, so you end up with meat (which is also quite soft) surrounded by
this flavourful slurry, with nothing substantial to chew on. Do I
ignore all this conventional wisdom and throw in some beans anyway, or
are there other options?

TIA.

Nikita.

A shredded (and then chop the shreds) carrot will cut the acid and will cook
away to nothing.

"Nikita" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Problem 1: the chili comes out too acidic.
That, no doubt, is the direct result of putting tomatoes and/or tomato
paste into the chili. Putting less tomato paste and more water might
solve the problem, but I'm afraid the result will be too watery and
will lack flavour. What do I do?

Brown the meat and when it is nearly finished put in fresh crushed and
diced garlic cloves, like, three per pound of beef. Do as Lyn said and
dice some onions and cook them until they are brown but still plump,
in another pan. The garlic and onions will give your chili a nice tang
without using tomato sauce. Add your chili powder (and be sure to use
enough of it! Don't think teaspoons, think 1/4 cup!) to the meat and
garlic and muddle it all well together, make sure the heat is up high
and pour in a goodly amount of water, enough that it is very watery.
Bring it to a boil, then turn it down and get it to the point where it
just bubbles very gently. A bubble or two. Leave it there for three
hours, stirring very now and then, uncovered. It will thicken nicely.

Quoted message said:

Problem 2: the chili lacks texture.
They say putting beans into your chili is a big no-no; so I don't do
it. However, just about anything else you put into the chili
disintegrates into pretty much a paste after having been cooked for 2-3
hours, so you end up with meat (which is also quite soft) surrounded by
this flavourful slurry, with nothing substantial to chew on.

Nikita! Remember those sauteed onions I mentioned? Don't put them
in the chili until the last twenty minutes of cooking. Same with other
vegetables
you might want to use. (As Lyn said, it is YOUR chili, make it as you like
it!
I have added corn and diced jalapenos,and I always add beans--but not until
the last 20 minutes. I am talking canned or fresh, not dried beans.)

For the flavor and tang of tomatoes I often dump some medium
heat chunky salsa in, again--in the last twenty minutes of the simmer.
This makes a really nice chili. You can also cook it way down, omit
the beans and have taco meat, very nice rolled up in flour tortillas and
served with shredded cheddar and lettuce, sour cream, refried beans,
whatever you like, and it is good in hard shell (corn) tortillas too.

You can mess with masa (corn meal) but I like to keep all that starch
and sugar out of mine. But Chili is personal! Be creative and have fun.
🙂

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Rich said:

Quoted message said:

Problem 1: the chili comes out too acidic.

What do you mean by "too acidic"? I'm wondering if this might be just a
flavor bias on your part. Ask others to taste it and give their opinions.
Don't poison the well by suggesting in advance that you find it "too
acidic."

I think he wants to actually like the chili himself. I always appreciate
that
in foods I cook, too. And I hate chili that is too tomatoey-acidic! It is
like eating
a bowl of spaghetti sauce!

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Quoted message said:

Problem 1: the chili comes out too acidic.
That, no doubt, is the direct result of putting tomatoes and/or tomato
paste into the chili. Putting less tomato paste and more water might
solve the problem, but I'm afraid the result will be too watery and
will lack flavour. What do I do?

You have already received some sound advice, but just let me add. If you are
going to use canned tomatos, use a good quality brand, hopefully without
seeds. (hate tomato seeds in chili) and mash the hell out of them before
adding. If you will add tomato sauce or past, same deal.. use a good
quality.. taste a bit on a spoon, if you get a extra heavy acid taste, well
then that's what your chili will taste like. Tomato flavor can be very
overwelming.

Nothing wrong with beans in chili, but if you put them in at the start, they
will be mush by the time the chili is cooked. Best to leave them out and
either add them towards the end of cooking or better yet, serve on the side
to be added by those that like them.

As far as textue, the longer you cook the thincker it's going to be as food
stuffs break down. If it's extra watery, cook for a little while on med-high
with no cover to evaporate some of the water. You can add mesa to thicken
(the "chili kits" usually come with this) but to me it's just filler and I
never use it.

Each batch will get better. Good luck

Larry T

"LT" <[email hidden]> wrote :

Quoted message said:

As far as textue, the longer you cook the thincker it's going to be as

food

Quoted message said:

stuffs break down. If it's extra watery, cook for a little while on

med-high

Quoted message said:

with no cover to evaporate some of the water.

You and I agree on everything but the temp! I think the key to delicious
chili is the long, slowwwww simmer on low. I was so surprised to find that
ground beef could get tender! When I have used the med-high heat method
to evaporate the water my ground beef has gotten rubbery.

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"jmcquown" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

That's a big debate among chili purists but I happen to love beans in

chili

Quoted message said:

and I don't come from Texas so who cares what they think? In fact, a lot

of

Quoted message said:

chili purists say don't add tomatoes; what they wind up with is basically

a

Quoted message said:

brown beef stew with nothing added but ground chili peppers. Sorry, not

my

Quoted message said:

cup of tea 🙂

Not true! Chili powder, fresh garlic, onions and green chiles do not make
for a brown
beef stew! I bet you don't even use fresh garlic.

You have just never had good chili with no tomatoes. But, I use beans too.

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Nikiita has gotten some very sound advice here regarding "Chili".
Having been born and raised in Texas, I am therefore something of a
chili expert :-)
In Texas there are basically 2 types of chili.
First, there is the traditional "bowl of red", which is nothing more
than cubes of beef slow-simmered with spices, consisting mainly of
chili powder,etc.
It has no beans, and no tomatoes.
Properly made, it is absolutely delicious. I fondly remember having a
fabulous bowl of this years ago at a bbq restaurant in Austin. It was
awesome!
However, at my house, we always had the other kind of chili.
That is, the kind with ground beef, tomatoes, beans, onions,etc.
We often servied it over rice, or spaghetti, or alone with maybe some
cornbread on the side.
I make mine now the exact same way my Mother used to.
First I brown the beef, and drain. I then add chopped onion, some
canned tomatoes,
cooked kidney beans, garlic, chili powder, maybe a pre-made chili
seasoning mix, and water.I bring this to a gentle simmer, then add a
little tomato paste.After stirring to blend in I then simmer this on
LOW heat for a couple of hours.
It always comes out great,and the flavor is even better the next day.
I moved to Ohio to attend graduate school in Cincinnati, and soon
became a fan of "Cincinnati Chili", which is quite different from the
Texas kind!
Obviously, I love chili in all it's incarnations.

Darren

Nikita said:

Problem 2: the chili lacks texture.
They say putting beans into your chili is a big no-no; so I don't do
it. However, just about anything else you put into the chili
disintegrates into pretty much a paste after having been cooked for 2-3
hours, so you end up with meat (which is also quite soft) surrounded by
this flavourful slurry, with nothing substantial to chew on. Do I
ignore all this conventional wisdom and throw in some beans anyway, or
are there other options?

Sounds like you're using an inappropriate cut of meat. Try using beef chuck
roast cut into 1-inch cubes.

Bob

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

As far as textue, the longer you cook the thincker it's going to be as

food

Quoted message said:

stuffs break down. If it's extra watery, cook for a little while on

med-high

Quoted message said:

with no cover to evaporate some of the water.

You and I agree on everything but the temp! I think the key to delicious
chili is the long, slowwwww simmer on low. I was so surprised to find that
ground beef could get tender! When I have used the med-high heat method
to evaporate the water my ground beef has gotten rubbery.

Yep, I wasn't suggesting high heat for long... maybe 10-15 min towards to
the end go get some of the water out. I needed to do that when I first
started messing with making chili (many moons ago) but, I've pretty much got
it down now, and it all times out just right without needing to do that
evaporation thing.

Larry T

cybercat said:

"Nikita" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Problem 1: the chili comes out too acidic.
That, no doubt, is the direct result of putting tomatoes and/or tomato
paste into the chili. Putting less tomato paste and more water might
solve the problem, but I'm afraid the result will be too watery and
will lack flavour. What do I do?

Brown the meat and when it is nearly finished put in fresh crushed and
diced garlic cloves, like, three per pound of beef. Do as Lyn said and
dice some onions and cook them until they are brown but still plump,
in another pan. The garlic and onions will give your chili a nice tang
without using tomato sauce. Add your chili powder (and be sure to use
enough of it! Don't think teaspoons, think 1/4 cup!) to the meat and
garlic and muddle it all well together, make sure the heat is up high
and pour in a goodly amount of water, enough that it is very watery.
Bring it to a boil, then turn it down and get it to the point where it
just bubbles very gently. A bubble or two. Leave it there for three

That's how DH makes his - he also sometimes adds diced pork and/or beef
to the ground. My favorite is vegetarian with no meat, but I don't
make that anymore unless he's OOT (too much hassle for just me...)

-L.

cybercat said:

"LT" <[email hidden]> wrote :

Quoted message said:

As far as textue, the longer you cook the thincker it's going to be as

food

Quoted message said:

stuffs break down. If it's extra watery, cook for a little while on

med-high

Quoted message said:

with no cover to evaporate some of the water.

You and I agree on everything but the temp! I think the key to delicious
chili is the long, slowwwww simmer on low. I was so surprised to find that
ground beef could get tender!

A ground beef with a higher content of fat will be more tender, too.
Just cook most of he fat off before using it. We use turkey now, so
it's a moot point for us. I hate that rubbery texture!

-L.

"Bob Terwilliger" <virtualgoth@die_spammer.biz> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Nikita said:

Problem 2: the chili lacks texture.
They say putting beans into your chili is a big no-no; so I don't do
it. However, just about anything else you put into the chili
disintegrates into pretty much a paste after having been cooked for 2-3
hours, so you end up with meat (which is also quite soft) surrounded by
this flavourful slurry, with nothing substantial to chew on. Do I
ignore all this conventional wisdom and throw in some beans anyway, or
are there other options?

Sounds like you're using an inappropriate cut of meat. Try using beef
chuck
roast cut into 1-inch cubes.

That's what I use. I simmer for about three hours, adding my chili spice mix
in different phases. I add masa after the meat is tender.

If you want beans, add them toward the end.

Mary

Rich said:

People here in Hawaii usually eat their chili mixed
about half and half with plain white rice, but I don't condone that.

It's really good served on a pile of rice and may be just what the OP
needs.
--

Ham and eggs.
A day's work for a chicken, a lifetime commitment for a pig.

cybercat said:

And I hate chili that is too tomatoey-acidic! It is
like eating a bowl of spaghetti sauce!

I've never encountered "tomato acidic"... unless I'm using only fresh
tomatoes and it's more bland than acid to me. How can a decently
flavored chili taste like spaghetti sauce anyway? The flavor is
entirely different.

--

Ham and eggs.
A day's work for a chicken, a lifetime commitment for a pig.